Democratic Underground Latest Greatest Lobby Journals Search Options Help Login
Google

Reality Check: The Election is NOT over, and I remain pessimistic

Printer-friendly format Printer-friendly format
Printer-friendly format Email this thread to a friend
Printer-friendly format Bookmark this thread
This topic is archived.
Home » Discuss » Archives » General Discussion: Presidential (Through Nov 2009) Donate to DU
 
dolstein Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-11-04 01:00 AM
Original message
Reality Check: The Election is NOT over, and I remain pessimistic
Let me put my cards on the table: I'm voting for John Kerry. I have already given Kerry $100. I may very well end up giving him another $100 before the convention. I think Kerry has made a few smart decisions, like opting out of public financing for the primary and picking John Edwards (who I voted for in the New York primary). All of these actions make me less pessimistic than I was a few months ago, but I'd still give Bush a better than 50% chance of winning.

There is where I see the election today. I think at least 45% of the electorate will not vote for Bush under any circumstances. But I also think at least 45% of the electorate will not vote for Kerry under any circumstances. At most, around 10% of the electorate is up for grabs, and I wouldn't be all that surprised if the figure is closer to 6%.

Why am I pessimistic? Well, for one thing, despite all the things that have happened during the past four years, Bush still has the overwhelming support of Republican voters -- close to 90% according to the polls I've seen, which is comparable to the level of support he received in 2000. Bush didn't face a challenger in the primaries. And when was the last time a Republican incumbent who faced no primary challenger was defeated? If memory serves, it was 1932, and sorry, as bad as things may seem to us all, things aren't nearly as bad as they were during the Great Depression. The simple fact is, when Republicans are united, they tend to win (1952, 1956, 1968, 1972, 1984, 1988). And even in those rare instances where they lose (1948, 1960), it's usually by a razor thin margin. So any talk of a Kerry landslide is pure wishful thinking in my opinion.

Also, I think nearly all of the ABK ("Anybody but Kerry") voters will end up supporting Bush. But some of the ABB ("Anybody but Bush") voters could still end up voting for Nader, particularly those who feel most strongly against the war in Iraq. Now I fully expect Nader's support to drop as election day approaches, just as it did in 2000. And in the end, Nader may end up taking very few votes away from Kerry. But as he saw in 2000, even if a shift of a few hundred votes can be enough to move a state into the Bush column.

In addition, it appears that Kerry will take federal funds for the general election. Assuming Bush does the same, that means that Kerry will have to stretch his $75 million over three months, whereas Bush only has to make his $75 million last for two months. That's a pretty big gap. Of course the money Kerry raises for the DNC will help close the gap, as will money raised by liberal Section 527 organizations. But the Kerry campaign won't have control over that money.

Finally, there's the matter of an October surprise. The fact is, the election outcome could easily be swayed by events to come. First, there are the things that neither campaign can fully control, like the economy and Iraq. And while it's possible that the economy could tank or Iraq could descend into anarchy, I fear that Bush will once against benefit from the "soft bigotry of low expectations." The economy was so bad for so long, that even middling employment numbers can appear to be good news for the president. And I believe the bar will be lowered for Bush on Iraq too -- even the slightest decline in the rate of American casualties might be seen as progress. And the sad fact is, the people who get to decide whether things are improving on the economic front and in Iraq -- the media -- are still largely on Bush's side.

And what about the things the campaigns CAN control? Well, Kerry has already played his ace in the hole -- he picked John Edwards. Candidates used to be able to count on the conventions to provide an added boost, but with the electorate already badly polarized and the networks limiting themselves to only 3 hours of coverage, I wouldn't counton Kerry getting much of a bounce.

But Bush has yet to play his hand. He still has the option of replacing Cheney, and I certainly wouldn't put it past him if he thinks it will get him re-elected. He also has the anniversary of 9/11, and you can expect him to play the commander-in-chief role to the hilt. And the fact is, as the incumbent president, it's going to be a lot easier for him to manipulate the press than Kerry. He can control the timing of government announcements, be they terror alerts or economic reports. And just as important, he can try to delay release of unfavorable information until after the election.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
NMDemDist2 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-11-04 01:06 AM
Response to Original message
1. I'm more optimistic than i have been in months
and if the country votes for * again I quit

I'll make as much $$ as I can as fast as I can and get out. I'm too old and too tired to fight for 20 more years.

I love this country, but not to the detriment of the entire planet, so screw it, if the majority of Americans want that little twerp to "lead" them, they can count me out.

But i still think this one (while we still need to work hard) is VERY winnable
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Meritaten1 Donating Member (241 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-11-04 01:22 AM
Response to Reply #1
3. I'm optimistic too!
Kerry/Edwards is a great ticket.

Plus, I've never seen people more motivated to vote against an incumbent-- Bush administration policies have hurt so many.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
physioex Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-11-04 01:12 AM
Response to Original message
2. Replace Cheney...
You make it sound soo simple. Cheney is the master Shrub is the puppet, I assume you know this already? Do you really think Shrub makes the decisions? Are you aware the man doesn't even read, and cannot prononuce Abu Gharib? The Neocons are the ones in charge Dickey, Rummy, Wolfie, Perly, and Libby. Take them away and Shrub is finished....
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
shoopnyc123 Donating Member (997 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-11-04 01:29 AM
Response to Original message
4. At the Beach in Long Island today...
Edited on Sun Jul-11-04 01:29 AM by shoopnyc123
I heard some anti Kerry remarks, (New York's Long Island). I don't think that it's everyone, but there are some odd thinkers out there. Some people here think that Giuliani should have been president. Go figure.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
TXvote Donating Member (317 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-11-04 01:31 AM
Response to Original message
5. You are correct
Two weeks before Ann Richards lost her race against W for Governor, nobody thought she could lose. Die hard liberal activists did not go to the polls because it was unimaginable that W would beat her. Yet beat he did.

For the longest time I thought only Texas progressives were so gullible or otherwise disorganized or at fault for this defeat. And then I watched the nation be duped and in turn, the world.

He has one heck of a machine and we have this frat boy backed into a corner now. He likely to come out swinging and in fact will play "dead" to pacify those who would go vote. Bush inspires complacancy if it will serve to make the progressives stay home.

Also,the conservative base generally attends a church on Sunday where a lot is said about our nation and duty and voting for God's candidate. On Tuesday, you had better go vote. It is likely a fellow parishiner will call to see you have. And on Wednesday at prayer meeting, everyone will ask if you did.

Progressives are generally less organized so we have to find other ways to hold hands and actually GET to the polls. I suggest a national Halloween Party....
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
JayS Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-11-04 01:41 AM
Response to Original message
6. Let's not forget that the ABBoK (Anybody but Bush or Kerry) crowd...
...may take votes from Bush by voting for Badnarak. :)
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
tritsofme Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-11-04 02:46 AM
Response to Original message
7. Excelent analysis
You describe my feeling to a T.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
zoeyfong Donating Member (508 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-11-04 04:41 AM
Response to Original message
8. Bush is the worst prez in decades, but dems could still lose, and that's
pretty sad. This country and this party are being lead by unprincipled incompetants. When the democratic strategy is just to be a tiny bit better than repugs, that means we are always going to be in tight races, no matter how bad repugs get. And even if we win, who really cares, if we're only a little better than repugs? There has been some nice-sounding talk from kerry-edwards about helping out the working people, but there are no bold proposals, only suggested tweaking of basically republican, anti-worker, anti-common person economic structures. Dems are going to have to do better than this if they want to have any hope of bridging the culture gap and getting white, blue collar votes. if dems are barely any better than repugs on economic issues, there's no way middle and lower-class social conservatives will ever vote democrat.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
TexasSissy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-11-04 08:08 AM
Response to Original message
9. Yes, I'm worried, too. There's a group of the population that will
believe and do anything that * and Cheney say (do I need to say they don't have the brightest bulbs on the street?). They are only vaguely aware of current events, and their sole voting thrust is to vote for the person that God has chosen.

Why is it that Democrat voters seem to be more intelligent and aware of current events? Not all of them. But certainly more than Republican voters.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
chimpymustgo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-11-04 08:25 AM
Response to Reply #9
10. I am wildly optimistic - but wary.
Kerry/Edwards is the Dream Team - and millions of people across the country are feeling a new wave of hope wash over them. These rallies - with 10, 15, 25,000 people - in JULY - numbers unheard of! I am feeling the ground rumble, and feel Democrats could be headed for a huge victory.

THAT SAID - I do not underestimate the cabal's capacity for evil, and their craven determination to maintain power. The margin of voters up for grabs is indeed small - but already, we are seeing stories about swing voters, Repub women SAYING they're thinking about voting for this ticket.

I think we're also going to see huge numbers of new voters. People are disgusted with the direction of this country. Given something to hang their hopes on - Kerry/Edwards - people who never bothered to vote will have just enough hope to vote.

But we have our work to do. Each and every one of us.

We can win.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Nashyra Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-11-04 09:34 AM
Response to Reply #10
11. I am extremely optomistic
that is why each and everyone of us has got to go out and work our f*&^%$# asses off. GOTV is the most important, no time to sit back and revel in the * slipping poll numbers. Those who have been active all along need to go out and reel in those friends and associates who have been motivated by Michael Moore's film. I've got two more precint captains waking the streets since they saw the film and they had not lifted a finger for the campaign since day one. I think we CAN win but the side has got to continue to turn and we have to make it happen, the polls have to be consistently over the margin of error so it is more dangerous for them to try and steal the election. Work, work and more work, there is no reason to be pessimistic, just go out there and convince your friends, family and neighbors to GOTV.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Zynx Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-11-04 09:36 AM
Response to Original message
12. I'm not even going to bother with this.
I have been optimistic since the campaign began and was one of the few optimists in December and have been proven correct thus far. I'm not going to respond to the same pessimists who were telling us to write off the election eight months ago.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Waverley_Hills_Hiker Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-11-04 10:22 AM
Response to Original message
13. As usual, Dolstein....
Dolstein, as usual you have an excellent hard-nosed anaylses here. Thanks for posting that.

An added factor that will help the GOP is GOTV and voter registration.

I think the GOP, via the christian conservative base (ie fundy & evangelical churches) will be working heavy on GOTV and also registration, to bring more voters to the polls. I think this will provide the margin of victory for Bush in Ohio, at least.

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
monchie Donating Member (297 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-11-04 10:27 AM
Response to Original message
14. I'm cautiously optimistic.
At this point in the game, I'd say Kerry will most likely win -- if the voting machines are honest.

Unfortunately, that's a damn big if.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
DemocratSinceBirth Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-11-04 11:13 AM
Response to Original message
15. If The Dems Can't Beat Bush In This Environment They Need To Find Another
Country!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
lucky777 Donating Member (298 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-11-04 11:28 AM
Response to Original message
16. I'm Pessimistic for the same reasons . . .
Kerry and Edwards simply aren't going to convert a lot of swing voters -- they just aren't. They lack intensity, and frankly, they are very boring. I fall asleep when Kerry or Edwards come on CSPAN.
They cannot recapture the Nader voters back into the Dem party, and they can't bring Repubs over to the Dems.

Of course I'll vote for Kerry -- I lived in Jacksonville Florida in 2000 and saw what happened. I predict that Bush will win for the reasons you suggested.

My analysis: The country is basically split into two groups -- one is urban-multicultural-progressive-tolerant-antiwar and the other is rural-traditional-nationalistic. The two don't meet, they don't swing to each other --- Black guys from the south side of Chicago will never swing Republican, and White guys from Pensacola aren't going to start voting Democratic. It's too polarized. The only way to get any swing is to have a very charismatic leader, which we don't. I predict we'll lose in another voting fiasco. But I'll try my best to stop this from happening.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
lucky777 Donating Member (298 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-11-04 11:28 AM
Response to Original message
17. double post - ignore
Edited on Sun Jul-11-04 11:30 AM by lucky777
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
DemocratSinceBirth Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-11-04 11:31 AM
Response to Reply #17
18. Who Would Have Brought Excitement To The Ticket?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
DU AdBot (1000+ posts) Click to send private message to this author Click to view 
this author's profile Click to add 
this author to your buddy list Click to add 
this author to your Ignore list Wed Apr 24th 2024, 12:31 AM
Response to Original message
Advertisements [?]
 Top

Home » Discuss » Archives » General Discussion: Presidential (Through Nov 2009) Donate to DU

Powered by DCForum+ Version 1.1 Copyright 1997-2002 DCScripts.com
Software has been extensively modified by the DU administrators


Important Notices: By participating on this discussion board, visitors agree to abide by the rules outlined on our Rules page. Messages posted on the Democratic Underground Discussion Forums are the opinions of the individuals who post them, and do not necessarily represent the opinions of Democratic Underground, LLC.

Home  |  Discussion Forums  |  Journals |  Store  |  Donate

About DU  |  Contact Us  |  Privacy Policy

Got a message for Democratic Underground? Click here to send us a message.

© 2001 - 2011 Democratic Underground, LLC