"Hillary is within striking distance of winning the popular vote nationwide

[2rth2pwr]

-- a key part of our plan to win the nomination," campaign chairman Terry McAuliffe said in a letter to supporters Sunday.
"That means we need every last vote we can get in West Virginia on Tuesday and in the races to follow."

Her campaign is trying to turn out the vote in the remaining six contests, hoping the popular vote argument will persuade superdelegates to endorse her instead of Obama.

Clinton's campaign has argued that she would be more electable in a general election because she has done well in swing states like Ohio and Pennsylvania, as well as Florida and Michigan, which were stripped of their delegates. .. http://www.cnn.com/2008/POLITICS/05/12/campaign.wrap/

"I think we see what happened in 2004, when Al Gore won the popular vote, and where the country has gone and the feelings toward government since then. I put a lot of stock in that," he (West Virginia Gov. Joe Manchin, an uncommitted superdelegate)said on CNN's "American Morning."

"If the people believe that it was over, they wouldn't be voting maybe in the way they might vote tomorrow or in the next few campaigns," he said.

All of this talk has led to 2 responses from Obama supporters-

1. White people in these states(WVa, Ky, Puerto Rico etc..etc..) are backwoods racist hicks ie.

"O.K., I'll say it. West Virginia = Racist, Uneducated Whites who wouldn't vote for Obama anyway."
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x5935571

"In the latest Hayden/Doh! poll conducted between now and 5 minutes ago by asking my invisible friends, Hillary is likely to win West Virginia’s primary by elebenty bazillion points tomorrow. Which will gain her 3/4ths of a delegate but will bolster her argument to superdelegates that Obama can’t connect with eighth grade "dropouts who marry their cousins and flirt with sheep unless they find out he’s really half-white and has a crush on Mrs. O’Leary’s cow."
"And 38% think bologna sammiches will do just fine for lunch, after which they’ll kick some tofu-eating college hippie elitist ass.

Local rap musician Cleminem summed up West Virginian attitudes as “fuck man, they don’t even get the jokes, so why bother insulting them? They only use the internets for nekkid pictures of well-sheared lesbian lambs and Shari Lewis’ swinging udders.” http://www.reachm.com/amstreet/archives/2008/05/12/per-latest-polls-there-could-be-upsets-in-ky-and-wv/

OR

2. It's all over, this doesn't count anyway, so why are you Clinton supporters even voting? Just stay home and keep your mouth shut. Sort of like the way FL and MI have been treated-

"The Democratic Race Is Over"- http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2008/05/07/opinion/main4078023.shtml , "Pundits Declare the Race Over" http://www.nytimes.com/2008/05/08/us/politics/07cnd-pundits.html?bl&ex=1210305600&en=ce371a86470524ce&ei=5087%0A


Get Out! Network Morning Shows Dismiss Hillary's Race as 'Over'" http://newsbusters.org/blogs/tim-graham/2008/05/07/get-out-network-morning-shows-dismiss-hillarys-race-over



"Clinton can't hear the fat lady, just the mothers of America" http://www.smh.com.au/news/us-election/clinton-cant-hear-the-fat-lady-just-the-mothers-of-america/2008/05/12/1210444338585.html




Truly sad to see the lengths that Obama supporters will go to suppress the vote, and if that doesn't work, to label the voters that do turn out as motivated by racial hatred.

[Dinger]

1. K & R

[WeDidIt]

2. So what was the Popular Vote count in IA, ME, NV, and WA?

When you can tell me those numbers, popular vote may have something approaching meaning here.

[bowens43]

3. Obama is the nominee.

stop your whining, jump on the band wagon or don't.

[Endangered Specie]

4. Does this popular vote count include caucus states?

[endarkenment]

5. a) no she isn't.

b)delegates count, popular vote can't even be counted accurately.

[Jersey Devil]

20. Also doesn't give Obama 1 single vote in Michigan

Hillary's campaign has devolved into a complete joke

[sabra]

6. you are quoting Terry McAuliffe - Mr. Spinmaster

[GarbagemanLB]

7. The popular vote is a bullshit metric because of Caucuses. You'd have a point if there

were only primaries.

[ingac70]

8. Forgetting the other 3 races...

Obama will win handily? The next six races will be a wash and Hillary will still be behind in popular vote.

[rox63]

9. Way to disenfranchise the caucus states

:banghead:

[zulchzulu]

10. The nominee is picked by delegate count, not the popular vote...

Those are the RULES. I know, when some people can't admit a loss, they try to change the rules. They are called CHEATERS.

[2rth2pwr]

16. The rules include Superdelegates, and they can use any metric or no metric to choose.

[hendo]

23. And Obama will win the SDs too.

Hillary can win by 10%+ in each of the remaning primaries and Obama will still get the nomination almost by default. She is fighting a losing battle and ruining her rep in the process. Not that I have a problem with HRC further damaging her reputation, but when she hurts the eventual nominee in the process thats just stupid.

[2rth2pwr]

27. He hasn't yet.

[democrattotheend]

29. He just took the lead

And I find it highly unlikely that an overwhelming majority of those left support Clinton. Most superdelegates who support Clinton endorsed her before the primaries began, when she looked inevitable.

[2rth2pwr]

34. Whether or not you think it's likely or not, the contest continues.

If you think the primary is over, you can post in other forums. This one is titled GD:Primaries.

[hendo]

56. Sure

the contest continues for now, once Obama has the 2025 delegates though, HRC should bow out gracefully. She does know how to do that, right?

[tblue37]

45. I hear the sound of goalposts being moved--yet again! n/t

[lisa58]

11. I thought it was about delegates?

[2rth2pwr]

14. It is, Superdelegates also.

[lisa58]

24. delegates are delegates...

...super or pledged

[2rth2pwr]

28. Yes, and she can convince SD's with large popular vote blowouts.

[lisa58]

33. bet she can't

[otohara]

17. It Is....Otherwise Al Gore

would have been our President.

[rucky]

12. 3) Any count that includes Michigan is bogus

4) She did well in big swing states among Democratic voters. That is NO indication she has a better chance of beating McCain in a general. That's why they're called swing states.
5) Superdelegates are trending away from Hillary and towards Obama, so make your case if you feel you must, but accept the results.

[endarkenment]

13. f) demanding rules changes at the end of the game is pathetic.

[rucky]

15. w) Operation Chaos. n/t

[rucky]

25. VII) $20M debt.

[endarkenment]

32. 1.4.6 Stupid OP talking point - its over deal with it

[rodeodance]

66. But Obama is going apandering to MI today. to bad he did not show he cared earlier.

[tekisui]

80. Hillary didn't care earlier either. She is a hypocrite.

And she has turned down more compromises than Obama, when they've tries to rectify the mess.

[scheming daemons]

18. You can spin yourself into the ground.... Obama's still the nominee....

You're down to hoping that he is "caught with a live boy, or a dead girl".


That.... or hoping for him to get hit by a bus.

[susankh4]

19. Yes she is.

And all the while we have a bunch of D.U.ers saying these votes don't matter. Not West Va., not KY, not OR.... on and on. The list of voters who just "don't matter."

Can you believe the Super Dels may have to go against the will of the voters to install Mr. Obama? Good luck to the Dem party with that strategy....

[ima_sinnic]

37. "the will of the voters"- ?? SD's consider many things, esp. what is best for the party,

who stands the best chances of winning the GE, who fires up voters, who brings in new voters, WHO BRINGS IN MONEY, etc.

Primaries are not a "democratic" process; they are a party process that happens to include general voters. More factors than just the "popular vote" are considered. Choosing the nominee also includes caucuses, so the whole question of a "popular vote" is moot anyway.

In every metric the SD's use to evaluate and commit themselves to a candidate, HILLARY HAS LOST--she has fwon a lot fewer states, won fewer pledged delegates, has run her campaign into bankruptcy, has not registered any new voters that anybody knows about, has disapprovals in the high double digits, with approval down around zero, carries around baggage that would fill umpteen boxcars with scandal and unsavory dealings, not a good reflection on Democrats, is a backstabber, is a proven liar, and has recommended the Republican candidate over the Democrat.

What SD in his or her right mind is going to go for that kind of anti-party fuckwad? The only ones who stick by her now are the old-school people who are indebted to her for one reason or another. When they get into the privacy of the voting booth, they will vote for someone else, too.

but feel free to be delusional--or republican, whatever your problem is.

[susankh4]

40. Shoe's on the other foot now...

I see.

[islandmkl]

21. in a somewhat-related development...

the New England Patriots intend to use points scored earlier in the 2007 football season against the Jets and Dolphins to apply to their Super Bowl score...

making the NEW ENGLAND PATRIOTS the 2008 SUPER BOWL CHAMPIONS!!

...or something like that...

[MikeDJohn]

30. Go Pats! YEAH But not by cheating like that!

They lost! Hillary lost! We can all Get Over It!

[DearAbby]

22. What popular vote in colorado?

and all the other states who held a caucus instead? this Popular vote argument is not valid. I dont know why the Clinton supporters continue to raise this.

[SeaLyons]

26. K&R

[debbierlus]

31. GO VOTE ON THERE POLL QUESTION:

Cnn.com has a ambiguous question about what should count more in determining the nominee...

The popular vote or the delegate count.

They are SETTING up the people. I posted this in another thread and people are stating they believe the popular vote should count, not realizing this poll is a set up by CNN. Post is in my journal, if interested.

[mckeown1128]

35. Newsbusters??? more right wing sources for Clinton talking points. nt

[2rth2pwr]

41. Rightwing sources parroting Obama supporters.

[mckeown1128]

62. wow your reply doesn't even make sense... go troll some where else. nt

[2rth2pwr]

71. Over your head? Too bad.

[dionysus]

84. you need to drink a cup of coherance...

:rofl:

[dbmk]

36. Noone is suppressing anyone as far as I can tellIts all over soon anyway

About 20 more SDs and Obama will reach 2025 by the end of the primaries. He has already prevented Hillary from doing it.

At the current rate we are talking 4-5 days. But something tells me this will not continue long past tomorrow.

[Jane Austin]

38. Terry McCauliffe has so many "tells" it would be unsafe to

make a drinking game out of them.

First on Face the Nation then on MTP. You can absolutely tell when he's telling a whopper so big even he doesn't believe it!

Fun!

[CakeGrrl]

39. When you come up with the popular vote totals for *EVERY VALID PRIMARY*

We'll see where it stands.

Did you count the caucus states? Every one that participated in this primary election?

Are you still trying to throw in MI and FL even though they are not valid, despite the delusional spin of Terry McAuliffe?

Terry's lies do not alter reality.

If you did not include the caucus states, you have a meaningless number and a meaningless argument.

[2rth2pwr]

42. MI and FL won't be seated? Are you saying none of their delegates will be used?

[nemo137]

53. Given that Hillary is the only remaining candidate whose name

was on the MI ballot, I'd say it's pretty laughable to award her the votes for that one, yeah.

[2rth2pwr]

54. You must have posted to the wrong person. That wasn't the question.

[Patchuli]

61. Hillary agreed that those states would not count.

Then she cheated and campaigned and did not remove her name. Those states cannot be counted without a re-do. You cannot change the rules because you don't like the outcome after you agreed to the rules one way. Whatta pathetic attempt to cheat. Almost like she had a new (Rove) coach! Forget MI and FL this time around.

[2rth2pwr]

64. Hillary fought for a redo, Obama wants to keep those voters under his thumb.

[Patchuli]

82. Obama is going by what they agreed. Period.

Hill is trying to change the rules since she didn't like the outcome of the game. Period.

[cliffordu]

43. LOL - god, you are sooooo funny!!

:rofl: :rofl:

your innocence is charming.

[amelia]

44. K&R

[Pawel K]

46. newsbusters is defending Clinton? And you post it here? You can't possibly be that stupid

you know you are full of shit and you just don't care anymore, right?

[2rth2pwr]

68. Are you one of those people that can't bear to click on the Drudge Report?

poor thing.

[lojasmo]

47. Simply wrong.

Even if you count non-sanctioned Florida, Michigan cannot be counted for a couple of reasons
1)Obama was not on the ballot.
2) their election was ruled unconstitutional.

Also, there's the messy 'not counting four caucuses' math of Clinton's.

essentially, the whole argument is crap.

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

48. Even if true, what difference would it make?

She's finished. Finito.

[OzarkDem]

49. She'll pick up a lot of delegates and votes in WV and KY

More than Obama will gain in Oregon.

[oasis]

50. That's another reason why Obama continues to duck debates. (eom)

[Laura PourMeADrink]

51. Is there a pill for delusion? Sorry, but it's over, go through the

grief and try and pull yourself together. Sometimes our favorites win and sometimes
they lose. That's life. But being delusional - like she has a chance with the
SD landslide building and building. It's over. Sorry, I know you love her, but
it's over. She should have quit in TX - with grace, good sportsmanship, and dignity.
Every day she's been in, a new person a minute has grown to dislike her. But, it
is her own fault - she could have maintained her dignity and maybe had a decent
shot later. I for one, might have given her consideration, if she had acted
with class - Now she just looks like she's out to ruin O's chances only. There
is no other conclusion to be made.

Not only is this race over - but it's too bad, her higher career, do to her own actions,
is over as well.

[Texas Hill Country]

52. k&r

[samsingh]

55. didn't President Gore already do that

[Clear Blue Sky]

57. BFD. The nomination is not decided by popular vote.

[2rth2pwr]

69. Yea, I remember you making that argument for b*sh in 2000.

[AtomicKitten]

58. If only that made a damn bit of difference, which it doesn't, plus it's not true.

Obama has:
* More states.
* More popular vote.
* More superdelegates.
* More delegates.
* More money.

Obama wins by any metric.

[RareLubbockDem]

59. And I'm within striking distance of winning it all!

All we need to do is uproot and move the goal posts one more time!

In fact, why the hell won't he debate me??

[NoodleyAppendage]

60. If you and your Hillary ilk were walking on the road...then you would be "within striking distance."

Just go away. Please. Just go away.

IT IS OVER.


J

[MaineDem]

63. There.is.no.popular.vote!

It does not exist.

There is no way to count it.

There is no mention of it in the rules as counting for anything.

Regardless of which campaign is using the term it is bogus.

There...is...no...popular...vote...count.

[rodeodance]

65. there.is.a.popular.vote!

[MaineDem]

78. Sorry but I know for a fact that there isn't

For example, there is no count for Maine. None, nada, zip. Delegates were counted but never the popular vote. Same is true, I believe, for all the caucus states.

[PBS Poll-435]

67. K&R*

Too late to recommend.

Thanks for the post, though.

[indimuse]

70. Why are The Obama's ,his supporters and the MSM so vehemently TRYING to get Hillary to quit..

to disenfranchise millions of American voters and Hillary's RIGHT to finish the primary..She has EVERY RIGHT! And REASON to take this all the wway to the convention!!! WHO are YOU to TRY to BULLY her out??? The longer we wittness the campaign, the More evident it appears, BO CAN NOT WIN THE GE!!! Step outta DU, and go look at some maps...Obama SURE to LOSE!
K&R!!!!

[2rth2pwr]

72. You got it.

[grantcart]

74. stay as long as you want

Obama is now 140 delegates away and there are only 400 delegates left.


He has 45 super delegates from states he won by landslides - caucuse states most of them that you don't count.

Just sit back and watch the deluge over the next 3 days.

oh and by the way Hillary is not only losing super delegates she lost her first pledge delegate today.


So far Hillary is down about 8 delegates this week (including WV)

[amelia]

73. K&R

[ImpeechBush]

75. A 41% margin isn't a loss, it's a repudiation

Every voter in West Virginia who listened to the news this past week heard the same message from the media. The race was over. Obama was the presumptive nominee. There was no point in voting for Clinton; she had lost.

No doubt a number of Clinton voters were convinced by the constant refrain, and voted for Obama, ready to move on.

So how do you get to a 41% margin for Clinton? Obviously this was more than a preference of one candidate. It was a huge "Hell No!" in the face of conventional wisdom.

I still think Obama is going to be our nominee. But I hope he has a good plan and strategy to bridge the gap between himself and the many Democrats who so adamantly oppose him. Get past the bravado; there is no way we can write this many people off and win the general election.

[kevinbgoode]

76. Hillary should have dropped out after she failed to meet her goal

of sewing up the nomination by Super Tuesday. After all, she wasn't very interested in popular vote, having all the states have a say, or Florida and Michigan.

She failed. She had all the advantages and she failed to not even make the deal.

Frankly, I still don't even understand why she ran this time. For the last few years, the Repukes have been waiting for her to run - she not only started as a presumptive inevitable nominee but the Republicans expected her to be the candidate as well.

She apparently cannot successfully campaign without promoting division in this country, which, if anyone is paying attention, ain't gonna work this time around from any candidate. When someone who was supposed to be the inevitable nominee has negatives so high that she can't finish the primary process as a frontrunner, it is her electability across the board that is in question - not the one who is ahead.

[jefferson_dem]

77. I'm still not convinced. Did she talk about this in her "greatest speech ever given" tonight?

If so, that just might do it for me.

[tekisui]

79. She netted 147,000 last night.

She won't reach Obama's popular vote count. And, it is such a flawed metric as to be laughable. Caucuses don't count the popular vote.

[datopbanana]

81. :0

[dchill]

83. Oh! I see now. Hillary was running in a primary contest...

in a separate reality, where only popular votes cast in non-caucus and disqualified states were to be counted toward her "nomination" - in that case, she's the WINNAH!

Hillary Clinton, winner of the Carlos Castaneda Primaries.