Obama men! Post here if you're tired of being called "sweetie" by sexist women

[Hugabear]

See how ridiculous this is? Or is the double standard okay?

[ruby slippers]

1. I'm not a man, but I get called "sweetie" all the time by the waitresses....and

I hate that, too. Does that count?

[Hugabear]

7. Next time that happens, do something about it

Doesn't matter if it's some kindly old grandmother who's working part-time to make some extra money. If she calls you "sweetie", that's plainly sexist and you should complain to her boss, and get her fired.

:sarcasm:

[Marrah_G]

27. There is a big difference between that and the Obama story

Women in Journalism have worked their asses off to break into the "boy's club". For a woman to be called "sweetie" by a man in power, in front of all her colleagues is indeed demeaning. It reduces her to a only female, rather then a colleague. It is not meant as a term of endearment, because the person saying it has no real affection for a woman he doesn't know.

I don't think it was intentionally demeaning, but it was demeaning. He would have never spoken to one of her male colleagues in such a manner.

As a professional woman I would not appreciate being called sweetie by a colleague who didn't know me extremely well. And even then I would be taken aback if he called me that in the middle of a meeting in front of my co-workers.

[Hugabear]

65. So context means nothing - it's all or nothing with you?

I agree, if a male superior, co-worker, or colleague were to call a professional woman "sweetie" in a demeaning manner, then you have a very legitimate complaint. But to make this an "all or nothing" issue is also wrong.

[DesertFlower]

15. i'm not a man either.

doesn't bother me. waitresses sometimes do that. i bought some pottery from a woman a few years ago who kept calling me "babygirl". i was older than her. not a problem.

[Harry Monroe]

51. I don't mind sweetie

But I hate it when a waiter or waitress comes up and says "Hi, I'm Joe (or Joan) and I'll be your waiter/waitress tonight". I am always tempted to respond "Hi I'm John and I'll be your customer tonight" (but my wife usually stops me before I can get the words out, by kicking me under the table)

They're there to make a living, I'm there to eat. So we gotta be on a first name basis for the hour or so we're in the restaurant??:shrug:

Just a pet peeve of mine

[IndyOp]

67. The waiter/waitress puts themselves in a subservient position to you by giving their first name

- part of the purpose of them giving their first name is so that you can "order them around" if you were so inclined to do so. Joan we need coffee. Joan can I get the check? Joan my little one wants a chocolate ice cream. Joan, where are the bathrooms?

Many people would find it very rude (and "uppity") if their waiter/waitress did not give their name.

Just a thought, take what you like and leave the rest.

Peace.

[Harry Monroe]

68. And perhaps, subconsciously, that's why I don't like it

I don't need a servant when I eat, and I am not inclined to order people around like they are some damned peasant. It is just not my style, never has been and never will. I am simply a member of the working class myself and never felt the need to boss people around. I know what it is like to work hard for a living, working shitty hours for shitty pay. The first name basis thing grates me. I never offer my name, so why should they offer theirs? Our relationship lasts for an hour or less. I know it is their job to see that the customer is satisfied and has his culinary wants fulfilled while he/she is there, but I cannot stand when I am in deep dinner conversation with someone and it is constantly interrupted by their coming over to to say "Is everything OK?". If it is not, I'll signal them. Why interrupt my conversation to ask. If you must ask, pick a time when I am not engaged in conversation.

Anyway, rant over. It just hit a raw nerve.:rant:

[IndyOp]

72. I think it is helpful to let them know that you don't need a lot of attention -

I feel the same way about that, so I usually let them know up front that all I'll need is to order, get food, and get the check. If I need them for anything, I'll wave...

:hi:

[Enrique]

2. sweetie's ok, but "chief" is another story

:mad:

[JasonHill]

3. im not your chief, fwend

:grr:

[jgraz]

4. Ditto for "boss" or "big guy"

[Marrah_G]

5. You really just do not get it. It's sad.

[Beausoir]

8. They get it. They just think sexism is funny because they get away with it.

[casus belli]

18. Good luck with your crusade of political correctness. n/t

[Marrah_G]

31. You are damn right it is a crusade. Women are STILL fighting every day for equality and respect

ESPECIALLY in the workplace.

[casus belli]

41. If you don't realize this isn't helping, then I don't know what to tell you.

Implying covert sexism in an admittedly reckless comment without looking at the context is meaningless and does nothing to reduce the very real cases of sexism that occur every day. If anything it serves to diminish the impact of the word. Not to mention, he apologized for the comment and made more than a reasonable effort to make it up to her. Let it go. Choose your battles.

[Marrah_G]

48. I think I have said a dozen times...

That I don't think he meant it to be demeaning and that it was great that he apologized personally to her.

This incident does bring Sexism in the workplace into the light. We are talking about it right now. Had this not happe3ned we might not be thinking about it.

[casus belli]

53. I'll give you that.

I think you're right. We should be discussing it more, I'm in complete agreement with you on that point. We just need to be careful about HOW we discuss it. I've seen discussions on sexism completely devolve into chaos even when both sides were well-meaning initially.

[Marrah_G]

55. Yup- sort of like politics and religion- we on DU are so screwed :)

[NanceGreggs]

21. No, we think YOU'RE funny ...

... because you think calling a fellow human being by an endearing name is "sexism". But that's because you don't get it.

[Marrah_G]

34. Calling someone you have affection for "sweetie" is endearing

Calling a professional woman, in the workplace, in front of her colleagues, whom you do not know well enough to have any endearment for, is not appropriate.

[NanceGreggs]

40. What is truly inappropriate ...

... is taking a word or phrase meant to be taken as a gesture of friendliness and attempting to twist into being something demeaning or oppressive.

[Marrah_G]

46. I would have thought you of all people would get this.

I don't think Obama meant any harm and he apologized right away. He did the right thing, no big deal. Perhaps with it being talked about, other men might think twice before doing it.

Women have worked long and hard to be taken seriously in the workplace. Especially in a field like journalism.

I guess this is something we will never agree on.

[Hugabear]

62. What do you mean, "you of all people"?

Seriously - because she's a woman, she should think the same way that you do?

[Marrah_G]

64. Oh yeah- that's it exactly........

:eyes:

[Texas Hill Country]

70. it would be different if it was affectionate... it was dismissive, he was fending off questions...

that is not endearing.

[Occam Bandage]

39. Keep tilting at windmills. Some of them, I'm sure, are actually dragons.

[Colobo]

10. I'm 24. Girls my age and older women, in all sorts of settings, including work and school

call me "sweetie" or "dear".

[Hugabear]

16. Oh, I get it alright. I understand that the double standard is perfectly acceptable here

When a woman calls a man "sweetie" or some other term of endearment, it's no big deal, it's just her way of being friendly and polite. But if a man does that, it's automatically because he's treating her like a second class citizen, and not at all because he's trying to be friendly or polite. Cultural upbringing has absolutely NOTHING to do with this at all.

[Marrah_G]

36. No, you really do not get it and I am not sure if you ever will.

[cliffordu]

6. I remember the sadness the day I realized that the young women in

the stores and the bartenders were treating me like their dads, or worse, like now, like their grandfather......

:cry:

[eleny]

12. My first "ma'am"? That was a bad day.

[DesertFlower]

24. makes ya feel old, doesn't it?

when people come to my house to do work i always give them my first name. i'm informal and want people to feel comfortable with me.

[eleny]

45. yeah, kinda

:(

[last_texas_dem]

50. Don't feel bad

I have a bad habit of calling pretty much any woman who is assisting me (cashiers, waitresses, etc.) "ma'm" w/o even taking into consideration whether or not they may be married. It's just an effort to be respectful, and until one of my friends mentioned a couple of years ago that I may have "ma'm"-ed so women who aren't actually married and thus making them feel "old" I had never really thought about it.

[eleny]

57. i do understand it's a nice, respectful term

but i guess as i got older it was a shock. your mind is maybe 30 but your body is 60 and oy!

thanks for your reply. you're a sweetie! :evilgrin:

[casus belli]

9. Hon, sweetie, dear, even a few babes...

You could look at it as demeaning, or you could look at it as an awkward attempt at politeness. I choose the latter. I've yet to take offense at politeness, even if it is misplaced.

[mcctatas]

11. I have a bad habit of calling elderly men and women

"sweetie", I try really hard not to, but what can I say, I am a flawed human being :shrug:

[grantcart]

13. well I prefer it to "hey fatso"

[ruby slippers]

19. you have one right, there, grant.....

[casus belli]

20. LOL...Grant :)

[DesertFlower]

26. lol.

:rofl:

[crankychatter]

14. yes... I'm going to boycott the Waffle House

but the Gypsy told me I'd fall in love with a peroxide blonde, semi-obese waitress with a Southern drawl...

I'm doomed on principle

Maybe I should blame Obama

[Domingo Moore]

17. It's not the same

Men pay child support. Women don't. Some things are not the same.

[CaliforniaPeggy]

22. Men nearly always pay child support...

But occasionally, women pay it...

Just sayin'...

[ruby slippers]

23. men pay child support? My ex didn't get that memo apparently....

[DesertFlower]

30. mine sent checks.

most of them bounced around the block like a ball.

[ruby slippers]

35. I finally got mine when I moved to the same state as he and they

threatened to take his driver's license from him. He paid up real quickly....but, my girls never forgot that is how they got it finally....

[DesertFlower]

37. i was in the same state.

the judge went easy on him. i later found out that the court clerk lived in my ex's building.

[Harry Monroe]

69. Could you get the court to garnish his wages??

Any man who fathers a child is responsible for said child until he reaches adulthood. No exceptions, if, ands or buts. A man who doesn't pay child support is welshing out on his responsibility and is a scumbag. That the marriage broke up is not the child's fault. He took on a responsibility by bringing a new life into the world and to shirk that responsibility is reprehensible in my book.

[DesertFlower]

28. not true. if the woman makes more,

she might have to pay the man. i've known men who were getting alimony.

[DearAbby]

25. Ah hell, Honey...if it makes ya feel any better

:hi: Sweetie!

[cynatnite]

29. It's not ridiculous. You just don't get it. n/t

[DearAbby]

32. How about DUUUUUUUUUUUDE....does that demean?

[DU GrovelBot]

33. ## DON'T DONATE TO DEMOCRATIC UNDERGROUND! ##

==================
GROVELBOT.EXE v4.1
==================



This week is our second quarter 2008 fund drive. Democratic Underground is
a completely independent website. We depend on donations from our members
to cover our costs. Whatever you do, do not click the link below!

[Name removed]

38. Deleted sub-thread

Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Beregond2]

42. I understand why this was innappropriate, and it was good

he apologized, though of course no offense was meant. But there are so many other things being commonly said these days that offend me, that most people don't think twice about. For example, young women who refer to older ladies as "you guys." I hear that from waitresses all the time, and it makes me want to slap them silly. Not to mention the endless sexist abuse that is heaped on men by their women, and they have been brainwashed into thinking they deserve it, and can't respond.

I feel so sorry for straight men. If I had to put up with that kind of crap from a partner, he'd be saying it without teeth pretty damn quick.

[atufal1c]

43. The shit was just inappropriate.

He knows better.

Shouldn't have done it. We shouldn't make excuses for it. That's bullshit.

He apologized.

It's over.

[Forkboy]

44. To be fair, just switching the idea around doesn't make them equal situations.

As men have never been the victim of patriarchal oppression for centuries.

[Marrah_G]

49. Thank you Fork - I think its good that people are talking about it

AND.... I think Obama handled it great.

Of course to some here I am just a hysterical woman complaining about nothing.

[Forkboy]

56. It's a tough one.

To me what made it wrong was simply that it was in her work environment. Under different circumstances she might not have minded (we don't know...I could be wrong). To some women there's nothing wrong with what he said. To others there is. It shows what a minefield the topic of gender and race can be, and I think the complexity of it is what drives people to make bad attempts at oversimplifying it, as this OP does.

I suspect the word comes naturally to Obama being around his wife and daughters, but it's something that he should be a bit more careful with. There's a time and place for endearments with most people. I think he handled it well, and hopefully learned something from it.

[Marrah_G]

61. I think you nailed it exactly

[NewHampshireDem]

47. My boss calls me 'Love' or 'My Love' all the time ...

but she does that to everyone. And she's a lesbian. So what does this all mean? :crazy:

[jeff30997]

58. Er...

Reverse opposite non sexual non harassment? :crazy:

[nomorewhopper]

52. sweetie, hon, i get called it all

and im a man

and i couldnt give a shit

the phony outrage here is hilarious

[bhikkhu]

54. I spent a year in Atlanta and got called "sweetie" by lots of girls

What hell! If only there was a class action suit - sign me up! I am still in recovery! The scars may never heal!

[knixphan]

59. I like sweetie

My mom always called my dad 'sweetie'...

Once, in 1st grade, they asked what our parents names are, and when I was asked my dad's name, I replied 'sweetie'.

[bowens43]

60. happens all the time here in North Carolina..

sweete and sugar. I like it.

[Ichingcarpenter]

63. I've been called a sweetie by my female co-workers .. I confess

[hokies4ever]

66. I never complain

when an older woman calls me an endearing name. People need to pay attention to the intent behind actions and not just the action itself. This reporter just wanted 15 minutes of fame. She actually played Obama's personal apology to her to the media? Anyone else find that strange?

[Neshanic]

71. I would not mind being called sweetie by anyone.