"We’re going to decapitate them, smudge them, step on them, act like they never existed"

[madfloridian]

Those are the words of the former Democratic president, Bill Clinton, which he used against his own party today.

LOUISVILLE, Kentucky - Democrats are acting more like Republicans by not counting the results of the Florida and Michigan primaries and by not seating those states’ party delegates, former President Bill Clinton said on Tuesday.

“The Republicans are supposed to be the people that don’t count votes in Florida, not Democrats,” said Clinton.

The January votes in Michigan and Florida were deemed invalid by the national Democratic Party because both states moved their election dates forward in defiance of party rules.

“The Democrats said, ‘We’re going to decapitate them, smudge them, step on them, act like they never existed, act like they never voted,’” the former president said. “It’s very strange that the Democrats would be more authoritarian and more hostile to the voters.

“Do the right and decent thing by Florida and Michigan. Don’t let the Republicans look more enlightened than us, which they do today. It’s unbelievable. I never thought I’d see that,” Bill Clinton said.

Dems acting like GOP toward Florida, Michigan - Bill Clinton

I never thought I would see a former president acting like he is acting.

His wife accepted the party rules last year. She only decided to claim the delegates after she lost Iowa.

Here is the Meet the Press video in which Hillary Clinton's campaign accepted the DNC rules for the primary.

Hillary accepted & signed the DNC rules barring MI & FL. From a MTP interview

Here she goes again.
On Sept. 1 2007, she accepted and signed the DNC rules barring any other states having a primary earlier than the specified date. She did agree upon it before the election and now because she is losing, she wants them counted?
What about your signed pleadge? -
on MI and FL votes.

DNC Chairman Howard Dean
Letter to Democratic Presidential Candidates
August 31, 2007

As the leader of the Democratic Party, I strongly urge you to adhere to the 2008 Delegate Selection Rules...
The 2008 Delegate Selection Rules adopted by the full DNC at its August 2006 meeting clearly provide that only 4 states - Iowa, Nevada, New Hampshire and South Carolina - may hold their respective contests prior to February 5, 2008. The findings of Non-Compliance included a 100% loss of pledged and unpledged delegates.


Hillary Clinton Campaign
September 1, 2007

Clinton Campaign
Statement On The
Four State Pledge

We believe Iowa, New Hampshire, Nevada and South Carolina play a unique and special role in the nominating process. And we believe the DNC's rules and its calendar provide the necessary structure to respect and honor that role. Thus we will be signing the pledge to adhere to the DNC approved nominating calendar.
Added: April 06, 2008

Now she is claiming a win by popular vote, and using an electoral vote map made up by Karl Rove...to show she is ahead. She is using a type of new math and it does not compute.

...."If all states with popular vote totals are counted — which would exclude four caucus states that have not released numbers — Mrs. Clinton would lead Mr. Obama by more than 26,000 votes out of more than 33 million cast. By other calculations, Mr. Obama is ahead in the popular vote.

I have to live here in Florida, and the climate among Democrats is not healthy. The Clintons need to stop the divisiveness right now for the sake of the party and the country.

There have always been rules that govern a party. This year they are saying their rules matter more. She once said that the DNC rules for delegates were not the same as hers.

[Beregond2]

1. My shame at having ever supported them is growing daily.

[madfloridian]

2. I just feel sadness now.

:shrug:

[anigbrowl]

3. It's OK...6 months ago I wouldn't have believed this either.

Back in December the worst thing I would have said about her was that she seemed a touch overconfident.

[Raine]

18. Same here

I never thought I would feel such disgust for people I used to admire so much. :-(

[speedoo]

ditto.

They fooled the hell out of me.

But I learned my lesson. I live in NY and I will never vote for Hillary again. I know her now.

[mamalone]

91. Me too....

I will do whatever I need to do to make sure she does not ever represent me ever again. It seems every day I think this is it.. she can't go any further. But the next day she still does go further....

At this point I just find her appalling.

[Radio_Lady]

123. There are, of course, two sides to every story. Read the comments following the Reuters story..

Here are the first two:

May 20th, 2008
7:49 pm GMT

Sadly, rules were set and rules were not followed. When is enough enough and when do party rules actually mean anything? The states should have followed party rules. However, there are TONS of innocent people effected by this that had no say in what happened with the rules. If they really want to count the votes, then rerun the elections and allow the candidates to fairly represent themselves.

HOWEVER, if the shoe was on the other foot, Bill Clinton would not give a single care about those votes.

- Posted by Randy

May 20th, 2008
10:57 pm GMT

EXACTLY! … why wasn’t there a revote in FL and MI when there was time to do so? The reason was Barack Obama. He took his name off of the Michigan ballot and then he was the one who wouldn’t consent to a revote even when it was being paid for. So OBAMA is the one who is as responsible for the voters in those two states from being included in these 50 UNITED STATES of AMERICA. How in the world can he now ask for their votes in the general election. He doesn’t have a chance! He will reap the consequences of his inactions. That’s a lesson one should’ve learned in adolescence. Obama’s appeal is too narrow, and he’s not attracting the types of voters it will take to win against John McCain. Sad to see what this man’s arrogance has done to this country. Obama - a BIG mistake!

- Posted by Jon

(36 more comments follow which I did not read.)

[mamalone]

127. You know I understand that they are angry...

I understand that they are disappointed. I even understand that they don't "get" Obama. They don't like him... I know this. But that does not excuse a former POTUS for saying such reprehensible things. There is no excuse. none.

[Radio_Lady]

128. Fine. You win. Good-bye and good luck. RL Ellen

Feel better now?

I'm going to play with the living horses.

(acquired from DUer QC)

[mamalone]

129. OK.....

but I wasn't trying to "win." I was just trying to express my opinion... and I appreciate hearing yours even though (or maybe especially because) we are on opposite sides of this current issue:)

[Carolina]

21. mine, too

What a fool I was to have supported them so ardently and fiercely in the 1990s.

Now, Billary's behavior has made me believe every rightwing claim about them had some truth at its core. One thing is certain, they have shown their transparent quest for power and power only... people, party, rules and country be damned!

[mistertrickster]

35. Ditto . . . I defended Clinton during BJgate etc. Now I see that they were mainly

for themselves, not the party, not the country.

[ShortnFiery]

47. Well put, I feel the same. eom

[Missouri Girl]

85. It is sick and disgusting

and so beneath them. I'm so sick of this woman, I just see red everytime her goofy grin creeps on to my television screen.

[QC]

4. Oh yes, it's time for the daily thread on this topic.

[mcctatas]

7. And we almost went a whole 24 hours....

:rofl:

[QC]

10. It was purely a slip up! Honest! Won't happen again! n/t

[madfloridian]

11. When someone is tearing the party apart, I will speak up.

Laugh if you wish.

[cui bono]

8. It's not dead when every day it's a new attack on the Democratic Party.

If it had been a one time thing that happened and it kept being brought up you would have a point.

[madfloridian]

Exactly. It is a new daily outrage being said.

I will keep pointing it out.

[madfloridian]

9. There is no dead horse, I fear. This needs to be said.

Sorry you think it is a dead horse. I heard Hillary say she was just going to keep going on and on and on.

[QC]

13. Your candidate won tonight. Can you not celebrate a bit and enjoy yourself? n/t

[madfloridian]

17. No, he can't win until she says he does.

I am tired. I have to live here with the anger and divisiveness they caused.

Just hide the thread.

[ann_american2004]

81. guess that means

you will keep going on and on and blah blah blah...blah *yawn* zzzzzzzzzzzz

[Life Long Dem]

101. I guess that means

if he doesn't continue this then I'd pick up on it, if I lived in Florida, or if not me there would be someone else to pick it up.

Not enough appreciation is said about madfloridan and the news he is bringing from Florida. Thanks.

[madfloridian]

105. Why, yes. It does. As long they blab on and on so will I.

When they stop, I will as well.

[Crunchy Frog]

31. When she stops pushing it, people will stop posting about it.

[WillYourVoteBCounted]

46. Yes, Bill is beating a dead horse. Its a shame he tried to run for a third term

its best to retire gracefully.

I know he misses being president, but he needs to accept it.

[rambler_american]

96. Is that the horse

she rode in on?

[cliffordu]

5. I am so incredibly sad about this. Absolutely disgusting.

[cui bono]

6. Wow. This is why they need to get Clinton to drop out. Although I guess Bill would just

start going off about that. I'm sure there's no way to win with them.

[Skip Intro]

12. The rest of your OP headline is, "act like they never voted." Which is exactly what is happening.

He is correct. It is a simple fact.

[QC]

14. Shhhhhhhh! You weren't supposed to bring that up! n/t

[madfloridian]

16. I had that, but there wasn't room for Bill Clinton's name.

So I had to change it.

You guys seem proud of this.

[merh]

20. It appears that the rules and hillary's words don't matter to you

or Bill Clinton.

Some didn't vote because they knew it didn't count. They too were complying with the rules, shame you and others overlook that.

[Skip Intro]

25. Therefore we should discount those who did vote?

I mean, they are Americans. They did vote. They're Democrats. Over two million. Record turnout. Let the Democratic party tell them their votes are worthless. I'll relish voting for Hillary in 2012.

[madfloridian]

26. You are not even being realistic. Now that is denial of the worst sort.

.

[merh]

30. They knew going in the rules

What do you say should be done for those who didn't vote because they knew they wouldn't count?

The people of Florida and Michigan need to clean house with their party leaders and not let them continue to violate the rules.

[ChiciB1]

34. That'll Be The Day!!! n/t

[roguevalley]

49. 2012. She won't get the nod. that will be President Obama's second

run.

[Andy823]

82. Hillary agreed to the rules

"BEFORE" they voted, and back when she thought she had the nomination in the bag. Now the Clintons are trashing the party in order to try and come up with some kind of way for her to win. It's disgusting if you ask me!

[Citizen_Penn]

86. they voted for delegates.

it's a primary, NOT AN ELECTION.

[Damian the LHP]

108. Boo hoo.

They didn't follow the rules, their votes didn't count because they didn't follow the rules and THEY KNEW IT, and now that your failure of a candidate isn't going to win, you're all throwing whiny, foot-stamping tantrums.

Excuse me whilst I find my frilly shirt and tiny, tiny violin.

[Leopolds Ghost]

15. Bill Clinton finally outs himself. "The DEMOCRATS SAID WE could never get this far."

[kenny blankenship]

41. In a way Hillary is already running a 3rd party candidacy and has been for weeks

People scoff at the idea of her going Lieberman-Independent and being on the ballot in Nov., and I don't think she can, but clearly she hasn't been running as a Democrat.

[shadowknows69]

48. Exactly, since when do you refer to your party in the third person?

Shouldn't Bill be attacking the specific leaders that broke the rule? "The Democrats"? WTF!!! Why not just call us the Democrat Party Bill and complete your trip to the dark side. You and GHW Bush can rule from your dark tower together.

[undergroundpanther]

19. Hillary is not a democrat

I know some don't want to hear it. She has ties and beliefs similar to neocons.Bill had a follower of Leo Strauss, a neocon "philosopher" on his cabinet. The actions the Clintons are pulling are neocon tactics.
Neocons want the Dem's divided and Hillary is doing it just as the Neocons want it done. They do not want a true liberal in office that does not believe as they do. They do not want a person that can't be boxed in, bought,manipulated or intimidated into doing what the neocons want them to do.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x5265549
http://www.cato.org/pub_display.php?pub_id=8495
http://www.dissidentvoice.org/2007/07/richard-holbrooke-a-hillary-clinton-democrat/
http://www.dailykos.com/story/2008/4/27/125254/051/69/504365

[Lilith Velkor]

57. Then why did the neocons expend so much effort in ratfucking the Clintons?

If she were so much their girl, she'd be the candidate, no?

[billyoc]

113. They're competing with her for the same corporate spoils. nt

[Lilith Velkor]

117. Of course they are. So is Barack.

They are different factions of the same ruling class, and in that sense UGP is correct.

I'm just saying that Hillary is not in the same faction as the neocons, and the current turf war is over control of the opposing faction.

[w13rd0]

22. Thank you...

...it is a fascinating example of a pretty profound power struggle taking place.

[Douglas Carpenter]

23. I spent almost 8 years defending most things Bill Clinton did and always gave him the benefit of the

doubt.

This is so sad, just so sad.

[bbgrunt]

24. will this disgusting behavior

never end? They are really ramping it up for the rules committee meeting. I am totally disgusted with them. And you are right to continue to post this as long as they continue to destroy the party. Thank you for your diligence.

[madfloridian]

27. I know it angers people when I do, but the FL issue is ripping us apart

here in this state. No truth is told, and the Clintons just keep on pushing it.

If it angers people, I am sorry. But it is very telling of a struggle within the party.

[Hoof Hearted]

28. I stand with Billl, a true Democrat against the disenfranchisement of millions of voters in FL and

Michigan.

If the cadre of Barack Obama wants to be remembered as those who fought against counting against the votes of Florida and Michigan, they will deserve their fate.

[madfloridian]

29. Updating...

emptied list too soon.

[Pastiche423]

40. It has nothing to do w/Obama supporters

as has been said over and over again. The Dem leaders of Michigan and Florida should be your target. Deny the truth all you want, it won't change it.

[grantcart]

32. And all this time I thought 'Ground Hog Day' was a fictional story

I am sure glad we don't pay you for this - we could never afford it.

[madfloridian]

36. Please make me stop...

I feel like Bill Murray.

[Lilith Velkor]

58. Nobody's stopping you from posting stupid, divisive, undemocratic shit

We're just making fun of it. :popcorn:

[madfloridian]

62. I don't think grantcart was making fun of me.

I seriously doubt it.

But you are, and I just really don't give a hot damn.

Anyone defending the Clintons now is in serious denial.

[Muttocracy]

33. wow. nt

[AtomicKitten]

37. Much to the Clintons' surprise, they will find they in fact are not above the rules.

[Cha]

38. bil clinton is a desperate idtiot who needs to

be given some more rope..see ya, bil.

[Swamp Rat]

39. Bill Clinton has learned how to build a FUX Noise-style Straw Man.

That's what happens to you when you hang with neocons.

You become one of them.

[K Gardner]

42. I don't know how I missed this thread. Looked at the OP title and thought it was

a Republican talking point. God help us.

[madfloridian]

67. You were right the first time. It is a GOP talking point.

But it works quite well for the Clintons.

[DevonRex]

43. So Bill and Hill are not democrats anymore? WTF? nt

[DemVet]

44. Bill is correct. Deal with it.

[WillYourVoteBCounted]

45. OMG - would Bill be "tombstoned" from DU for saying this crap?

imagine if one of us posted that stuff here as our own words.

[rucky]

50. WTF, Bill!

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

51. And people still complain about Michelle's joke.

:rofl:

[crankychatter]

52. that's some false and inflammatory BS from Slick Willy, eh? n-t

.

[rox63]

53. It's sad that I now feel the need to tell Bill to STFU

After admiring him and Hillary so much during the 90's. :(

[madfloridian]

54. We need to get the media to stop using the "popular vote" count as valid.

I think they are doing it on purpose.

Chris Matthews did it last night when Wasserman Schultz was on with him.

[ShaneGR]

55. Well, since you've posted about this like 9 million times.....

I still disagree. My vote should at least mean something, even if its only 50% or whatever. Incidentally I voted for Edwards. Regardless of all the hyperbole about it, last I checked we're supposed to NOT disenfranchise voters.

[madfloridian]

61. Do you agree with Bill Clinton's words?

Just wondering.

[2rth2pwr]

56. Another post from you trying to stir division in the party, when you know damn well

that MI and FL delegates will count in some way based on the May 31st meeting. Your vitriol spewed at the Clintons is aimed at your stated goal of upholding the current

status quo which is total disenfranchisement of millions of American citizens.

Sick.

[Mimosa]

63. Hillary Clinton agreed to the 'rules'

2rth2pwr,nobody's 'sick' except...fill it in. HRC new what the rules were. She was willing to abide by them until Feb 5th hit her.

[2rth2pwr]

65. The rules include provisions for change and petition.

[greguganus]

75. I think its funny as hell you support Clinton and use that picture of her. n/t

[2rth2pwr]

76. Then you'll like this-

[HCE SuiGeneris]

74. Another post from you discounting the fact that it is the Clintons spewing vitriol

and attempting to divide the party.

Sick.

[Danger Mouse]

112. Hahaha, hypocrite.

[lojasmo]

59. Shame on you, William.

(lojasmo wags finger)

[Mimosa]

60. The Real Bill Clinton isn't cute, is he?

I always saw through Bill's affable glad-handing persona. Now he's showing the ruthlessness.

He must really want to get back in the White House. But Why? Does he want to die in it? Is he so unhappy out of it?

[madfloridian]

71. No, he isn't

I feel rather betrayed. I used to get in trouble with my fellow teachers defending him in this conservative area. I even defended him about Monica....

[flpoljunkie]

64. Madfl, Kevin Spacey, who plays Ron Klain in HBO's RECOUNT has bought Hillary's meme about counting

all the votes, and the Florida Democratic party establishment's spin--that it was the Republicans who did this to Florida's voters. Someone forgot to tell him how they willingly and eagerly went along with changing the date. Spacey is glib, but he's uninformed. He was just on MSNBC with Andrea Mitchell promoting RECOUNT, which will air on HBO this Sunday night, the 25th, at 9PM.

I believe they went along with moving the primary up in an attempt to catapult Hillary Clinton to a big win on Super Tuesday--give her the "Big Mo." But a funny thing happened on the way to the coronation of Hillary Clinton as our "inevitable" nominee...

[madfloridian]

66. Everyone has bought into Hillary's spin. That's the sad part.

I have tried to tell the truth, but in the end I am only one tiny voice and no one pays attention.

This is a sad thing to me, to see the Clintons pushing a lie about party rules.....and the media falling for it.

[Mimosa]

69. Kev is a longtime FOB....

...He's loyal to Bill, right or wrong. He doesn't count! LOL

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

68. My nose was right in it's resistance to the Clintons '92 & '96.

This time I'll heed it's warning if, god forbid, Hillary manages to frighten enough people to get her nominated.

[Mimosa]

70. Heck, yes, your nose was right.

I'm putting so many cool people on my buddies list. LOL

[AzDar]

72. He has lost his ever-lovin' mind.

:wtf:

[izzybeans]

73. My wife and I wondered the other day

The clinton's remind us very much of a married couple we are very good friends with. They had a cocaine problem and they would both be wide-eyed and outlandish the whole time we hung out. Very bombastic and out-of-touch. Makes me wonder where that $20 mil was spent. :)

[EnviroBat]

77. Not to mention the close Columbian business dealings...

[Eric J in MN]

78. I've defended previous things Bill Clinton said this year.

But not this time.

[KoKo]

79. I think his heart problem changed his personality...... That's pretty terrible

what he said...and some other things.

[ann_american2004]

80. spin spin spin

your quote on the front page is misleading. Former Democratic President Clinton did not say he would decapitate anyone.
Play fair
stop soiling the path of Obama


think before you stink!
Obama '08

represent HIM not your hate!
Obama can stand on his own without the smear from you.

[madfloridian]

84. Welcome to DU. You are defending the indefensible behavior of the Clintons.

Which is your right.

[ann_american2004]

87. lol- thank you

but how is it indefensible? It is his party--he is deeply vested in this party and it is his heart and soul. He's had to pay with the short and curlies to defend it.
If he is PO'd about something let him speak. He has that honor. While this party has been handing out asshats and unelectables for 40 years, with the fortunate exception of him? LOL. Let him speak.

[madfloridian]

88. He just spoke of that party as in the third person.

It is not his party, it is OUR party as well.

[ann_american2004]

90. yeah maybe he's not feeling the love

right about now. But as they say in the biz "The man's earned his just wraps." Let him speak.

[madfloridian]

94. He has no right to speak ill of the party that treasured him for years.

He has no right to do that.

[ann_american2004]

120. Oh yes

here at DU you do indeed treasure him. hmmm it just oozes from the rafters this 'treasuring'. (been here on and off since primaries from 2004 election, lurking, so I know some DU). Must say there's been a bit of remodeling in recent months. Place has changed inside a bit. But it has always been fiesty.

I suppose some think Democratic President Clinton should demure, be grateful. Yes. He should act more like Jesus. That guy never got pissed off at those zealots who treasured and then crucified him.

[skyounkin]

111. He can speak all that he wants

if it was the truth- but since it just right-wing spin- he can STFU.

[ann_american2004]

121. wow - rightwing spin? LOL!

I doubt Clinton suffers from Stockholm, so your calling him a right winger is very amusing. You should go on the road with that.

Obama '08!
Let the man stand on his own
not under the rubble of the vicious purpose of his flock!
Don't soil his good name
by calling out false blame
on a hero from our past
who did much for the party and passion
Of a needy generation!
We let Chappaquiddick go
Yet call Hill a ho
Which is your party?
I dunno.
But Obama does!
He knows right from wrong
It is his creed, his passion his song.
Emulate the Man!
Man!
I know you can!
Man!

[yardwork]

83. I'm disgusted with Bill Clinton. That makes me sad.

I remember Bill Clinton's speech at the 2004 Democratic Convention. I thought it was great. I've never been so disillusioned by a leader. Normally I don't think much of politicians, so my opinions rarely have far to fall. By 2004 I had forgiven Bill Clinton for a lot of things and was well on my way to actually admiring the man.

All that is gone now.

[georgecolombo]

89. Let's Look At Who Exactly Is Acting Like Republicans

Hillary is citing Karl Rove as an electoral authority.

Bill appeared on the Rush Limbaugh show.

Terry McAuliff commended FOX News for its "fair and balanced" coverage.

Lanny Davis praised FOX NEWS, also.

Both Clintons are complaining about the biased mainstream media.

And so on, and so on.

So, you tell me, who is acting like Republicans?

[pjt7]

92. The Clinton's are ruthless politicans

to think the Republican party has a lock on dirty tricks is foolish. There quest for power has no ends & it's up to the real leaders of the Democratic party to say enough is enough.

[paulk]

93. tell it like it is, Bill

Oh, I'm sorry. Did I interrupt your daily Clinton hatefest?

--------------------

“The Republicans are supposed to be the people that don’t count votes in Florida, not Democrats,” said Clinton.

carry on!

[tbyg52]

95. Dear Bill: Go jump in the lake. nt

[Perry Logan]

97. As usual, your premise is dead wrong.

Clinton was quoting when he used those words. You ascribed something he was quoting to him, falsely presenting them as his own words.

Technically, that's prevarication on your part. If Hillary did it, you'd call her a LIAR (with all caps, natch).

This howler does little to dispel the impressions that Obamites are a little off in the head, and not overly bright.

[madfloridian]

106. Ooooh,...so not true. He was pretending to be quoting. He made up the words.

They are hurting themselves with their own words, and I intend to keep pointing them out.

Oh, BTW...who the heck do you think Bill was quoting? Links, please.

[Damian the LHP]

110. Ah, of course.

We're crazy because you backed a loser. Then again, what do I expect from the "there's no racism, you're just sexist" crowd?

[zulchzulu]

98. The Clinton Family legacy is definitely headed into the backwaters where it belongs

Bill and Hillary KNOW they are lying. Just as they both are complicit in helping have the working class get in worse conditions and think they are stupid enough to still vote for them, they are assuming that people have not figured out that Hillary Clinton had agreed with the Four State Pledge and only transparently decided that the rules needed to be changed because that's the only way she can "win" at this point.

Just as Bill openly cheated on Hillary in the White House and presumed she was too stupid to think he would be caught, Hillary Clinton is trying to cheat on the American public and think she can get away with cheating as well.

Trust the Clintons at your peril.

[weezie1317]

99. Truth is, he wouldn't be saying that if Obama had also broken the rules...

and put his name on teh ballot. I loved Bill Clinton as a president, but he's being Karl Rovian here.

[Life Long Dem]

100. He's filling them with lies and distorting this.

She signed the DNC rules. Wave that in front of his face.

[invictus]

102. Zell Miller, Joe Lieberman, Bill & Hillary Clinton ... one by one the neo-cons are storming out ...

... of the Democratic Party after stabbing it in the back.

[chill_wind]

103. That's really graphic language.

The kind I'd expect to hear at a Karl Rove fundraiser dinner for Bush.

[Cherchez la Femme]

104. Misrepresentative quotation

You selectively chose, as your title, a string of words which he did say, yet the designed impression is that Bill Clinton was talking about what he was going to do to "third person Democrats" instead of the quote in context. Very clever --and very unfair-- of you to leave out both the beginning (“The Democrats said...") and end ("act like they never voted,’” the former president said. “It’s very strange that the Democrats would be more authoritarian and more hostile to the voters.")of that particular sentence, which changes the meaning completely from the appearance of Bill and Hillary threatening the Democratic Party to a legitimate gripe about the complete and total mess-up of the Florida and Michigan primaries.

I have nothing against Barack Obama, except for what his "fans" have instilled in my mind by their own actions and their own rhetoric.
By what I've observed here and on many other sites, and by the continuation (Obama not taking control and laying down the law of what is unacceptable) there is NO ersatz, vaunted "change" in the Obama campaign -- it is as cut-throat as any political race ever run, Democratic OR Republican. With all the overdone 'outrage' by his fanbase, time and again it is those same fans who cross the line over and over again.

There is as much unity with Obama's base as there was with all of Dubya's promised unity.
And that is the most shocking of all, because it is within the same party!
You are eating your own, and reveling in it.


How well you have learned from the Republicans -- and still think you can claim the high road!

Mine are not the only newly-opened eyes as to where our Party is. Severe blowback will occur, yet you've been warned this repeatedly and still apparently don't care, based upon the unchanged behavior.

Is it so fucking difficult to like one candidate and talk them up, and NOT hate the other candidate? Jesus, how childish.
And the result is the party is needlessly split. The adage A Divided House Cannot Stand comes immediately to mind.
How unfortunate not only for the Democratic Party, but for the entire world; of all times now, when we should be united.

[madfloridian]

107. Those were Bill's words. No one in the party said them but him.

I don't do guilt trips, and I don't like being accused of lying.

Wow, there must be the word out on me tonight. You think?

[Cherchez la Femme]

118. No, it's not your actions

it's not your own words, but "the word" must be out on you... :eyes:

And you indeed selectively EDITED, for negative EFFECT, what he said. You admitted you edited, above, yet now you're complaining about a guilt trip?
Mine is not the only post of this type, if you feel guilty you may want to actually consider what was said.

Clearly, a very many of Obama's fans are delirious, and it reflects poorly upon him.
And as for the other comment about Bill Clinton of all people (the 'first black president', remember?) being racist; that doesn't even deserve a response.
If they really cared about Sen. Obama,
and about unity, which is the key to winning
and about what will happen after the primary, which is what is truly important
they'd be much more circumspect about their rhetoric and hate and rein it in -- concentrate on what is important and non-divisive, not these created sideshows chock full of staged, overreacted outrage.
It's obvious they don't; as obvious as they have forgotten who the real enemy is and what we ALL have to do, together, to defeat it.

[Major Hogwash]

109. Bubba is a racist piece of shit.

And we're not "fans", we're Democrats!!

[Lilith Velkor]

115. Well said

And welcome to DU. :hi:

[Penndems]

132. I'm bookmarking this thread based on just this one post

Bravo - well said. A mature, thoughtful and honest response.

Welcome to DU.

[Zambero]

114. Self-serving crap

Bill Clinton would cede all of Michigan's delegates to Hillary, since Obama voluntarily took his name off the ballot in accordance with the DNC rules. By counting all votes for her, Obama supporters in that state would be truly disenfranchised. But then again, Bill is citing the new Clinton rules and not the ones Hillary signed onto earlier. There is no subtlety here. It's a wanton blow against democratic processes. When Saddam Hussein ran for election in Iraq, all the votes were counted, all for him all the time. The Clintons now champion that model, not because it is fair, but because it would give them a boost in the delegate count,one they did not earn. The whole world is watching.

[Tommy_Carcetti]

116. Eat us! Hey, it's Thanksgiving Day! Eat us, we make a nice buffet!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tIufyg09WnQ

Eat us! Hey, its Thanksgiving Day!
Eat us, we make a nice buffet!
We lost the race with Farmer Ed,
eat us 'cause we're good and dead.
White man or red man from east, north or south,
chop off our legs, and put 'em in your mouth!

Eat me!
Sautéed or barbecued!
Eat me!
We once were pets but now we're food!
We won't stay fresh for very long!
So eat us before we finish this song!
Eat us before we finish this song!

[SaveAmerica]

119. Do you have a link to the video of the vote in Florida to move the primary date up?

I tried to do a youtube search but couldn't find it. Thanks.

[madfloridian]

131. Here are several

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=385x136278

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=385&topic_id=135846&mesg_id=135846

And this one where Wasserman Schultz says rules are non-productive right after Dean is shown saying we need rules.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=385x136162

[SaveAmerica]

133. Thanks, that's just what I was looking for

[Career Prole]

122. Gee, thanks for clearing that up, Bill!

Now I know that I no longer have to say "with all due respect" before I tell you to kiss my ass.

[npincus]

124. kick

[barack the house]

125. They are really trying to whip up a frenzy. Awful, basically they are linking the DNC emotively to

terrorists.

[barack the house]

126. They are really trying to whip up a frenzy. Awful, basically they are linking the DNC emotively to

terrorists.

[defendandprotect]

130. Huge profits are at stake for the Clintons and DLC . .. don't forget that --- !!!

Yes, the corporate-sponsored DLC is dedicated to moving the party to the RIGHT --
and HRC is part of their leadership --- !!!

This is the right-wing power group distorting and attacking the play ---
HRC said she was removing herself from one of those ballots --- and she didn't!

HRC is declaring herself the winner in a race where she had no competition because
everyone else followed the rules!!!

Disgusting --- Bill and HRC are destroying her future in political office !!!

[saltpoint]

134. Bill Clinton needs to sit down with someone like Bill Moyers and shut his

ridiculous mouth for five minutes and listen.

He learned a lot early on but appears to have forgotten much of it.

He needs the benefit of counsel. He has not done his wife many favors this winter and spring. He's done his own legacy even fewer.

[liberaldem4ever]

135. I truly don't understand what they are thinking

I would RESPECTFULLY love to know what the Clinton supporters are planning. I understand that they think she deserves the nom, but have they really thought ahead? What do they expect will happen if they do find the one really unlikely scenario where they CAN take the nom from Obama at the convention and actually accomplish her strategy to be the Dem nominee?

Do they think that Obama's supporters will ever support her if she gets the nom this way? Wouldn't it just create so many bad/angry feelings that any chance to win the GE would be lost?

If the Clinton camp have figured out any possible way where she could win the GE after she got the nom that way, I would love to hear it so I can understand their position better. And if you don't have a way to win the GE, then WHY are they putting our party through this much stress? The Repubs are really loving this. :shrug: