Bill Clinton Admits Hillary Does NOT Have the Popular Vote.

[berni_mccoy]

During the speech where he claims that the media is out to get her to shut down her campaign, Bill Clinton makes the following statement:

"If you vote for her and she does well in Montana and she does well in Puerto Rico, when this is over she will be ahead in the popular vote," Clinton said.

quote taken from: http://www.cnn.com/2008/POLITICS/05/26/bill.clinton.mon/

So it appears that they recognize they do *not* yet have the popular vote. I hope that this is taken into consideration during the May 31st RBC.

[BeyondGeography]

1. A weak moment

He'll bounce back.

[mcctatas]

2. Yeah.....

every once in a while he slips up and tells a truth about Hillary's performance;)

[berni_mccoy]

3. I think he knows the writing is on the wall and they are desperately grasping onto it

[papau]

16. Folks - Hillary has popular vote now - after PR she'll have it without FL/Mich counted

[berni_mccoy]

21. Apparently, even Bill doesn't agree with you.

[RUMMYisFROSTED]

22. Caucus doodle doo!

[CoffeeCat]

28. Hillary does NOT have the popular vote...

Hillary left out four caucus states, in her creative, lie-based "popular vote" metric.

How curious--since Obama won all of those states!

Man, some of you have no problem spewing complete balderdash with a straight face.

How do you do it?

She's not winning the popular vote. That's a big, fat lie.

Regurgitating this false talking point, reveals who the lemmings are.

[dionysus]

52. you know that to be false.

[Window]

32. Yes, those Clintons do have their moments.

[hendo]

50. the brief glimpse of truth, you mean? n/t

[high density]

4. Yeah those "popular votes" down in Puerto Rico

are much more important than the delegates from our caucus states.

[Liberal_Stalwart71]

5. Yeah, I thought small states didn't matter! n/t

[PoliticalAmazon]

10. New Clinton campaign talking point: "As goes Puerto Rico, so goes the nation." n/t

[thereismore]

30. Nice.

:smoke:

[Why Syzygy]

6. That was a slimy play. He is *implying* that the popular vote means something.

Isn't that psychotic?

[MonkeyFunk]

8. How is it psychotic?

It's an argument to the superdelegates that more democrats prefer Clinton to Obama. It's a pretty good argument, I think.

[Why Syzygy]

11. Psychotic means break with reality. POPULAR VOTE!! Means nothing.

So sorry. Hillary lied to you. Again.

[MonkeyFunk]

15. No

it does mean something. You just don't like what it means.

[TheDoorbellRang]

25. Popular vote would only be a meaningful parameter if no states used caucuses

There are about 15 states that chose the caucus method to pick their nominee. Whether or not one "likes" them, they are geared to attract the dedicated party activist rather than the entire populace, so the popular vote is not a viable parameter in caucus states.

The argument for popular vote as a valid parameter for the entire primary season is like saying "I have 50 pennies and you have 40 nickels, so I have more money than you do."

[DeschutesRiver]

38. Whether anyone now dislikes it because their candidate can't win without it,

there are no popular vote tallies in democratic primaries, and there is no way given the caucus system that a "popular" vote could even be properly tallied. Pisses me off to no end to watch the Clintons pretend that they care about letting FL and MI participate for noble reasons; yet in calculating their fake popular vote tally, they must ignore the the caucus state results. Since those states don't help them achieve their personal ambitions, they are made irrelevant without a second glance back.

Which is a pretty freaking hypocritical. Worse, flat out deceitful - something tossed out on the assumption that their voting base is just too dumb to understand the reality, so they can fib with ease about it. That is what is disrepectful in this campaign of theirs. Arrogant car salesmans making their best fabricated pitch.

If this system is to be changed, let the party do so in a considered fashion - not at the demand of a candidate who is behind in the actual primary, and merely wishes to find another system that, if it were in effect, would boost their chances. This is another fantasy.

[Iceburg]

24. Popular vote means NOTHING ...except in a democracy :-(

[greguganus]

36. Wondering if it's worth the effort to take "ignored" off and see who it is. n/t

[SoonerPride]

12. There is no popular vote.

Sorry.

[hogwyld]

19. Well, by your standard

Why don't we just run the primary in California, NY,and a couple of other overpopulated states since we small state heathen don't really deserve a say.

[MonkeyFunk]

23. What is "my standard"?

I've said only that it's an argument to be made to the superdelegates. And it's a good one, too.

[SoonerPride]

27. Except that there is no popluar vote.

You can't only count 35 states.

Well, Clinton tries to, but no one except morans is buying it. Why?

Because there is no popular vote in the caucus states, so you can't look at it because it is meaningless.

The 50 penny 40 nickels analogy above works for me.

[hogwyld]

34. I disagree on the popular vote count after the fact

As the original strategy was to amass the most pledged delegates. To change the rules mid game to win, is shady at best. It also means that we would be basically running a 10 state strategy to run up the score, while ignoring the other 40 states since they're not big enough to matter. As a resident of a smaller state, I think, as a citizen of the United States of America, think that we shouldn't change it to the United States of over 5 million people or more.

[MonkeyFunk]

46. Why can't you guys understand my simple point?

No one's asking to change the rules. No one's saying the popular vote leader has to win. I'm saying it's an ARGUMENT to be made to the superdelegates, who can use any criteria they want in deciding.

Obama will argue that they should go with the pledged delegate leader - but that's just an argument, not a rule.

[SoonerPride]

49. But it is an invalid argument.

And everyone who pays attention knows it.

Since it disenfranchises caucus states who don't tally popular votes, no one, except low information voters, pays any attention to the meaningless popular vote metric.

It doesn't hold any weight whatsoever with super delegates.

Thus, while she can scream it till she is blue in the face, no one of any import is buying it.

At all.

[JackORoses]

29. as long as you ignore all caucus states

but I'm sure that's ok with you since all you are concerned with is winning.

[SoonerPride]

35. Why anyone would still pimp the popular vote is mind boggling.

Isn't it?

It's just such nonsense.

[ForeignSpectator]

40. Whatever, according to bill clinton, hillary is behind in the popular vote, too.

Case closed.

[Chulanowa]

51. And he's using a metic that excludes the majority of Democrats in FL and MI

Because most of 'em stayed home due to the candidates all agreeing their delegates wouldn't count. It also, as noted, excludes four Caucus states that Obama swept.

Sure, Clinton is ahead in the popular vote, provided you're only counting states that went to Clinton. Which is pretty much what her campaign is doing.

[MattNC]

7. I don't see it that way

just depends on how you read it.

[berni_mccoy]

14. How do you read it?

[MattNC]

45. by doing well

in those remaining states she'll hold on to her (bogus) popular vote lead.

[berni_mccoy]

47. If he believed she had the popular vote, he would have said that. But he didn't

These guys are ultra careful about their choice of words (for the most part). I don't believe this was a slip up on his part. They *know* the popular vote count is bogus and they know, no matter how you legitimately count it, they don't have the popular vote. That's what makes the Hillary supporters here seem so desperate when they claim she has the pop. vote.

[stratomagi]

9. Poor Bill!

Two words: CAUCUS STATES!

[Doityourself]

13. I saw & thought, Bill didn't get the memo . All her other surrogates and fans are saying she is

already winning the popular vote!

The Big Dog...done fucked up! lmao

[MercutioATC]

17. There's no way to measure the popular vote in caucus states.

For Clinton (who lost the caucus states) to ever make the claim that she's won the popular vote is just silly.

[SoFlaJet]

18. I'm using my alternate strategy

to Let It Sink by bumping up Berni's thread

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x6144513

[quantass]

20. Yea i noticed that quote too.

[cboy4]

26. It seems like every time I look up, Hillary is winning another

large state.

No wonder she's going to finish with the popular vote.

[berni_mccoy]

31. We are going on Geographical size now? I think Obama's got her beat there too

He's got Texas and Alaska.

[SoonerPride]

33. All those western states have lots of acres too.

Big, giant land masses.

[cboy4]

37. Actually more Texans voted for Hillary. She won.

Hillary Clinton: 1,459,814 51%
Barack Obama: 1,358,785 47%

http://www.cnn.com/ELECTION/2008/primaries/results/state/#val=TX

[SoonerPride]

39. Except of course, this is about delegates. Obama won.

Moving goalposts and changing rules mid-game makes you Hilary fans look pathetic.

The name of the game was delegates.

And he won more.

Period.

[cboy4]

42. Obama fans must watch football games and tell each

other whichever team scores the fewest touchdowns wins. lol

[SoonerPride]

43. Sorry, but Obama has more points on the scoreboard, son.

Hillary is trying to argue that because she has more passing yards (not total yards, just passing) that she is the "winner."

Her metric for "victory" is pathetic.

[frylock]

53. hillary fans must wait around in empty stadiums..

waiting for the outcome of a completed game to change.

[berni_mccoy]

41. LOL! so you ARE going for land mass now...Incredible. And Obama WON Texas...

the name of the game is MOST DELEGATES. She couldn't create a campaign strategy that would win. Plain. And. Simple.

[DangerousRhythm]

44. Awesome. That's why it was called the Texas ONE Step, I assume.

Oh wait, it wasn't.

:freak:

[DefenseLawyer]

48. The "popular vote" doesn't exist.

How does one win what doesn't exist?