Obama people, will you please STOP pecking at the Hillary people!

[scarletwoman]

This place looks like a chicken yard massacre, all the big birds rounding on the weak ones and just pecking and pecking, until all that's left behind is a pile of broken bloody feathers.

Just stop it. Stop being bullies.

Peace,
sw

[Bucky]

1. I am not a pecker

[greguganus]

5. Then you are the peckee? n/t

[scarletwoman]

6. ...

:eyes:

[greguganus]

11. At least he didn't say he was a cockfighter. n/t

[hisownpetard]

17. Oh, yeah? That's not what I heard!

:shrug:

[KittyWampus]

35. I love yoooooou, a bushel and a peck... anyone know what musical that is?

eta- best earworm ever. :)
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-1681307147600604137&q=&hl=en

[helderheid]

63. I sing that to my kids all the time!

[Plaid Adder]

224. Guys & Dolls.

Hotbox Girls!

C ya,

The Plaid Adder

[cliffordu]

45. pecker pecker pecker

:rofl:

[YOY]

71. Can we "teabag" them then?

[dionysus]

99. oh no you didn't...

:spray:

[YOY]

103. Oh yeah I did!

[Richard Steele]

2. Soon enough. nm

[scarletwoman]

12. No, now. All the anger and triumphalism and hostility is poisoning us.

[Richard Steele]

15. As long as her supporters continue offering opinions, I'm entitled to offer rebuttal.

When the day comes that they no longer use DU as a forum
to attack and smear the 2008 Democratic Presidential Nominee,
I'll stop responding to their attacks and smears.

[scarletwoman]

27. I'm not talking about "responding", I'm talking about posting shit like "LOSER!!11"

I'm talking about how nearly every time someone who is perceived to be from the other camp posts something, they are met with instant hostility and aggression.

We could at the very least extend people the benefit of the doubt that they may actually be making a good faith effort to reach across the divide.

Yes, there are assholes in the Hillary camp posting imflammatory shit, but I sure do see alot of Obama assholes just jumping down the throats of people who are actually trying to be reasonable and civil.

I've been anti-Clinton for YEARS. I NEVER wanted her in this race. I only accepted Obama because he was the only hope for keeping Clinton out. I've come to feel more comfortable with him as time has gone on, for which I'm grateful.

I want the disappointed Clinton people to have a chance to feel more comfortable with him, too. To not feel so angry and afraid and disheartened.

Hostility only begets more hostility. And it's just plain strategically stupid when we have a big battle ahead of us with the Republicans.

Peace,
sw

[Richard Steele]

31. Well, if that's what you're discussing here, then I'm much more in agreement with you.

You know, your paragraph "I've been anti-Clinton for YEARS.
I NEVER wanted her in this race. I only accepted Obama because
he was the only hope for keeping Clinton out. I've come to feel
more comfortable with him as time has gone on, for which I'm grateful."
really describes my own feelings pretty well.

He was certainly not my first choice back when the race began,
but he has impressed me enough that I'm comfortable supporting him now.
Another month or so like the last few, and I could possibly go from
"comfortable" to "enthusiastic". I'm not ruling it out.

Peace.
Richard

[scarletwoman]

36. Thank you. He wasn't my first choice either -- Kucinich, then Edwards.

But NEVER Hillary.

"Another month or so like the last few, and I could possibly go from
"comfortable" to "enthusiastic". I'm not ruling it out."

Yes, that's pretty much where I am, too.

Thanks again.

Peace,
sw

[tigereye]

76. you are a very wise woman!

:thumbsup:


thanks for this post.

[scarletwoman]

80. Thank you. Although I am probably more foolish than wise to hope that people would get my OP.

:)

Peace,
sw

[tigereye]

84. it's a nice olive branch -

it's important to remember that we are all Dems and most Dems will be on board when the nomination is announced.

[The Magistrate]

86. Your Effort Here Is Greatly Appreciated, Ma'am: Thank You

[merh]

105. How can the effort be appreciated when it is not fair or balanced?

All Obama supporters are not responsible for the unrest and the petty atmosphere and neither are all Hillary supporters. But in that same vein, but for the negatives of the Hillary supporters there would be very little negatives of the Obama supporters, no need to peck as it were.

One side is not more responsible than the other and to only call out one side is wrong, to applaud that calling out, as a mod, is even worse, imho.

Edited to add, with emphasis: Some folks call for peace but don't involve all the parties to the dispute in the talks, then they wonder why the talks don't work, just like this OP.

[scarletwoman]

116. I would simply like to feel proud of my fellow Obama supporters, not ashamed.

I have no sway with Clinton supporters because I am not one of them. Therefore I address my fellow Obama supporters.

Let me give your quote right back to you: "Some folks call for peace but don't involve all the parties to the dispute in the talks, then they wonder why the talks don't work..."

My OP is a call for MY party to stop throwing sticks and rocks at the other side in order to make it possible to talk to each other. We're behaving like hostile and agressive bushies, not peace negotiators. It is not helpful.

Peace,
sw

[merh]

133. It is not all Obama supporters throwing sticks as you try to make it

appear. For the most part, Obama supporters are deflecting the pots and pans tossed at Obama and are debunking the lies. As long as Hillary stays in this and her supporters are free to come here and bad mouth Obama and other dems (like Kennedy, Richardson, Edwards or anyone else that doesn't support Hillary) then the animosity will remain high and the petty behavior will continue. Your post does nothing to diffuse it, it actually fuels it as you think you speak for us all and you condemn all because a few have posted poorly.


You can't negotiate peace if you only blame one side and don't hold all responsible - the bushieslikes are those using rove and his tactics and right wing sources to damn one candidate while supporting another.

[scarletwoman]

142. That is not the point. We can't control the behavior of others, we CAN control our own.

This isn't about "blame", this is about taking responsibility for our own part in fueling hostility. When we give in to anger and agression we are only weakening ourselves and pushing the other side into a more entrenched and defensive position.

It's bad martial arts, if nothing else. It's certainly bad negotiating behavior.

An eye for an eye leaves the whole world blind. Gandhi

Peace,
sw

[catgirl]

158. Overall, Obama supporters have been civil

Don't confuse trolls with Obama supporters. And stop bashing Obama supporters. You're
talking to us like we're idiots or something.

[scarletwoman]

164. I'm an Obama supporter and I have seen a great deal of incivility from Obama supporters.

I have of course, seen a great deal of aggression and hostility from Clinton supporters as well. But since I'm not one of them it would be of no use for me to ask them to be nice. They would react to me precisely the same way as many of the people on THIS thread have reacted when they assumed I was a Clinton supporter.

This thread is a marvelous demonstration of exactly the behavior from Obama supporters that my OP was inveighing against.

If you feel that my exhortation to not bully does not apply to you, then there is no reason for you to take it personally.

Peace,
sw

[catgirl]

236. I don't take it personally

I just think all these fingers pointing at the supporters
of Hillary AND Obama are ridulous and ask for flaming.

[scarletwoman]

238. Me too. (nt)

[merh]

159. Good, then control your own behavior and stop lumping all Obama

supporters into one and stop blaming all for the poor choices made by a few. If you are going to ask for civility ask it of all involved and try to consider the whys - most folks are only defending their position and their support. Most are just responding to the lies and the distortions. Only a few post the stupid threads and instead of giving them attention, they can be ignored.

You ask for peace but in your search for it you hurt feelings, judge without understanding and broadbrush. And now it appears you are suprised that your calls for peace have no effect.

[scarletwoman]

163. "Most are just responding to the lies and the distortions." Are they therefore powerless to control

their own reactions? Is that what you're saying?

I'm asking people to THINK. I'm asking people to get beyond she's being mean so I have to be mean back. No, you DON'T have to. No one can make you respond a certain way, it's ALWAYS your choice.

I'm asking people to choose to get out their egos and their lizard brains and fight evil by making energetic progress in the good.

Peace,
sw

[merh]

167. You are missing the point.

You dare to judge others when your behavior is as detrimental to peace as any post they could make. (As you can see from the reactions to your post.) You blame all obama supporters for the poor choices made by a few and/or the intentionally bad posts made by those pretending to be pro-obama. That isn't fair and that isn't right.

In addition to your broad brushing and judgmental post, you neglect to acknowledge that the hillary supporters are not victims and blameless, many (not all) are provocateurs, intentionally posting lies and distortions to antagonize and cause the dissent you so object to.

If you are going to ask for peace then ask it of all, if you are going to lay blame, lay it in the measures that is fair and to all responsible, not just those you choose to call out.

And what you sorely miss is the very obvious - when the candidate is named the behavior your give a pass to, the behavior you ignore and thus approve by your avoidance, will be bannable behavior. That should tell you something.

I'm asking you to think. Not all posts are as you allege, many are refuting the lies and the distortions, they aren't mean, they are factual and to the point. Practice what you preach and stop making unfair generalizations. It is not a nice way to behave.

[scarletwoman]

170. Wow. No, you are the one who has completely missed the point. I'm sorry.

Asking people to behave honorably and respectfully is not being "judgemental".

I admit to self-interest, however. As I said in another post; I want to go into battle in the company of strong, fearless and honorable warriors, not poo-flingin monkeys.

What Hillary supporters do does not concern me, let them defeat themselves through their own wallow in the dark side. I want my fellow Obama supporters to walk in the light. That's not being judgemental, that's love.

Peace,
sw

[merh]

179. Yes, it is judgmental when you don't ask all parties to be honorable

when you single out one side and blame all on that side for the poor judgment of a few that purport to be on that side. You don't shine a light for obama supporters to follow, you can't if you are calling only on them for the peace and blaming them for the unrest. They are not alone in this, they are not responsible.

When you see an injustice do you sit silent and hope that it will straighten itself out?

When you hear someone baring false witness against someone you care about do you sit quiet and hope that they will stop and that the lies will do no harm?

What should be most telling to you is that your post has support from the side you have held blameless, from the martyred victims that are as responsible for what they get because of all they give out.

And please with the hyperbole, this is a message board, we fight with words - this board if for discussions and we use words formed by pixels on a screen to discuss, to disagree, to debate. There is no poo flinging except in the images you create with your words and those your interpret through the words of a few.

When you want to be fair and not condescending, let us know, we may pay attention to that one and even thank you for it.

[scarletwoman]

182. Where I have I "blamed"? I've merely asked people to behave well.

I'm pointing out that hostility only breeds more hostility. I'm pointing out that it is to our advantage to marshall our strength by rising above emotionalism and availing ourselves of our rational minds and better angels.

I'll repeat, I want fearless and honorable warriors on my side. I'm asking my fellow Obama supporters to behave fearlessly and honorably.

How Clinton supporters behave is irrelevent. If they are behaving cravenly, it will only be made more apparent by the contrast offered by our honorable behavior. It's the best way to win.

Peace,
sw

[catgirl]

157. I'm with you there

To blame real Obama supporters is outrageous when there are trolls/pretenders flaming
many threads. The worst bashing has come from Hill supporters. In fact, there are
many threads bashing dems all over the place (now it's Nanacy Pelosi's turn).

[merh]

161. I knew it wouldn't be long before they went after Pelosi since

she had the nerve to say she wouldn't let this mess go to the convention.

The nerve of that woman *fauxoutrage&footstomping* hrrmmpphh! Have they called her a "bitch" yet? You know they can name call, we can't. It makes us peckers or something just a lame. ;)

:hi:

[scarletwoman]

165. Would you care to read some of the hostile posts from Obama supporters on this thread

directed at me because they think I am Clinton supporter?

They are not all from trolls, by any means.

Peace,
sw

[catgirl]

231. I see some people ridiculing your "pecking" post

you're heavily blaming Obama supporters for?... defending themselves Like I said,
Hillary supporters have been brutal, then they spin the tables and say it's OBAMA
supporters doing it. Very childish, at best. No need to continue this kind of stuff
with posts like yours.

[scarletwoman]

232. I'm not "blaming" anyone. I'm asking people to let their better angels guide their behavior.

I'm asking Obama supporters to rise above pettiness and vindictiveness and self-indulgence. I'm not sure why this would be considered a bad thing. Maybe you could explain it.

Peace,
sw

[scarletwoman]

122. Thank you. The responses to my OP have been truly fascinating, haven't they?

I never ceased to be amazed...

:hug:
Peace,
sw

[The Magistrate]

132. Indeed, Ma'am: A Miniature Illustration Of Mr. Orwell On Nationalism

I expect you will have read the essay, but for any who have not, here is a link:

http://www.george-orwell.org/Notes_on_Nationalism/0.html

[scarletwoman]

141. Actually, I haven't read it, but I shall, now that you have pointed it out.

Thank you for posting the link.

I've never really been a political theorist, I'm really sort of a mythologist. I tend to perceive human behavior through the lense of archetype.

As above, so below.

Peace,
sw

[The Magistrate]

145. One Of His Points, Ma'am, In That Piece

Is the ability of the devotee to avoid seeing where one's own behavior is the same as that of the opponent, and even to condemn in the other side what one will praise in one's own.

That site has most of his essays, and they greatly repay reading, old as they are: he was perhaps the last honest man....

[scarletwoman]

174. "...the ability of the devotee to avoid seeing where one's own behavior is the same as that of the

opponent, and even to condemn in the other side what one will praise in one's own.


Well, that's quite it in a nutshell, isn't it?

What's truly fascinating on this thread is seeing all the hostility and defensiveness leap to the fore in so many responses -- completely oblivious to the fact that they are demonstrating exactly the behavior I was talking about in my OP.

Peace,
sw

[FSogol]

139. Do you have an example of this? n/t

[scarletwoman]

153. Yes, I'll be happy to point you to three very good examples from yesterday.

They are a large part of the reason I posted my OP, along with all the jabs and crowing and hostility I read in myriad comments on myriad threads.

This one A little respect, please. from a Clinton supporter asking for a little patience and respect. The OP wrote politely and with sincerity about her emotional state, and made an opening for Obama supporters to connect with her on a level beyond rancor and name-calling. So what did she get?

Another one from a Clinton supporter: Ok Obama folks, make the case... who, throughout the thread, demonstrated his sincerity and willingness to listen to those rare few who actually "made the case". But the number of people who jumped on that thread with insults and hoots and mockery and snark way outnumbered those who chose to engage in rational dialogue.

And then this from an Obama supporter: FAILURE!!! How is that useful? It's just ugly crowing triumphalism. What good does name-calling do? It's noxious, it's toxic.

We need ALL Democrats with us to work on winning in November. Deliberately baiting people, refusing to offer them the benefit of the doubt when they make an effort to reach across the divide, is SO counterproductive.

Peace,
sw

[FSogol]

155. I agree. We do need all Democrats on our side in the GE. However,

out of your 3 examples, only one of them (the third one) makes your case.

Example #1 is a Clinton supporter bemoaning the fact that people are being mean to her. She provided no examples. (She posted the same type of post today.)

Example #2 is flamebait. Its a concern post subtlety bashing Obama and the lack of experience meme.

Example #3 is an over the top bash on Clinton. I agree that type of post should not exist and is not helpful.

We see things thru our own biases. I mostly notice the extremist Clinton supporters and their RW-talking point based attacks on Obama. I haven't been seeing many of the posts like your example #3

Peace.

[scarletwoman]

162. I'm sorry, but I think you are dead wrong about #s 1 & 2.

Read some of the dialogue that happened between the OPs of those threads when respondents took them at their words and posted something respectful back to them.

#2 especially was NOT flamebait in any way, shape or form. Not once did the OP slam any Obama poster who "made the case", in fact he several times acknowledged that someone had made a good point. This was a person who was open and willing to listen, he demonstrated that throughout the thread.

I thought #1 was a huge missed opportunity. It doesn't diminish us to attempt to be kind to someone, to give them a little space and support and simple respect as a fellow human being. It diminishes us NOT to.

We need to move past all this hard edged dualism and work on cohesion and inclusion.

And my larger point is, it is absolutely irrelevant how someone else behaves. No one can "make" you behave in a particular manner, how you respond is ALWAYS your own choice and no other's.

I'm asking people to choose to behave honorably, no matter how anyone else is behaving.

Look to the examples of Gandhi and MLKing for what I mean.

Peace,
sw

[Terran]

57. When your candidate stopes behaving like an ass. n/t

[scarletwoman]

60. My candidate is Obama, who is yours? (nt)

[Terran]

69. My mistake then.

When Hilary stops behaving like ass...how about that?

[JuniperLea]

72. In other words...

You have no control over yourself, and you cannot hold yourself responsible for your own actions.

Nice.

[Terran]

77. Yes, you're absolutely correct

I am an ObamaBOT. You've busted me.

[JuniperLea]

85. And you brag about it to boot...

Man, what on Earth has become of the human race?

You should take a clue from Obama... he's moved on... he is fighting the REAL enemy: McCain. Too bad he'll suffer because his supporters are so fucking dense.

[Terran]

111. Good god man!

:sarcasm:!!!!

Dense much??

[JuniperLea]

114. Yes, you are now that you mention it

Follow your posts... jeez...

[Terran]

184. apparently

you don't understand what "sarcasm" is. Seek help.

[JuniperLea]

185. Apparently you don't know how to follow a conversation

Or know how to remember what you posted.

[JuniperLea]

70. I've said it all along...

Hillary isn't hurting the party in the least... it's the incessant whining that is hurting the party.

[PoliticalAmazon]

IMO, Hillary is playing Bush Jr's role in the 2000 election theft....

Yes, it would be wonderful if we could all be statesmen/stateswomen, yadda yadda yadda, but she's (and they) are bringing the fight to us.

As long as the comments remain issue-related and not poster-related, IMO we need to fight this attempted theft as strongly as we fought the 2000 theft by Bush Jr.

[trueblue2007]

210. You're 100% right on.

I just came here to see what DU was saying about Scott McClellan and all I see is hateful notes about Hillary and Hillary Supporters!

This place sucks.

[scarletwoman]

217. Thank you. It will get better soon. We all need to remember who the real enemies are. (nt)

[Swamp Rat]

3. k&r

:)

[scarletwoman]

175. Thanks, Swampy. I think you're lucky you got on this thread early,

look at what a tangle it's turned into! :D

:hug:
Peace,
sw

[Swamp Rat]

189. "Americans need to watch what they do, and watch what they say."

[scarletwoman]

191. Warriors need to be impeccible. I want a cohort of honorable warriors beside me in battle. (nt)

[greguganus]

4. Chickens are female. Sexist!! n/t

[Iceburg]

59. No sexist -- just plain stupid. Think dogs, cats, rats, pigeons,..

hopefully you can find your way home tonight.

[scarletwoman]

64. Hens are female. Chickens are chickens, just like horses are horses.

There are roosters and hens, and stallions and mares.

Btw, I am an Obama supporter.

Peace,
sw

[iamthebandfanman]

7. itll be over soon.

i suggest you plead with hillary folks to do the same.

[scarletwoman]

67. No, I'm not going to plead with the Hillary folks. It's up to us to clean up our own behavior.

Look at some of the responses here from Obama people who think I'm a Clinton person. Those aren't the words of honorable victors, those are the words of mean, petty bullies. Is that who we want to be?

Peace,
sw

[JuniperLea]

75. Wish I could rec a post!

Well said.

[scarletwoman]

82. Thank you. I do appreciate that some people on this thread understand what it's about.

:)

Peace,
sw

[Blue-Jay]

8. .

[Bensthename]

9. Big peckers showing off to the little peckers..

Little peckers dont need to be outed. Good call.

[Indenturedebtor]

10. I have no idea what you're talking about...

*Wipes beak*

:hide:

[Imagevision]

13. I agree, Obama's camp seem to know what they're doing so far, pass on Billary comments...

[Tyler Durden]

14. Lately, the call is for Clinton Supporters to "Stop Whining"

They have forgotten this:



emblazoned on the walls of rePUKE supporters in the Fall of 2000.

They have gazed into the abyss for too long.

[mrreowwr_kittty]

20. The constant comparisons to the stolen 2000 election by Clinton supporters are tiresome

There is no comparison. It is apples and oranges. Hillary Clinton agreed to the same rules as the other candidates, and she and many in her camp who were voting DNC members (like Harold Ickes) agreed that MI and FL should be stripped of their delegates if they moved their primaries up. They didn't care about MI and FL until Clinton was losing.

[Tyler Durden]

39. We are not talking about the ELECTION...

We are TALKING about the treatment of 49% of Democrats by 51% of Democrats: a very, very different thing indeed.

And since you seem to be so righteously correct all on your own, perhaps that might be where you end up in November.

NOT an optimal solution.

[mrreowwr_kittty]

42. And now with the equally tiresome threat to not vote in Nov.

Do what you want. For every bitter deadender Dem who sits home, at least 2 Independent voters will take their place.

[Tyler Durden]

43. The figures do not support you.

But self-delusion has its place; I seldom found it of much comfort myself. There aren't enough Indies available to replace the 1 in 16, but everyone has their religion I guess.

DO remember to blame the Obama Campaign for the tragic loss in November. That way you won't have to hear anyone say "I told you so."

[dionysus]

50. you want to blame us for bitter hillbots voting repuke and you call us delusional?

:rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl:

[Tyler Durden]

55. "Bitter HIllbots." Wonderful.

Amazing charm and attraction you have there. SURE to win converts from the Clinton Camp.

Go drink some more wine, dionysus.

[dionysus]

62. bitter is as bitter does. never have I seen such a pack of babies they threaten to vote GOP because

their candidate lost. you wanna coddle their bitter asses, go right ahead.
you can give them one of these;

[cbayer]

106. Do you take the same position with Obama supporters who say

they will not vote for him if Clinton is on the ticket? If you do not, why not?

[dionysus]

110. Yes. I'd still vote for Hillary if she pulls off the impossible. Any Obama supporter who would

bail if Hillary is the VP, would be just as childish\selfish\stupid.

[cbayer]

126. I agree

I doubt their motives whichever side they come from.

[KaptBunnyPants]

146. I would be unhappy about it, but I'd support the ticket.

It would be a mistake, a severe one in my opinion. The pro-business faction of our Party badly overextended themselves on this one and we have a real chance to reform the Democratic Party to be more pro-working class in policy. Putting Hillary in the VP position would be the end to that opportunity, and I don't see her playing second fiddle to anyone. Besides, the upside just isn't there. There's too much poison between the two campaigns for them to work together effectively. That said, Obama is free to pick whoever he chooses as his VP. As long as it's not Dick Cheney he's got my vote.

[dionysus]

100. yes, bickering on DU is just gonna tip the whole election.

[JuniperLea]

79. As if to illustrate the OP's point

Obviously you can't be held responsible for your own actions, but insist on blaming your actions on others.

I hope you make it to the fourth grade soon.

[dionysus]

83. quit acting like you're above this. you're just a scold. your high horse act is stale.

why don't you stop defending those who attack the party nominee. coddle tham all you want, but stop endorsing their bullshit please.

[JuniperLea]

91. Show me one post where I've coddled anyone

Or defended anyone attacking Obama. Your lies are fucking lame.

I am above this mess. I understand that ADULTS are responsible for their own actions... and posts... and that anyone who blames another for their own actions has the mentality of a seven-year-old.

Obama has turned his focus on the REAL enemy... McCain. Pity more people don't listen to Obama and follow his lead. All this whining will hurt him in the long run.

You don't need a high horse when you take the high road.

Wallow in the gutter if you like... your choice.

[dionysus]

96. you do this crap continuously, and try your whole "i'm the ADULT, you're seven yrs old!!" routine,

while slinging your very own ad homs all over the place. if you can't see how much of a hypocrite you are then there is no sense talking to you.

[JuniperLea]

113. Prove it

Quit with the lies. What a fucking joke. I'm a hypocrite because I'm supporting Obama's efforts in focusing on McCain. Yeah, how could I? Jeez. Obama has set a very good example, and sadly, many of his supporters refuse to follow his lead. How embarrassing.

[dionysus]

121. lies? you recycled the whole "i'm the adult you children" like three times in this very thread...

you are a hypocrite because you are running around pecking at Obama supporters because they are pecking at hillary supporters which is oh-so-bad, yet you are engaging in the very behavior you are falsely claiming to be above.

i guess it's only okay when you do it right?

:eyes:

[JuniperLea]

124. Thanks for proving my point

A simple "I know you are but what am I" would have saved you some typing.

[dionysus]

128. you didn't prove a thing except blindness to your own hypocrisy...

when you attack A for attacking B because attacking is bad, that is called hypocrisy.

[JuniperLea]

144. Lame

Very sad, and very lame.

[dionysus]

147. now you're proving my point...

[woolldog]

149. dionysus, everything you're saying in this thread is spot on. (nt)

[scarletwoman]

88. You just had to come in this thread and start pecking, didn't you.

Victors can afford to behave honorably, it diminishes all of us when our people are behaving like smirking bullies.

Peace,
sw

[dionysus]

93. thats a crock.

you have some fairly obvious trolls continuing to slam our nominee and you apparently want to let them spew their crap unanswered.

[scarletwoman]

109. No, I'm saying let us mind our own behavior. Besides, why NOT let trolls "spew their crap answered"?

Why should we be fearful? Why not just let the trolls wear themselves out banging their heads against hard reality?

I'm talking about how we treat our fellow DUers, and what it says about OUR character and honor.

Peace,
sw

[JuniperLea]

151. Not to mention how we represent our candidates

I'm embarrassed for both candidates. Acting like a jerk doesn't NOT make one's candidate look better... the opposite is clearly true.

Obama moved on... he's now going after McCain... we should take a clue.

[scarletwoman]

22. "They have gazed into the abyss for too long." Thanks, quite apt.

It's the tribalism and simplistic dualistic thinking.

I can't help but think of the fate of the indigenous people on this continent, they warred on each other all the while the Europeans just kept rolling over them.

Dems really need to get a damn clue.

Peace,
sw

[Tyler Durden]

41. Democrats NEVER "get a clue." We're FAMOUS for it.

The divisions and derision in the Democratic Party make the the debates in the Socialist Workers Party look like a Junior League TEA by comparison.

We thought WE were factionalized. How wrong we were.

[scarletwoman]

54. Yeah, but what do you know, you're from the People's Front of Judea -- splitter!

I know I'm just shouting into the whirlwind here, but I'll be damned if I'm going to go down (again) without a fight.

What kills me is we should be happy, the Republicans are the weakest they've been in years! We really CAN pull this election off, if we'd stop being so damn fearful.

Peace,
sw

[Symarip]

16. Calls to stop this or that really go nowhere

I think they're usually counter-productive.

[Erin Elizabeth]

51. I tend to agree.

Just the other day, I saw someone on another message board demand that one particular person STOP RESPONDING TO THEM. Yeah, because THAT works. The person just responded to them even MORE because they knew they got under the other person's skin.

[scarletwoman]

94. Actually, I think this thread has been quite educational so far.

All through the responses you can find clear demonstrations of what I was talking about in the OP. Now, if people would look in the mirror that this thread has provided, they just might see something.

In any case, I've been on DU for over 7 years, I'm very attached to it. I will always speak out against bad behavior here.

Peace,
sw

[Symarip]

107. I'd never tell you to stop.

:)

[scarletwoman]

119. Thank you.

:)

Peace,
sw

[Bread and Circus]

18. Your post is so hypocritical it is beyond worthyness of a detailed response.

[scarletwoman]

125. I'm curious as to why you think so. I can guess that you don't know that I'm an Obama supporter.

Would you have posted a different reply if you had known that?

Peace,
sw

[Bread and Circus]

136. It doesn't matter because I took your words at face value. And the nastyness goes both ways...

no side is the "victim" here.

[scarletwoman]

148. So what if the nastiness goes both ways? Do we not have the power to choose how we respond?

What is "hypocritical" about calling on my fellow Obama supporters to rise above pettiness and conduct themselves with honor?

To me it's only common sense. The best way to discredit the bad behavior of others is not to mirror it, but to let it be exposed through the contrast of your own good behavior.

Peace,
sw

[Bread and Circus]

152. Because I thought your use of the word "bullies" had a bullying quality in and of itself

but yes, I'd like to dispense with the nastyness. It's hard as I think a good portion of this board is being astroturfed and freeped.

[scarletwoman]

154. Well, I'm calling it as I see it.

If you want to "dispense with the nastyness", it's very simple: don't engage in it.

I'm not buying the "astroturfed and freeped" argument. It's irrelevant. Each one of us is responsible for own behavior, no "freeper" can make you behave in a certain manner, how you respond is YOUR choice.

Peace,
sw

[Bread and Circus]

173. k

[ShortnFiery]

19. Oh GAWD! Not another "I'm a poor victim" thread? Or righteous indignation over PERCEIVED victimhood?

This crap - feigning self-righteousness never fails to disappoint. :thumbsdown:

[scarletwoman]

32. I hope you see what you just did. I am actually an Obama supporter. I have been anti-Hillary for

longer than most people have been on DU.

I am very grateful that Obama came along and gave us an alternative -- I was pretty sure I wasn't going vote if Hillary was the Dem candidate. I'm glad I won't have to make that choice.

I've even come to like and appreciate Obama in his own right. I do believe that he will make a decent president. I'm glad I won't have to hold my nose.

Please think about how you responded, and what you assumed about me.

Peace,
sw

[JuniperLea]

68. Their hate for Hillary

Overrides any common sense or decency. It's really getting pathetic.

I voted for Edwards and never joined the Clinton or the Obama camps because, well, I just plain don't trust either of them to deal with BushCo's leavings, or to make sure BushCo cohorts go to jail, or end the war, or anything else that's important to me. But I will vote for the Dem nom, which appears will be Obama. So be it.

The funniest thing about this whole hubris stew mentality is that if you don't agree with someone, you are automatically in "the other camp"... as you have seen illustrated so perfectly here. I was once called an Obamaniac and a Hillbot in response to one single post! Oh, the stupidity! LOL!

They are drunk on hate. Clinton could die saving Obama from a blazing fire, or step in front of a truck to save him, or take a bullet for him, and she will still be hated here. It's pretty disgusting.

[scarletwoman]

102. "Drunk on hate" -- Yes, it often appears so. Thanks for your post. (nt)

[totodeinhere]

168. If you are such a strong Obama supporter then you should defend him against all of the lies and...

half truths and dirty campaign tactics perpetuated by the Clinton campaign.

[scarletwoman]

181. Obama doesn't need me to swear and scream at people on a message board. It does nothing to help him.

The best thing WE can do to help Obama is to follow his example and behave honorably.

The screaming meanies will defeat themselves.

Peace,
sw

[totodeinhere]

199. I didn't say that you should "swear and scream at people." But...

that doesn't mean that you cannot defend Obama in a calm and respectful manner. In fact, with a very few exceptions, that is how most Obama supporters approach it I think. Of course there are a few extremists on both sides, but I suspect that they won't be around much longer.

[Peacetrain]

21. Granted what I am about to say, will be counted for little, because

my post number is so low.. I have lurked here for years..and only decided to join, because of Ms. Ferraro and what I perceive as a possible kneecapping of womens rights over an election..I am a supporter of Senator Obama, and have always been.. I am from Iowa, a 59 year old woman who is basically or white scot irish descent with a little Cherokee.. proud of all my ancestors.. have never supported Senator Clinton, because of the family links..I do not believe in "novelty presidencies".. we are trying to survive from a father/son grouping.. We need new blood.. that being said.. I would vote for whoever the democratic candidate is.. there is my history ..so you will know exactly where I stand..no guessing.

The pecking by a few.. from my observations..nearly 90% of the time.. start in Senator Clintons base.. yesterday being a good example.. the attempt to demean his family history and his family members service.. it was awful.. so I am not surprised to see a unified move back by the majority against having a candidate swift boated again..

So hopefully soon there will be peace among posters ..and I will just disappear into the woodwork again.. because my guess for what ever is it is worth.. is that some of disruptor's from both sides really are "plants"

[Cha]

33. Thank you, Peace Train and I don't

care how many posts you have you make more sense than some who have 1000s.

"The pecking by a few.. from my observations..nearly 90% of the time.. start in Senator Clintons base.. yesterday being a good example.. the attempt to demean his family history and his family members service.. it was awful.. so I am not surprised to see a unified move back by the majority against having a candidate swift boated again.."

[merh]

34. Welcome to DU

and thank you for your post and participation.

Some folks call for peace but don't involve all the parties to the dispute in the talks, then they wonder why the talks don't work, just like this OP.

Fortunately the primary season will end and then we will be better able to focus on the GE.

:hi:

[Cha]

89. Well said, merh..

"Some folks call for peace but don't involve all the parties to the dispute in the talks, then they wonder why the talks don't work, just like this OP."

It's no wonder hilary supporters are fawning over the op.

[merh]

108. It gets very tiresome.

It makes sense a good many of the hillary supporters are fawning all over the op, they love being portrayed as victims and that to me is rather pathetic and quite telling.

[Cha]

118. Oh yeah,

out there lying and saying ugly things but you better not call them on it with the facts or that upsets mightily. I believed that's called hypocritical to the maximum.

[scarletwoman]

44. Thank you for your thoughtful post.

I'm a 58 year old Norwegian Minnesotan. I've been anti-Clinton for years, for many reasons.

The thing about what the Clinton people post, it's mostly stupid stuff and it's out of desperation. It's sad and annoying, but it can't really hurt anything because it has no grounding in reality. There's no reason to react to those things out of fear. And all the hosility and anger and agression has its roots in fear. We need to stop being fearful.

And while the Clinton people post things out of their own fear, Obama people are posting agresssive mocking things out of egoistic chest-thumping. We're all caught up in this dualistic power paradigm of dominance/submission. Obama people (some, not all, of course) are behaving as though they are demanding submission from the Clinton side.

That is, simply put, a very bad way of pulling together as a party and winning the White House in November.

Peace,
sw

[Erin Elizabeth]

53. Democratic Underground is a message board on the internet.

Granted, it's a fairly large one. But it's not the Democratic party. I see a lot of people making the mistake of talking about the posts here as though it IS the party.

What I'm getting at is that what's said here isn't really going to have that much of an impact on the party as a whole or any election result.

[scarletwoman]

131. Who we are and how we conduct ourselves individually affects the whole.

I'm calling on people to be honorable warriors, in order that we all be strong for the election battle ahead.

Peace,
sw

[JuniperLea]

81. Methinks you missed the point

Picking on a candidate is fine, picking on each other is not.

However, the time has long since passed that we should ALL be focused on pummeling McCain instead of each other. Obama got the clue... the rest of us should too.

[yellerpup]

115. Osiyo, peacetrain!

And welcome to DU. :hi: I also am an Obama supporter. Although I was tremendously excited when the Clintons moved to NY and when Hillary won her Senate seat here, I have never been able to support her run for president. I really despise the idea of dynasty in USA politics and can't support another round of Bush/Clinton/Bush/Clinton. We've already lost too many of our rights. Above that, with Hillary Clinton as my senator I have learned that she easily turns a deaf ear to 'libral' entreaties not to vote for the IRW, not to vote for the Kyle/Lieberman amendment, not to approve of the use of cluster bombs against civilian populations. That is not to say that she is all bad, she isn't--but her voting record IMO is indefensible. Although Obama was not my first choice, he has won me over completely and I will happily vote for him in November. (I too am a 59 year old Scot/Cherokee mix).

[AllentownJake]

23. Short answer

No

[Straight Shooter]

24. I am not weak.

But you can see from the responses, people have absolutely no idea where you stand in this campaign. They're not paying attention to what anyone actually posts on this board, which is why they begin their kneejerk howls of outrage that you should suggest the pile-ons stop.



Baraaaack, brak-brak-brak, baraaaack!

[scarletwoman]

183. I'm sorry, I should have tried to come up with a different word.

Part of what I had in mind is that it's pretty clear that Clinton supporters are outnumbered here by Obama supporters. So, "weak" as in being a numerically smaller group and therefore disadvantaged in terms of support for your side.

It IS pretty fascinating how quickly people pile on in indignation when you point out that they have a tendency to pile on. Ironic, even. :D

Peace,
sw

[Straight Shooter]

197. No apology necessary. I wasn't offended, I was just stating my POV.

Yes, it's fascinating when you hold up a mirror and people yell, "How dare you, that ain't me!" :hi:

[scarletwoman]

201. "...when you hold up a mirror and people yell, "How dare you, that ain't me!" " Yup, that's it in

a nutshell. Well-said!

And thank you.
:hi:

Peace,
sw

[Straight Shooter]

205. Peace to you, scarletwoman.

You're one of DU's treasures. I have never read a small-minded or mean-spirited negative post from you.

:hi:

[scarletwoman]

209. Thank you for your kind and generous words. I'll do my best to live up to them.

:hug:

Peace,
sw

[Straight Shooter]

212. You already have.

:hug:

[reflection]

25. No. n/t

[TwilightGardener]

26. Bullies? The only bullies are the ones trying to present attacks and arguments

(and imbecilic/RW ones at that) against the presumptive Dem nominee on a DEM forum. Actually, by definition those would be "Republicans" or "Freepers".

[Major Hogwash]

28. I was FORCED to read this thread by Hillary.

She made me log on to the internet this morning.
And she made me read DU.
And she made me read this thread.
And she made me make this post.

Yes, we are all FORCED to respond - and it's all her fault!!

[scarletwoman]

150. LOL! Thank you.

Peace,
sw

[scarletwoman]

29. To all the peckers in this thread, sorry I did not make it clear that I am a Obama supporter.

But thank you for demonstrating my point.

Peace,
sw

[KittyWampus]

37. Some Obama supporters don't realize that giving Hillary attention is EXACTLY what she wants

I understand why her statement about Bobby caused an outcry.

But here it is almost a week later, she's on the road to being irrelevant and mostly just looks pathetic.

[2rth2pwr]

38. Pretty amazing.

[scarletwoman]

58. We need to hold up the mirror to ourselves, all of us.

And as an Obama supporter, I feel a responsibility to call out Obama people on their bad behavior.

Peace,
sw

[butterfly77]

30. Tell Hillary and her campaign...

to stop pecking at us and our candidate..

[scarletwoman]

187. Why would they listen to me? I'm an Obama supporter. (nt)

[bain_sidhe]

40. Sigh. Good try though.

I see by the responses that this plea has been treated like every other plea for civility, but I like the imagery.

Soon enough, all of these "big birds" will be surveying all the naked bloody feathers with smug satisfaction, and demanding that their naked victims quit whining and join the flock. All will be sweetness and light, then, right? We'll all join wings, both the feathered and the naked, and march into the general election like one happy family, right?

Right??

[scarletwoman]

74. Thanks. "Sigh", indeed. Oh well, I figured what the hell -- I don't start threads very often,

so I don't mind tossing one to the four winds.

I just hope some of the posters take a good hard look at themselves at some point.

Yeah, marching together to the general election -- it's a dream I have...

Peace,
sw

[dionysus]

46. this is what pisses me off. you act as if the hillbots aren't starting flamewars like clockwork...

it's just those big bad obama bullies. that's bullshit and you know it.

[scarletwoman]

172. No, I know that the Clinton people are behaving very badly also. But I'm an Obama person, so my

interest lies in how MY people behave.

I want to be in the company of fearless and honorable warriors, not poo-flinging monkeys. Let the other side behave badly, we can be better than that.

Peace,
sw

[Buzz Clik]

47. No.

[crankychatter]

48. as long as Clinton poses a threat to Obama's nomination and her supporters post incendiary, lying BS

then ya get what ya get

[Erin Elizabeth]

49. Is Hillary still in the race?

Yes?

I don't see how she can still be in and her supporters expect to not ever hear a negative word. The primary, as Hillary and her supporters have loved to say for months now, is still going on!

That being said, I doubt I'm one of the peckers, as I have about a brazillion people in my dungeon of ignore. You can't peck at what you can't see.

[11 Bravo]

52. Okaaay, I'd say you have your answer.

[scarletwoman]

188. Indeed. This has been an absolutely fascinating thread, very revealing. (nt)

[BlooInBloo]

56. Amazing how Clinton supporters NEVER try to reign in the few shitty members of their team...

They're FINE with Those Few Shitty Members running around trashing everything.

Clinton supporters truly want nothing more than "free shots" at Obama. Fuck that.

[scarletwoman]

196. So? Isn't it to our advantage to show that we are better than them? (nt)

[backscatter712]

61. When the Hillbots stop sniping at the nominee, I'll shut up.

But as long as they're going to take swings at us every time we make nice, I don't feel like making nice.

[rucky]

65. Nance put the final nail in the coffin.

but this is a zombie movie, so...

[JuniperLea]

66. "They" will only shift the blame for their actions...

The neener neener... Why can't I do it because Johnny did it too... I won't stop until Johnny stops, bullshit comments you are getting.

This is the third grade, I swear.

I didn't hit her! I was just standing her swinging my fist around and she ran into me!

Thick as a fucking brick, I swear.

Thank GAWD Obama has moved onto the REAL fight against the REAL enemy... John McCain! It took him long enough... and apparently it's taking "us" a lot longer.

At some point we all have to grow the fuck up, control ourselves, and become responsible for our own actions. Blaming another for our actions is not an excuse for anyone over the age of seven.

[dionysus]

97. i see you like to recycle this "i'm an adult, you're all 7 yrs old" line. nice. are you a teacher?

[JuniperLea]

117. No, but I raised a lot of kids...

And without exception, they behaved a lot better at age seven than 80% of the people on this thread.

Take a clue card... try following Obama's lead instead of potentially embarrassing him.

[SoonerPride]

73. As Clinton said: "If you can't take the heat get out of the kitchen."

Toughen up sister.

[scarletwoman]

198. I'm tough enough to try to be a peacemaker when nearly everyone else is howling for blood.

I'm proud to support Obama, I'd like to be proud of my fellow supporters, too.

Peace,
sw

[The Doctor.]

78. Sure, when they stop acting like worms...

:hide:

[Lucky 13]

87. dupe

[Lucky 13]

90. Think of DU as a "pack".

As long as the "weak ones" keep growling and biting, the alphas will continue to attack. Once they are no longer a "threat", they will stop being attacked.

[JuniperLea]

92. Jeez

And you think being sub-human is a good thing?

:eyes:

You honestly don't see the merit in behaving better than you perceive others to be behaving?

[Lucky 13]

134. If you'll notice, I didn't say I thought it was a good thing.

I didn't pass any judgment on it. Just noting behavior.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

95. Alpha -LOL

Being an Alpha Male is not showing up to a mano a mano fight with ten of your friends...

[JuniperLea]

120. Well said

Very well said.

[Lucky 13]

137. Actually, you're wrong.

First of all, re-read my post. I wasn't ADVOCATING for this behavior... just noting that it's the way things are around here right now.

Second of all, you are wrong about showing up to a mano a mano fight with ten of your friends. The whole pack, led by the alphas, will gang up on one or two individuals that are "out of line" with the will of the alphas and will continue to attack until they submit.

Again, no judgment... just noting behavior patterns.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

143. OK

I will use the Warsaw Ghetto Uprising as a model...

Who were the brave ones?

The hundred or so Jews who fought with nothing more than revolvers and improvised incendiary devices or the thousands of well armed NAZI troops who eventually subdued them?

[gaspee]

218. Or until

The so-called weakling rips the alpha's throat out and then the rest of the followers have a new alpha. It's what betas (followers) do. Roll on their backs and show their bellies to the new alpha.

[stevietheman]

98. Whining about nonexistent bullying is a form of bullying itself. n/t

n/t

[JuniperLea]

123. Ignoring a problem doesn't mean it's not there. eom

[Lerkfish]

101. reminds me of the time

a parent split up two fighting brothers.
"Tommy, you need to stop fighting Bobby!"
"But MOM, aren't you going to tell Bobby the same thing?"
"No."
"why not?"
"Because YOU will actually listen to me."

[Hugabear]

104. Jeremiah Wright, William Ayers, Crazy Michelle, Obama's grandmother, etc etc etc

I guess it's okay when Hillary people peck at Obama supporters.

[BlooInBloo]

135. Yup - now they want you to stand there and just take it, since it's not over for them.

[cbayer]

112. Nice sentiment.

Many of the responses highlight your point and I don't think they will stop, but I appreciate your asking them to. I also notice that you do this in other threads and I think that is helpful as well.

[scarletwoman]

129. Thank you. Watching the responses on this thread has been extremely interesting.

I'm heartened that you've seen my efforts elsewhere, I made up my mind over the weekend that I was going to do everything I can to encourage healing and peacemaking here.

It's a bit like shouting into a tornado, but for the sake of my own sense of honor and responsibilty, I'm going to keep doing it.

Peace,
sw

[Forkboy]

127. A lot of the stuff is pointless and needless, and I've been alerting on a lot of it lately.

Threads just harping on her for the sake of harping on her suck.

Having said that, I will keep responding to those who post shit like the stuff about Obama's uncle, and until that stuff stops, either through those people being dealt with or through Obama officially securing the nomination, I'll keep jumping on those individuals when I see it, and I won't be kind about it.

I've tried very hard for the last year to differentiate between those people, and the vast majority of Hillary's supporters that are good Democrats. I've been able to stay friends with a lot of her supporters, and I hope I can continue to do so. And I do wish some Obama supporters would grow up and stop posting the pointless crap just to egg them on.

[Julius Civitatus]

130. NOTE: McCain's primary strategy involved dividing the Democratic party

For those that are not aware, here's an interesting link:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x6162097

... The document, dated May 15, 2008, and disowned by the McCain campaign team, presents a memorandum by 'S. Schmidt', likely Steven Schmidt, McCain's senior campaign advisor. It outlines a strategy designed increase rivalry between followers of the Democratic Party candidates Hillary Clinton and Barack Obama. Several specific techniques are described including organizing Clinton "meet-ups" (http://hrclinton.meetup.com /).

The memo appears to have been sent to a wider McCain campaign team group which focussed on internet based campaigning.

According to the memo, conflict between Clinton and Obama has created the possibility, on the event of an Obama nomination, to 'depress the turnout of key Democratic demographics in November'. ...

I wonder how many of the bullies I've seen in DU and many other liberal-leaning websites and forums are actually McCain plants. I've never seen such vicious posts since Freeper trolls in the 2000 elections. I knew that many of the posters poisoning the well HAD TO BE a bunch of GOP volunteers in disguise. Many of the most vicious pro Clinton and pro Obama posters here are purposefully creating a rift among Democrats, on behalf of the GOP.

Beware. We are being played.
Again!

[gaspee]

219. It's depressed this turnout

I'm not voting for the top of the ticket in November. Straight D down the rest of the ticket, but I'm leaving President blank.

[Ganja Ninja]

138. I'd love to but look at some of the threads they post.

Time and time again they come in posting victorious proclamations backed up Hillary's special math. None of it amounts to a hill of beans. If they stop I'll be more than happy to stop.

[BlooInBloo]

140. And amazingly enough, the idea of cleaning THEIR OWN house never occurs to them.

[scarletwoman]

171. But what difference does that make? Aren't we able to clean our own house whether

they clean theirs or not? Are we chained to them so that we have no way of moving unless they move?

Every time we let our tempers get riled up, every time we heedlessly fling out hurtful words, every time we mock and crow, we diminish ourselves. We turn into a mirror image of what we profess to hate.

WE can control our own actions, we can't control anyone else's. It is OUR choice how we respond to what others do.

I'm asking my fellow Obama supporters to choose the way of light and reject the dark side. It does not matter what the other side does, it only matters what WE do.

Peace,
sw

[BlooInBloo]

177. pushback != dirty house.

[scarletwoman]

156. What you're saying is that you have granted THEM power over YOUR behavior.

You're saying that you are powerless to make your own choices independent of what someone else does.

Is that really what you want?

Peace,
sw

[JerseygirlCT]

160. You make it sound as if it's all sort of one-sided bullying

You know that's not the case.

[scarletwoman]

169. No, I'm only CALLING one side out on it -- there's a difference. I'm calling MY side out, because

I think it reflects poorly on us, and I want us to be better than that. I don't want to feel ashamed of the company I keep.

I want to go to battle with strong, fearless and honorable warriors, not poo-flinging monkeys.

Peace,
sw

[JerseygirlCT]

242. Ok. I can understand that. nt

[hfojvt]

166. pick a little, talk a little

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jbhnRuJBHLs

[IndependentDem]

176. i agree, but...

when there are posts like this: http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x6173383
its hard for some people to play nice. IMO, BOTH sides have needed to settle down for awhile now... when was the last time someone started a thread in gd.p that initiated an actual discussion about policies or anything relevant for that matter? Too many people from both sides are so emotionally tied to this race that they cant let it go. I for one cant wait until its over.

[scarletwoman]

190. I don't know. People *could* just ignore it.

Nothing we write here is going to change the outcome out there in the real world. It's really not useful to get riled up.

I'm anxious for it to be over, too, of course. I'm very concerned about all the damage that's being done in the meantime. I don't think we ought to wait for the bitter end before we start looking at ways to start mitigating that damage.

Peace,
sw

[IndependentDem]

192. I'm right there with you...

I have read DU for some time now but didn't start posting here until recently... my first 100 or so posts were all "unity" related because i disliked what this place was becoming, unfortunately they all fell on deaf ears.

btw- if its ok with you i think i will steel this line for my sig for a while.
"Nothing we write here is going to change the outcome out there in the real world. It's really not useful to get riled up."

[scarletwoman]

200. Yes, please steal that line! Thanks!

:D

Peace,
sw

[knixphan]

202. agreed

'Eye-for-an-eye leaves everybody blind'...

[ericgtr]

178. All I see today are hit pieces on Obama from them

But yeah, it seems fair.

[JoFerret]

180. Sore

winners? or sore worried-wannabe-not-yet-winners?

[scarletwoman]

195. People are drunk on their emotions, and they've allowed their sense of identity to be completely

tied up with their candidates.

When that happens, every perceived attack on their candidate feels like an attack on themselves, and the survival instinct kicks in. Once someone's psyche is in survival mode their lizard brain is in control, the "fight or flight" instinct takes over and there's an adrenaline rush that comes with it that can be very seductive.

So people keep themselves whipped up for that adreline high. And unfortunately, that means they're WAY out of the realm of rational, higher brain functioning.

I'd just like to see people hanging out more in their frontal lobes, instead of in their lizard brains.

Peace,
sw

[JoFerret]

207. Would be good.

Cheers SW

[scarletwoman]

211. Cheers to you, too. I intend to keep working toward that goal. (nt)

[trekbiker]

186. there are more Peckers for Obama than Hillary?? hmmm......

[Warren DeMontague]

193. They need to stop dressing like bird seed.

[Unbowed]

194. Hey, if you walk like a RW asshole, talk like a RW asshole and act like a RW asshole....

chances you are a RW asshole. If they're calling themselves Hillary supporters, it doesn't change what they are.

As for the genuine Hillary Clinton supporters, it's a free country. Support who you want to. However, if you start siding with the RW assholes, then expect no quarter here. No Democrat has any business talking up Rove and Company. That's taking things to a whole different level. I rather suspect that Skinner had more in mind than a catchy name when he called this Democratic Underground.

Just a hunch.

[Darth_Kitten]

204. You also don't call people out........

:eyes:

[Lucky 13]

203. Pecking? I thought you said picking.

Sorry. My bad.

[malik flavors]

206. 90% of the people on this forum act like their 13. Both Hillary and Obama supporters.

[scarletwoman]

208. I hope it's not 90%, but there definitely is a lot of juvenile behavior here.

I didn't join the Obama side to hang out with a bunch of Heathers.

Peace,
sw

[Lilith Velkor]

225. That's why I never joined the Obama side.

I hate what these people have done to DU/the blogosphere, and parts of meatspace. I hate it more than I hate Hilary, and I can't stand her slick corporate ass.

Thanks so much for making the effort, scarlet. I wept with relief upon reading it. Literally.

I know you probably don't even remember my dismayed reply to you the other week (I don't remember what it was either, just the thought "Oh no, they got her too!"), but it feels like you really listened to me.

[scarletwoman]

228. Dear Lilith, I'm so glad you found my thread! And, yes, I remember your reply.

I even went back to it several times to study it and think about it. At the same time I also felt that you had misread me somewhat -- but before I figured out how to reply to you in that thread, we met in a different thread and it seemed to go much better. I decided to let your other post go unanswered and just go with the better connection.

I spent most of the primary season with GD-P rendered invisible and avoided it like the plague. So I missed several months of rancor and poo-flinging.

It was just a month ago that I decided to venture into GD-P, so I'm still rather new to the follies. And what with no scorecard at hand, it's taken awhile to know the players.

Thank you so much for your comment here, I really appreciate it! :hug:

Peace,
sw

[Lilith Velkor]

240. Soon it will be Hate Week

I don't see the point in it, since they've been having Two Minutes Hate every two minutes, but it's not my call.

If it were, I'd have a policy of no rules at all during primaries, because the uneven enforcement of the rules is what really disturbs me. Freepers have been allowed to run amok, as long as they pretend to support Obama.

Oh well...anyway, I ran to GD for some air that day, and just happened to see the appreciation thread sitting there with 4 recs. 'Twas serendipity.

C'mere! :hug:

[JohnnyLib2]

213. Thanks, scarletwoman.

Hopefully, I'll work beside folks with your outlook this Fall---in the Dem. booths. K & R

[scarletwoman]

215. You're very welcome. Thank you for the k&r. Yes, I want as many allies as possible!

We have a serious battle to win -- the end of Republican misrule!

Peace,
sw

[Kahuna]

214. Now we're "pecking?" That's quite a visual..

:silly:

[scarletwoman]

216. Lots of pecking going on all around. As an Obama supporter, I just felt that an appeal to our

better natures would be to our advantage.

Peace,
sw

[ElsewheresDaughter]

220. thank you for trying

most times many behave like harpies .....Winged monsters who carry off persons to the underworld and inflict punishment or torment them.

[scarletwoman]

223. I just want to let you know that I will keep trying. I love the painting in your post!

My first love has always been mythology.

Peace,
sw

[Elspeth]

221. Hey Scarletwoman, I'm still here

And I can take you any day of the week, sunshine. :)

(Note to Agent Mike: this comment is in the spirit of the OP and I have not yet killed any chickens before, though I have eaten them. :) )

[scarletwoman]

226. I had to sacrifice many chickens to make this thread. Arm wrestling or horseshoes?

:D

Peace,
sw

[Elspeth]

239. Arm wrestling...or bowling?

:)

[progetto]

222. You can't be serious. These one sided pleas go nowhere.

Time to recognize the reality that there are some supporters on both sides that will just keep at it.

Most of this "pecking" will stop once the candidate that has no chance of winning finally concedes. If instead the fight goes to the convention, things will only get worse around here.

[scarletwoman]

227. Of course I'm serious. I wouldn't have posted this otherwise. I've been here 7 years, DU is my home

I'm not about to let a bunch of ill-mannered louts mess it up. I will call for civility no matter how many times I have to do it.

Peace,
sw

[Beacool]

229. I'm no weakling, I'm as tough as my candidate.

Personally, no anonymous person hiding behind a computer affects my life.

It is foolish though, the more they bully the less some of us will ever consider voting for the rookie.

:shrug:

[scarletwoman]

233. I'm sorry, please see my post #138 on this thread where I apologized for my word choice.

It is foolish though, the more they bully the less some of us will ever consider voting for the rookie.

Exactly!

That's why I wrote my OP. I want Clinton supporters to be given respect and treated with kindness instead of being ganged up on. My overriding goal is a huge Democratic turnout in November. I want people like you to at least feel okay about marking "D" on your ballot.

Both as an Obama supporter and as an oldtimer on DU, I feel a responsibility to call out bad behavior. Triumphalism and petty vindictiveness ought to have no place here. As far as I'm concerned, nothing less than the fate of the whole planet is in the balance -- we just CAN'T let the Republicans win in November!

Peace,
sw

[Danger Mouse]

230. I do not bully, I only respond to attacks.

I am trying my best not to be the instigator.

[scarletwoman]

234. Thank you! Not being an instigator is what I'm talking about.

I just want to do everything I can to assure that people vote Dem in November.

It's not about us, it's about the whole world. We have a solemn responsibility to keep the Republicans out of the White House. Which means that we really ought to think about how we're interacting with other Democrats and do our best to calm hostility rather than feeding it.

Peace,
sw

[barack the house]

235. I am all for that it is self defeating.

[scarletwoman]

237. Thank you. I'm amazed anyone found this thread at this point. (nt)

[Sundoggy]

241. No, because...

...two posts above yours is another called:

"OK..."She wasn't the only one crying. There was a whole lot of white people cryin'." What's NEXT? "

[scarletwoman]

243. Of course you go take up arms and fight that kind of shit. I wasn't talking about legitimate duels.

I'm talking about when I've seen non-flamebait pro-Clinton posts get jumped on by a troop of snarking Obama people who never pause to consider that there might be an opening for dialogue. No, it's just automatic attack because that person has been identified as belonging to the "other" side.

Obviously there's a good number of Hillary people who will go down throwing everything they can at Obama until they are finally banned.

But there are other people here, some longtime DUers that I've known for years, that I see no point in continuing to antagonize, because they are people I would like to have on my side for the big battle ahead. Yet they can't post ANYTHING without someone deciding to take it the worst way possible -- the insults and mockery fly and any chance of dialogue is totally shut down in a hail of mutual contempt.

I'm sincerely asking, is this smart? Is just staying all the time on hair-trigger defensiveness and hostility really the best strategy for the long term?

We need our wits about us. We need to be sharpening our rational minds and our creativity and learn to dazzle our opponents with the sheer beauty and awesomeness of our mad skilz. I want us to quit engaging in the low-minded self-indulgence of kicking them when they're down.

I wish we would simply ignore anything that gets posted that is clearly delusional, and/or is posted just to push the buttons of the Obama people. If they don't get attention there's nothing in it for them. At the same time I wish we start behaving like gracious and honorable victors, we should not seek to humiliate or heap contempt, or demand that they submit.

I wish we would stop coming out of a place of fear and anger, and instead come out of a place of joy and confidence. There are creative ways to resolve conflict and restore broken bonds, why don't we work from that level instead of from the level of battle-axes and claymores? Do we really want to condemn ourselves to tribalism and dualism forever?

We have important work ahead of us, work that is going to require all the nimbleness and alertness and creativity we can muster. Here, we have a perfect opportunity to practice our ability to make Obama's case to a skeptical audience. If we're not willing to learn how to do that starting now and starting here, what does that say about our confidence and spirit?

Peace,
sw