I Can't Bite My Tongue Anymore.

[David Zephyr]

I am nervous about who Senator Obama picks to be his Vice Presidential running mate. I know that many of you here are, too. It seems now that General Wes Clark is out of all consideration. That's really sad considering his stature, sharp mind and sterling resume. I believe that Clark would bring Arkansas and Florida (he's half Jewish) along in November and has the best knowledge of foreign affairs of all the contenders (Joe Biden is second). It seems also that Governor Bill Richardson is "out". Another person with an outstanding resume, foreign affairs experience and solid executive experience.

The truth is that we don't have any say in this at all and that's as it should be, but I have some serious concerns about a few of the names that are being mentioned these last hours before an announcement is made:

Governor Tim Kaine: Two years as a governor. He hasn't even finished his first term. This may (or may not) help carry Virginia, but considering Obama is in his first term as a U.S. Senator, the GOP and McCain's campaign will have a field day with this should Kaine be the VP choice. Polls already clearly show that there are many Americans who are concerned that Barack may be too "inexperienced" to be President. While that is nonsense to me, should he choose a rookie Governor like Kaine, then we are asking for an even harder battle in November than we already have. A very bad choice.

Senator Evan Bayh: Of all the names tossed around, this is the one that troubles me probably the most. Why is he even being considered at all? To win Indiana? To win rust-belt whites? To appease Hillary voters? All the negatives of Hillary without any of the positives. A very, very bad choice.

Senator Hillary Clinton: I have said, and even still believe that Senator Obama will choose Senator Hillary Rodham Clinton for a great many reasons. I may be wrong, but I was pleased to see that political columnist Richard Cohen just wrote in the last few days of the rationale for picking Hillary. Certainly, she has run 50 state campaigns and is battle tested on the national stage and brings far more to Obama than Kaine or Bayh ever could or would: Arkansas, Ohio, Pennsylvania, Michigan and Florida. A very good choice for Obama.

Senator Joe Biden: Well, here's an excellent choice. He helps Obama with Catholics. He helps Obama in Pennsylvania. He helps Obama with foreign affairs bonefides. He won many of the presidential debates last year. A very good choice for Obama.

Senator John Kerry: Considering the fact that Kerry won Ohio in 2004 and has also run the 50 state marathon and brings all those tens of millions of voters right back once again, Kerry bolsters Obama with his decades of foreign affairs experience, too. Kerry would be a very good choice for Obama.

I confess that I have been concerned that Obama kept such a small circle of advisers around him when it came to making such a critical first choice. Because he is still "new" to Americans, they will be watching him very carefully on this, his first big decision tipping how he can and will govern.

All any of us here at the DU or liberal blogs can do is give our opinions. So mine carries no more weight than the youngest newbie here at the DU, but I gotta tell you that I have good reasons to worry why we might just screw this up again:

Eight years ago, Al Gore made a terrible choice with Joe Lieberman to be his running mate. Lieberman would not even give up his Senate race to run freely with Gore "just in case" Gore lost. He was a disastrous VP choice.

Four years ago, John Kerry made an equally dismal choice in picking John Edwards. I saluted here, but nearly pulled my hair out when he did it. Edwards didn't deliver North Carolina and wound up fighting with Kerry's team which David Axelrod mentioned as nicely as possible.

Barack Obama needs to shore up and balance his attractive "newness" with someone that Americans already know and trust. I hope that those around him giving him advice realize this that "change" can be disconcerting to people and if they are going to give the helm of the ship of state to you, they will be checking to make sure that your second-in-command isn't also a newcomer.

[Barack_America]

1. Obama doesn't need help in Pennsylvania.

He needs help in VA, MI, OH, CO, IN, FL, etc.

[David Zephyr]

4. Tom Ridge.

.

[snowbear]

7. The old dude picks Ridge and loses his newly-found evangelicals..

Yeah. Right.

[David Zephyr]

16. The fundies will always fall in line. They always have.

They voted for the first divorced man to be president who never went to church over a man that was faithful to his wife and taught Sunday school.

They've already lined up behind McCain inspite of his views on immigration, campaign finance reform and more.

They will fall in line. They always do.

[Kurt_and_Hunter]

20. You are correct. Ridge would be McCain's best shot at winning.

He could lose by more with Ridge, but this election will be decided by the margins among married women and Ridge would give McC a "puncher's chance."

[David Zephyr]

23. Ridge really makes me nervous.

He's pro-choice and from Pennsylvania. He would be, as you say, "McCain's best shot".

[Barack_America]

15. Wouldn't be enough.

Philadelphia and its suburbs decide PA. I have seen on McCain sign and HUNDREDS of Obama signs in those areas.

[David Zephyr]

26. I wish I had your confidence, but I don't.

Obama swept Philly, but Hillary walked away with the state. Obama lost by around 10% that night.

[Barack_America]

31. The suburbs I'm talking about are where Hillary either won or Obama won by a very small margin.

And Obama now has the Democratic machine behind him.

Yes, I feel very confident about PA.

[David Zephyr]

35. Then I am counting on you.

We have to win the great state of Pennsylvania. The home of my hero, Ben Franklin.

Kristi1696, you must promise me that we will not lose there.

[Barack_America]

44. I promise that Obama will win PA.

And I will work hard to make that happen.

[WinkyDink]

18. Tommy is no match for Big Ed's charisma. Trust me.

[Kurt_and_Hunter]

2. I thought Kerry all but conceded when he picked Edwards, but like yourself I never bad-mouthed it.

Spilt milk and all that.

But it was an apalling pick.

[The Velveteen Ocelot]

3. I don't recall that you ever bit your tongue.

In any event, Obama will choose the person he believes would be the best running mate, for reasons he thinks are important, and nobody at DU will have the slightest effect on that decision.

[David Zephyr]

12. LOL!

I can't bite it for very long, I should say. LOL.

By the way, thanks for underscoring what I had already written in the OP: "The truth is that we don't have any say in this at all and that's as it should be"

[The Velveteen Ocelot]

25. And so... I think we can just wait and see what happens..

:hi:

[David Zephyr]

27. My valium may not carry me through.

But the doctor has me stocked up. :hi:

[RoyGBiv]

57. Wow ... sanity ...

.. on DU ... who'd a thunk it? :)

[Kittycat]

5. I'm not concerned, but I bet it's Biden

for several reasons you posted :)

[David Zephyr]

13. Biden would be a great pick.

No doubt.

[ruggerson]

6. Agree with you on Biden

and agree that, of those left standing, Kaine is hands down the worst choice.

[David Zephyr]

17. I'd be thrilled with Biden.

Thanks for weighing in, ruggerson.

[cliffordu]

8. I'm all for Clark -- then the RW radio asses can complain that the Democrats

are running "A Mooslim, and a Chew."

Heads would explode, The Middle East would be confused and I'd be happier than I've been since....oh, I dunno.

[ccharles000]

9. ...

:hug:

[David Zephyr]

30. Well, thank you.

I need that.

[Kermitt Gribble]

10. The worst

are the people here rationalizing a republican as our VP candidate.

[David Zephyr]

19. Yeah. I agree there 100%.

:thumbsup:

[Dinger]

29. A-Friggin'Men! (nt)

[AlCzervik]

37. i wish i could recommend your post.

:thumbsup:

[americanstranger]

11. Disagree on one point.

Biden knows more about foreign policy than just about anyone - he's been at it for 30 years now. I'd give Clark the edge in military affairs, though.

- as

[JackORoses]

14. I thought you were certain of who was going to be VP.

Obama will choose much more wisely.

[David Zephyr]

24. Which is why I wrote in the OP

"I have said, and even still believe that Senator Obama will choose Senator Hillary Rodham Clinton for a great many reasons. I may be wrong."

"I may be wrong." You might learn those words yourself, JOR.

[JackORoses]

28. but, you know I'm right. You're letting your prior affections cloud your decision-making.

[LibDemAlways]

21. I disagree on Biden and don't understand the Biden

love here on DU. He's a moderate Washington insider who's run for President more than once and never generated any traction or enthusiasm. He's long-winded and loves the sound of his own voice. He's made some well-publicized verbal gaffes. Just last year he praised Obama as an "articulate" "clean" African-American. He voted for the war and for the bankruptcy bill. He's from a small state that the Dems are going to win anyway.

Just, no.

[Barb in Atl]

36. I like Biden...

...because he slaps McCain around with the greatest of ease.

I actually miss him spitting on the latest McCain attempt to drag Obama down.

[LibDemAlways]

40. I don't dislike Biden as a person. I'm all for

him slapping McCain around. I just don't happen to think he's the best possible VP choice.

[Eurobabe]

61. Who's your choice then?

Out of the current crop?

Just curious.

[BeatleBoot]

22. Since I am a Democrat, I am used to losing Presidential Elections

And most on DU must enjoy it, given their hatred of the only Democratic President to win two terms since Franklin Delano Roosevelt (Bill Clinton).

My family can't afford to lose anymore, but I wouldn't be surprised if we do.

Hopefully the VP candidate will bring us a much needed swing state to put us over the top.

[HCE SuiGeneris]

.

[BeatleBoot]

51. ..

Realist.

[Naturyl]

32. Kerry would be a bad choice.

Americans have a "winner/loser" mentality, and guess which camp Kerry is in?

In American culture, losers are damaged goods and should go die quietly. Harsh but true. Kerry wouldn't help Obama.

Nor would Clinton, but that's another matter...

[donco6]

46. I agree. Strategically a bad choice.

Though, I like him very much for a cabinet post. Or any post for that matter.

My vote is with Biden, FWIW.

[saltpoint]

33. I'm still in the take-what-comes mode and wil support the ticket even

if Obama's choice is not on my top-5 or top-10 list.

I did write to the Obama campaign expressing my support but hoping nevertheless that Sam Nunn's name is passed over for the veep job.

Doesn't mean anybody needs to listen to that suggestion, but that's as far as I'll go in meddling with History.

I think McCain's next few months here are going to be bone-jarringly unpleasant out on the stump. On the first Tuesday in November, I think he'll be buried alive in a wide blue field.

I'm not hogwild about Bayh either, but can and will make the practical case for his selection.

There are usually degrees of enthusiasm for politicians. Bella Abzug and Barbara Jordan are two of my champions, may they rest in peace. I'm essentially a Kennedy Democrat. I like Gore now even better than I did in 2000. I want to see the ticket lift a LOT of down-ballot boats in November, so I'll trust Obama and his crew to make the choice they need.

[David Zephyr]

34. Big Ooops! Russ Feingold. A very good choice.

I should have included one more name. A great name. A great Senator.

That would be Russ Feingold.

None other than DU's own William Pitt and Alexander have been mentioning his name and I should have included him

He'd help Obama in the General Election and he would truly be a great VP.

[angee_is_mad]

38. Do Americans trust hillary?

or is it that they (we) just know her? I would be interested to see polls reflecting that the majority of Americans trust hillary.

[David Zephyr]

42. They know her and they know she'd be the biggest advocate for universal health care.

That's a subject they believe her on. And that's a gigantic issue today.

[angee_is_mad]

48. Economy is #1

but health is EXTREMELy important. People are concern about pocketbook issues now and foreign affairs is cropping back.

Having hillary on the ticket will only attract voters (pumas) who are pissed off that Obama won the election. I definitely feel there are not enough of them to counteract voters who HATE the clintons.

Also there will possibly be a backlash in the black community. That will hurt lower ticket candidates who need to have record breaking black turnout in the south to have a working majority in both houses. Obama is the only candidate that can deliver over 90% of the black vote. With hillary that will go down to normal average of the 80s for the democratic candidate.

People need to stop underestimating the sentiment that is in the black community.

I hope this post doesn't get deleted.

[Metric System]

58. Wow, so you're saying African-Americans will stay home and not vote for Obama if Hillary is VP?!?

There's a lot of anger among Hillary supporters too stemming from the primaries but the majority of them are now planning to vote for Obama. If the majority of Hillary supporters can put the primaries in the past and vote for Obama I would hope that Obama supporters would do the same IF Hillary is the VP (which she likely won't be). Otherwise, how is that any different from the PUMAs?

[Sparkly]

39. Clark should not be out of the running.

That's what makes ME nervous.

I don't see the "safe" choices as safe, at ALL.

[Dinger]

45. Yeah, They're Safe Alright

They're safe from helping Obama getting elected.

[windbreeze]

49. me too

I'm left wondering what went on here...it just doesn't strike me right, somehow...and the Wed evening...securing america...Tammy Duckworth...man...to me it's like proverbial salt in an open wound...but mayhaps I am alone there...??wb

[AtomicKitten]

41. Obama will choose the VP he wants, as it should be. I have every confidence in him.

He had done a great job so far and has earned some confidence.

[malik flavors]

43. I agree Tim Kaine is a bad choice. Too unknown and has zero foreign policy credintials.

Joe Biden is a solid choice. Foreign policy, he's well known, he's liked by both Clinton and Obama followers, he's from Penn., and he'd be a great attack dog that would really fight for the ticket.

Hillary is solid, but brings a lot of baggage. She would help in battle ground states with democrats, but could lose independents. She would also fire up the republican base, which would be a big negative. The biggest issue would be the drama though. I just don't think Obama would be comfortable with her on the ticket, and Bill would cause a mess.

Bayh is an ok choice. He has foreign policy experience and executive experience. It's hard to find one person with both of those things AND that can help carry a state. He also helps with the working class. I just wish he had a bit more fire in him.

Sebelious is great, but she's also unknown and has zero foreign policy experience.

Bill Richardson WOULD be great, but he supposedly has skeletons in his closet and two minorities on one ticket is a bit much for many Americans. Clinton loyalist also hate his guts. Not a good unity choice.

My first choice though is Wes Clark. I'm really disappointed that the Obama camp hasn't shown much interest at all in him. Maybe their throwing a curveball, and they'll shock us by picking him but I'm doubtful. With what's going on in Georgia, Pakistan, and the rest of the middle east, Wes Clark would be a perfect pick for Obama. And he can go after McCain like nobody else.

Jim Webb would have been a good choice also, but I guess he wasn't willing. Though he could also be another suprise pick.

[Skwmom]

50. Yeah, that Washington foreign policy experience has just served this country

so well. We go to war with the wrong country, destroying our reputation, thousands dead, thousand more wounded, and trillions will be borrowed before it is all said and done.

Frankly, I just don't know how much more Washington experience this country can take.

[Avalux]

47. I am hoping the Obama campaign will suprise everyone.

We'll have to wait and see but I won't count Clark out until I hear otherwise; I won't count out Richardson either (he doesn't even get mentioned anymore).

[PurityOfEssence]

52. It WOULD be cool if it was Jan Schakowsky...

She HAS been involved in the campaign...

[eshfemme]

53. Much as I love Biden's crusty old bastard-ness, picking him as VP

would be too much of an echo of Bush-Cheney as Bush was the neophyte with the experienced oldhand in the VP slot in 2000. I really don't think it's a winning strategy to subconsciously remind people of that disastrous combo no matter how good Biden is. I know it's unfair but the spectre of Bush-Cheney needs to be considered.

[GoesTo11]

54. Bayh would be like having no VP at all

I was curious about him and watched a bunch of youtube videos of him. Just boring as can be, and doesn't believe what he says.

"Gen. Petraeus, I praise and honor your service to our great country, and thank you for your candor with this committee."

etc.

He is just boring. Polite, good looking I suppose, but he would do no more good out on the campaign trail than would a stuffed teddy bear. "Hey everybody, Evan Bayh is coming to town for a rally!" Yawn.

[TexasObserver]

55. he's really boring

[musicblind]

56. Kaine is against Civil Unions

and Bayh said he is against them as well and would support an amendment to the constitution to define marriage as between a man and a woman if it was necessary.

[Independent_Voice]

59. When did Bayh say he was against civil unions?

I thought he said he would only support FMA if the courts tried to "uncut" Indiana's marriage laws?

[LostinVA]

62. Yup, a dealbreaker for me

[H2O Man]

60. We are witnessing

history in the making. It is an exciting time, and it is interesting to see how the DU community is experiencing this. Many people are nervous, as you noted.

At this point, "who is it?" is on all of our minds. I'm reminded of Malcolm X's saying, "Those who know don't say, and those who say don't know."

I had considered a number of possibilities, and rated them on "tiers." The top three, for me, were Biden, Clark, and Clinton. There were a few more on the 2nd tier, and then some I did not want to see picked on the last level. Your descriptions are very similar to what I think, which I think is a good sign.

With Biden and Clinton, I think either could be VP or Secretary of State. I think that during our Convention, most democrats are going to be pleased. Obama is going to move in the direction that Lincoln did, as so wonderfully described by Doris Kearns Goodwin in "Team of Rivals."

Enjoy the next couple weeks! Then, we need to all focus on working towards winning in November.

[Samantha]

63. I find the options of Kaine and Bayh terrible demoralizing

There are a handful people who I believe would truly excite the base. They are not in that group.

My personal favorite is Biden, and despite his words of yesterday, I continue to hope. Dodd, fine. Richardson, very fine. There are other choices which would be inspiring, Caroline Kennedy, for example. But the party deserves better than Kaine or Bayh.

Sam