To the new "Moderate" faction. Moderate is something you ARE NOT.

[TheBigotBasher]

It is not moderate to be happy with a health insurance industry that provides Americans with the most expensive care in the World but one of the worst outcomes.

It is not moderate to continue a Prison Industrial complex that results in a higher prison population than China.

It is not moderate to continue a Military industrial complex that results in America spending more on Arms than every other Country in the World put together.

It is not moderate to have allowed a "War on Drugs" to escalate whilst washing your hands of the consequences that war is having on your southern neighbour.

It is not moderate to have enabled a "War on Terror" that has simply achieved the shredding of what you stand for as a Country and more terrorists.

It is not moderate that American workers have the shortest holiday periods in the World and are afraid to use them.

It is not moderate to allow employers to fire workers at will.

It is not moderate that the Social make up of Ivy League universities has hardly changed because education for far too many American school children is underfunded.

It is not moderate to have watched employers cutting pay and conditions on the back of fear that those jobs would go abroad, while enabling those jobs to go abroad anyway.

It is not moderate to blame the health care policies of the Car Industry for the company failures, when that expense is caused by the failure of Government to provide a decent health care system in the first place.

It is not moderate to blame those being foreclosed on when you sold them that dream and did nothing about property hyper inflation as it made people feel richer while their pay was being cut.

It is not moderate to make so many spending cuts to a stimulus budget that you do the work of the GOP for them and the result is that it may be now too small to work.

It is not moderate to go on tv against your own Party and your own budget, decrying "pork", while ensuring that your State gets more than its fair share.

It is not moderate to have been so weak as a Party that is allows Republicans the ability blame the state of the economy on the Democratic Congress because that Democratic congress refused to stand up to their President.

It is not moderate that after the voters elected a Democratic House, Senate and President, to change America you now think it important to stand up to the President.

If you block or water down the changes that are needed in America, you are no moderate, you are every bit as extreme as the Republican candidate that wants your seat and is rubbing its dirty reptile hands at the prospect of the Democratic Party failing, all because you wanted to claim the label moderate.

[lob1]

1. K&R because I'm not a moderate.

[Guy Whitey Corngood]

2. I'm a moderate.

I'm somewhere between the so called "Blue Dogs" and the extreme left. :evilgrin:

[Cant trust em]

3. I would call myself slightly to the left of center-left.

Is that too nuanced?

[Guy Whitey Corngood]

4. Not at all. nt

[Jennicut]

45. No, I consider myself there too.

Not really into Dennis K. and some on the far left but Evan Bayh make me puke.

[TheBigotBasher]

6. This all depends on where you see left and right.

From a UK perspective, so called "blue dawgs" are far right and the Republicans have no equivalent.

[Cant trust em]

13. That's because the UK is full of Euro socialist/communist/marxists

LOL.

[TheBigotBasher]

15. he sad thing is

it is not just Republicans that parrot that. Except it just shows their stupidity.

Interesting that Blair, of the (once Socialist) Labour Party is one of their heroes.

Thathcher, the only other Prime Minister they remember increased spending on the UKs socialist National Health Service by 50% in real terms over her premiership.

They claim France is Socialist, yet it has a Conservative Prime Minister.

The hard right of America knows nothing about International politics, hence why Iran, who used to give the US military intelligence on the Taliban, became an enemy.

They do not even understand the basics of what they spout as economics. The Laffer curve is just that, a curve that highlights the optimum level of taxation, where above or below you start doing damage to the economy and government revenues.

[Cant trust em]

16. most people who use the word socialist

don't know what that means. It's just a big scary word that means something bad.

[Guy Whitey Corngood]

17. I was joking I see little difference between those guys and the 2 so called moderate

republicans that they keep around for shits and giggles.

[wroberts189]

9. Most people consider themselves moderate ..even myself..but

I have yet to see it get defined. What is moderate???

For example ..you either believe in a woman's right to choose an abortion or not.

You either believe in climate change or do not.

You either believe drug use is a medical issue or a criminal issue.

you either believe we have a right to health care or not.

[TheBigotBasher]

10. The media and "Blue Dawgs" have labelled themselves moderate.

That is patently false. The Republican Party agenda has moved further and further towards the hard right over the last 16 years, dragging the Congressional Democratic Party with them. Support of that agenda, even if tacit, and working against a Democratic President, to aid that agenda, places them as extreme as the Republican Party.

They need to work with the Party and get America working again. The size of the US economy has always meant when it gets a cold, the rest of the World gets a flu. Now its economy is on life support. The Republicans will not thank them and will still run dirt against them. Something Kay Hagan would do well to remember.

[kctim]

19. Its not about simply believing

in those things or not, but rather the limits one is willing to go to in order to deal with them.

[Two Americas]

33. that is an illusion

One stands for something or they do not.

For example, people say "I support that and I agree with you BUT..." which is then followed by all of the ideas that oppose the thing they supposedly stand for. This is then called "moderate" or "practical" or "realistic."

People want to say they support progressive causes when they actually do not.

A good example was the almost complete absence of any support for the GLBTQ folks here during the Warren fiasco. "Don't get me wrong I support gay rights, BUT..." followed by people saying "we have other priorities" and " you are going about it wrong" and "you are hurting your own cause" and on and on.

There was almost zero support for GLBTQ rights here, yet there were lots of people saying that they "supported gay rights." They were being "moderate."

If you support a right, then it would not be conditional on anything. Rights exist or they do not. If they exist, they exist at all times and under all circumstances, or else they are not rights. If a person's supposed support for a right is conditional, then it is not really support but is the opposite.

So "moderate" merely means a clever way to string words together and concoct unlikely and illogical arguments that simultaneously take both sides on every issue. By saying we support the left wing position, we are then free to promote the right wing position and not be called on it. This is the main method by which right wing positions are promoted, and explains the amazing success of the political right wing over the last couple of decades or so.



...

[kctim]

37. It is no longer that black and white

Moderates don't oppose ALL of the ideas, just the one's that go to far. Moderates are why abortion is legal, but not used as a form of birth control or genetic selection. Moderates are why guns are not banned, but there are common sense laws of ownership.
When either party pushes too hard, it is the moderates who keep them in check. That is not taking both sides on an issue and it is no where near illogical.

Gay rights transcend party lines, so its hard to gauge where the "moderate" stance is. African Americans, by an overwhelming majority, oppose gay rights but yet vote for the party most pro gay rights. Does that make them moderates out to destroy the Democratic party? Not hardly.

Progressives need moderates if they want to keep the power which enables them the opportunity to one day make their progressive ideas the moderate ideas.

[Two Americas]

32. what it amounts to

It is a matter of being accepted socially. Saying "I am a moderate" sounds good, and gives a person something to say in social settings and be accepted.

It is a comfortable place to hide. It is a way for people to be cowardly and not take stands while convincing themselves that they aren't doing that.

[Rockholm]

21. I'm a moderate.

Fiscally conservative and socially liberal.

[reggie the dog]

5. I am a dog lover

why do the right wing democrats have to say they are dogs???? Now I hate blue dogs....hating all dogs may come next.....oh noes.......well the USA is fucked because now the Democrats lost their majority and the majority in power now wants Obama to fail.

[wroberts189]

7. So i am not the only one who hates this "moderate" bs KNR n/t

[ThomCat]

8. Moderates have never done anything

but allow us to get pulled to the right. They dismantled the left wing of the party, and now there is no force pulling us to the left.

We finally have Democrats dominating the government and they're fighting to look like moderate republicans!

We need Lefties, representing the left, fighting for the left, pulling our entire national debate and agenda to the left.

Get the moderate assholes the hell out of there so we can undo the damage already! x(

[cascadiance]

11. "Moderate" is a code word for closet corporatists!

Their real agenda is to keep the issues that affect corporate power over this government from coming to the table. They'll voice their opinion on social and other emotional issues to keep the discussion framed there, but be "in the middle" on those issues and be willing to "moderately" bend on them, since corporatists don't really care about who wins those issues. They just care that they have enough congress critters living off of their corporate teat to keep their power over them when the populists start yelling more.

[yurbud]

12. moderate=moderately for middle & working class, but fanatical for corporations

[Zodiak]

14. You cannot win the game when your offensive line...

...secretly plays for the other team.

The good thing is....when they betrayed us during the Bush presidency and allowed this country to fall off a cliff, the excuse to keep them around was that they had to vote that way because Bush was oh-so-popular.

Now, when they have a popular President from their own party, they suddenly develop the guts to fight the Presidency, declaring openly that they are waging an ideological war with the majority of their party.

They have played their last card and we are finally out of excuses for keeping them around. What they push for is disaster (more corporatism, less helping our workers), and it has been proven time and again. This country needs its liberals, now, and it is a poor strategy indeed to declare an ideological war against them without understanding the anger that is out there.

If they want to fuck with President Obama and the solutions this country needs, then we need to cut them loose. This is not the time to be positioning oneself for a run in 2012. This is the time to get shit done with a new way of thinking.

[Faryn Balyncd]

18. Moderates are not "moderate" and centrists are anything but "centrist"

K & R




(( and, as we all know, anyone who thinks the right wing "conservatives" are actually conservative is nuts.))

[w4rma]

39. "Moderate" and "Centrist" are code words for pro-corporate. (nt)

[leftofthedial]

20. yet because these reaganistas put a phony "D" beside their names,

we pretend that the "conservative" fascist movement in Amurka is dead.

Call them what they are--repukes. Recognize that Democrats really control nothing.

[burythehatchet]

22. I do not know how the party apparatus works, but why not kick them out of the party?

If they want to run let them run as what they are, Republicans. Put our hard earned money behind people who represent Democratic principles. The enemy within is far more deleterious than the known enemy.

[kctim]

23. Why not kick them out of the party?

Because the party cannot hold a majority without them.

[TheBigotBasher]

24. The one thing Americans did not want

was four more Republican years. They wanted Democratic candidates to take up their positions and CHANGE America, not tinker with it.

[kctim]

26. Agreed

But, "their positions" differ greatly from area to area and not acknowledging that only weakens the Democratic party.
Like it or not, moderate Democrats are the Progressives biggest allies and working with them is not only easier than working with Republicans, it is also the most effective way to keep Republicans from regaining control.

[TheBigotBasher]

27. The GOP is able to hold the nation to ransome still

because in Congress with views as divergent from the libertarian right to the most extreme God bothering so called Christian fundamentalist they are a united front. They are far more effective at blocking Democratic legislation as a tiny rump than a majority Democratic congress was at blocking the programme of the most unpopular President ever.

If the Democratic Party had half the discipline of the Rethugs, America would be number one for health care and education; ahead in high speed rail; better able to look after its poor, its old and sick, and most importantly Republicans would not be able to argue Government is bad - simply because they can not manage it.

Every single Democratic senator owes their seat and therefore their loyalty to the programmes espoused by Barack Obama during the General Election. He was elected to lead an reform the Country. It is the job of the democratic Party to MAKE that happen.

[Hippo_Tron]

34. You miss a key part of the equation... money

It's easy to hold together a coalition to vote for the interests of powerful and wealthy lobbies when they promise they will not only finance your own campaigns but run slick advertisements that convince Americans that the vote you cast in favor of their lobby is good for the average joe as well.

Meanwhile, voting the right way doesn't finance your campaign and too many Democrats are tempted to vote with the powerful lobbies because they need the cash to get re-elected. No other democracy in the world has bought and paid for elections like we do.

[Dr Fate]

25. They were calling their support for Bush's war & tax cuts "moderate" as well.

To these types, "moderate" really means conservative.

[cooolandrew]

28. I'm glad they laid their cards on the table we can now watch them and pressure them.>

Least they saved us the effort to work out who we'll have to work to oust in future primaries if they don't play ball.

[Honeycombe8]

29. Many of those things you list are not moderate, it's true. But why do you think Bayh had anything

to do with them?

It's a fool's argument.

Might as well say:

It is NOT moderate to kill unwed mothers.


That statement is true. But it has nothing to do with Evan Bayh.

[TheBigotBasher]

30. It is the so called "Moderate Dems"

that have stood by and allowed these things to happen. As a result of them, the voters when they elect a Democratic Government end up getting diluted Republicanism. That is not what voters want.

[Honeycombe8]

36. I disagree. Reid and Pelosi, as well as other definite lefters, were as much, if not more so,

to blame for allowing the atrocities of the last 8 years to occur. Not much they could do, true, because the pubics controlled the Congress for most of that time.

But didn't they vote for the Iraq War? Almost all the Dems, moderates and lefters alike? Wasn't Pelosi in on the no-warrant searches? Didn't they approve some of the budget bills passed? Feinstein (I don't consider her a moderate) voted for that awful Medicare Reform Act (a/k/a big pharma subsidy).

Plenty of blame to go around. The so-called moderates did not stand alone the last 8 years in allowing the Bush agenda to be forced on the citizens. In fact, some of those moderates weren't even part of the Congress during those years.

[LWolf]

31. Too late to recommend, but I'll give it a

:kick:

:thumbsup:

[omega minimo]

35. So what's yer point?

:yourock:

[tekisui]

38. Moderate = Status Quo/Don't Change Things= Conservatism

[Liberal_Stalwart71]

40. Even liberals, except for Rachel Maddow, are calling them "moderates" They aren not!

Blue Dog Democrats are not moderates. They are conservative Democrats.

[TheBigotBasher]

41. I would not even call them "Conservative Democrats"

Republican Democrats and after Reagan there is a big distinction.

[MarjorieG]

42. We are talking about President Bush, not Obama, right?

Otherwise had it with Obama pile-on.

"It is not moderate to have been so weak as a Party that is allows Republicans the ability blame the state of the economy on the Democratic Congress because that Democratic congress refused to stand up to their President."

[Political Heretic]

43. K&R from the outer reaches of the radical fringe left! :)

Hellooooooooo people of earth! :)

[espritjoie]

44. Where is The Outrage!!

Maybe it is because "MODERATE" is such an innocuous word. I have a petition that I started after learning about the Conservadems goals to thwart President Obama and those of us who support him and his goals! Has there been an uprising? A rush to the streets? No this isn't France! Millions of phone calls or petitions? No we aren't there yet! I have 380 signatures .... We have millions and millions of people suffering and we have yet to get desperate enough to see the light as a country! We need these selfish "moderate" people OUT! How do we inspire our country to move? Does it take a complete collapse?


http://www.thepetitionsite.com/1/conservadems-you-should-be-replaced

[Norrin Radd]

46. kr

Moderates have commitment issues.

[ima_sinnic]

47. moderate = middle-of-the-road cowards without the guts, vision, or desire to fight the status quo

moderates = don't-rock-the-boaters who benefit from keeping things just the way they are.