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BUSH Likely To WITHDRAW From IRAQ After Election

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liberalpragmatist Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-20-04 04:41 PM
Original message
BUSH Likely To WITHDRAW From IRAQ After Election
Edited on Mon Sep-20-04 05:04 PM by liberalpragmatist
According to, in the immortal words of Jon Stewart, that great "Douchebag of Liberty," Bob Novak, the neocons are on the verge of abandoning their Iraq project. After Iraqi "elections" are held in January, the plan to quickly exit and declare victory. Take this with a grain of salt, but if true, who's the real "cut-and-run" figure (as Spencer Ackerman of the New Republic Online has asked)?

Moreover, now the Neocons are saying it will take a, quote, RESOLUTE president like Bush to resist the temptation to get back involved in Iraq once the place blows up into civil war. Now, the neocons are saying that the mistake in Iraq was trying to stay and fix it up - instead, now their new ideology is just to depose regimes and get the hell out.

http://www.suntimes.com/output/novak/cst-edt-novak20.html

Inside the Bush administration policymaking apparatus, there is strong feeling that U.S. troops must leave Iraq next year. This determination is not predicated on success in implanting Iraqi democracy and internal stability. Rather, the officials are saying: Ready or not, here we go.

This prospective policy is based on Iraq's national elections in late January, but not predicated on ending the insurgency or reaching a national political settlement. Getting out of Iraq would end the neoconservative dream of building democracy in the Arab world. The United States would be content having saved the world from Saddam Hussein's quest for weapons of mass destruction.

<snip>

Well-placed sources in the administration are confident Bush's decision will be to get out. They believe that is the recommendation of his national security team and would be the recommendation of second-term officials. An informed guess might have Condoleezza Rice as secretary of state, Paul Wolfowitz as defense secretary and Stephen Hadley as national security adviser. According to my sources, all would opt for a withdrawal.

Getting out now would not end expensive U.S. reconstruction of Iraq, and certainly would not stop the fighting. Without U.S. troops, the civil war cited as the worst-case outcome by the recently leaked National Intelligence Estimate would be a reality. It would then take a resolute president to stand aside while Iraqis battle it out.

<snip>

This messy new Iraq is viewed by Bush officials as vastly preferable to Saddam's police state, threatening its neighbors and the West. In private, some officials believe the mistake was not in toppling Saddam but in staying there for nation building after the dictator was deposed.


Unreal.

EDIT: Take this with a grain of salt. This is Novak. And I'm somewhat skeptical that the neocons are abandoning their "dream." Personally, I think it's just as likely that they're going to stay there and pour forces in for years until we HAVE to get out and nearly 10,000 (*hopefully* not more) troops are dead.

But to be honest, I can also see the scenario Novak lays out realistically. If Rove realizes that continued involvement in Iraq is going to doom the GOP after a *won* election, do you really think Bushco's going to do anything other than withdraw? These guys are the most political shitfaces I've ever seen. Do you really think they'll stay put if it's hurting the GOP? They'll pull out, cynically declare victory. Bush will keep claiming that he did the right thing and that any mess that resolves isn't his fault - it's the Democrats and the Iraqis fault, not his. Plus, withdrawing would free up forces to topple Iran and North Korea, as part of the new revised neocon ideology, where we just depose regimes we don't like and don't stay to clean up the mess.

Oh, and about the oil thing - is it so inconceivable that they'll just let Allawi become dictator after crushing the insurgents in a brutal campaign that wipes out entire Sunni cities ala the Hama Masacre in Syria (look it up)? As long as Allawi gives them their oil - well, that's probably a *success* to them.

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mimitabby Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-20-04 04:43 PM
Response to Original message
1. uh, didn't they already do this and forget to leave??
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bahrbearian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-20-04 04:44 PM
Response to Original message
2. Of course Chimpy is getting us out of Iraq, he's taking us to Iran.
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democratreformed Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-20-04 04:47 PM
Response to Reply #2
7. Yeah, this was my thinking too.
Gotta go on to other things (uh, wars).
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ClintonTyree Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-20-04 04:51 PM
Response to Reply #2
11. Quite correct.................
so many regime changes, so few soldiers for cannon fodder.

How could ANYONE, Conservative, Liberal, Independent, no matter from what country, take the Bush regime seriously if they did this? The credibility of the U.S. is practically zilch as it is, after something like this, I wouldn't be surprised if some countries invaded the U.S. for a regime change.
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htuttle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-20-04 04:45 PM
Response to Original message
3. I call bullshit on this 'Secret Plan to End the War'
If Bush wins the election, what impetus would he have for getting out?

This is a whispering campaign to make people think Bush plans on getting out of Iraq. I assure you he doesn't.

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21winner Donating Member (374 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-20-04 04:45 PM
Response to Original message
4. I don't believe it.
Why would anyone else?
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MallRat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-20-04 04:46 PM
Response to Original message
5. "Messy new Iraq" is preferable to Saddam?
Un. Fucking. Believable.

-MR
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A_Possum Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-20-04 04:46 PM
Response to Original message
6. Flip-flopper!
Why can't he decide what his plan is? Stay the course or withdraw after the election? Doh, what should I do today, Daddy, I screwed it up so bad I don't know if I should stay or leave!? Bu
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NewYorkerfromMass Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-20-04 04:50 PM
Response to Original message
8. He has to maintain the illusion of "success" until the election
This should piss off a hell of a lot of troops who became casualties after the capture of Saddam.
"Mission Accompished"? Only if Bush is elected.
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Parche Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-20-04 04:50 PM
Response to Original message
9. Early Withdrawl
Is that a Premature Election?
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patdem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-20-04 04:50 PM
Response to Original message
10. UH! Iraq is CENTRAL in the 'War on Terra'...are we pulling out of the WOT?
How will this be spun?

Usama-dead or alive...oh well, he's just a guy.

Iraq-Central in the 'War or terra'....oh, well, just one country?

These people are TRULY AMAZING...

I guess it will be ONTO IRAN...cause hey, they REALLY ARE A THREAT!!! We were only kidding before! You know how that goes (idiots) :grr:
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MuseRider Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-20-04 04:52 PM
Response to Original message
12. So why did we
build all the bases? We will NEVER leave Iraq this is just more bullshit.
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aint_no_life_nowhere Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-20-04 04:53 PM
Response to Reply #12
16. and I believe the embassy were are building will be the world's largest
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cmd Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-21-04 07:45 AM
Response to Reply #12
30. Correct, MuseRider
We are building all those bases because the Saudis want us out. There is NO way we will abandon them. We'll be in Iraq longer than I will live.
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librechik Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-20-04 04:52 PM
Response to Original message
13. this is to conteract Kerry's (no doubt true accusation) that Bush
has a massive troop call up planned after the election. Misdirection thanks to Novakula's leak.
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WilliamPitt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-20-04 04:52 PM
Response to Original message
14. Bullshit
14 bases? Don't think so. Iraq is a staging area for the grand plan.

How does this jibe with the other reports of a massive planned call-up post-election, and a massive attack against the insurgents post-election?
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LisaLynne Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-20-04 04:53 PM
Response to Original message
15. How can these people ...
even say this stuff with a straight face? Although, I will say one thing -- to me it seems as though they are starting to be on the defensive. Kerry says he will bring the troops home and suddenly BushCo is all ready to pull up stakes and get out. They're started to react to us instead of vice versa. Which is a good thing.
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Disturbed Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-20-04 05:02 PM
Response to Reply #15
19. Novak.
This scum is a Repub. operative. This is dis-info meant to confuse anyone paying attention to events. Of course, most Americans only hear sound bytes on TV and the attention goes to other things in 40 seconds.

No Repubs or Dems will remove troops from Iraq as long as the oil is there.
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whistle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-20-04 04:57 PM
Response to Original message
17. That is pure horsesh*t and Bob Novak knows that....
...BushCo are in Iraq for the oil, 2nd largest reserve in the world so Chevron and Halliburton and Bechtel and other major corporate players have no intention of letting that go. But, they will let the rumors leak that that's what they'll do to put the sheeple back to sleep about Iraq. If the vote is still moving in favor of Kerry Dubya's thrump card will be to shut down the election and stay in office that way.
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aint_no_life_nowhere Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-20-04 05:17 PM
Response to Reply #17
22. Novak thrives on horseshit - like fungus or poisonous mushrooms
Novak has no moral compass whatsoever when it comes to the truth.
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blindpig Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-20-04 04:59 PM
Response to Original message
18. disinformation.
all of that oil, all of those bases, all of that ego, all of those contracts, I call BULLSHIT! Aint nothing but a bone to throw to those so-called moderates who remember what a quagmire looks like.
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JSJ Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-21-04 05:11 AM
Response to Reply #18
28. disinfo it is- meant to leave the impression they will- some will buy it
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grasswire Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-20-04 05:05 PM
Response to Original message
20. lies and triangulation
They're trying to remove Iraq as an issue for Kerry.

But remember Richard Nixon's "secret plan" to end the war in Vietnam?

Hmm?
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sonicx Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-20-04 05:12 PM
Response to Original message
21. doesn't matter. Kerry's going to win. nt
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karlrschneider Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-20-04 05:21 PM
Response to Original message
23. KarlSchneider likely to win Powerball lottery after Wednesday...
:eyes:
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oasis Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-20-04 05:34 PM
Response to Original message
24.  A flip-flop by the "War President"?...Nah
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Quetzal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-20-04 05:35 PM
Response to Original message
25. I saw John Stewart Saturday on my flight from
JFK to LAX. Shook his hand and told him "Shalom"

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dogman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-20-04 05:58 PM
Response to Original message
26. Nofacts is trying to undercut the fear of a draft.
Go back to sleep kids, there's no boogeyman B$$$.
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sr_pacifica Donating Member (775 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-21-04 04:50 AM
Response to Original message
27. I think it a plausible scenario
As you say, if it's harming the Republican Party, they will pull out, claim they achieved what they wanted---deposed Saddam and provided enough security for Iraq to have elections, and if civil war breaks out, it's the Iraqi's fault. I think you're right on about the "cut and run" strategy and the likelihood that Iraq is going to be saddled with another tyrant, but this time someone who will protect American interests (oil).

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AntiFascist Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-21-04 07:07 AM
Response to Original message
29. This could be major news.....
it could mean the conservatives are winning out over the neocons. If true, it would mean a complete failure for PNAC in Iraq, with the exception of capturing Saddam, even if Bush decides we are moving on to Iran.
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