Obama as Health Care Salesman: He Sucks!

[Beacool]

Dearth of a Salesman: President Obama gave interviews to a number of network health correspondents today as part of his health care push. Here is an "edited transcript" of his talk with Dr. Nancy Snyderman of NBC. As a health care sales pitch, it was awful. Why? Let's go to the videotape.

1) What's in it for you? Pain and discipline! Here's Obama's first big spiel, embracing a question from Snyderman:

Snyderman: I haven't heard anyone ask just for the American public to pony up here, that this is going to require some give for all the stakeholders involved.

Obama: Well, let me - let me talk about what I think the American people are going to have to do.

First of all, the American people have to recognize that there's no such thing as a free lunch. Right? So, we can't just provide care to everybody that has no cost whatsoever, you don't end up having to make any decisions.

So, obviously, we've got to have a system that controls costs, gives people choices, but makes sure that we're getting a good bang for the buck. And we've got to have the American people doing something about their own care.

Snyderman: So, self-responsibility.

Obama: So, self-responsibility is going to be critical. This is probably not going to be something that's legislated. But I tell you what, every business out there is going to be looking at their health care bottom line. And increasingly what you're going to see is that businesses are going to incentivize their employees to stop smoking, lose weight, get exercise, get regular checkups.

What we can do is we can encourage those companies that have those sorts of wellness-prevention programs. We can make sure that it's easier to find a primary care physician to get a regular checkup, that everybody has basic insurance. But the American people are going to have to participate in their own health.

Did Obama forget to highlight the part about the good things that are in the health care bills--things people might actually want that they don't have now? That failure is all the more inexplicable because the bills emerging from the House and Senate HELP committees actually do hold out the promise of a down to earth benefit that an most voters might desperately crave, namely not having to worry about where their health insurance will come from anymore! (Worst comes to worse, they can always sign up for the public plan.) Instead, in Obama's version it's time for voters to pay the bill for what they are already getting. Pony up, sinners! Everybody loves collection agents.

2) He lectures: It's also time, Obama tells his viewers, to lose weight, and stop smoking, and pull up your socks. Later on he tells people that they are foolish to prefer brand name drugs to generic drugs, and to want multiple medical tests. "If you only need one test, why do you want five tests?" Stop clinging to your tests! You're worse than those people in Pennsylvania.

Who knew we were electing a national mother-in-law? And get a chance to endure increased taxes for the privilege. Obama's supposed to be rallying support from voters, not castigating them. Outside the S& M parlor, most people do not enjoy paying to be disciplined.

http://www.slate.com/blogs/blogs/kausfiles/archive/2009/07/15/obama-as-health-care-salesman-he-sucks.aspx

:7

[scheming daemons]

1. You're right... he should follow Hillary and Bill's tactics from 1993-94

;-)

Just playing with ya, Beacool...

[Beacool]

8. I thought that it was a funny article.

:D

[BlooInBloo]

2. I love seeing your posts of bitter loser tears here (seriously).

[Beacool]

9. Always so ridiculous..........

It's an amusing article, at least for those of us with a sense of humor.

;)

[Oregone]

3. Odd post

If Obama is anything, he is a salesman. He has Americans, in droves, supporting a movement to keep this right-wing health system.

I imagine everyone can do a better job, but, you know, "sucks"?

[Tuesday Afternoon]

7. +1

[FrenchieCat]

52. -2

[Dawgs]

10. Just because you don't like it doesn't mean it's 'right-wing'.

We all get it. You're position is single-payer or nothing.

My view is that if you were President we would get nothing; because you are stuck on a position that would never pass.

[Oregone]

17. The current system, which will be preserve, is fringe right-wing

It has nothing to do with whether or not I like it. It is capitalism at its best. It turns a service into a commodity, whose price is determined by a a pretty free market. The owners of the companies that provide such services are allowed to profit at gross rates for often providing inferior products. This practice doesn't only burden the typical America, but causes debt, bankruptcy, maltreatment and death in the name of greed. To make it all worse, this "service" is tied to employment, making one a virtual indentured servant with no employment options if they wish to keep using services.

The entire system, as is, couldn't be more right-wing. These reforms will address some points, but a right-wing structure will still remain.

[Tuesday Afternoon]

53. True.

[area51]

93. Great post.

I wish I could nominate it for the Greatest Page.

[CakeGrrl]

62. Consider the OP. If it bashes the President, it gets posted. Simple.

[BeyondGeography]

4. Maybe Mark Penn has some ideas

[Beacool]

11. Who knows, maybe he does..........

Penn may be a jerk, but the Democrat's version of Rove is probably Axelrod.

;(

[scheming daemons]

12. Democrats version of Rove USED to be Carville

Axelrod has taken his place

[pnorman]

14. Carville and/or Axelrod = Rove???

Is this supposed to be "serious" discussion?

pnorman

[scheming daemons]

21. In job title and function... .not in policies..... They're our "QB", just like Rove was theirs

But ours are better at it.

[pnorman]

38. I'll let this "pass", but I'm still flabbergasted at the comparison.

n/t

pnorman

[scheming daemons]

40. It's like comparing FDR to Stalin in a very narrow sense: Both led their country to victory in WWII

But their tactics are VERY different.


For the record: Axelrod = FDR, Rove = Stalin

[Beacool]

15. I don't think that Carville is as nefarious as Axelrod.

I would take Carville over Axelrod. Carville is mostly bluster, even though underneath that Louisiana twang is a very astute man. Axelrod always reminds me of Rove. Although I got to give it to both of them (A & R), they sure knew how to market their candidate.

[scheming daemons]

20. Axelrod is more effective

[Beacool]

25. Than Carville or Rove?

Yeah, Axelrod is quite effective at marketing his candidates.

[scheming daemons]

26. At winning.

[Beacool]

28. Well, the three of them saw their candidates win the presidency.

Carville with Bill, Rove with Jr. and Axelrod with Obama.

[scheming daemons]

30. But Axelrod's tactics were better than Rove's... i.e. win with a positive message, not with fear

[Beacool]

34. Hmmm, there we disagree.

His style may be more "throw the stone and hide the hand" and then have a "who, me?" look of innocence, but he's just as vicious as Rove. Then again, his job was to get his candidate elected and he completed the job.

[scheming daemons]

37. "Hope and Change" is a better slogan than "Vote for us or the terrorists win"

;-)

[Beacool]

43. Yeah, but they are just slogans.

Platitudes repeated ad nauseam.

[pnorman]

56. As one who had supported Nader over Lieberman in 2000,

I've taken more than a few lumps for that, with "at winning" forming the core of it. So now I, essentially a "lapsed anarchist", am as enthusiastic a supporter of a "winner" as I have ever been in all my misguided 79.4 years on this earth. No, O'Bama isn't a "socialist". He probably isn't even Irish for that matter! But to me, he's the Real Deal, and I also have faith in the people he's chosen to surround himself with.

So I now find myself a "Moral Relativist", among a crowd of "Purists". I wonder how many of them scorned my "Naderite-deviationism" back then?

pnorman

[scheming daemons]

64. I was probably one of them.

;-)

[pnorman]

70. And then again, maybe O'Bama IS Irish!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EADUQWKoVek

pnorman

[SemiCharmedQuark]

13. "The Dems version of Rove is Axelrod"...lol, ok.

[scheming daemons]

22. In one respect... Axelrod is our "QB", Rove is theirs. Ours is better.

[alcibiades_mystery]

84. Beacool's still mad that Axelrod outsmarted the whole Clinton machine

:rofl:

[alcibiades_mystery]

83. ROFL

:thumbsup:

[JTFrog]

5. Kaus: "half the Democrats are going to vote for McCain and I'm going to be one of them."

http://bloggingheads.tv/diavlogs/36?in=35:26&out=35:46

[dionysus]

33. holy shit

[jefferson_dem]

6. Obama sucks as a "salesman" for his "right wing" health care plan.

More pearls of wisdom and sound analysis brought to you by the "Democratic Underground."

[HamdenRice]

16. Depressing, isn't it? Yesterday someone told me the Dems & unions conspire to destroy the working

class. So what is that person doing on a Democratic website posting multiple OPs per day?

[BlooInBloo]

18. "Axelrod always reminds me of Rove." - These people are just like birthers...

In fact, they're the ones who started the birther stuff.

But they really only exist for us to have something to laugh at.

[scheming daemons]

24. Axelrod is different than Rove.... But consider them like boxers

Axelrod has all the skills and talents necessary to win.

Rove hits below the belt and hopes the referee doesn't notice.


Both have the same goal.... making sure their candidate wins.... but one does it with dignity, the other doesn't.

[Beacool]

27. And both of them are just as cut-throat.

Politics is a blood sport after all.........

:shrug:

[jefferson_dem]

47. Even if they are not actually right-wing trolls...

there's no doubt they share their motive and method. And they are getting more and more extreme and up-front in their expressions of "concern". Pretty soon, we'll start to see "ABO 2012" (Anybody But Obama) siggy lines. Scumbags.

[BlooInBloo]

50. Yep. They provide good humor value, though.

[WI_DEM]

19. Not at all. He's going to succeed where Bill and Hillary failed and get health care.

He'll succeed where Truman, JFK and LBJ failed too.

[Beacool]

23. Oh, I have no doubt that we'll get some kind of health care bill passed.

The $64,000 question is whether it will be a good one.

:shrug:

[yourguide]

42. It'll be better than what didnt get passed in 1993/1994 n/t

[Beacool]

44. And that's supposed to do what?

Is this the school of anything is better than nothing?

[yourguide]

45. It's the school of a moderate tactic to get some of it done...

is better than an abrasive tactic getting none of it done.

I dont have stars in my eyes, what gets passed wont be perfect but it will open the door to additional reforms down the road which is a good thing.

Just imagine if that door had been open some 15 years ago.

[Beacool]

49. 15 years ago was not the same political climate than now.

Frankly, I don't trust Congress much. They seem a lot more interested in pleasing their respective constituencies than in what is really best for the country as a whole. And I fear that Obama is so eager to have this feather in his cap that he'll sign anything that Congress comes up with, same as with the stimulus package who nobody bothered to read in its entirety.

[yourguide]

51. And congress was more trustworthy in 1993/1994?

You fear Obama is so eager to have this feather in his cap??? Things need to change when it comes to health care. If the Clinton's had compromised in 1993/1994 then by now we'd be talking about putting the finishing touches on a health care bill that would have given us EVERYTHING we are looking for now, updating the "compromised" system that the Clinton's would have put in place.

Same with the stimulus bill that no one bothered to read??? You mean the stimulus bill that the republicans had bits and bobs tacked on and *claimed* they didnt read? That stimulus bill?

Um, you do realize jobless claims were down again this week? Second week in a row or did you miss that memo?

Boy, every so often you slip and let your dead ender mentality show. Face it, the Clinton's blew it and your view that the Clintons and the Clintons alone represent the Democratic party is really transparent when you post crap like this.

[Beacool]

59. Interesting...........

As I recall, there were plenty of people opposed to the health care bill at the time. 1993 was not 2009. Ditto for the issue of same sex marriage and gays in the military.

The May unemployment rate was 322,000, it rose to 467,000 in June. No, I haven't checked it the past 2 weeks, but we're still losing jobs at an alarming rate. I'm not blaming Obama for it, but it is what it is.

As for representing the Democratic party, there are as many factions within the party as there are Democrats. Some Democrats I like more than others and some I don't like at all. I'm no different from any other Dem with an opinion.

[yourguide]

65. LMAO

There are plenty of people opposed to the health care bill now, this is different how? Not doing anything in 1993/1994 allowed the health insurers to quadruple their profits and have more money now to fight this bill. Way to go!

There are many many many accounts, including HRC herself, saying they should have been more bi-partisan and should have compromised. I dont see any difference here other than the people opposing it having MORE money to fight it this time around.

Ditto for same sex marriage and gays in the military, but again if they had opened some of those doors back in 1993 and 1994 then we'd be improving on what they built rather than starting from scratch.

And no, you are no different than any HRC supporter who cant stand Barack Obama, also known as McCain/Palin voters...

[Beacool]

66. Wrong, my friend.

If I supported the Republicans, then I wouldn't even bother coming here. Too busy to do that. Not liking some Democrats does not make anyone a Republican. Did conservatives who disliked McCain become Democrats? I doubt it.....

[yourguide]

67. You support one democrat and anyone involved with that democrat

yet you continue to tear down the current democrat in the highest office in the land with right wing talking points like "the stimulus bill that no one had time to read".

You sure are a funny democrat, or you are exactly as I and others suggested...

[Divine Discontent]

74. Good post.

as someone else said, just because you disagree with what's said, doesn't mean it's 'right wing commentary'. I made a thread with a list of reasons why I'm saddened that the guys I helped get in the WH are doing the corporations bidding, among many other things I list.

Now, I don't think I've been accused of being a stealth GOPer, anyone reading my 5 years of posts would know better, or my journal, but I get attacked for being racist, in essence. Because I call out the president for being super likable, but doing very little that I'd expect of a Democratic progressive president. His #'s are slipping because he's losing the liberals - not the right wingers - they can't stand him OR us! I'm upset that on a good swath of issues, he's doing no different than the previous pres would do. Makes me sick to my stomach....... to be honest...

[Beacool]

90. I hear you.

Obama was not my candidate, but he was the nominee and it was a better choice than McCain-Palin. But, one lesson that I learned from this past election cycle is that I will never again vote automatically for a politician just because he/she has a "D" next to his/her name.

As for the name calling, I just laugh at it. I've been called a PUMA, racist and a closet Repug. Who cares? I don't personally know any of these people, so they don't affect my life.

Take care!!

;)

[Flying Dream Blues]

87. Exactly...anyone who thinks we can do this all at once is not

being realistic. As much as I'd love it to happen now, it's going to take some time.

[Flying Dream Blues]

80. Deleted and moved to reply to OP. nt

[MarjorieG]

29. A lot of illness could be avoided, at a lesser treatment cost. Let's manage good health not illness.

[Beacool]

31. Kaus is not questioning that, he's just saying that Obama

is not selling it to the public in a way that the average American will find appealing. Remember that most Americans are not tuned to every political nuance like we are here.

[dionysus]

32. dissappointing coming from kaus Bea.

:hi:

[Beacool]

35. Hey, new banky!!!

She even has feet!!!

I'll save her for nap time.

:pals:

[Undercurrent]

36. Relevant?

What is the point of posting an article critical of our Democratic President written by someone who voted for McCain?

[yourguide]

46. consider the source that posted it n/t

[Undercurrent]

72. You are correct, of course.

It's just so pointless, and does nothing but stir and stir. (I think all that stirring would get boring after awhile.)

[WinkyDink]

39. Skinny non-smokers get diseases, too. But they'll also pay less for insurance?

[Beacool]

48. Yep, too true.

A coworker has tongue cancer. She has none of the major factors: she doesn't smoke, is not an alcoholic and has no family history of it.

She was operated in June. They had to reconstruct her tongue with a piece of flesh taken from her arm and she started chemo and radiation this Tuesday.

This person is in her early 40s, fit, eats healthy and exercises regularly. She's also a terrific person. To say that we are stunned by her situation is an understatement.

:(

[ErinBerin84]

41. lol

This guy's wikipedia says that he is against "amnesty for illegal immigrants", and is "skeptical of affirmative action and labor unions." I'll pass.

[ecstatic]

54. and the big smile is because...?

:shrug:

[Beacool]

60. Because it was funny.

At least to me......

:-)

[AspenRose]

55. Most people put titles of articles in quotes

OR give attribution to the author, so people will know who wrote it.

I suspect the OP got too much joy and satisfaction typing in the title without the quotes, though. Much more fun to stir shit up.

[Beacool]

61. The article is quoted verbatim and I posted the link

What more you want?

Please.......

:eyes:

[AspenRose]

68. ROFL

:rofl: Whatever.

[Spazito]

57. What you find "funny" is and has been both...

interesting.........and.......consistent as well as very obvious.

[cali]

58. ha ha. hillary still isn't president, dear. I love your misery over it.

pine away just like the dead parrot and the fjords. she still won't be president. tough for you.

[Beacool]

63. Hey, I'm not miserable.

My life hasn't changed one iota, honey. I just like to amuse myself.

;)

[jclincali]

69. Ugh, you're the one who seems miserable.

[DailyGrind51]

71. He needs to be more "FDR" and less "Adai Stevenson"!

Stevenson had a great mind, but was too much the "Oracle of Delphi" when we really needed "Joe Namath"!

[karynnj]

73. Actually, I heard him speak in NJ today

His comments on healthcare were EXCELLENT. He made many points that countered right wing lies.

Two observations the biggest applause was for two things:
- His strong endorsement of a public option
- His comments that if "you like your doctor, like your plan, you can keep it.

He also spoke of the fact that people were going to here a lot of nonsense that the Republicans have always used to defeat health insurance - the context was that we needed to know and spread the truth of what was in the bill.

It gets titing when you continuously post negative Obama articles. The fact is that the Kennedy plan, which Obama likes and which id consistent with his goals, at least got passed by the HELP committee - that is one step further than the Clinton plan, which no one on the Finance Committee then was willing to vote for. Neither Clinton came close to selling their plan.

[anonymous171]

75. Holy shit OP just triggered my PTSD from the primaries.

[grantcart]

76. well the OP doesn't have to worry

he is such a poor salesman that he won't get the nomination and has no chance at winning the GE.

[FrenchieCat]

77. Wow! Lanny Davis was right for once after all!

:rofl:

[Imagevision]

78. We'll still be talking about healthcare reform in 2012...

[Autumn]

79. Reading that cracked me up

especially " First of all, the American people have to recognize that there's no such thing as a free lunch. Right?" I think we Americans have always realized that . Wouldn't it be nice if our elected officials did ?

[Flying Dream Blues]

81. It must be difficult to contemplate Obama doing yet another

thing that Hillary couldn't. But still, it bothers me that you continue to root against him kind of like the Republicans do. You're constant "I found this interesting" or "Isn't this funny" negative Obama posts are very transparent, but I'm sure you're aware of that.

I guess I would think you'd care more about the country than about your ex-candidate who by the way has been treated very well by this administration. I was sympathetic to you for a long time because it was obvious how devoted you were to her, but now it is clear you are hoping for Obama's and by extension, our collective failure, and that doesn't belong here in my opinion

[alcibiades_mystery]

82. I gotta believe he can do a btter job of it than Hillary, past experience

:wow:

:rofl:

[Peacetrain]

85. Congress sucks. Lets just be honest here

[Flying Dream Blues]

86. Well, that's something to wish for, huh, Peacetrain? By your name

I can tell you're an optimist. I try, but some people I've given up on.

[Beacool]

88. Something we can fully agree on.

:-)

[hughee99]

89. Chessmaster... and so forth.

Why can't people see that seeming to do a poor job at something (in this case selling his health care package) is just part of his overall master plan? I'm going with blind faith until his overall master plan is revealed in 2016.

[Beacool]

91. You're a patient person.

LOL!!!

:7

[invictus]

92. The OP is still angry that Hillary didn't get the nomination. n/t

[BlooInBloo]

94. Of course. And I love watching it. Every second of it. It's like winning again and again.

[Beacool]

95. You are delusional.

It makes no difference in my personal life who is president, Republican or Democrat, it doesn't personally affect me. But I do care what happens to others and I will always think that Hillary was the best suited for the job at this point in time.

My opinion, others can disagree. That's their prerogative.

:shrug:

[BlooInBloo]

96. There's nobody gladder than I that you continue to stick to your guns...

Don't have to defend yourself to me!

:rofl:

[Beacool]

97. I'm not defending myself.

I'm just pointing out the futility of your deprecating posts. My life is fine regardless of who's president. I'm not so sure about others though.........

:eyes:

[BlooInBloo]

98. Or explain, describe, or whatever verb you prefer. You rock on - I'll enjoy the show!

[Occam Bandage]

99. Wow, Beacool likes an article mocking Obama. What a shocker.

I feel like it's spring 2008 all over again.

[CakeGrrl]

100. Meh. I thought this stupid thread sank!

Oh well...interesting contrast to the Hillary threads she puts up, isn't it?

Besides, you couldn't very well expect her to resist an article that featured the words "Obama" and "sucks" in the same sentence, could you?

;)