Waffle Words

[MadHound]

You know, I was about ready to do it. I was almost ready to come on here, issue a mea culpa, fall on my sword and prostrate myself before the Shrine of Obama, begging for forgiveness for its high priests. This moment came right after Obama spoke these words in his speech:

"And the insurance reforms that I've already mentioned would do just that, but an additional step we can take to keep insurance companies honest is by making a not-for-profit public option available in the insurance exchange."

Hallelujah! The man is going to fight for the public option. I wasn't even disconcerted by the statement that this public option would only cover approximately five percent.

But then came those words, the waffle words I have talked about and predicted, delivered after once again scolding his base:

"For example -- for example, some have suggested that the public option go into effect only in those markets where insurance companies are not providing affordable policies. Others have proposed a co-op or another non-profit entity to administer the plan.

These are all constructive ideas worth exploring. But I will not back down on the basic principle that, if Americans can't find affordable coverage, we will provide you with a choice."

Oh man, he's willing to bring in triggers, or coops or both. It is these sort of waffle words that infuriate the left. He didn't take a "line in the sand" stand on the public option, but rather signaled that it is open to negotiation, that he's willing to drop it in favor of something that is more favorable to the insurance industry.

And you folks who are in the center, DLC, moderate side of this Democratic tent wonder why the left is pissed at Obama, this is why. With the chance of a generation to bring about a huge step to single payer, Obama waffles. He is willing to throw over the public option to achieve "bipartisan support". He is willing to throw out the public option in order to achieve "victory", whatever that means. He is, while throwing a bone to right in the form of malpractice reform, once again banishing his base, the left, to the cold, not even willing to reward them with the compromise position of a true public option.

And you wonder why the left is pissed, this is why.

Well, it could very well backfire on the man. Many on the left have drawn their own line in the sand, if we can't get even the meager compromise of a true public option (note, we're not asking for single payer, just a step towards that with the public option) thrown our way, from a Congress with huge Democratic majorities and a Dem in the White House, if we can't get this, that's it, we're gone. See how well the party does without us in 2010 and 2012. We're tired of being the red headed step child of the party, first to give, last to receive.

Yeah, I hear y'all, the typical "Who else ya gonna vote for, Republicans? Har dee har har!" Well, you know what, it's come down to this. I'd rather watch the country flame out quickly under the Republicans because it means the quicker we can set about rebuilding it in a better fashion than the alternative, this slow, agonizing, insidious, death under corporate controlled Dems. It isn't like we're going to get anything we on the left want from either party, so let's get this done quickly and move on.

So here's the deal, I'm going to continue to fight for the public option. However if Obama signs a bill will no true public option, ie triggers, coops, or no public option at all, I'm gone, and I imagine that much of the left wing of the party will also go that way. Then see how well you do in upcoming elections. Perhaps the party will learn a meaningful lesson and change then. Or simply fade into the annals of history. We'll see.

[emulatorloo]

1. "constructive ideas worth exploring" is a way of being nice like when you tell your aunt her hat

"interesting."

[Robb]

2. Exactly. Where some see waffle words

...I see low-grade pandering to the inconsequential wing of government. :)

[MadHound]

8. Well, you know, after thirty plus years of being taken for granted,

It would be nice for Obama to pander to his base, and just this once take a strong line on something the left cares about. My God, it's not like we're asking for single payer in this bill, just the first step towards it.

[Robb]

11. I hear you

...I said something similar to Mrs. Robb recently, about how I'd really like someone to pander to me for a change.

But the longer the President looks like he's listening to the GOP, the longer they look stupid for saying otherwise. I know, "chess game" crap, but it makes sense to me. :)

[MadHound]

4. So are you saying that Obama was being politely dismissive of these alternatives?

I would like to believe you, but it would have been much more reassuring to hear him actually draw that line on the public option than use these waffle words that he used.

[Jennicut]

6. Yes...he essentially said if there is a better way to cover the uninsured then bring it up to him

But essentially there is no better way, public option is it.
It was a polite dismissal and a way of simply saying that if there are better ideas, he would want them in the bill. Nothing is better then public option except single payer and the votes are not there for that.

I understand your fears...we have to see what is in the final bill.

[MadHound]

10. We'll see indeed

Overall the man delivered a fine speech, but those waffle words, well, I've been around the block too many times not to realize that they usually mean that the legislation in question is open to being negotiated away.

[emulatorloo]

14. Well put two and two together -- 1) he said the R leadership has offered no ideas, just delay and

and untruths and the status quo. 2) He said if anybody has a genuine idea, he will listen to it. But he won't listen to time wasters.

I do not think any of the Republicans are going to come up with a genuine idea that is better that public option. I do not believe Obama thinks so either.

On the other hand people will like to think that Obama has an open mind.

SIDE NOTE: As to the McCain thing, Obama had to go back in his time machine to 2008 to get a good idea out of a Republican

[MadHound]

18. Snowe came up with the triggers idea

And coops are coming from the Blue Dogs. I can see him signing either into law in order to be able to claim bipartisan support and "achieve victory"

We'll see, like I said earlier, I'm not going to stop fighting for the true public option.

[emulatorloo]

22. I think Obama is going to fight for it, and so am I -- still calling my reps and Sens n/t

[OwnedByFerrets]

3. Even though it did no good, with the wave of UN's, I did rec this

[MadHound]

5. Thanks, I appreciate it

I knew that this would get buried by unrecs the minute I posted it, but hey, I really don't care.

[Robb]

7. FWIW

I rec'd it also, not because I agree, but because you make a good argument and it's a discussion worth having. :hi:

[MadHound]

13. Thanks, it is a discussion worth having

I'm hoping to get those Dems in the center and right to see where the left is coming from on this one.

We've been loyal foot soldiers for a long while, it's time we got paid.

:hi:

[MNDemNY]

9. K&R...

NO PUBLIC OPTION .. NO BILL.

[TheKentuckian]

12. Any time you are solving a problem one must be willing to explore alternatives

I perceived a dare more than a waffle. Effectively, he was saying that the public option is best way he knows of to keep private insurance competitive and provide essential choice but if someone has a better idea that fits in this framework then it would be explored.

I think the straight line comprehension is the public option has to be there unless a better choice is discovered that hasn't come to the forefront.

[MadHound]

15. Could be,

But given the man's penchant for wanting to be bipartisan, and his willingness to sacrifice good ideas to achieve "victory"(witness what he did with tax cuts and the stimulus bill), I can't help but be leery of what he says.

I can see him throwing in triggers to gain the support of moderate 'Pugs and thus proclaim bipartisan support, yet triggers will make a mockery of the public option and ensure that we don't get one:shrug:

[high density]

16. After last night I'm convinced the health insurance exchange will include the public option

In fact it was the least amount of "waffling" I've heard on this issue from the WH since the debate started.

[MadHound]

19. Well, having watched him go from a Senate candidate who supported single payer

To a Presidential candidate who supported a public option, to a President who is willing to include something other than a public option (witness what he said this summer and last night), I find that the man, in his Quixotic quest for bipartisan support is willing to toss about anything overboard.

Witness the stimulus bill, forty percent of which consisted of tax cuts. He sacrificed good economic stimulus money (sixteen billion for education construction alone) all so he could claim bipartisan support (ooo, big whopping two Senators).

This madness of his about being bipartisan is going to water down any legislation he proposes. The people gave him and the Democrats an overwhelming mandate to lead this country, and just as forcibly rejected Republican solutions, like tax cuts. The man needs to stop being bipartisan and simply do what is best for the country.

[high density]

23. He explained last night why he is against single payer

And he has explained this position previously. Who is to say he hasn't learned from his experience with the stimulus? He's not as stupid as you seem to imply.

[Prism]

17. It should be called the potemkin option

It's just for show. He knows the base will practically revolt without a public option, so he has to keep repeating his "Ice cream is delicious!" statements out of the left side of his mouth while continuously signalling, for many months now, that he is all too willing to toss it out in the name of hollow victory and approval numbers.

I'm not sure which bothers me more, that the President has been spending months preparing the base for the gradual, eventual jettison of the public option, or that so many rabid supporters and propagandists continue to insist that the rest of us are all hallucinating these dozens of statements in incredibly clear, unparsed language that the public option is a tertiary concern to this administration.

I see posters who are so pleased that the President "scolded" the party base last night.

I have a deep suspicion the true scolding will happen in 2010, and it won't be the base on the receiving end of it.

[TheKentuckian]

20. Your opinion is no less or any more valid than anyone else's but many disagree with your assesment

Your ENTIRE focus is the public component as is the opposition's and the man needs to have everyone to look at the the whole picture not just a piece to sell any reform because most people's primary interest isn't establishing a public plan. Turning down the heat and defusing American cynicism of government over reach is key to getting ANYTHING done.

You might be right but your opinion is based off of your own focus and skepticism, not any objective reality.

[emulatorloo]

21. 1. I didn't take it as "scolding" at all 2. If denying somebody on ''pre-existing condition" is

made illegal, then that is not a "hollow" victory. If it is illegal for people to be dropped from coverage because they are sick, that is not a "hollow" victory, etc etc.

That is why I didn't take it as a scolding -- it was more like, step back, the public option is one part of this plan and a good one but it is not the whole thing.

I firmly believe in the public option, I firmly believe Obama is going to fight for it as the best way to provide competition to the insurance industry. And I am going to keep calling my reps and Senators about it.