Yes We Did
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Mon Oct-26-09 04:22 PM
Original message |
I can't wait for the first red state to opt out! |
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I just can't wait.
Why?
Because, assuming the PO works, in the following election cycle you are going to see the biggest state by state shift in the history of this country.
I want to see the republican party explain to their constituents why they decided that they are not worthy of affordable health coverage when all the "blue states" have it and are getting the coverage they deserve and need.
One Cycle.
That's it.
One election cycle and you will see every red state that opts out turn bright bright blue.
I can't wait.
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AlinPA
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Mon Oct-26-09 04:24 PM
Response to Original message |
1. I heard that Canada had an "opt-out" back when the started up their health care program. nt |
John Q. Citizen
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Mon Oct-26-09 04:33 PM
Response to Reply #1 |
2. Nope. They had one province, Saskatchewan who started their own single payer system. |
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It worked so well the other provinces adapted similar solutions.
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Spazito
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Mon Oct-26-09 04:37 PM
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3. It took us 20 years and a different governance structure to get it done.... |
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and it came to fruition incrementally. Even Saskatchewan introduced it incrementally, starting with hospital coverage. http://www.healthcoalition.ca/History.pdf
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vaberella
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Mon Oct-26-09 06:27 PM
Response to Reply #3 |
22. Thanks for providing facts and not glossing over the story like the poster above you. n/t |
John Q. Citizen
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Mon Oct-26-09 07:35 PM
Response to Reply #3 |
27. Yes, and you called it Medicare, just like we did! Then the centrists sold us out and |
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decided a market based solution would lead to more campaign contributions for one political party.
And our incremental reform was frozen in it's tracks!
We've been trying to get it done for 70 years. Your 20 years sure seems like the blink of an eye compared to how long we have been at this here.
Truman first proposed it. Johnson passed the senior citizen portion in the 60s, and then the right wing has stopped us, with the help of the corporate-Democrats, for the last 50 years from making any real progress on a socially responsible system.
Instead, it looks like we are getting Romney Care.
A huge bailout for the private insurance companies is what they are trying to pass off as reform.
Only the partisan few are fooled though. Everyone else sees it for what it is.
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Spazito
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Mon Oct-26-09 08:48 PM
Response to Reply #27 |
29. I responded to your post to ensure you and others were aware.... |
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of the facts regarding our universal health care and that it was not done in two steps but many over a period of many years and done incrementally. The governance structure of the US and that of Canada are very different which seems to affect how change is made as well as the length of time it takes.
Your post seemed to imply it was a two step process, universal health care in Saskatchewan and then to the other Provinces and that is incorrect so I provided the timeline for clarity.
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flvegan
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Mon Oct-26-09 04:43 PM
Response to Original message |
4. I'm simply *giddy* over the collateral damage part of that idea!!!! |
derby378
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Mon Oct-26-09 04:46 PM
Response to Original message |
5. I'm not willing to play a game of "chicken" with the uninsured in the red states... |
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...just to score a political point.
Either all states get the public option, or this is a failure.
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DontTreadOnMe
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Mon Oct-26-09 05:00 PM
Response to Reply #5 |
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I think they will be the first state to op-out. If then, Texas turned blue... imagine 20 continuous years of Democratic Presidents.
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derby378
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Mon Oct-26-09 05:02 PM
Response to Reply #7 |
8. That's exactly my point |
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I live in Texas. If we opt out, people are going to die. The insurance companies will show no mercy. By the time Texas opts back in (if ever), the damage will be done.
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27inCali
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Mon Oct-26-09 06:02 PM
Response to Reply #8 |
19. but the people have the choice |
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of coarse they are going to poll the issue and the local governments will have to reflect the will of the people. As of right now even most average conservative people on the street want an option. I think if any governor tried to opt out, even in Texas, there would be an absolute firestorm and said gov would be either recalled or shot before they could opt out.
I really have faith that not a single state will opt out. regular republican people on the street wont really give Dems any credit at the polls for it, but they'll keep it.
I don't understand why supposed Liberals on this board would be so glib about trading human lives for political dominance though. That aint right.
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gkhouston
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Tue Oct-27-09 03:11 PM
Response to Reply #19 |
42. What the people of Texas have is e-voting. It's not clear how often "the will of the people" |
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is being reflected.
I find it both amusing and telling that the people who assume no states will opt out (or will return quickly) tend to be from blue states while the DUers in red states are markedly less optimistic.
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8 track mind
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Mon Oct-26-09 07:55 PM
Response to Reply #8 |
28. Rick Perry is dumb enough to do it. N/t |
uponit7771
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Tue Oct-27-09 08:47 AM
Response to Reply #28 |
34. You're right, Perry is only slightly smarter than Bush |
TexasLady
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Mon Oct-26-09 08:58 PM
Response to Reply #8 |
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I dont know what I will do without it. Im skimming by now with all my visits to docs and coumadin clinics and medicines, because their little computers show Im still pending yet another appeal to get medicaid...Im scared to death, no pun intended either.
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treestar
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Tue Oct-27-09 02:57 PM
Response to Reply #8 |
41. If no state at all has the PO then even more people die |
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And those red states will have chosen the situation for themselves, based on their votes.
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RichGirl
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Mon Oct-26-09 05:15 PM
Response to Reply #5 |
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Frankly...being willing to let people die just to win big in the next election seems very right-wingish....
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Yes We Did
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Mon Oct-26-09 05:39 PM
Response to Reply #13 |
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Edited on Mon Oct-26-09 05:41 PM by Yes We Did
Let's not go overboard. I never said any of that... If you can't have any sense of humor then you are in the wrong place.
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vaberella
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Mon Oct-26-09 06:30 PM
Response to Reply #5 |
23. How is that chicken? The Republicans wouldn't dare or they would be voted out. |
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That's the bloody point. No state will opt-out it would horribly illogical. The point is to force the hand and make sure it's a main stay----at that point when the opt-out plan comes up to deadline point and no state decides to follow through another health care provision will be enacted in order to repeal that provision and make it a mandatory supplement. I don't understand what's wrong with this idea.
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derby378
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Tue Oct-27-09 08:26 AM
Response to Reply #23 |
32. I sure hope you're right... |
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...but if Republicans could manage to lie us into an illegal occupation of Iraq, some of them just might be able to opt their states out of the public option.
Still, I will try to keep optimistic. We also need to expand the public option so that it will cover anyone who needs it, not just those who aren't currently insured.
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uponit7771
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Tue Oct-27-09 08:49 AM
Response to Reply #32 |
35. True, the no precondition discrimination and recession laws should help a little |
Randypiper
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Mon Oct-26-09 04:49 PM
Response to Original message |
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what reason is there for a state to opt out?
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vaberella
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Mon Oct-26-09 06:32 PM
Response to Reply #6 |
24. Because they want to commit political suicide. |
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Additionally it would be the way Perry went on in Texas. How he didn't want the stimulus money in order to placate a loud base. So it would be a political win. In the end it was an epic fail because he took the money---as a matter of fact begged for it.
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alcibiades_mystery
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Mon Oct-26-09 05:03 PM
Response to Original message |
9. Nobody will opt out, just like nobody opted out of the stimulus |
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Edited on Mon Oct-26-09 05:05 PM by alcibiades_mystery
It's politically undoable, just like turning down the stimulus was. Hell, they even had to take stimulus funds in SC and Louisiana. They'll take the public option everywhere, and they'll like it. Opt out is window dressing, and nothing more, and only the usual suspects who are inclined to despise anything this administration accomplishes are pretending nbot to see it (even they're not this stupid).
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moondust
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Mon Oct-26-09 05:08 PM
Response to Original message |
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Reform/PO/single payer is a no-brainer as most anyone in all the other western democracies will tell you. Opposition to it is therefore not based in reality but is rather almost entirely political/ideological. The blind supporters of the "Party of No" may just keep blindly saying NO.
:shrug:
What I'm waiting for is to see how many of that first state's poor and uninsured/uninsurable pack up and leave that state for greener pastures where the public option is offered.
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Yes We Did
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Mon Oct-26-09 05:12 PM
Response to Reply #10 |
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It's probably not going to happen, as it would be political suicide for the repugs... but it would be fun to watch them try to explain why they did it.
You want to see real outrage at town halls? That will be it.
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ecstatic
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Tue Oct-27-09 11:10 AM
Response to Reply #10 |
37. It will take a lot of work and activism to combat the RW media spin |
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on the PO. We see how the RW has demonized healthcare in other countries for decades and they will do the same to the PO option. We will need commercials, articles, etc.
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Clio the Leo
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Mon Oct-26-09 05:10 PM
Response to Original message |
11. You will be waiting a LONG time. |
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"Never" usually takes a while. ;)
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Hepburn
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Mon Oct-26-09 05:19 PM
Response to Original message |
14. The race is on between Arizona and Utah, IMO, to be the first. n/t |
The River
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Mon Oct-26-09 05:23 PM
Response to Original message |
15. No State Will Opt Out |
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If it's done correctly and costs start coming down, the citizens will prevent it during the legislative part of the opt-out process.
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Yes We Did
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Mon Oct-26-09 05:38 PM
Response to Reply #15 |
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And that is my preference. I was just saying.... that's all. :)
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polichick
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Mon Oct-26-09 05:47 PM
Response to Original message |
18. This will sure make upcoming gubernatorial races interesting! nt |
Aramchek
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Mon Oct-26-09 06:12 PM
Response to Original message |
20. Please, Brer Repuke, don't throw us in the Opt-Out Briar Patch!!! |
Mrs. Overall
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Mon Oct-26-09 06:13 PM
Response to Original message |
21. I have been wondering about the same scenario-- |
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and if republicans who need healthcare will vote out of the office the repub politicians who are against affordable coverage.
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vaberella
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Mon Oct-26-09 06:34 PM
Response to Reply #21 |
25. You'll see that to be the case. Shoot Arnold is all over this to pass. |
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So you know how that is going. Plus with all the publicity of well known former repub politicians supporting the Pres. This shit is not politically safe becuase it will say Glenn Beck/Limbaugh share head stupidity of the RNC.
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Better Believe It
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Mon Oct-26-09 06:45 PM
Response to Original message |
26. The big question is what individuals and employers will be permitted to opt in. |
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Let's see the details .... sooner rather than later.
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eridani
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Tue Oct-27-09 03:49 AM
Response to Original message |
31. This is nonsense. There is no public option until 2013 |
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Therefore the experience of the public in both red and blue states will be identical for four years.
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backscatter712
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Tue Oct-27-09 08:31 AM
Response to Original message |
33. Don't say we're throwing the red-state uninsured under the bus. |
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Edited on Tue Oct-27-09 08:40 AM by backscatter712
They're throwing themselves under the bus every time those ignant rednecks elect douchebags like Rick Perry and Bobby Jindal who would opt out of real health care for them.
You elect 'em. You don't like the consequences? Throw those assclowns out and elect someone who'll fight for your interests instead of shoveling bullshit in your face.
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harun
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Tue Oct-27-09 11:36 AM
Response to Reply #33 |
39. I agree that decisions have consequences, including votes but I feel |
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if we get a TN, KY, AL, OK or MS opting out, that it is an injustice against those who need HC reform in those states.
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and-justice-for-all
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Tue Oct-27-09 10:53 AM
Response to Original message |
36. I can not wait either, it will be pukes cutting their own throat....nt |
otohara
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Tue Oct-27-09 11:15 AM
Response to Original message |
38. And For Those Upcoming Gov. Elections in 2010 |
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Gov. Ritter ... I was thinking he would have a hard time - but not so much now.
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Jeff In Milwaukee
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Tue Oct-27-09 11:46 AM
Response to Original message |
40. A reversal of the southern migration in the U.S. |
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Most of the Red States, those most likely to Opt-Out, are also "right to work" states, and that's where all the jobs have been going during the last thirty years. When the cost of providing health care goes through the roof in these states, employers will have to either cope with the rising costs or cope with an increasingly dwindling work force, as the best and brightest employees will be migrating to states that have a public option.
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