True or False: Kerry has NOT executed a Standard Form 180

[dolstein]

This is the form authorizing the release of a veteran's military records. I keep hearing that, despite claims that all of his records have been made available, Kerry has yet to sign a Form 180. Is this true?

Of course, I also hear that Bush hasn't either.

[Gman]

1. Never play the other man's game

which is what Kerry would be doing if he capitulated and signed the 180. At this point it really doesn't matter. His war record is not credibly challenged as is Bush's.

[Walt Starr]

2. Bush has not signed form 180

neither has Kerry.

[MissB]

3. I don't know if he has or not

I don't think he has.

When the subject comes up, I first ask them what military records are missing. I've never had anyone provide an answer. I then let the person know that John Kerry's military records are available at his website http://www.johnkerry.com/about/john_kerry/military_records.html

[partygirl]

4. True. Kerry has not

and he will not sign it. It is irrelevant. He is a war hero and anyone who questions his service is wrong. You do not question the service of a patriot.

the haters just want to see the medical records (so that they can say OH that was only a scratch--why did you get a purple heart) and the after action reports (so they can say--oh so and so disagrees with your accoutn of this incident. Stuff like that. They think that there will be little discrepancies that they can hang him on. So NO Kerry will NOT be releasing the full record. He has released a few things that support his claims and that should be good enough.

He served and Bush did not. Any other questions?

[dolstein]

26. PLEASE -- you wouldn't accept that logic from the Republicans

If Kerry had nothing to hide, he'd authorize the release of his complete military record. Period. End of story. It really is that simple.

Just as we don't take Bush's claims of having served honorably in the National Guard at face value, we shouldn't expect other people to take Kerry's claims at face value.

[sonicx]

5. what do RWers expect to find? nt

[chill_wind]

10. Clenis Sniffers

>>what do RWers expect to find? nt<<

Probably hoping to find he was given an antibiotic or some other treament that they can whip up as some sort of bogus "evidence" of some treatment of some kind of STD. Nothing arrouses and agitates freeps more than their nagging suspiscion that somebody, somewhere might have had sex with somebody....

[quisp]

6. but he has released

the all important DD-214 witch is your discharge form that lists all your codes, disipline actions, medals, and honorable or other than honorable.

I'm dying to see *'s but I bet that form will never see the light of day.

[LittleClarkie]

31. And then the Freepers went nuts all over

The little discrepancies that are in his DD214s. Hell, my dad's DD214 doesn't even list half his medals.

And Kerry's DD214 lists a V decoration on his Silver Star that doesn't belong there. It looks like the typist just had a brain fart for a moment and copied the V decoration from the line above.

The Freepers made a big deal about there not being a Valor decoration on a Silver Star. Typogate, I called it.

They went conspiracy happy just based on what was there.

Kerry released plenty. Put what he released next to what Bush released and it's almost laughable. Kerry's list is as long as your arm; Bush's as long as your middle finger.

[EthanAllenVt]

7. Kerry has not and he should never release his medical records

His medical records are between him and his doctors. We don't have any right or need to see them. Let the repubs kick and whine all they want but Kerry's records are his business and his only!

[IndianaGreen]

13. The voters have the right to know the candidates' medical records

I am not so much concerned about Kerry's medical records of 35 years ago as I am about his medical records today. How well has Kerry recovered from his bout with cancer? What is the long term prognosis?

In Bush's case, I would like to know if there are any criminal records that have been suppressed by court order. I also want to know if Bush has ever undergone psychotherapy, and if not, why not?

Both candidates should sign the Form 180 releasing to the public all of their military records.

[Sparkly]

16. I disagree

If there are enough records to show they did nothing wrong, that's enough.

If there's no health concern that would impede their ability to work in office, they should have privacy regarding their bodies.

If there's evidence of something weird -- shown in Chimp's records and behavior -- that's another story.

[IndianaGreen]

18. There is no privacy when you run for President

and these two guys running now are no exception.

[Sparkly]

21. There should be. How they have sex, whether they have piles,

there needs to be *some* privacy. It's a matter of where the line is drawn publicly. I think it should be drawn before complete disclosure of all medical records.

[IndianaGreen]

24. Why hold Kerry and Bush to a different standard than previous candidates?

We always got access to the full medical records from the Presidential candidates before. Unless they want to feed some speculation that they are hiding something, they better cough it up.

We saw Big Dog and Bob Dole's records in 1996, and Al Gore and Bush in 2000.

[dolstein]

27. Because a lot of DU'ers are flaming hypocrites

NT

[yardwork]

22. Bush and Cheney have never released any of their medical records

John Dean makes a big deal about this in "Worse Than Watergate," because Dick Cheney's multiple heart attacks and who knows what other medical problems have a direct bearing on his ability to serve.

At the time that Dean wrote his book, Bush's medical condition was not an issue. It is now.

Dean devoted a whole chapter to the unprecedented refusal of Bush and Cheney to release information that had been standard for all modern presidential candidates to reveal. If Kerry is now keeping some things private, it's because Bush/Cheney created a new standard for secrecy.

It would be poor political strategy for Kerry to release information that Bush/Cheney refuse to release about themselves. The whole thing is a disservice to American voters and to the potential fitness of all future presidents.

[zulchzulu]

8. What part of "serving your country honorably" don't you understand?

That's what I always say.

Questioning a war hero's medals is like questioning all war medals.

You're either with military honor and procedure or you're not. Question the sacrifices of those that have served to doubt what America stands for like a finger-pointing mealymouthed coward.

We know where America stands. And those souls that perished for freedom know that those who served this country demand some respect from THOSE THAT DIDN'T.

OK... Bob Schrum... here...

[dolstein]

29. What part of "honorable discharge" don't you understand?

Sorry, but you'd laugh if the Republicans tried to pull that crap.

[StopThief]

9. Bush has signed, Kerry has not.

nfm

[Sparkly]

12. Bush has signed???

Really????

[partygirl]

14. yeah the 180.

[Sparkly]

17. I'm looking for a credible source for that.

Do you have a link handy?

[Sparkly]

19. Even Moonie Washington Times indicates he didn't

http://www.washtimes.com/commentary/20040821-104240-6539r.htm

Says he should.

[CornField]

15. Bush has signed lots of things

I'm not certain he has signed SF 180, but I'm positive he signed Executive ORder 13233 on Nov. 1, 2001. The Executive Order gutted the 1978 Presidential Records Act. The Order granted all former presidents, as well as any persons selected by them, an unprecedented authority to invoke executive privilege to block release of their records. In addition, it granted the power to invoke executive privilege to present and former vice-presidents as well.

And Bush's Order empowers a current president to block release of a former president's records even when the former president wishes to release them. Finally, it makes the Department of Justice available to represent, in litigation, any incumbent or former president seeking to withhold information.

[yardwork]

25. Thank you!

This is the real issue.

[sonicx]

20. if he signed it...

why are his docs still coming out daily?

[yardwork]

23. No way. Not only has Bush never signed off on releasing the records

even the ones that should be made available without his permission, through Freedom of Information Act, are "lost," according to the Pentagon.

Not to mention the bales of shrink-wrapped records from Bush's terms as governor of Texas, which are hiding in Poppy's presidential library, all protected by an executive order W signed on practically his first day as president.

I'm telling you, books have been written about the unprecedented secrecy of this administration.

[Scorpious_Maximus]

28. * has NOT signed.

The ONLY reason the freeptards want Kerry to sign a SF-180 is to get his medical records.

I say, F/O freeptards.


Bush needs to release the Flight Incident Reports.

[rowire]

11. Kerry Served, Bush Didn't

I can tell you that without a government form.

[dolstein]

30. Sorry, but this is a classic Republican tactic

If you don't want to answer the question, fine. Just answer a different question. That's straight out of the GOP playbook. And it's crap.