Ohioans -- tell me a bit about America's north coast

[eyesroll]

There may be a bit of relocating going on in the Eyesroll household, sometime in the next couple of years, due to a potential business venture. (Nothing definite, nothing concrete, but some possiblities.)

My husband's gung-ho about the Cleveland area, but I haven't been anywhere near there in 20 years (and that was to visit my dad's distant cousin in one of the "heights," and I was 8 and just in awe of the enormous house). We will, of course, be heading that way to visit before making any decisions, but I thought I'd get some input from some sources who don't have a vested interest in this.

He's got a weird affinity for Ashtabula County (well, I've never been there, so I don't know if it's weird or deserving), but is OK with other lakefront counties between there and Cleveland, and maybe a bit further west than that. He likes the lake.

So -- What's to like about this area? What's to hate? Quality of life? Politcs? Where is there affordable and decent housing (single-family, to buy)? I've seen some super-cheap, good-looking houses on Realtor.com, in Ashtabula, Geneva, Conneaut, etc., but what's the catch? Are they falling apart? Are these liveable neighborhoods? Is there anything to do that doesn't involve driving for an hour? What's the job situation like there? (I am a writer/editor, but would be OK with employment that peripherally used those skills, if it was a good match, and I'm used to commuting.)

For reference: We currently live in realtively Democratic neighborhood in a very Republican county in Wisconsin. Our house is 120 years old, so we're used to old properties on little land. My commute's about 35-45 minutes each way right now and I don't mind it, although I don't want to extend it by too much if I don't have to.

Thanks for any and all advice you guys have!

[bowens43]

1. I grew up in Ashtabula......

I couldn't wait to leave when I turned 18 and now I would do anything to get back. It's really a great place if you don't mind the snow. Beautiful friendly small towns. Lots of beaches and parks. Good fishing. Ashtabula county has LOTS of room. It's the largest county in Ohio with the the smallest population. There isn't a lot of work in North Eastern Ohio so many towns have some run down areas but the price of houses and property is VERY low compared to here (North Carolina). Conneaut is OK , it has a few great wineries , Geneva on the Lake is s small tourist location. Lot's of people in the summer , empty in the winter. I spent much of my misguided youth drinking in the local bars (the Cove and the Castaways) there. Everything is a long drive From Ashtabula County, unless you like the lake. Ashtabula (the city) is almost exactly half way between Cleveland and Erie so you're an hour away from 'culture'. half an hour south and you're in Amish country. Very cool if you're into that sort of thing.

There is nothing weird about having an affinity for Ashtabula county. If you go be sure to check out the covered bridges. Take the tour in the fall. It's beautiful.

I was just there over the July fourth weekend. I still have lots of family in Ashtabula and the surrounding towns.

[eyesroll]

2. Thanks, bowens

We'll probably be going in September (to coincide with a couple of other things).
I'm used to snow (I live in Wisconsin), but I'm a bit concerned about the Lake Erie snow machine. (I suppose that's something I can easily look up on Weather Underground.)

[Kolesar]

3. This is the snowiest place this far south in the United States

My take on Ashtabula County is that it was an industrial success until America entered the post-industrial era. A lot of facilities that supported big, heavy industry have disappeared in Ashtabula County. (There are a few polluted sites, but it is not a huge problem.) Ashtabula has been a bargain for real estate for the longest time.

Ashtabula has wonderful forests on the undeveloped land. There is some really special agricultural land near the lake that has a very long growing season for grapes and other fruits.

I have lived in Lake County for one year and I love it. Lake County is prosperous suburbia with a great tax base and well-funded services. The parks are heavenly. I love cross country skiing here. Consider Madison township.

Just having somebody want to move here, and not because of being relocated is unusual. My home seems obscure.

The people in this part of Ohio are friendly. Ashtabula is also proud of its history in the abolitionist movement. It was a terminus for the underground railroad. Ships would pick up fugitive slaves on the shore and take them to Canada.

[eyesroll]

7. Thanks, SpikeTrees

I looked up the snowfall, and it's only a few inches worse than Milwaukee (depending on how close to the lake you are, anyway).

[InkAddict]

4. Left the North Coast 17 years ago For SW Ohio

We had friends in Ashtabula County--Orwell, OH. The snow is awesome (blizzard country)in the wintertime. The country is very pretty with rolling hills, some river ravines--Western Reserve type towns with large courthouses and town "squares" or Main Streets. You will love the fall -- gorgeous colors, warm days, cool to downright chilly evenings meant for hot cider/pumpkins and Icabod Crane stories. The folks in the area are into hunting, fishing, shooting (trap). The Geauga County Fair is the oldest in the state -- the MetroPark system in Lake and Cuyahoga Counties are superb with lots of hiking, picnicking, wildflowers, and waterfowl (ducks,geese). Most of Ashtabula county is still rural with vinyards, corn fields, cows and horses, etc. You can find most any kind of housing from very large newly-built homes on hugh lots to smaller ranches and bungalows on acreage. Not much in the way of "plat" neighborhoods in Ashtabula except in incorporated cities that tended to be "blue collar." Smaller towns have "historical" homes, Victorian three-stories and bungalows built in the 50s and 60s. There should be some new construction too. Many areas have instituted lot size minimums of 1/2 - 5 acres. You'll need to switch sports allegiances - fans are rabid for the home teams.

[eyesroll]

6. Thanks, InkAddict.

I'm pretty unaligned (not much into sports, but can keep a conversation for the sake of the neighbors/business contacts/whatever), but my husband (gasp) is a Reds fan.

Whereabouts are you in SW Ohio? My in-laws all live in Springfield.

[InkAddict]

10. A transplant from Painesville, OH (Lake County)

to Dayton, OH - I miss Lake Erie, even though we're not boaters - there's nothing like a large body of water and a beach five minutes away. One year we actually celebrated New Year's Day on the beach with pork and sauerkraut. Cold and bracing, but it just seemed right with the waves sweeping the beach...UG - I'm getting to schmaltzy! It was fun though, and I miss that sort of spontaneous relationship with the water. Sure don't miss Cleveland traffic though - it's much better in the rural countryside.

[eyesroll]

11. How bad is Cleveland traffic?

Right now, I have a 23-mile, 35-to-45 minute commute (each way), from Waukesha to Milwaukee. How long would a similar drive be in the Cleveland area? (Assuming I was commuting from a point 23 miles east into downtown Cleveland, and it was mostly highway driving.)

Then again, I grew up in suburban Chicago. Milwaukee traffic's nothing.
Thanks.

[Magrittes Pipe]

12. It depends which route you take.

The Clevelanders here may be able to be more specific, though. ;)

Interstates BLOW at rush hour. Some thoroughfares are better. Just take Chester in from the East, and you should be okay.

[Magrittes Pipe]

13. Oh, and BTW...

Cleveland drivers are the worst in the country.

Worse than Chicago. Worse than Los Angeles.

Worse than BOSTON.

No offense to any Clevelanders here, I'm sure you have the same assessment of Forest City drivers as I do. ;)

[Kolesar]

14. Ohio drivers are polite

They make room for you when you want to change lanes and put your blinker on. Most of them use their turn signals. Only a few of them are death-wish speeders going 80 mph in a 60 mph zone. Cannot say that about Boston or Detroit.

[Magrittes Pipe]

15. I'm specifically talking about Cleveland.

How many times have you seen someone make a right turn from the left lane down by Case? Good Lord.

[Kolesar]

16. The I-90 commute from the east is the best highway in town

Generally, Cleveland freeways are not as busy as other towns. The only consistent slowdowns are on the inner belt and the high level bridge on I-71 in downtown Cleveland. I-480 gets busy. I-90 is three lanes, then four lanes once you get into Cuyahoga County. I-90 does not have left-hand merges and people having to cross lanes, so it is a pretty sane drive. I-480 is insane. I live 23 miles east of downtown Cle and it takes me less than 30 minutes to get downtown, but I seldom drive it at rush hour.

There are actually Laketran commuter shuttles from various points in Lake County to downtown Cleveland . You can park and ride. The fare is actually cheaper than parking downtown (!).

www.laketran.com
www.laketran.com/content.aspx?i=28

[InkAddict]

5. Left the North Coast 17 years ago For SW Ohio

We had friends in Ashtabula County--Orwell, OH. The snow is awesome (blizzard country)in the wintertime. The country is very pretty with rolling hills, some river ravines--Western Reserve type towns with large courthouses and town "squares" or Main Streets. You will love the fall -- gorgeous colors, warm days, cool to downright chilly evenings meant for hot cider/pumpkins and Icabod Crane stories. The folks in the area are into hunting, fishing, shooting (trap). The Geauga County Fair is the oldest in the state -- the MetroPark system in Lake and Cuyahoga Counties are superb with lots of hiking, picnicking, wildflowers, and waterfowl (ducks,geese). Most of Ashtabula county is still rural with vinyards, corn fields, cows and horses, etc. You can find most any kind of housing from very large newly-built homes on hugh lots to smaller ranches and bungalows on acreage. Not much in the way of "plat" neighborhoods in Ashtabula except in incorporated cities that tended to be "blue collar." Smaller towns have "historical" homes, Victorian three-stories and bungalows built in the 50s and 60s. There should be some new construction too. Many areas have instituted lot size minimums of 1/2 - 5 acres. You'll need to switch sports allegiances - fans are rabid for the home teams.

Oops - sorry for the double

[asthmaticeog]

8. Cleveland's a mixed bag right now.

Without knowing the nature of your business venture, I'd suggest an approach of cautious optimism. The last 25 years have been spent on seriously bad "economic development" ventures -- big-ticket lifestyle/profile projects like arenas and the Rock Hall of Fame that have produced no return but have instead seriously drained public coffers. On the upside of that, Cuyahoga County political and businness leaders are finally wising up to the fact that they've seriously goofed, and are looking at restucturing and rethinking their ideas. On the downside of that, a major corporate toady (Tim Hagan, D.I.N.O., embarrasingly failed gubernatorial candidate) just got elected County Commissioner, and he's devoted to a pointless, extravagantly expensive Convention Center proposal that will do exactly what the other big projects have done - drain us. So whatever restructuring may happen is compromised. I'm thinking of leaving as soon as my job (which I love) plays itself out, even though I truly, deeply love the area.

OTOH, if you're thinking of both residing AND locating the business in Ashtabula county (much of which is incredibly gorgeous), it's a whole different ball of wax, except for whatever effect a hopeless economy up the road a bit may have. I know exactly squat about Ashtabula's economics.

On the cultural side of things, Northeast Ohio totally rocks - great museums & galleries, great dining, quirky music scene, plenty of green space & HUGE, BEAUTIFUL park reservations, and Democrats tend to dominate electorally. If you guys decide to come (and I hope you don't let my jaded-Clevelander despair dissuade - despite our leader's f-ups, there's rather a lot to love about it here), let me say, in advance, welcome! Despite our leader's f-ups, there's rather a lot to love about it here.

[eyesroll]

9. Thanks, asthmaticeog

The business venture isn't mine (and, without going into detail - it's less dependent on the local economy and perhaps more on national factors than other ventures would be; the business doesn't have to be based in Ohio but that's where the other partner is), so I'd be more along for the ride and commuting to wherever (within reason) to get a job (which is why Ashtabula, however cheap the housing, may be just a touch too far for a commute to anywhere with good employment).

Thanks for the honest assessment.

[lfairban]

17. I can't resist re-telling my favorite Cleveland jokes.

"If you can't see why the rest of the country thinks that a river catching on fire is funny, you might be from Cleveland."

A woman wakes from a coma in a small room in a hospital where someone has cut an enormous fart, and asks, "Where am I? Cleveland?"

I used to go to an inner-city site on business in the '80s. We never had any real problems, but we always made sure we were out by sundown.

I don't think that the environmental problems are as bad as they were a decade or two ago. You will probably be more comfortable with the politics than you would be in Cincinnati.

Ashtabula County, as I recall, is a very pretty area.

[LeftyDonkey]

18. Welcome to the North Coast!

I've moved around quite a bit but have ended up in Cleveland a few times (and live there most of the time now). Cleveland, and the rest of NE Ohio really is an undiscovered jewel. Here's what I know:
I don't know that much about Ashtabula. I went camping there once and it rained every afternoon. Of course, that rain becomes snow there in the winter. Very soon you will find yourself using words like "snowbelt" and "lake effect." Mostly a rural area, but close enough to take a day trip into Cleveland. Actually, Erie, PA is closer to Ashtabula than Cleveland. Erie is a great hard-working town. There is a state park in Erie, Presque Isle, which has some fascinating ecology.
Ok, back to Cleveland: World-class medical facilities (Cleveland Clinic and University Hospitals), cultural institutions (Cleveland Symphony Orchestra, Cleveland Museum of Art, Playhouse Square), recreational areas (MetroParks, Lake Erie, etc.) and some fun neighborhoods. You can find anything you need in terms of shopping. Downtown is great during a day (little sketchy at night). The traffic in Cleveland is easy. The interstates can be a little slow at rush hour (this is a major American city after all) but other than that you've got nothing to really worry about.
Because Cleveland and the rest of NE Ohio has had such a harsh treatment by the rest of the nation over the last 50 years (that means you lfairban! :spank: ) it might not seem like the area is easily knowable once you get here. It might take a little time, but you will get into the swing of things.
For local press, the Cleveland Plain Dealer is terrible and very GOP friendly. Look at the Cleveland Free Times for what's going on in town.
Welcome to town. Glad to have another Dem in Ohio. You should check out www.cleveland.com/fiveohios when you get a chance.
If there's anything us Ohioans can do, just drop a line.

[eyesroll]

19. Thanks, LeftyDonkey!

We're not there yet, and no decisions have been made, but I'll take a look at the resources you mention.

[Chili]

20. welcome eyesroll...!

I hope you decide to move to the North Coast. Lifelong resident, here - I love Cleveland! In all honesty, I've been to Europe a few times, been around the country a bit - and have yet to find a place I'd rather live (except London, LOL - must admit that).

I live in a suburb just east of Cleveland. If you're considering the Cleveland metro area, you will love the cultural offerings (as mentioned above - great posts), and if your husband is a sports fan, we've got the Browns, Cavaliers and Indians. I'm unable to compare housing costs, but I do know that every type of home is available, from new to old to semi-rural - Cleveland Heights in particular has some fantastic affordable housing (older homes with that undefinable "character" label).

Things I love about Cleveland: The Cleveland Museum of Art; sunsets over the lake; summer nights; immense cultural diversity; the conveniences of having anything you need within a 15 min drive from anywhere in the area; most importantly to me, the Cleveland Clinic - even if I wanted to move, which I don't, my family must be near the CC (the CC has some of the most respected heart specialists in the world); the feel of a big city while retaining a small-town outlook; the celebration of food: during the summer, if you like to eat, every weekend there's some food festival somewhere where you can stuff yourself comatose; fall in Ohio is gorgeous!

Things I hate about Cleveland: the month of January; the month of February; the cultural divide between the East side and the West side of Cleveland (this is disappearing); the month of January; rush hour into or leaving downtown Cleveland (I know, it's probably not nearly as bad as other major cities, but I hate it nonetheless); the month of January; no championships for any major league sports team since 1964 (recently voted by ESPN as the nations Most Tortured Sports City: http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/page2/story?page=tortured/cleveland); the lack of "city self-esteem" longtime residents may still have from being the butt of national jokes that, apparently, live forever; did I mention the month of January?

Things visitors I know have said about Cleveland:
"It's so GREEN!" - transplanted New Yorker.
"Everybody's so friendly - I've NEVER met people so friendly!" - visiting Mississipian (this was, really, truly amazing to her).
"It's so small!" - visiting Chicagoan.

Like any major city, the metro Cleveland area sprawls from east to west - and south too - like a huge octopus (though, yes, the downtown area is small compared to Chicago, LOL!). You have an enormous choice in types of neighborhoods to choose from. Don't know much about Ashtabula except to say that I spent a summer there as a teen, and it's a beautiful, quiet, small-town area - you'd love it there too!

Places I'd recommend: Chagrin Falls, Cleveland Heights, Lakewood, Mayfield Hts / Lyndhurst / Highland Hts. area.

:hi:

[eyesroll]

21. Thanks for the detail, Chili

And welcome to DU!
:hi:

I've been researching Lake County, mostly, (Ashtabula seems nice but in order to live there, I'd have to have a job fall into my lap, or else commute for way too long) but I'll take a look at the cities you've suggested.

[Chili]

22. Lake County

Eyesroll, I worked in Lake County for nearly 20 years (Eastlake), it's next door to Cuyahoga County... one of my best friends lives in Mentor, nice suburban area, near lots of malls and shops. There's also Mentor-on-the-Lake and Concord, among others.

Here's a link for you:

http://www.lakevisit.com/index.html

Thanks for the welcome, glad to be here!