Hate to see DUers turning on Bev. She worked tirelessly to expose fraud

[Vidar]

and continues to do so. Focus has changed to Ohio & Jesse Jackson, but let's not forget that Bev kept hope alive when no one else was speaking up. She defended the name of her organization against copyright infringement & ruffled some egos here. So what. We can't afford to turn on each other while the Republican tyranny is allowed to flourish.

[Jersey Devil]

1. So she did a little grandstanding - big deal

If that is what it takes to get noticed then despite the criticism it was worth it.

[cybildisobedience]

2. why are we calling it "grand-standing"?

Didn't she just do what she had to do?
I applaud her gutsiness. I am sick to death of namby-pampy Dems allowing these Nazis to walk all over them.

[Jersey Devil]

5. It was "grandstanding" but I too applaud it

She wasn't getting any press so she made some in a very inventive scenario. There is nothing negative about causing a ruckus imo if it gets the attention you desire.

[Ducks In A Row]

23. it's not grandstanding.

the definition:To perform ostentatiously so as to impress an audience

I don't think Bev figures she's going to impress anyone. She wanted to let LePore and the rest of the officals know she had suits for all of them. They have been hiding from her, and she found them. Found them at what was supposed to be a public meeting

And instead she surprised them and showed them to be misusing public resources.

No matter what the officals and the media try to say, they weren't supposed to be using public time, money and resources for a party.


Now if she knew what was happening and do it to expose them, that might have been grandstanding.


Bev is great and the freepers (in freeperland and the ones hiding her) hate her for her freedom!

[Vidar]

7. Agree entirely. The quiet, civil approach doesn't work in this

political climate. Loud and obnoxious does.

[spotbird]

3. I haven't turned on her, but I truly don't understand her.

Why hasn't she released the total of the original tape she found in the garbage bag? It is so basic and so compelling that I'm at a loss as to why she is keeping it to herself.

The other issue is the video tape of the day at the dumpster. We are working against deadlines here and anything that shows conclusively that these people are thieves should be released.

It's her ball so she can make the rules, but she can't expect people to blindly follow without an explanation.

[Ducks In A Row]

24. it's not just her ball, it's the ball that needs to go to court

she has her eye on the goal of not only exposing the fraud, but sending people to jail, to reforming the process, to getting rid of the machines that steal votes.

[mattclearing]

4. I don't think people are turning on her.

I think people are just frustrated and Bev has put herself out there.

I do question some of her moves, like the jacking of Theresa LePore's retirement party, but chances are her video is evidence in a court proceeding now. She can't just leak it to people.

It's a shame though...if someone asked me to choose between a court of law and the court of public opinion after 2000, I'd have to go with Olbermann. Too late now, though.

People here need to get out of the circular firing squad mentality. There are people sowing dissension. I've been lurking here forever, but I have a low post count, so I will probably be ignored. It's used as a way to insult people who are every bit as much dedicated to the cause as others.

People are so ready to flip on each other. We're all on the same side here. Don't feed the trolls, or the people who are letting their emotions get the best of them.

When we fight each other, somewhere Rove is laughing.

[SmokingJacket]

16. "When we fight each other, somewher Rove is laughing"

Thank you for that reminder.

Let's try to give people who are on our side the benefit of the doubt.

[rman]

6. waiting for Bev's response to Olbermann blog

is that "turning on Bev"?

[Vidar]

8. By itself, of course not. Bev & Olbermann are both heroes for

our cause. I just don't want to see useless bickering among ourselves.

[Jersey Devil]

9. Olbermann didn't criticize her for grandstanding

What he said was if you are going to do any grandstanding to get attention you better be able to back up what you are saying with hard evidence after you are finished with your stunt. I think he is right and that Bev Harris has to put something on the table now.

[Paradise]

10. Bev Harris is my hero, my role model!

Whatever it takes, Bev! Thank God he gave you the courage of your conviction!

None of us are even good enough to shine your shoes, IMO! Thank you! :hug:

[gorbal]

11. She needs to GET the proof!

They won't even let her audit in most counties in Florida. The one proof she has is on lockdown in florida. She tried to show some of her proof on the air on CNN, but they weren't showing it. What have you heard that contradicts this?

[Paradise]

20. She's workin' on getting proof.

Me? Working and raising a family doesn't allow me time to get anything. Count on people like Bev Harris! The only thing I hope comes out of any investigation is THE TRUTH (whatever that may be)!

[CantGetFooledAgain]

12. Bev needs to get on Countdown - whatever it takes

I don't know exactly what it going on behind the scenes. But we have a mainstream media news anchor who seems willing to interview Bev on his show. This is a huge opportunity and she should be willing to make whatever concessions are necessary within reason to make it happen.

This movement is more important than any individual within it.

[saddemocrat]

13. bev

I'm not turning on bev, but I'm disappointed. Many of us here donated money and came back regularly for updates. We were told little bits and pieces to keep us going...but now it is starting to look much less optimistic that the election fraud will be taken seriously. I just feel that if she has collected the evidence that making it public would be a good thing...

That being said, I could be wrong...which is why I'm continuing to hold off judgement and haven't withdrawn my support.

[senseandsensibility]

14. Go Bev!

With the grueling schedule and pressure she has been under for YEARS doing the heavy lifting WORK that no one else wants to do, I'm surprised she hasn't made more gaffs. Give her a break! No one is perfect, but in my opinion, she comes damn close. Could it be that some of these comments are caused by jealousy? Just asking.

[AmyCrat]

17. uh...... no.

First, I don't think anyone is damn close to perfect. Lots of people work tirelessly on their cause, it doesn't mean they don't make mistakes along the way.

And if they're not open to listening to the mistakes and learning from the mistakes, then EGO has gotten in the way. I'm not saying whether she's open to listening to them or not, I really don't know her reaction, but a lot of people here don't want to hear them, that's for sure.

Everything I have stated is FOR the same cause, and that's the reason I say it. I don't just blindly follow. If we're going to do this right, we have to recognize our own mistakes so they can be corrected.

I know there are a lot of people who've offered to help BBV, to volunteer their time and effort so that 3 people aren't ultimately the only ones handling it. I've heard several say they get no response. While I agree that delegating to volunteers is time consuming, trying to do the whole thing yourself is the worse option... and it will only lead to more mistakes being made.

The people who constantly question the motives and call names of anyone who dares to try to offer constructive criticism - those are the ones doing the tearing apart. We are all adults. We should all be able to critique, be critiqued, discuss, listen and find a way to make the cause better.

[rodeodance]

15. I am not turning--although i think it was a mistake to raid that party

Give her a break, she has worked tirelessly for a good cause!!--and so has KO!!

[panestra]

19. It's been my experience

that sometimes you need to hit them up the side of the head with a two by four. In fact I've been accused of that many times. There's nothing wrong with grandstanding now and then. It gets their attention. This is my first post, but I've been lurking here for years. Hope I did this right.:hi:

[newyawker99]

26. Hi panestra!!

Welcome to DU!! :toast:

[Ducks In A Row]

25. it wasn't a party, it was a public meeting that was misused for ...

the officals had no right to have a party at that location, at that time.

and that's why the officals were screaming them, because they were found out.

and that's why the media is screaming, because they should have exposed it and instead are shown to be whores who aren't doing their job.

[StClone]

18. I read posts like this and I think it Psy-Ops

I have read few attacks on Bev yet here is a post claiming such to, in my opinion, plant the seed.

[hlthe2b]

21. Someone pointed out that turning on ourselves also occured in Civil Rights

Struggle... that it apears to be a common evolution of important movements--unfortunate that it might be. Those trying to lead and the most dedicated workers often have disagreements over methods, objectives, and personal agendas/motives. The key issue is whether we can put those differences aside--along with the hurt feelings or grievances-- and keep our focus on the big picture. At some point all else must become unimportant if the cause is sufficiently important.

I have seen signs of this willingness to move beyond painful grievances for the greater good in several posts that were extremely frank. We must foster this, without adding to the personal hurt that some feel so intensely. It seems to me the first step must be not to jump to conslusions, realize that everyone will make mistakes or overstep on occasion, and seek to maintain the focus on goals, while acknowledging some may have grievances. I'm sure every important leader in history--whether Gandhi, MLK, or Thomas Jefferson-- had their detractors...

[bearfan454]

22. Bev has been super.

She brought this whole vote fraud bbv situation to light. We owe her a hell of a lot. She is one brave lady.

[LoZoccolo]

27. We can't afford to diss our only mainstream media outlet...

...while the Republican tyranny is allowed to flourish.

[Skinner]

28. Continue discussion here

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=203x105121