Help! Software engineers or similarly skilled people

[Carl Brennan]

Can you hack a stand alone computer with a wireless computer in the same building.

I understand that the stand alone must have a reciever on it. If it does how hard would it be to tweek some numbers on the vote count? Can one check for a receiver on the stand alone by using the screen and keyboard?

Mods please let me run this question. I need this info for the WA recount.

[rooboy]

1. What operating system are we talking about? n/t

[phantomvotes]

5. I know you can do it with palm pilots

That is why you don't dare use one while you are in a casino.
I had some info saved which I will post as soon as find it.

[wlubin]

53. who says it is a standard publicly know os? Anyone can write their own

operating system.

[Higans]

2. The Tabulator Hard drives in FL were networked

and had two recorded out side attempts to gain access to them but beside that, who cares? The only people who voted were the people who locked the press out. Don't you get it? they don't even count the votes.

How exactly would you visually inspect a "Vapor Vote"?

Is E-Voting ME-Voting?

If so, Can you Prove it?

P.S. Letter to Santa Can My Children please have Transparent Election? i.e. auditing and paper ballots. This is all I will ask for every year.That is all my children will ask for too. It is all that their children will ask for. In fact the verry moment that any child finds out that Santa is not real, that child should also be informed that the elections are rigged. That way we get Both lie's done at one time.

[Lithos]

3. Yes

How depends on how the wireless connection interfaces with the system. You have of course the WiFi types of connection which gives the same access as wired networks.

Google on wardriver if you want more information.

I'm sure you can do similar things with a CDPD or other wireless standard type of modem.

[ExCiber]

4. Depends

Is the standalone in any way connected to a network?

Is there an unsecure wireless AP on that network?

A true stand alone machine (no network connection) can only be hacked at the keyboard of that machine.

[trudyco]

6. I wonder if a wireless connection could look like a battery pack.

Does anybody look at the configuration on the machine first?
I wonder if there is a jammer that could mess it up if there was a wireless nw. Something you could set up inconspicuously.

I wish somebody in Ohio would insist that they take a couple of votes out, after the votes have been hand counted, and run the rest through the machine. They shouldn't let anybody see the ones taken out so they could hack the machine to come out with the same amount. See if the numbers match. Or maybe they should accidently set off the fire alarm or spill coffee on some ballots or accidently bend some - trip the person as they go to feed the machine. Do something to change the number of ballots fed to the machine so it won't match the cherry-picked ones.

trudyco

[Must_B_Free]

9. in laptops, the antenna is not visible

you wouldn't even know it was there except for the device showing up. I think the wireless circuits were integrated into the CPU with the intel Centrino chip...

[GetTheRightVote]

7. If a cell phone can transfer phone numbers wireless why can't one

computer call to another to transfer numbers as well, update them, and then transfer them back again, it happens every day in such tools, pdas, etc. What I am saying is that the tech knowledge is there and being utilized everyday, it is not that hard to believe anymore that machines can talk to each other.

[Carl Brennan]

14. Excellent.

I am not sure. I'll have to check to check about the LAN tomorrow. There are alot of computers on the floor of the recount and in an ajacent room that are used to correlate the numbers.

What is "AP"?

I need to check if they are true stand alones. What if a reciever was hidden on the computer, could it then be hacked.

[ExCiber]

21. Access Point

This is the wireless device coordinating activity.

In an infrastructure configuration there's one or more AP's coordinating communication through the network. In an AdHoc config. all devices share coordination.

In either case a tool like NetChaser or WarDriver will tell you if they exist, security settings and the power meter will give you some indication of where they are.

[Clark2008]

39. Right... the stand alone has to have a modem

or some other means of network access.

If it does - it can be hacked, no matter what OS it has (of course, Windows is the easiest).

There really is no "hack-proof" computer with network access. If it's hack-proof one day, it's not the next. The firewall has to constantly be reworked to prevent it.

[Must_B_Free]

8. An isolated machine is just that, Isolated

if it has wireless that is on, you can get in.

You could even have a secret network over the AC lines, I believe. It would require hardware to support this, but I have seen home networking products that work over AC, in my recollection.

http://www.futureviz.com/html/ethernet_over_ac.htm

[ExCiber]

10. Low speed AC data has been around for a long time

Not common but has been around for at least 20 years and can't get past any step up or down XFormers.

Broadband over AC is just around the corner and is being tested in some markets. Of cource it does require quite a bit of hardware to be installed on the power grid to work.

[phantomvotes]

12. Lying With Ones and Zeros

http://www.theemailactivist.org/voter_fraud.htm

The Email Activist Lying With Ones and Zeros
Promoting active citizenship through the power of the Internet. “If you look at theconsequences for democracy, it's terrifying.There's no way to run areliable election without averifiable paper trail--that's what these machines don't have.”- David Dill, StanfordUniversity computer-science professor “A quiet revolution istaking place in U.S.politics. By the time itis over, the integrity ofelections will be in thecontrol of a few largepro-Republicancorporations."– Andrew Gumbe “There are hundreds ofways to embed a rogueseries of commands intothe code and nobodywould ever know. Thenumbers would all tallyperfectly.”- Dr. Rebecca Mercuri,expert in voting systems “A number of myRepublican colleagueshave come up to meexpressing someconcern about the voting.I've explained my bill tothem. They said thatsounds good, let me goback and talk to my staffand presumably talk tothe leadership.And I never hear fromthem again.”- Representative Rush Holt “Corporate America isvery close to runningthis country. The onlything stopping them fromtaking total control arethe pesky voters. That'swhy there's such a driveto control the vote. Whatwe're seeing is thecorporatization of thelast shred of democracy.”- Roxanne Jekot,a programmer whoreviewed Diebold’selection codes What if you were a reporter and you learned that the Republican candidate for Georgia’s governorship won the election of 2002 even though polls indicated that his Democratic opponent was likely to beat him by a margin of 9 to 11 points?And what if you learned that in the same state, in the same year, a Republican candidate for Senator defeated his Democratic opponent, even though the Dem was expected to win by a 2 to 5 point margin?And what if you learned that in 2002, Georgia became the first state in the U.S. to use computerized touch-screen voting machines in all of its election districts? Well, if you were a good reporter, you’d probably talk to the election officials who counted the votes, wouldn’t you?And what if you learned that Georgia’s votes were not counted by state election officials but were instead counted by employees of the private corporation that manufactured and programmed the computerized voting machines? After you picked yourself up off the floor, you’d probably ask to see the paper voting records, right?And what if you learned that those machines produced no paper voting records and that there is no way whatsoever to verify that they recorded the votes accurately?And, what if you learned that the company which sold those voting machines to Georgia, and which counted Georgia’s votes, is a big contributor to the Republican Party? In fact, it turns out that the three largest manufacturers of touch-screen voting machines are all major contributors to the Republican Party.If all that were true, you’d probably start smelling the foul stench of election fraud, wouldn’t you?Well, everything you just read is true. Shockingly true. The reporter is Andrew Gumbel, and the three corporations at the heart of this stunner are Diebold Election Systems, Sequoia Voting Systems, and Election Systems and Software (ES&S). (You can read Gumbel’s full story here.)The voting machines these companies produce run on software just like the software that runs your home computer. It’s made up of strings of ones and zeros, just like the codes that hackers use to spread their Internet viruses. Just like the codes that advertisers use to slip web trackers and spyware onto your computer or to hijack your Web browser so that it takes you to their sites instead of to the sites you request.Get the picture? These expensive high-tech voting machines are actually easier to rig and manipulate than any other form of voting! And they are rapidly replacing older voting machines all across the country.According to Gumbel’s report in the London Independent, what happened in Georgia was not unique in the 2002 elections. Colorado, Minnesota, Illinois, and New Hampshire also experienced unusual last-minute swings in some of their election districts, but only in the ones that used electronic voting machines. Interestingly, those sudden and unexpected swings only occurred in hotly contested districts, and in each case, the winning underdog was a Republican.In July of 2003, independent researchers from Johns Hopkins University examined the software Diebold created for the Georgia elections and found it scandalously flawed—hackable by any talented teenager. Diebold’s software, for instance, violated several of the most basic security protocols, such as placing passwords in the source code and configuring the “smart card” function so that one person could cast more than one vote.Hopkins researchers also found loopholes that could have allowed votes to be altered without a voter’s knowledge, either on the spot or by remote access. This means that a voter could leave the voting booth believing that he or she had voted for Candidate A, but the machine would actually have recorded his or her vote for Candidate B. This also means that someone with a device as simple as a Palm Pilot could alter votes from across the room.State governments purchase voting machines through exactly the same bidding process they use to purchase other items. Naturally, companies that want an advantage over competitors are likely to grease the skids, so to speak, by wining and dining politicians, not to mention making large campaign contributions. This creates an enormous and democracy-threatening conflict of interests. Any company that produces easily rigged voting machines can promise politicians much more than a good price or a kickback for accepting the company’s bid. Even if the politicians themselves aren’t in on the scam, CEOs of these highly conservative companies still have an incentive to assure the victory of candidates who are friendly to Big Business. Diebold’s contract with Georgia was worth $54 million, and Diebold is also about to close a similarly lucrative deal with Maryland. It makes one’s hair stand on end to learn that in August, 2003, Diebold CEO Walden O’Dell wrote a letter to Ohio Republicans in which he said he was “committed to helping Ohio to deliver its electoral votes to the president next year.” He wrote this letter at the very time Diebold was bidding for a contract to sell its voting machines to the state of Ohio! What’s more, even after O’Dell’s letter was exposed to the public, Ohio’s Secretary of State—who happens to be a Republican—still had the audacity to put Diebold on Ohio’s list of preferred voting machine vendors. As it stands, Diebold’s machines will be used in Ohio’s presidential primary in March.Think that’s bad? Try this. Chuck Hagel, the head of ES&S, sold his company’s voting machines to the state of Nebraska. Shortly after that he became Nebraska’s first Republican Senator in 24 years. Eighty percent of Hagel’s votes were counted by ES&S employees in complete corporate secrecy. States all across America are currently rushing to install computerized voting machines because no one, after all, wants to re-enact Florida’s Hanging Chad Fiasco of 2000. What isn’t well known, however, is that while punch card machines like the ones that embarrassed Florida have a relatively high error rate, computerized voting machines are even worse. The truth is, the safest, most reliable method of counting votes is—you guessed it!—hand-counted paper ballots. See for yourself at The Voting Technology Project.Clearly, what we need in is a law that will require all voting machines in this country to provide a verifiable paper trail. And fortunately, a bill like that is now in the works. Not surprisingly, however, not a single Republican supports it. Representative Rush Holt, a New Jersey Democrat, has introduced a bill in Congress, called the Voter Confidence and Increased Accessibility Act, which would, among other things: require all voting systems to produce a voter-verifiable paper record that can be used in manual audits.
ban the use of undisclosed software and wireless communications devices in voting systems.
require mandatory surprise recounts in 0.5% all voting jurisdictions, both domestic and overseas.
require all voting systems to meet these requirements in time for the General Election of 2004.
(You can find the complete text of the bill here.)So far, Holt’s bill has 61 co-sponsors supporting it—all of them Democrats. Please check here to see if your Representative is among those who have co-sponsored this bill. And if not, get angry. What’s more, consider the potential fate of Congressman Holt. He represents counties in New Jersey that might soon begin using touch-screen voting machines. If that happens before his next election, we might never hear from him again. Or any other Democrat, for that matter.Here’s what you can do about this outrageous attack on democracy.First, direct everyone you know to this web page.Second, send a copy of the following letter to your Representative in Congress.Dear Representative _________________:I am astonished and fearful to learn that electronic touch-screen voting machines are easily rigged and that they may have already been used to steal several recent elections throughout the country.For a summary of the threat posed by electronic voting machines, please visit www.theemailactivist.org/voter_fraud.htm on the Web. Once you’ve read this summary, I expect that you will immediately co-sponsor Representative Rush Holt’s bill, HR 2239, the Voter Confidence and Increased Accessibility Act. I also expect you to fight aggressively to get this bill pushed straight through Congress in time for the 2004 General Elections. You can find the full text of Congressman Holt’s bill at http://thomas.loc.gov. In summary, it will require all voting systems to produce a voter-verifiable paper record that can be used in manual audits.
ban the use of undisclosed software and wireless communications devices in voting systems.
require mandatory surprise recounts in 0.5% all voting jurisdictions, both domestic and overseas.
require all voting systems to meet these requirements in time for the General Election of 2004.
If you do not support this crucial bill, I will do everything in my power to see that you are not re-elected. Nothing less than democracy is at stake.Sincerely,(Your name and address) Third, send a copy of the following letter to your elected representatives in your state legislature. If you have trouble finding their contact information, please visit our Getting Started page.Dear Delegate (or Senator) ________________:I am astonished and fearful to learn that electronic touch-screen voting machines are easily rigged and that they may have already been used to steal several recent elections throughout the country.For a summary of the threat posed by electronic voting machines, please visit www.theemailactivist.org/voter_fraud.htm on the Web. Once you’ve read this summary, I expect that you will immediately initiate legislation to place a moratorium on the use of these machines throughout our state. I also urge you to initiate legislation that will require all voting systems in our state to produce a voter-verifiable paper record that can be used in manual audits. This legislation should also ban the use of undisclosed software and wireless communications devices in our state’s voting systems.If you do not support such a bill, I will do everything in my power to see that you are not re-elected. Nothing less than democracy is at stake.Sincerely,(Your name and address) Subscribe to our free email newsletter.

[trudyco]

16. Yeh, I asked about that before because there were so many

power shortages, machine failures, and rebooting across the country. The machine failures and rebooting could be crummy machines, but power outages sounded really wierd.

RadioShack sells simple devices that transmit data via the wiring in your house. I don't know if you could jam that, but it would be interesting to unplug the machine (and in one precinct that happened twice during the elections).

So spyware has been a hit lately. Is there a jamming device that would mess up wireless transmission?

trudyco

[Must_B_Free]

18. certainly

all you have to do is generate noise on the right frequency or range.

[Carl Brennan]

11. Let me give the situation.

It is the Washington recount. There are "stand alone" computers being used to compare the count numbers on the boxes of ballots to the numbers on the computers. The numbers on the harddrive of the computer are, purportedly, numbers from the machine recount. My concern is that a hacker could enter "new numbers" from the machine counts done previous to the hand recounts to line up with the hand recounts. I want to look into this tomorrow when I go back to the recount.

Thanks for your help.

Can a reciever be identified without opening up the hardware?

[ExCiber]

13. If you have a Palm

with wireless get a copy of NetChaser (free 10 day trial).

It'll tell you of any wireless AP's in the area.

[berniew1]

15. Its easy for elections staff to manipulate them; or manufacturer reps in m

Its easy for elections staff to manipulate them; or manufacturer reps in many cases, where they develop software or service the systems or have access to them for such.
It is reported that some of these computers have connections to the manufacter rep, and some have been hacked and documented to have interactions with the manufacturer reps.

[Carl Brennan]

17. I don't have a Palm. That sounds like a good idea.

What's AP stand for? I am assuming it is a reciever device. The ideal situation would be to check the County stand alones themselves to see if there are any recievers on them.

[Must_B_Free]

19. access points

I run into them all the time in hotels and airports.

[ExCiber]

24. Good part time business to be in

Go into most any residential neighborhood and you'll find dozens of unsecured networks.

Get the minimum information about the owner, go to the house and sell your service to secure their network.

It's amazing how many people have installed wireless routers in their home with NO SECURITY!

[thedutch]

27. I would advise

that you stop by a local university or community college and ask for some help in this. Any professor teaching a security or networking course will have all of the necessary tools and knowledge. I recently took a course in which my professor _taught_ us how to wardrive (it was his way of saying "wireless networking sucks").

[skids]

37. Make sure there is opaque tape over the IRDA ports.

Make sure there is no wireless LAN card in the computer, and make sure you know where the computers came from, who put them together, and who has had access to them.

[AntiFascist]

49. The usual off-the-shelf type receivers are...

PCI boards that are installed inside the computer with small antennas that can fold up at a right angle. This can provide the machine the same access as an ethernet cable. If the folder or directory containing the file that has the count numbers is set as "shared" (under Windows) then other machines on the network can access the file.

On edit: there are many less obvious ways to gain access to the file if the folder is not shared.

[candice]

20. Check Randi Rhodes message board

A computer expert from upstate New York said he'd decompile the source code, if necessary. Check for him on Randi's message board.

[k8conant]

23. Here's what I get on http://www.therandirhodesshow.com/main.html

The Message Board and Article Archives are not working correctly. Please stand by.

Tim Allan Walker
Producer, TRRS

[Carl Brennan]

22. delete

[phantomvotes]

25. Some more info

http://64.233.167.104/search?q=cache:QBKUog9DYVAJ:www.ngfl-cymru.org.uk/vtc/ngfl/ict/wjec_ict/as_ict/communication.doc+Can+you+hack+a+stand+alone+computer+with+a+wireless+computer+in+the+same+building.+&hl=enWireless

Wireless Media
Radiowaves
Here the data is transmitted as a series of radio waves.

Microwaves
Mobile phones use microwaves. Ideal for linking computers in two separate buildings fairly near to each other.

Satellite systems also make use of microwaves.
Infra-red
This works a bit like your television remote control. Infra-red signals can only travel short distances and this limits their use.

Often used to provide a link from a laptop computer to a printer so that data can be sent between the two without the need for a cable.

__________________________________________


Below is a copy of a forum post by Kevin O'Donnell from (votersunite) that I saved and sent to Jeff Fisher:


BY: Kevin O'Donnell

I was an election observer in Scott County Iowa. Republicans had illegal palm pilots in polling places sending voter ID to Washington. We shut them down where I was, but you may want to take a real hard look at this county. It was one of the most hotly contested in the country. Also, take a hard look at Lucas County, Iowa.
____________________________________________
ANOTHER STORY about Tabulation: http://www.votefraud.org/how_a_private_company_counts_our_votes.htm

[momzno1]

26. Do you remember BBV finding

a wireless router or modem in a machine that the county said was "stand alone" and it is part of the court case in Volusia (I think I remember that properly)
I definitely think that it can be hidden within the machine. And perhaps manipulated to coincide with the recount numbers.

[59sunburst]

28. What About Peer to Peer via USB?

Here's one way:

1)Plug a USB Wireless device into the back of the PC. They are very small now. Unless you looked for it, you wouldn't see it.

2) Install the device driver. Make sure the wireless communications utility runs in the background and is not visible in the system tray (if possible).

3)Configure it for peer-to-peer communication. This means it would not have to go through a network. It could communicate directly with a laptop in another room, for example.

4) Do your hacking.

5) Remove the USB wireless device.

6) Uninstall the driver.

[ExCiber]

29. If it's 802.11 then it's still detectable

Even in the Ad Hoc config you're describing a beacon will be sent every 100 mSec. or so.

[GetTheRightVote]

30. Many wireless connections can be accessed from outside

very similiar to my router system. I can go outside and sit in the yard while still working on my laptop, it is great, but not so great for voting machine fraud. We do not want machines in our elections, if they are we can never know if they are honest, can not trust in a system based on computers.

[Roger_Otip]

42. Hacking with a Pringles tube

the machine would have to be connected to a wireless network, but many machines with sensitive data on them are - interesting article here on how easily they can be hacked: http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/sci/tech/1860241.stm

"Empty cans of Pringles crisps could be helping malicious hackers spot wireless networks that are open to attack.

Security company i-sec has demonstrated that a directional antenna made with a Pringles can significantly improves the chances of finding the wireless computer networks being used in London's financial district."

[Ellipsis]

50. 802.11g

more secure. less range, our experience, within 50 feet. They would have to be inside. unless the signal would be amplified. doubtful that.

[Alizaryn]

31. It would be great if there were a computer expert around the area

that would show up and help them determine if there's a problem.

[skids]

32. If you can put a WLAN receiver onto the standalone computer...

Then that's 99% of the battle. If you were able to open the case, and plug in a card, odds are you could have made yourself a backdoor while you were there doing that. Or if you can't get into the administration interface, you may not have to, if the computer tries to autoconfigure the new hardware. Or you could have a special custom-made plug-in card that runs code in the BIOS sequence, before the computer boots the main OS, you could create a back door that way.

Another option is to use a port that came built in to the computer. For example, a lot of computers come with IRDA ports on them. If those ports were active, and searching for IRLAN connections, that is another way to try and get in.

Once you have an active network connection that is asking for an address, you can DHCP or BOOTP the address to it. Or you could attack it over any protocols it is running that don't need IP addresses. All you need to do is find a service running that is not configured securely, or which has a bug in it which you can exploit.

Once you are in, hacking votes is the easy part. Even if the votes are kept in a secure database, hijacking a process that has that database open is still possible -- and if the vendor made it easy for their technicians, which they often do, it is easy for you, too. And if you are the vendor, even moreso.

Getting it to sing "Yankee Doodle" with it's hard drive would be more of a challenge.

Basically with computers, anything is possible. They are very flexible -- any system based on a "standard commodity" solution will have tons of crap it doesn't need, like access to a real-time clock that could change it's behavior depending on whether it is between the hours of 3pm and 9pm on November 2 or not. No voting machine should know what time it is, IMO, any timestamps should be relative to when
it was last turned on, but even then, you would have to make sure to test the system for a full day. Twice or three times. For a full day each time. Otherwise you could not be sure that the machine was not rigged to start changing votes after it has been receiving votes for more than a few hours. How many BoE's do you think test that much?

Any "custom hardware" solution that cannot be installed on a random PC also comes with security problems. The vendor could have any number of hidden hardware or firmware components installed in it. Wireless transmitters can be hidden quite easily and disguised as part of the normal internal workings of the machine. And they could be custom solutions that will not be usable/detectible without special equipment.

Computers are not safe without a paper trail, period, and even with the paper trail, they are not safe if the people running the election system are not willing to do a recount immediately after the election, with no legal resistance or delay, with the paper ballots have been secured very well in the meantime. Countering the strategy of "hack the preliminary results, then cover up by making the ballots match before the recount happens" needs to be considered in any secure election. Any public official that drags their feet on a hand recount of the paper trail is jeopardizing the security of the system.

[trudyco]

33. I think the salient problem is what to do now - right?

Looks like there's lots of ways to transmit wireless from an inconspicuously placed - what was it called - AP? and a laptap in a lounge nearby. Infrared probably wouldn't work through the wall but I assume the other ways would. So there is a way to locate the AP with an add on to a PDA. How would you jam without knowing anymore than what's been speculated here?

It seems that locating is good, but so far we've caught repubs red handed doing fraud and nobody seems to want to prosecute. Heck, Blackwell should have been jailed by now. Maybe Washington is better, but it seems like the best option would be to be able to foil them by jamming their transmission.

Can it be done without knowing the particulars?

trudyco

[skids]

38. Bring a microwave oven and a few cordless phones.

And run them constantly :-).

[ExCiber]

43. Not sure if that's a good idea

2.4 Ghz cordless phones can sometimes disrupt wireless, but it's not any guarantee.

A microwave oven with bad seals will without any doubt do the job but them tumors can be a real bitch to deal with :)

[Ellipsis]

48. how about this

it's late

http://www.cybernet.com/products/PVA/index.html

k

[Lil]

52. "seamlessly integrated ...without the need for separate equipment"

Wow!
(From article above complete with photo)

The heart of the software consists of a networked Collaboration Engine that allows mobile users to share technical information across wireless and wired networks. This Collaboration Engine provides each user with access to data, text, and graphics – all in real time. Features such as Whiteboarding and Application Sharing enable multiple users to annotate and manipulate a common file or picture, regardless of physical location. Optional hardware modules are seamlessly integrated into the system so that a field-based user can measure electronic signals or read barcode data without the need for separate equipment (more)

[Ellipsis]

57. yes wow but...

(slow typist with bad grammar)

it was late, so, don't go crazy here. I was being a little sarcastic with the cybernet link though it is a coincidence.

it's a cybernet thing... but a different cybernet then the Barton Watson. This stuff is not rocket science. Simple stuff readily available on the market today... this is just a different concept on how to apply stuff all ready available.

kinda like a walkie talkie

...As long as there is access to the machine, software installed and permission by the computer to access

Who cares if you can notice an errant 802.11 signal for a while. If your only flipping votes on a spread sheet this stuff would not take that long to do. If your putting this kind of thing in older computer though, no dice, then it would have to be a "custom". A simple blue tooth USB thing could work with just the flexibility of giving access to IO.

What your looking for may be only 1 of two parts... 1 just passing the signal to another place in the building to a cpu networked via a hard wire to the net.

If the machine was hacked I'd guess it would take place at the end of the day. Who's around after the polls close? check their computers.
k

[Carolab]

62. Actually, oddly, the Cybernet linked above IS the "right" Cybernet

or so our research into it in multiple threads shows us. The Barton Watson company, CyberNET Group, doesn't produce anywhere near the leads of the Cybernet Systems Inc. company, which is the company of the above-referenced link. The former MAY have some connection but the links appear tenuous compared to those of the latter.

I find this very interesting. Thanks for bringing it into the discussion.

[Ellipsis]

63. I was curious about that

That..... was a deep forest.

given that... these guys would have access to new 802.11 stuf or the future Revs there of.
also a shit load of R&D They could easily make what ever they want in what ever size they want.

Okay then, How bout Piotr Blass and his this reverse interger thingie has a Patten on?

k

[Lil]

67. Yikes, I didn't even NOTICE Cybernet.

That is really - ummmm - curious? I just wonder . . .

[Ellipsis]

68. Seven degrees of Cybernet ala Kevin Bacon

Yes thats why I posted that, notice the cute little bluetooth headpiece.

okay I'll start

Jeff Fisher
Mr Feeney
Jeb Bush
Kathren Harris
Joesph Klock
Piotr Blass
Cybernet

Almost deserves its own thread.

getting punchy

k

[evolvenow]

34. Texting And US Politics: K*rl R*ve's Blackberry.

Texting And US Politics: K*rl R*ve's Blackberry.

Through it all, R*ve wore his war room on his belt -- the postcard-size BlackBerry communicator that holds his unmatchable Rolodex as well as his e-mail system, through which he squirted orders and suggestions to campaign workers and lobbyists using only a few words. "It's like haiku, "says a political operative who has been on the receiving end. During meetings -- even ones with the President -- R*ve would constantly spin the BlackBerry's dial and punch out text on its tiny keyboard. "Sometimes we're in a meeting talking to each other and BlackBerrying each other at the same time, "says a colleague.

(more)
http://www.smartmobs.com/archive/2003/01/03/texting_and_us_.html

and

http://www.time.com/time/nation/article/0,8599,388904,00.html

Saturday, Nov. 09, 2002
There is, as a rule, no smoking in the White House, but this Election Day was one for breaking the rules. The moment of sweet vindication came at midnight, up in the private quarters, where President Bush and close aides were watching the returns on the Fox News Channel. Unlike the fateful election night of 2000, when they waited for results that never came, this one was going well, and the President, who hovered close enough to the television to get static cling, was enjoying it. His strategist K*rl R*ve was perched on the edge of an armchair, double-thumbing e-mail messages into his BlackBerry when the call came in from Lloyd Smith, the salty 51-year-old manager of Jim Talent's campaign against Senator Jean Carnahan in Missouri. His boys had been torturing the computer models, Smith said, and it looked as if Talent was performing well enough in the Democratic strongholds of St. Louis and Kansas City to guarantee victory. "You're the man! "R*ve bellowed back into his cell phone. Then he gave the President the news: Talent's win meant they didn't have just the state; they had the Senate. They had it all.

[evolvenow]

35. Promis? Would they have access?via the "back door" to enter ...

http://www.fromthewilderness.com/free/ww3/magic_carpet.html

Here's how powerful the software is.

Approximately two weeks after the September 11 attacks on the World Trade Center and the Pentagon, the History Channel aired a documentary entitled "The History of Terrorism." In that documentary, a law enforcement officer described some of the methods used to track terrorist movements. He stated that "computers" were able to track such things as credit card purchases, entry and exits visas, telephone and utility usage etc. It was implied that these diverse data base files could be integrated into one unified table. He gave an example that through the use of such a system it would be possible to determine that if a suspected terrorist entered the country and was going to hide out, that by monitoring the water and electrical consumption of all possible suspects in a given cell, it would be possible to determine where the terrorist was hiding out by seeing whose utility use increased. Conversely, it would be possible to determine if a terrorist was on the move if his utility consumption declined or his local shopping patterns were interrupted. Aren't those "club" cards from your supermarket handy?

This is but the barest glimpse of what Promis can do. Mated with artificial intelligence it is capable of analyzing not only an individual's, but also a community's entire life, in real time. It is also capable of issuing warnings when irregularities appear and of predicting future movements based upon past behavior.

In the financial arena Promis is even more formidable. Not only is it capable of predicting movements in financial markets and tracking trades in real time. It has been reported, on a number of occasions, to have been used, via the "back door" to enter secret bank accounts, including accounts in Switzerland and then remove the money in those accounts without being traced. Court documents filed in the various INSLAW trials include documentation of this ability as well as affidavits and declarations from Israeli intelligence officers and assets.

The one essential weakness of Promis is that it must be physically installed on a targeted computer for it to be effective. (more)

[Carolab]

36. I read somewhere that

someone could just "stick" a wireless device on a piece of equipment anywhere nearby--doesn't even have to be in or on the stand-alone computer--and dial in from a remote location nearby (not necessarily on site) to alter the numbers.

[ExCiber]

40. Not true

If the device is really stand-alone then the ONLY access is via the keyboard.

If the target is networked (wired or wireless) and some unsecure AP exist on the network, anywhere on the network, then you may be able to get in.

[Carl Brennan]

41. Check your p-mail

[Cocoa]

56. more nostalgia

The Bev-heads telling each other to "check your inbox" was another mantra from those days.

[Carl Brennan]

58. What's a matter Creme Puff?

Haven't got anything better to do than crimp a little enthusiam?

That seems to be a trademark of Creme Puffs.

[Kip Humphrey]

44. Easy discreet exploit possible on election day

To make any stand alone temporarily wifi networked, on the day of the election, plug a portable wifi card w/UBS dongle into the UBS port in the back. Run Windows network config (click,click,click...). At the end of the day, remove the UBS devise and rerun Network configuration (click,click,click...). The only way to dtermine anything ever happened would be to check the hard disk for deleted data that has not been overwritten.

[Lil]

45. Curtis @Judicary: wiretapping contract proposals sent via internet

I have no idea if this is relevant.

In his testimony re: where he discovered/reported an employee - I think the FL Dept. of Transportation - had inserted a wiretapping program into some software the Dept. used. Employee only got a 3 yr. probation and $100 fine for it.

I am not a programmer, but I wonder if/how such a communication program could be used with the ANY of voting computer programs.

[Carolab]

46. Curious because

I had exactly the same thought. I wonder what Clinton Curtis would know about this?

[Lil]

47. Great minds. etc. Yes - I'd love to know. :-) n/t

[Lil]

51. kick for any last minute ideas for Carl

[Cocoa]

54. this is sooooo 2003

this is that wild goose chase crap from the pre-book era of BBV.

All these fake projects, snipe hunts (in Bev's own words), and similar crap intended to get people to feel like they were "involved" in "the cause."

I'm sure you will put all the info to good use "for the WA recount." :eyes:

[Carl Brennan]

55. So what are you doing slick?

Or is this just displaced whining from the last question I asked you that you never replied to. :eyes:

[Carl Brennan]

59. Thanks a million you guys for the input. I am now working

on a plan for looking into this. I linked up with a software engineer who may be able to join me in my inquiry with the County people.

This thing could be interesting and I want to keep you posted at this topic.

Any tech people or otherwise computer lingo savvy types in Seattle that want to input please p-mail me or post here.

[trudyco]

60. Good Luck

Hope you find the Access Point, if there is one, during the recount. Even better, figure out how to Jam it.

trudyco

[Carl Brennan]

61. Check your p-mail. nt

[ginnyinWI]

64. one more opinion

My husband has been in computer science for GE for 26 years, and he says the answer is "yes".

[Carolab]

65. You should PM Carl

and give him your information. He is working on this issue.

[zapped 1]

66. kick..nm

[phantomvotes]

69. CYBERNET, ACCENTURE and VOTEHERE

CYBERNET, ACCENTURE and VOTEHERE (department of Accenture)

A lot of technology at Accenture using remote vote and Radio frequency ID:

http://www.votehere.net/remotevote.html

http://www.accenture.com/xd/xd.asp?it=enweb&xd=services%5Ctechnology%5Ctech_silent.xml

http://www.votehere.net/partners.html

http://www.accenture.com/xd/xd.asp?it=enweb&xd=services%5Ctechnology%5Cvision%5Csil_gloss.xml

http://www.votehere.net/partners.html


Reference to post #48

Cybernet technology:
http://www.cybernet.com/products/PVA/index.html

[Ellipsis]

72. Is this for real?

fck.

too much stuff to go through.

sure like to know if all these guys go to the same picnics.

synopsis?

k

Diversifying through vote fraud, Love the bidness model.

[Carl Brennan]

73. The SOS of Washington is on the BOD of an Accenture

subsidiary named VoteHere.

BOARD OF DIRECTORS
Ralph Munro, Chairman
Jim Adler
Richard Green
Tom Simpson
Robert G. Wolfe
Tim Kilgallon

Ralph Munro, Chairman, former Secretary of State of Washington State
Ralph Munro served as Secretary of State of Washington State from 1980 to 2000. He has an impressive background in legislative, elections and government policy spanning more than two decades. Mr. Munro was instrumental in developing and implementing progressive plans making voting more convenient for citizens and improving the administrative process for elections officials.

Under Mr. Munro’s leadership, Washington State saw significant advancement in the efficiency of state election services including absentee voting, voter registration, election reporting and voter information. His notable achievements include implementing the presidential primary allowing independent voters to participate in the nomination process; transitioning election equipment from lever machines to more technologically advanced optical scan systems; designing the “Motor Voter” registration system that offers citizens the opportunity to register to vote at the same time they obtain a driver’s license; and supporting a program that allowed Washington-based Desert Storm troops to vote via fax from the Persian Gulf.

Mr. Munro has also given his time and expertise to government, civic and volunteer organizations. He served as past president of the National Association of Secretaries of State, co-chaired the International Task Force of the Council of State Governments and trustee and member of the Federal Election Commission Clearinghouse Advisory Panel and the Commission on Voter Participation.

Mr. Munro’s numerous awards include the World Citizen Award from the Seattle World Affairs Council, the Warren G. Magnuson Award for outstanding public service and the Executive Leadership Award from the Washington State League of Women Voters.

Mr. Munro has a BA in Education and Political Science from Western Washington University.


Jim Adler, Founder and CEO, VoteHere
Jim Adler is founder and CEO of VoteHere, the leading worldwide provider of secure electronic voting. Mr. Adler is widely regarded as an authority on the subjects of cryptography, Internet security and e-voting. Mr. Adler served on California’s groundbreaking 1999 Internet Voting Task Force, has testified before state legislatures on the subject of e-voting, and is defining certification procedures for e-voting systems. He is a frequent speaker at conferences, seminars and panel discussions on the topic of online and electronic voting both in the United States and internationally.

Under Mr. Adler's leadership, VoteHere has received extensive worldwide press coverage from Time, US News & World Report, The Wall Street Journal, CNN, Business Week, ABC, CBS, NBC, Financial Times, Wired, Red Herring, and USA Today.

Mr. Adler received his BS in Electrical Engineering with High Honors from the University of Florida and his MS in Electrical Engineering from the University of California, San Diego.


Richard Green, Co-founder of VoteHere
Richard Green is a co-founder of VoteHere and served as Chairman from 1998 to 2001. He works actively with management in strategic planning, business development, contract review, and technical design.

Mr. Green is a director of Jetboil, Inc., a producer of innovative products for the outdoor recreation market. Mr. Green is co-founder and Managing Director of Granite State Angels, a regional investment group located in Hanover, NH.

Mr. Green has 27 years of experience as an executive in the software and networking industries. In 1983, Mr. Green co-founded Corporate Microsystems, Inc. (CMI), a software firm specializing in data communications, where he served as CEO and Chairman for ten years. In 1993, he negotiated the successful sale of CMI to Legent Corporation, a major software vendor later acquired by Computer Associates.

Mr. Green is President of the Board of Directors of the Grafton County, NH Economic Development Council, is a founder of the Dartmouth Regional Technology Center business incubator, and is a member of the Assembly of Overseers of the Dartmouth Hitchcock Medical Center in Lebanon, NH.

Mr. Green graduated with honors in 1976 from Dartmouth College, where he received the John G. Kemeny Prize in Computing.


Tom Simpson, Managing Partner, Northwest Venture Associates
Tom Simpson is managing partner of Northwest Venture Associates with 15 years of experience as a venture capitalist and investment banker building and serving successful Northwest businesses in several markets. Prior to forming Northwest Venture Associates, he was a managing director in Dain Rauscher Wessels' Seattle-based investment banking group, where he spearheaded the fundraising of more than $350 million for several of the region's most successful emerging companies. Tom is a director of Confirma, Pacific Edge Software, Sur La Table, Pet's Choice, Sightward, Telect, TeleSym and VoteHere and a former director of AdRelevance (now NetRatings), Netpodium (now Akamai) and Packet Engines. He is a board member and past-president of the Evergreen Venture Capital Association, which oversees the 40 plus venture capital firms in Washington State. Tom serves on the boards of the National Association of Small Business Investment Companies and the Technology Alliance of Washington. He holds a bachelor's degree in business administration from the University of Washington and a master's degree in business administration from The Wharton School.


Robert G. Wolfe, Managing Partner, Northwest Venture Associates
Bob Wolfe has 25 years of finance, operations and technology management experience. Prior to joining NWVA, Bob was president and chief operating officer of Toronto-based GT Group Telecom, then Canada's largest independent telecommunications provider. Before GT Group Telecom, Bob was chief financial officer of Trillium Corporation, a private international investment company. While at Trillium Bob served as Chairman of Gargoyles, a manufacturer of specialty sunglasses. Earlier in his career, he spent eight years at Goldman Sachs. He has a bachelor’s degree in business administration from Washington State University and a master’s degree in business administration from Pacific Lutheran University.

Bob is also a director of IP Fabrics, Netmotion Wireless, and Pet's Choice. He is a board observer at Wireless Services.


Tim Kilgallon, CEO of Free and Clear, Inc.
Mr. Kilgallon has twenty years of experience building high growth, technology-based businesses. He is currently the CEO of Free & Clear, inc., which leverages technology and highly-trained remote specialists to provide behavior modification services, including tobacco cessation and weight management. He previously was president of Applied Discovery, a leader in providing web-enabled business services to the legal industry. Applied Discovery was acquired by LexisNexis. Before joining Applied Discovery, Mr. Kilgallon was CEO of Pointshare, a provider of online services to the health care industry. Pointshare was acquired by Siemens. Prior to Pointshare, Mr. Kilgallon served in various roles at Medaphis, including division president, CFO and General Counsel. Medaphis was a leader in providing receivables management, information technology and systems integration services to the healthcare industry. Before joining Medaphis, Mr. Kilgallon practiced law at King & Spalding in Atlanta, Georgia. Mr. Kilgallon holds a J.D. from Washington and Lee University, and a B.A. in Economics and Philosophy from Boston College.

[Carl Brennan]

70. Update 12/15.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=203x143606

Reply #22

[Carl Brennan]

71. Update 12/16/04

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=203x143606

[Lil]

74. kick for electing the new Dem. WA Gov.