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Higans Donating Member (819 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-24-04 12:06 AM
Original message
Damn these Hackers!
Edited on Fri Dec-24-04 12:27 AM by Higans

If that Map is correct and the central tabulators are only in three counties, then there is a good chance any recount hope lay in a full hand recount.

Per signed affidavit at http://www.truthout.org/docs_04/121604Z.shtml the Tabulation software has been compromised.


This makes it impossible for a 3% sample recount to determine if the tabulation software was operating correctly at the time of the original counting. In addition the new software possibly added could be programed to count accurately for the first 3-5% of the vote totals and then still feed you what ever numbers the programmers want after 50% or 75% or 100% have been counted. Thats just the way it is. You know this technology at least as well as I do People. Hard drives are so small. I could fit one in my pocket just as easy as you can. I could swap one out with a simple screw driver just as easily as you. If I installed a wireless card to my computer OR YOURS there is a good chance I can control the system without your knowledge. Or any one for that matter. wouldn't even have to be in the building.

Just the fact that he had the opportunity to remove possible evidence from the central tabulator is a gaping security hole. A lot of computers can be networked and controlled with a device that can fit in the palm of your hand and can be installed with out the use of a screw driver. wake up and fight these Hackers. Even if this Battle is lost (and I don't think it is) the war will be with us forever if we do nothing.



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shraby Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-24-04 12:26 AM
Response to Original message
1. They didn't even need a wireless
they could access the tabulators anytime they wanted to.
<http://www.truthout.org/docs_04/122404X.shtml>
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Ellipsis Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-24-04 12:51 AM
Response to Reply #1
3. ditto!
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Higans Donating Member (819 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-24-04 03:50 PM
Response to Reply #1
14. Thank you, thats evidence right there. he just admitted to
breaking fedral law 6 times previous. the fact is that the law has been broken. adjustments were made to the machines wile not in the presence of a Dem and Republican observer. or Greens or any one.
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mulethree Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-24-04 12:45 AM
Response to Original message
2. read the blue legend again
yellow = electab - tabulation

Blue = VIS AND Electab (Tabulation)

Orange - VIS only = voter registration but not tabulation.

So all the yellow AND Blue have Triad tabulation systems.

VIS is voter information service = registration management.

I compared the blue+yellow results to similar counties (White ones of similar size that used punch card scanners) and found them within 1% plus or minus (varies on what size of counties you limit it to)
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Higans Donating Member (819 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-24-04 12:59 AM
Response to Reply #2
4. Where are you getting your numbers?
From the hard drive in that tec's pocket? from the tiny 3% sample? or from the whole county hand recount?

The tec's said it was common practice for technicians to make adjustments before recounts. He said that he personally had done 6 counties, and 5 other tec's work with him. do the math what is 5x6?
It is so obvious to me that they can't even prove that they count them or else they would have done it by now.
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understandinglife Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-24-04 01:02 AM
Response to Reply #4
5. Stay the course. Thank you. (n/t)
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Higans Donating Member (819 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-24-04 02:50 AM
Response to Reply #5
6. We the people of the United States
Can't be fooled by computer games any more.
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mulethree Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-24-04 04:42 AM
Response to Reply #4
10. From the certified results
The certified results are substantially the same as the machine-recounted votes. If you take a dozen Triad counties and compare them to a dozen similar non-triad counties then you can see if the 'triad factor' is resulting in a skew of votes. There isn't one, at least not one thats large enough or consistent.

So either, Triad is not cheating, or theres a near-equal amount of cheating in non-triad counties.

You need 2% to make Bush loose, 4% to match the unadjusted exit polls. But Triad handles less than a quarter of the votes in the state.

The law that requires someone to set up the software differently for a recount is stupid. Having elections people who don't know their machine and software well enough to do it themselves is also stupid. And the hired elections company giving hints on avoiding a recount is also stupid. So is the law that requires a payment much smaller than the cost of a recount. Put it all together and we have a lot of suspicious recounts and people blatantly breaking recount laws to avoid an expensive hand count at all costs.

But some recounts were honest and didn't show problems.
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Higans Donating Member (819 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-24-04 01:44 PM
Response to Reply #10
11. results don't matter when they come from a illegally modified Machine.
Edited on Fri Dec-24-04 02:08 PM by Higans
Facts are Facts. Ohio Law Prohibits any "adjustments" of the machinery be made not in the presence of Dem and Republican Observers.

This is a Legal issue no matter how closely the numbers match. The Fact that the tec's can walk in off the street un-announced in 5 of 6 cases and take the tabulator apart swap parts and put it back together is a huge security hole, and a violation of Ohio recount law. The small fact that this can happen renders a 3% sample hand count completely useless.

It begs the question why Are the Machines modified at all between the original count and the recount contradicting State and Federal Law.

I don't care about Triad vs. non-Triad Counties. I care that the Tabulator Machines are so insecure that any one can walk in off the street and start swapping parts. The Machines need to be secured but the Hackers may have gotten to them already, and managed to rig the recounts just as easily as they rigged the count.

Even if the numbers match exactly it does not matter. the fact that the counting is being done by an easily manipulated machine is the problem. not to mention that any "adjustment" to the machines is Illegal. Do you get it yet? Who ever controls the machines can make the numbers come out how ever they want. This includes Triad, Die Bold all machines.

We the People need to wake up and realize just how easy it is for Hackers to fool us, and how little effort is involved in completely altering the programming of any computer. The next election I bet they will build the computers in such a way that they can alter the vote count with out physical access to the machines at all.

Taken from: http://www.truthout.org/docs_04/121604Z.shtml

There are several important considerations you should be aware of with respect to this matter. First, this course of conduct would appear to violate several provisions of federal law, in addition to the constitutional guarantees of equal protection and due process. 42 U.S.C. §1973 provides for criminal penalties against any person who, in any election for federal office, "knowingly and willfully deprives, defrauds, or attempts to defraud the residents of a State of a fair and impartially conducted election process, by . . . the procurement, casting, or tabulation of ballots that are known by the person to be materially false, fictitious, or fraudulent under the laws of the State in which the election is held." 42 U.S.C. § 1974 also requires the retention and preservation, for a period of twenty-two months from the date of a federal election, of all voting records and papers and makes it a felony for any person to "willfully steal, destroy, conceal, mutilate, or alter" any such record. Further, any tampering with ballots and/or election machinery would violate the constitutional rights of all citizens to vote and have their votes properly counted, as guaranteed by the Equal Protection and Due Process Clauses of the Fourteenth Amendment to the U.S. Constitution.


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mulethree Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-24-04 02:34 PM
Response to Reply #11
12. another dumb law
"Ohio Law Prohibits any "adjustments" of the machinery be made not in the presence of Dem and Republican Observers"

What good does this do if the observers don't have a clue whats going on? And if its a county with their own IT guy, you have a similar problem - that the check and balance of having both repubs and dems around doesn't mean squat if they are clueless as to the operation of the machine and software.

Please think the scheme out. How do you recount and get repeatable results each time. Now how do you get some precincts to match both previous counts and hand recounts? Remember that the scheme has to work perfectly in 40 or so offices with different people with differing levels of diligence.

You can 'fix' the paper ballots for all precincts - takes a lot of forged ballots and a lot of time with the ballots. To do it for 1000+ precincts seems too risky.

or

You can have foreknowledge of the hand-count precincts and have the computer leave those precincts alone. Have the computer do its trixes on precincts you know won't be hand counted. This SHOULD be impossible if the hand-count precincts are truly determined randomly.

or

You can have advance knowledge of which precincts will be hand counted, and a little time with the ballots and the computer. You 'adjust' the paper ballots so they will match earlier counts when they are hand counted, and you tell the computer to count these ballots 'straight' but maintain it's previous bias when machine counting other precincts. This requires access to the paper ballots for the hand-count precincts between the time that the precincts are chosen and the time that the actual count begins. Ideally the ballots will be watched very closely by many eyes during this period, so this would be extremely risky.

Well, we know that in cuyahoga at least, certain classes of precincts were known in advance to be 'safe' from hand recounts, in many other cases we have non-random selection, and in other cases we have a random selection but don't know when it was done - we don't know that the ballots couldn't have been tampered with between the selection and the recount.

But we do have some counties who choose at random in front of the observers, immediately and securely obtain the ballots and commence the hand count. So a few were done with valid hand-counts, but many were not, violated laws, invalidated the recount etc.

So please, describe your scheme for how a machine could be hacked to match both hand counts and earlier machine counts. Ideally a scheme that works even if the proper recount procedure is used with random selection, secure ballots etc.

If you come up with a scheme, we may be able to figure out some side affects it would produce that could be checked for.

I agree that we as a people are too easily fooled by hackers, advertisers, propaganda etc. But I myself, have spent years sniffing out computer bugs and hacks and protecting systems from them.

Think like a detective and you can figure out where to look for clues or evidence. Propose a theory and test it, refine, test, refine, test. You can't just "Eeek! an Unknowable!"














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Higans Donating Member (819 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-24-04 03:23 PM
Response to Reply #12
13. I would ask the question:
are the 3% the entire county hand recounting all the votes in that county? or is the hand recount only consisting or 3% of the total votes cast in that county?

From what I understand the way that the recount procedure works is that 3% of the hand recount is fed through the vote totaling machine to check for accuracy. If the numbers match the rest of the votes are stuffed through the machine to give you the final results.

Does the counting machine interface with the central tabulator?

Is the source code programming available to any one other then the manufacturer for independent audit of the source code by a non-partisan panel?

The problem now is that it is hugely possible that the original hardrives that may have contained "adjusted" software have been removed and replaced with out any ones knowledge. Possible tampering with evidence. All ready a violation of Federal Law.
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mulethree Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-24-04 04:42 PM
Response to Reply #13
21. adjusted software
Your premise seems to be that the machine counts are still screwy, but someone has tampered in a way that makes the 3% hand count an invalid test of the accuracy of the machine.

That the screwyness is still there, but somehow hidden from the hand-recount test. Not that something incriminating was removed, but rather some additional test-foiling stuff was added or activated.

So the key is to think up a way to foil the tests. Some way that thats reliable enough to pass the test consistantly in hundreds of cases with scores of different sets of people all watching carefully.

Make the hand count match the machine count.
Make both counts match earlier counts that were presumably bogus.

The ways I've though of don't pass the 'consistently with lots of people watching carefully' part. Perhaps my mind is insufficiently criminal for the task.





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Higans Donating Member (819 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-25-04 08:21 PM
Response to Reply #21
40. easy if you control the programming
You can make the machine count corectly up to ten % of the vote. thuss making the Small sample hand count apear accurate. and then have the software programed to total the count diffrently when the final total is compleated. If the Source code for the tabulators is only controlled by it's maker and not reviewed, they can get this machine to trick you any way they want. We are lucky that we caught this violation of Fedral Law before it slipped into the merky past.
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Higans Donating Member (819 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-24-04 03:58 PM
Response to Reply #10
15. btw there is no law that "Requires someone to set up Software
differently for a recount".
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IndyOp Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-24-04 04:05 PM
Response to Reply #10
17. Triad is not cheating -- you mean in the recounts? or not at all?
The following needs to be updated (to match what is in Arnebeck's lawsuit), but it seems to be an early estimate of what is in Arnebeck's suit...

ES&S AND TRIAD IMPLICATED IN KERRY/CONNALLY DISCREPANCY

Ellen Connally, an African-American supreme court candidate running an underfunded race won a greater percentage of votes in her race than John Kerry did in his in many Ohio counties. Kerry, as the presidential candidate should have a higher percentage than Connally because most voters have the priority of casting a vote for president. Connally ran better than Kerry in areas where she wasn't known and did not campaign!

There were 15 Ohio counties where Connally’s margin was 5,000 votes or more better than Kerry’s unofficial results: Auglaize, Butler, Clermont, Darke, Delaware, Greene, Hamilton, Hancock, Licking, Mercer, Miami, Putnam, Shelby, Stark, and Warren. All 15 counties use voting systems by ES&S (10 counties) or by Triad (5 counties). Both companies have ties with the Republican party.

In the 15 counties in which the Connally margin is 5,000 better than Kerry's, Connally's margin exceeded Kerry's by 190,437 votes.

Primary reference: Kerry Supports Ohio Vote Investigation, Jackson says
by Steven Rosenfeld, November 28, 2004.
<http://www.freepress.org/departments/display/19/2004/94... >
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mulethree Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-24-04 06:14 PM
Response to Reply #17
26. How would you analyze this?
As I stated before, either Triad isn't cheating, or they are cheating and similar cheating is happening in the non-triad counties.

Here they note these are 10 Es&s counties and 5 triad counties. You could try to find similar counties that are neither triad or es&s, but I don't know that you could just because triad is almost half the counties and Es&s has a large share of the rest - though different since they don't perform as much high-level administration as Triad does.

Every one is happy to see Moyer as a crook when he addresses the contest lawsuit, but they are surprised that people voted against him. I discount the Moyer/Connally race because he is a sleazeball and she seems sleazeless, and the races don't say (dem) (rep) beside them.

I'll look closer at these counties when I get some time. Probably not till sunday. They looked at counties, a precinct-level look could reveal more.
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IndyOp Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-24-04 04:01 PM
Response to Reply #2
16. Mulethree -- Can you explain how your comparisons differ from
this analysis posted a few weeks ago? The most important criticism I have heard of what follows was from Chorti who indicated that these results really need to be reported as percentages, rather than # of votes, to control for differently sized counties.

Triad machines produce 101,506 more Bush Votes than expected in Ohio
Posted by EOTE (link at bottom):

I looked at the difference in votes (in each county) from 2004 and what would have been expected if Kerry had obtained the same percentage of votes in the county as Gore had in 2000.

I also divided the counties up into four categories:
Electronic voting (7 counties)
Optical scan (12 counties)
Punch cards by Triad Government (41 counties)
Punch cards other (28 counties, mostly ES & S)

Here's what I found:

Punch cards by Triad:
13,369 less Kerry votes than expected, average of 326 LESS per county

Total non-Triad:
101,506 more Kerry votes than expected, average of 2,160 MORE per county

So, if the Triad counties had voted (in comparison with 2000) similarly to all the other counties combined, there would have been a net of 2,486 extra Kerry votes per each of the 41 counties, providing a net Kerry gain of 101,926 extra net Kerry votes. And with the additional provisional votes that are up for grabs, that could easily put Kerry over the top, I would think.

<http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=203x135124>
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mulethree Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-24-04 05:54 PM
Response to Reply #16
25. see post #30 of the thread you reference n/t
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IndyOp Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-24-04 08:09 PM
Response to Reply #25
28. Thanks for sending me back to the earlier thread...
Chorti had suggested that this needed to be analyzed taking county population into account - and your analysis indicates that he was right.

The counties implicated in switching votes from Kerry to Bush Arnebeck's suit are a mix of Triad (18), ES&S (16), and Fidlar (2) counties. The Triad counties implicated are Brown, Champaign, CLinton, Darke, Defiance, Greene, Highland, Holmes, Logan, Madison, Mercer, Miami, Pickaway, Preble, Putnam, Union, Van Wert and Warren.

The counties implicated in switching votes from Connally to Moyer in Arnebeck's original suit are also a mix ES&S (8); Triad (6); Danaher (1); Diebold (1). The six Triad counties are Ashtabula, Jefferson, Lorain, Montgomery, Portage, and Summit.

I have been staring at the data on the Ohio SOS site for the past hour and I can't figure out how Arnebeck and crew got the numbers they got -- I thought they were working from the Kerry/Connally discrepancy. Connally clearly got more votes than Kerry in the counties in which Arnebeck is arguing votes were switched from Kerry to Bush; Kerry clearly got more votes than Connally in the counties in which they argue votes were switched from Connally to Moyer. How they got their number I cannot discern.

:grr:


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HR_Pufnstuf Donating Member (782 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-24-04 03:11 AM
Response to Original message
7. THE BIG QUESTION BECOMES...
Edited on Fri Dec-24-04 03:13 AM by HR_Pufnstuf
...Did Diebold have remote access to their machines, and if not, why did Triad find it necessary to have this feature on THEIR machines?? And what IS the law regarding remote access to these machines? I would think they would always be kept offline by law.
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Gelliebeans Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-24-04 03:20 AM
Response to Reply #7
8. I know this is off topic
but everytime I see your name on a post "HR_Pufnstuf" I start singing that song and it gets stuck in my head for hours... LOL
;-) :silly:
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HR_Pufnstuf Donating Member (782 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-24-04 03:26 AM
Response to Reply #8
9. nah, that is purely on-topic.
Edited on Fri Dec-24-04 03:28 AM by HR_Pufnstuf
;)

say hi to freddy for me jimmy!

http://krofft.dementedstuff.com/pufnstuf.htm
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me b zola Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-25-04 05:27 PM
Response to Reply #8
35. Me, too n/t
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IndyOp Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-24-04 04:17 PM
Response to Reply #7
20. New optical scan machines built by Sequoia have internal modems
installed that can be accessed remotely using cell phone technology. Given sufficient motivation -- anyone could retrofit these devices into any punch card or optiscan reader --

From: VOTE FRAUD: WHAT THEY AREN'T TELLING YOU

"The missing link in the vote fraud investigation has been found. The November 1996 issue of Relevance Magazine reveals that two-way hidden modems are being built into the ever growing number of computerized optical scanner/direct recording voting machines in use all across the country from New England to California.

"How can tens of thousands of these independent voting machines in tens of thousands of separate locations possibly be manipulated without involving tens of thousands of people?....The bombshell from O'Halloran's article is that these hidden modems are accessible by remote cell phone technology. In other words, these voting machines can be accessed and manipulated from a central super computer without a phone line connected to the wall, and without the local precinct workers knowing that anything is happening at all.

"According to Dr. O'Halloran, "Of course, when the same company that writes the source code, also designs the internal modem, the possibilities are endless for accessing the computer either before, during or after the election to alter, or at least interrogate the computer's vote count. It raises the specter of a remote high-speed, vote rigging computer automatically and surreptitiously contacting, querying and rapidly adjusting the votes inside many precincts and/or central counting machines nationwide."

<http://www.newswithviews.com/Devvy/kidd72.htm >

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Higans Donating Member (819 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-24-04 04:52 PM
Response to Reply #20
22. Excelent point!
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JohnOneillsMemory Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-24-04 05:31 PM
Response to Reply #20
24. Heck, Boeing just flew a plane by remote satellite from 1500 km away.
Edited on Fri Dec-24-04 05:38 PM by JohnOneillsMemory
And this ain't even close to rocket science. When you look at the players in the BBV industry, the history of election fraud, and what's at stake in this election, you realize how easy this all is by wireless remote control.
http://www.spacedaily.com/news/uav-04zzzp.html
As linguistic expert Noam Chomsky might say, "Well, DUH!"
------------------------------------------------
(This is a fascinating history of the forces behind election fraud that range from Depression-era corrupt businessmen to Cold Warriors to theocratic billionares. They've spent 70 years preventing democracy in the USA for the profits of conquest and the glory of...themselves.

I don't think this is being handed out in orientation packets for 19 year-old army recruits on their way to Iraq for an 'up-armored'...Fallujan Freedom Frenzy. But it damn sure ought to be in high schools and colleges. Give it to the teens in your life.

Sources are down at the bottom, pun intended.-JOM)
--------------------------------------------------
Vote Rigging: how organised criminals have stolen U.S. democracy
Saturday, February 28, 2004 - 06:18 PM

Hi-Tech computer voting is now the order-of-the-day in America. In
October 2002, the US Administration passed the Help America Vote Act
(HAVA) which authorised the funding of $4 billion for states to use the
Direct Recording Election system (DRE) equipment which would have to
meet certain standards (set by the Act ) by the year 2006, at which
point, they (the states) will be under obligation to have purchased
said new equipment. As of December 2003, 36 states have agreed to these
obligations. <1> Note that in DRE, votes are stored electronically,
and, as such , therefore under proprietary ownership of the equipment
companies: the voter is therefore denied access!

As always, the above needs to be seen within an historical context if
it is to be properly assessed, and the following facts, at first
glance, may seem to be of little pertinence to the opening paragraph -
but, hopefully, this will be clarified by the further facts that follow.

In 1933, in answer to the economic Depression that prevailed then, FDR
set up the Business Advisory Council (BAC) - a cabal of prestigious
corporate capitalists who would subsequently become a crucial adjunct
to the US Department of Commerce. This depression lasted throughout the
‘30’s into the very early ‘40’s as evidenced by queues of jobless,
among whom it soon became common knowledge that there was no need to
apply at certain companies if you were either a Jew or Irish.

In 1961, JFK was elected president by a very small majority and
appointed Republicans to all his cabinet posts -but that of Secretary
of State. Not long after, as noted by G. William Domhoff in his book
‘The Powers That Be’: the BAC had “...made a unilateral withdrawal from
its quasi governmental status in 1962”, and dropping the term
‘Advisory’ from its title, it would from now on be known as ‘The
Business Council’ (BC). The reason for this break in relations was that
JFK’s Secretary of Commerce, Luther H. Hodges, had demanded a more
open-style Council, the chairman of which, Ralph Cordinger (of General
Electric), had become involved in a gigantic price-fixing scandal in
the electrical equipment industry. As a result, the Council declared it
would become an ‘independent organisation’ which would offer its advice
to all agencies of government. Domhoff added “Despite the fact that the
Business Council was no longer an official advisory group to the
Department of Commerce, it continued the prominent role it had
developed during the Eisenhower administration, supplying
businesspeople for government positions and meeting regularly in Hot
Springs with government officials. It was especially close to the
Johnson administration.”<2> The BC was not pleased with JFK.

(The following events of JFK’s presidency will, of necessity, heavily
rely on Mark Lane’s book, ‘Plausible Denial’ - inasmuch as it is the
most comprehensive published coverage of the assassination - to say
nothing of the attendant cover-ups. After all, Lane was personally
involved in much of the legal activity in this affair, and had much
access to documents)

But before going further, it is important to note that JFK had
inherited another brewing problem: namely, the Cuban revolution of 1959
had led to the expulsion from that island of the American Mafia, who
were soon co-opted by the CIA in the latter’s secretive plans to
‘remove’ Castro. A dangerous precedent was hereby set in motion.

In April 1961, the CIA-led ‘Bay of Pigs’ operation against Cuba failed,
and, as Col. L. Fletcher Prouty confirms to Mark Lane, JFK decided to
dismantle the CIA by initially firing top officers Allen Dulles
(Director), Cabell (deputy Director - whose brother was Mayor of
Dallas), and Bissell (Director for Plans). Prouty added that “..The
task of breaking up the CIA was scheduled for 1964, after the foreseen
Kennedy re-election”. (NB: From ‘55 to ‘63, Prouty had held the
following key positions: chief of special operations in (a) the Joint
Chiefs of Staff; (b) the Office of the Secretary of Defense; and (c)
The US Air Force.) <3>

In the aftermath of the Bay of Pigs fiasco, JFK set up the Cuban study
group to determine the future of the CIA (Dulles was part of that
group!). This resulted in the three National Security Action Memoranda
(NSAM) 55, 56, & 57 aimed at drastically curbing any future CIA
activities. This turned out to be a somewhat futile gesture on
Kennedy’s part - the illegal activities of the CIA continued. <4>

Soon after being elected, and on the advice of his administration
(mainly Republicans, as noted above), he had authorised a 12-fold
increase in US troops to be sent to Vietnam - to the satisfaction of
the Military-Industrial complex. It did not take him long to realise
his mistake. In 1963, now determined to withdraw the 16,000 American
troops from Vietnam, JFK sent Gen. Maxwell Taylor and Sec. of Defense
Robert McNamara to Vietnam to ‘prepare’ a report known as the Trip
Report (already drawn up by Maj. Gen. Victor Krulak & Col. Prouty)
recommending such withdrawal. (Understandable, when it is recalled
that, as Senator, he (JFK) had visited Vietnam in 1951 and written the
following complaint in his book “Strategy of Peace” (p.89): “In
Indo-China we have allied ourselves to the desperate effort of a French
régime to hang on to the remnants of empire.There is no broad general
support of the native Vietnam government among the people of that
area.”)

Now, this Trip report was duly signed and delivered to the president.
Result? The very crucial NSAM 263 of 2nd October 1963 which called for
the immediate removal of 1000 ‘military advisers’ and a timetable for
the withdrawal of all remaining troops. According to Col. Prouty: “The
Pentagon was outraged. JFK was a curseword in the corridors”. On the
10th of November 1963, Prouty was posted to the South Pole by Maj. Gen.
Edward G. Lansdale, CIA liaison to McNamara. He was therefore not in
Dallas when JFK was assassinated on November the 22nd. <5>

The dissimulative manner in which the investigation of the
assassination was conducted by the police, the FBI, the Warren
Commission, and the conniving media - all accompanied by numerous
contradictory statements - naturally aroused suspicion in the eyes of
many, including witnesses to the assassination. Now, suspicion, in the
absence of rational facts, prompts assumptions, one of which is a very
common-sensical one: namely, in view of the facts above, it was now
self-evident that JFK’s relationship with the CIA and the
Military-Industrial Complex (as was Eisenhower’s wont to call it) was
of such an inimical nature that he was now regarded as a threat to the
latter’s strategy of global domination - and would therefore have to be
killed sooner rather than later - preferably before the coming
election. Indeed, in 1979, the House Select committee on Assassinations
concluded that JFK was assassinated ‘as a result of a conspiracy’. As
for the consequences of such an act - the Establishment’s
economic/political clout was such that they were confident of their
ability to cope with them. They wasted no time - with not a little help
from the new president, LBJ, who had had little love for JFK. Now, it
was becoming increasingly necessary to cover the whole matter with a
veil of secrecy, with much assistance from the corporate-owned media -
but more crucially, subsequent elections would have to be better
‘controlled’ in order to ensure that the JFK débacle would not be
repeated. The new hi-tech computerised machines would later prove
essential to this aim.

Secrecy was of paramount importance to this project, and the first step
taken to ensure this was the unpublicised setting up, in August 1964,
of the News Election Service (NES), a consortium of the three major
television networks: ABC, NBC and CBS (CNN was to join later), plus the
Associated Press wire service, the New York Times, the Washington Post
and other news-gathering organizations, their job being to compile
computer-voting results at election time and feed them to the major
media. That this veil of secrecy was later lifted (but only to a
certain extent), was due to the investigatory work of two brothers, Jim
and Ken Collier - entrepreneurs - who wrote a book ‘Votescam:The
Stealing of America’ which exposed in comprehensive detail how votes at
elections were being manipulated from now on. But it must be hastily
added that the major book chains banned publication of the book (though
it is now available on the internet. <6>). The Colliers knew what they
were writing about: Ken had run for Congress in Florida in 1970.

It goes without saying that, in order to gain a clearer understanding
of any subject matter, it is helpful to view it from an historical
perspective - and so it is with the matter of voting methodology. It
should come as no surprise to learn that the paper-balloting system was
first adopted by Australia in 1856: after all, this was in effect a
symbolic gesture on the part of the many British/Irish who had
previously been expelled from their homelands to a strange land
thousands of miles away, there to serve their prison sentences on
criminal charges! These (now) Aussies were merely giving Britain a
2-finger salute: “Up yours, you Pommies!”. The Pommies got-the-message
and subsequently adopted this method of voting - which they still
follow to this day. (In America, as of 1996, only 1.7% of registered
voters used this system!).

The subsequent evolution in voting methods, from the mechanical lever
machine of 1892; through the punchcard, as used in the 1964
‘primaries’; to the marksense optical scan; to the latest Direct
Recording Electronic (DRE) system (see opening para. above) - all
reveal one significant, indisputable fact: namely, voting methodology
has become not only increasingly complex , but, more importantly, more
vulnerable to being manipulated illegally. This is not to say that the
simple paper ballot cannot be rigged (after all, a vote can be ‘bought’
in more than one way) - but it is verifiable - whereas the subsequent
methods (particularly the more recent ones such as the DRE) are not
verifiable, because of the legally-held proprietary rights of the
machine owners. In simple terms - the voter has no access to the
vote-count!

One of the earlier punch-card voting devices used was the
Harris-designed IBM Votomatic. “The punch card machine was first used
officially in 1965 in Fulton and DeKalb Counties, Georgia. .. problems
often occur with the ballot when it is put through the reading machine.
Although punch card machines are extremely fallible”, they were widely
used <7> “After several years, IBM realized that the Votomatic voting
machine... was actually a Pandora's box...and IBM eventually sold its
rights in the company after IBM's president, Thomas Watson, read an
article that implied he might be trying to install IBM voting machines
in enough precincts to win him the first electronically rigged election
for President of the United States”.... “With voting machines attached
to telephone lines it was possible to meddle with the actual vote from
a telephone miles away. Getting caught was not possible. ‘Deniability’
and ‘untrackability’ were built into the secret source codes that
animated the machines.”.... “Most Americans did not realize that such
an anti-democratic virus had infected their vote. Most do not realize
it today.” <8>

Spurred by reports and rumours of earlier cases of vote-rigging in Dade
county (when, in a referendum held in1959, the 27 municipalities had
lost their autonomous powers to an outside, elitist group, the Metro)
the Collier brothers decided that one of them, Ken, would run for
Congress against the sitting Democrat congressman, Claude Pepper, in
the 1970 election in Dade County, Florida. Pepper won in what the
brothers soon realised had been a manipulated, rigged vote involving
county officers, police, FBI, and judiciary! They were shocked, but
determined - and their subsequent years of detailed, thorough
investigation only confirmed their earlier fears. Vote-rigging was
alive and well in America - to say nothing of corruption in the higher
reaches of the Justice System in Washington!

One episode covering the Collier’s investigation in the aftermath of
the 1970 election is pertinently fascinating: again, they had learned
from earlier rumours/reports (see above) that the 1,648 mechanical
lever vote machines used in their election were probably stored at the
Opa-Locka airport hangar (Jim had learned to fly there)., and the
brothers were determined to see them - and learn from them. They
obtained a court order and went to said hangar - to find the machines
there. Producing their court order, and indicating one of the machines
stored there, Ken asked the man in charge “How can you rig this
thing?”. The man, assuming that their presence had been authorised,
explained that there were 2 simple ways: either by putting decals over
the counter, or by predeterming the counter reading “by shaving the
plastic wheel inside so that it slips ahead 100 or 200 or 300 votes.
Any good mechanic can do it with a razor blade.” And he gave them a
shaved ‘predetermining’ counter to keep. <9> They now had another item
of evidence in hand - and there were many more to come! (These
machines, made by Automatic Voting Machine Co. of New York were
evidently not as efficient as the later more complex computer machines
that were to follow).

As unearthed by the Collier bros. from the Library of Congress: in
1980, a study was commissioned by the CIA-linked Air Command and Staff
College in cooperation with the University of New Mexico to examine the
US electoral system. This important, candid study was subsequently
distributed to selected government agencies. Following are brief quotes
from same (NB: underlining is this author’s): "The United States
government has no elections office and does not attempt to administer
congressional elections.”...“The responsibility for the administration
of elections and certification of winners in the United States national
election rests with a consortium of private entities, including 111,000
members of the national League of Women Voters.”...“In the case of
counting actual ballots on national election night, public officials
have abdicated responsibility of aggregation of election night vote
totals to a private organization, News Election Service of New York
(NES)”..“ This private organization performs without a contract:
without supervision by public officials. It makes decisions concerning
its duties according to its own criteria.”...“The question and
accountability of News Election Service has not arisen in the nation's
press because the responsibility NES now has in counting the nation's
votes was assumed gradually over a lengthy period without ever being
evaluated as an item on the public agenda.” <10>

In 1990, due to a merger, NES became Voter Research & Surveys (VRS),
which, in turn, in 1993, became Voter News Service (VNS), which,
because of its exposed vote-rigging activities, was disbanded in early
2003 - to be replaced by the National Election Pool (NEP), a consortium
of ABC, AP, CBS, CNN, Fox, and NBC, “to provide tabulated vote counts
and exit poll surveys for the 2004 major presidential primaries and the
November general election. These six major news organizations, in a
joint decision, have appointed Edison Media Research and Mitofsky
International as the sole provider of exit polls for the most important
political races of 2004. The AP (group) will tally the vote”. <11>..A
case of many differing titles - but basically all the same consortium!
- perhaps best exemplified by the facts that the president of Mitovsky
International, Warren Mitofsky had been (a) executive director of the
CBS News election and survey unit from 1967 to 1990; (b) started and
directed Voter Research & Surveys from 1990 to 1993,”; and (c) had
started the CBS News/New York Times Poll in 1975 and directed it for
CBS for its first 15 years.” (He had even “conducted the only exit
polls for the Russian presidential elections in 1996 and 2000”; polled
for the 1993 and 1999 Duma elections; and in 1994, “conducted
the only exit poll and quick count for the Mexican presidential
election”). <12>

The following examples of vote-rigging of a high profile nature should
serve to illustrate the endemic corruption in the system:

(A) In 1988, ex-CIA Director George Bush snr. was elected President. As
is well-known, the New Hampshire primary is a crucial forerunner for
any presidential candidate. Senator Robert Dole was the clear favorite
for theRepublicans - but Bush snr. won unexpectedly. How come? The
Governor of New Hampshire was one John Sununu, a computer engineer, and
the computer voting machine being used was a ‘Shouptronic’ Direct
Recording Electronic (DRE) voting machine, supplied by Ransom Shoup,
who “had been twice convicted ofvote fraud in Philadelphia.”.. “It
completely lacked an ‘audit trail,’ an independent record that could be
checked in case the machine ‘broke down’ or its results were
challenged.”... “A source close to Gov. Sununu insists that Sununu knew
from his perspective as a politician, and his expertise as a computer
engineer, that the Shouptronic was prime for tampering. The concept is
clear, simple and it works. Computerized voting gives the power of
selection, without fear of discovery, to whomever controls the
computer.” On becoming president, Bush appointed Sununu Chief of Staff
in his administration. <13>

(B) Chuck Hagel was CEO of American Information Systems (AIS), a
computer voting machine company, until 1995, when he resigned in order
to run for the Senate in Nebraska in 1996. He unexpectedly won and thus
became the first Republican to do so in 26 years! AIS counted the
votes. In 1999 AIS merged with Electronic Systems & Software (ES&S). In
the following 2002 election, Hagel retained his seat, this time by a
landslide (83%). ES&S counted the votes!

AIS had been founded by brothers Bob and Todd Urosevich, in turn funded
by the Howard F. Ahmanson Co. - who therefore still have a stake in
what is now ES&S. (Howard Ahmanson belongs to the Council for National
Policy, a hard right wing organization, and also helps finance The
Chalcedon Institute, a fundamentalist religious group). The parent
company of ES&S, in turn, was McCarthy & Co., founded in the ‘90’s by
Michael McCarthy who subsequently acted as campaign director to Hagel
in his two elections - and is now Chuck Hagel's treasurer. Further,
Hagel had been president of McCarthy & Company, but resigned following
his election in ‘96 - but remains a major investor in the company!. It
is of pertinence to note here that ES&S also has a connection to the
Bush family. Jeb Bush's first choice as running mate in 1998 was Sandra
Mortham who was a paid lobbyist for ES&S and received a commission for
every county that bought its touch-screen machines. <14>

(C) Jeffrey W. Dean was the senior vice president and a director of
Global Election Systems in 2000 and 2001. He had been released from
prison in August 1995 after having served a sentence for theft in the
first degree. “Defendants thefts occurred over a two-&-a-half year
period.” While in prison, he had become friends with John Elder, who
had subsequently been released in November 1996 after doing 5 years for
cocaine trafficking. After release, Dean and his wife became owners of
Spectrum Printing & Mailing (the funding for this remains a mystery) -
and in 2000 sold this firm to Global Election Systems (GES) for $1.6
million - as a result of which, Dean served as Snr. Vice-President and
director of GES (noted above). In January 2002, GES was bought out by
one of the larger computer-voting companies, Diebold Election System,
who, in 2001, had contracted to build voting machines for GES. Dean was
retained as consultant for Diebold.

On 4th February 2002, John Elder (see above) was made general manager
of the Printed Products branch of Diebold. Weldon O’Dell, CEO of
Diebold, had donated over $200,000 to the Republican Party in the 2000
and 2002 campaigns - but is better known for his recent letter in which
he promised to deliver Ohio’s votes to George W. Bush in 2004! <15>

(D) Database Technologies (DBT Online) was founded by Hank Asher, and
was a company involved in the George Bush jnr. election fraud. The
group once had a data management contract with the FBI. However, this
was terminated following allegations that Asher was associated with
Bahamian drug dealers. In 1998, the state of Florida signed a $4
million contract with (DBT Online), which later merged into
ChoicePoint, for the purposes of providing a central voter file listing
those barred from voting. (As of 2002, Florida is the only state which
hires a private firm for these purposes).. The state Florida contracted
with DBT in November 1998, following the controversial Miami mayoral
race of 1997. The 1998 contracting process involved no bidding and was
worth $2,317,800!

On 17th April 2000, at a special Congressional hearing in Atlanta,
ChoicePoint Vice-President James Lee testified that Florida had ordered
DBT to add to the list voters who matched 80% of an ineligible voter's
name, and on February 16, 2001, DBT Senior Vice-President George Bruder
testified before the US Civil Rights Commission that the company had
misinformed the Florida Supervisors of Elections regarding the usage of
race in compiling the list.

ChoicePoint Vice President Martin Fagan admitted that at least 8,000
names were incorrectly listed in this fashion when, the company was
passed on a list given by the state of Texas, these 8,000 names were
removed prior to the election.He described the error as a "minor
glitch". He is also quoted as saying “"Given the outcome of our work in
Florida and with a new president in place, we think our services will
expand across the country." In January 2000, Pennsylvania terminated
its contract with ChoicePoint after alleging that the firm had
illegally sold citizens' personal information. In 2002, ChoicePoint
generated earnings of $200 million on revenue of $791 million. The
company employs 3,500 people at 52 locations within 26 states. <16>

(E) According to Mark Lewellen-Biddle of Purdue university, “the three
largest voting machine companies in America are Election Systems and
Software, Sequoia and Diebold”, Sequoia being the second largest “with
roughly one third of the voting machine market. In 1999, the Justice
Department filed federal charges against Sequoia alleging that
employees paid out more than $8 million in bribes. In 2001, election
officials in Pinellas County, Florida, cancelled a $15.5 million
contract for voting equipment after discovering that Phil Foster, a
Sequoia executive, faced indictment in Louisiana for money laundering
and corruption.” <17> And for good measure, Alex Lefebvre added that
Sequoia is largely controlled by the British cash-printing firm De La
Rue, whose parent , “private equity firm Madison Dearborn, is a partner
of the Carlyle Group, the investment firm that employs the current
president’s father, former president George Herbert Walker Bush.” <18>

The above examples are by no means comprehensive , but they are surely
adequate enough to illustrate that the criminal element could only have
permeated the electoral process - and for so many years - with, at the
very least, the connivance of the higher echelons within the political
structure of the country. Which brings us back to the Help America Vote
Act of 2002 (a duplicitous misnomer, if there ever was one!), and its
effect on the coming presidential election this year - to say nothing
of its effect on the crucially important ‘primaries’ very soon. Of one
thing we can be sure: the votes will once again be rigged, as
illustrated above, and confirmed as promised by Weldon O’Dell of
Diebold above - unless the American enfranchised public wake up very
quickly and take the matter into their own hands. There is little sign
of this so far.

The very concept of democracy is at stake.


ENDNOTES
<1> http://www.wsws.org/articles/2003/dec2003/vote-d24.shtml.
<2> www.thirdworldtraveler.com/Ruling_Elites/Policy_Formation_TPTB.html
<3> “Plausible Denial” by Mark Lane 1992 Plexus Publishing ltd. (p. 98)
<4> Ibid (pp 99,100)
<5> Ibid (pp102,103)
<6> http://www.votescam.com/orderbook.html
<7> http://nairobi.mwc.edu/~rdean8it/HIST200R/types.html.
<8> “Votescam: The Stealing of America” by James & Kenneth Collier 2000
Vistoria House Press (pp18,19)
<9> Ibid. (pp84-88)
<10> Ibid. (pp22,23)
<11> http://www.exit-poll.net/pool.html..
<12>
http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/election/
2001844416_exitpolls27.html.
<13> op.cit.”Votescam” (pp13-16)
<14> http://www.globalresearch.ca/articles/INF307A.html.
<15> http://www.scoop.co.nz/mason/stories/HL0312/S00191.htm.
<16> http://en2.wikipedia.org/wiki/ChoicePoint.
<17> http://www.inthesetimes.com/comments.php?id=490_0_1_0_C
<18> http://www.wsws.org/articles/2003/dec2003/vote-d24.shtml.


This is on http://www.bilderberg.org/wwiii.htm


Vote Rigging: how organised criminals have stolen U.S. democracy |

| postnuke | spc.org | bilderberg.org | infowars.com |
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Higans Donating Member (819 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-24-04 11:20 PM
Response to Reply #24
29. thanks for all that info.
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Ladyhawk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-24-04 04:08 PM
Response to Original message
18. Notice Warren County is one of them. Interesting... n/t
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IndyOp Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-24-04 04:13 PM
Response to Original message
19. Both Arnebeck's suit and at least one Green recount observer have
indicated that there was ballot-box stuffing. So - the story would go - on election night Triad altered vote counts in the central tabulators and/or remotely in the punch card readers in some counties (which had internal modems that could be accessed remotely) and, then, prior to the recount they added and removed the necessary number of ballots for the precincts to be recounted in which they had cheated.

In 85 out of 88 counties the precinct to be recounted was not determined randomly -- Blackwell determined in advance the precints to be recounted in most counties.

At least one Green recount observer (I think more than one) said that even though the BOE person had said that the punch cards were in order as placed there by the voters there were long runs of votes for one candidate and stacks of cards that were tidy-didy (i.e. appeared to have been machine-punched, not touched by human voter hands). Recount reports at <http://www.votecobb.org>

Any recount hope lies in a full hand recount - of all precincts in all counties - ASAP - hopefully they won't have been able to stuff all of the precincts they screwed with. They have had well over a month now --

:grr:

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Ice4Clark Donating Member (466 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-24-04 04:58 PM
Response to Original message
23. Why would text files for the following counties be housed on
TRIAD's server?

Ashtabula, Brown, Clinton, Darke, Greene, Loraine, Madison, Preble, and Union

Are these counties significant in some way?

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&lr=&c2coff=1&as_qdr=all&q=.txt+site%3A66.241.236.181
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IndyOp Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-24-04 07:49 PM
Response to Reply #23
27. All 9 counties are cited in Arnebeck's lawsuit to overturn
the election results. According to the suit Repubs stole votes from Dem Ohio Supreme Court Cheif Justice candidate C. Ellen Connally in Ashtabula and Loraine; Repubs stole votes from John Kerry in Brown, Clinton, Darke, Greene, Madison, Preble, and Union.

:kick:


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Ice4Clark Donating Member (466 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-24-04 11:26 PM
Response to Reply #27
30. Thanks for the reply. Just can't figure out why they still have
those text files on their server. Are they that stupid? Would they have something to do with the "cheat sheet" thing? Why else leave them up especially if Arnebeck has those very counties named in his lawsuit?
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Higans Donating Member (819 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-25-04 03:22 PM
Response to Original message
31. Kick for peace
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malatesta1137 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-25-04 03:39 PM
Response to Original message
32. Where's John Kerry?
nt
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Higans Donating Member (819 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-25-04 04:12 PM
Response to Reply #32
33. John Kerry is with us.
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malatesta1137 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-25-04 04:54 PM
Response to Reply #33
34. next time
give me something more substantial than an Internet rumor posted by a blogger no one knows.
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Higans Donating Member (819 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-25-04 05:42 PM
Response to Reply #34
36. Next time Wake up and realize that the MSM Lies to you.
Edited on Sat Dec-25-04 05:43 PM by Higans
TheY Keep Yelling Scott Peterson at you. (Hou did that turn out by the way? Convicted and sentenced to death baised on circumstantial evidence? you don't say?)

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Chimpanzee Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-25-04 05:44 PM
Response to Reply #36
37. I remember this malatesta1137 character.
Every post I've ever seen by this person is negative. Kind of make you go hmmmmmmm....
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malatesta1137 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-26-04 05:12 AM
Response to Reply #37
42. is pointing reality to you
'negative'? if so chimp, it makes ME go hmmmmmm
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Chimpanzee Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-27-04 02:42 PM
Response to Reply #42
46. No, freeper. But being an asshole is.
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Higans Donating Member (819 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-27-04 02:55 PM
Response to Reply #46
47. Could you two take your argument elseware?
Please take it off my topic. go be jerks in a message no one cares about thank you.

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Chimpanzee Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-28-04 09:54 AM
Response to Reply #47
48. Sorry, I was not at my best last night - the stress finally got me
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Higans Donating Member (819 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-25-04 06:16 PM
Response to Reply #34
38. You want somthing more substantial Here:
The Words from JK Himself:

http://blog.johnkerry.com/blog/archives/003805.html

We've got your Back JK.
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malatesta1137 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-26-04 05:18 AM
Response to Reply #38
43. 'great' words from John Kerry indeed:
"Earlier today, I spoke to President Bush, and I offered him and Laura our congratulations on their victory."

Please.
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Higans Donating Member (819 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-26-04 11:36 PM
Response to Reply #43
45. Strategic.
if he didn't conceed, MSM would be all over him. Strategic.
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Higans Donating Member (819 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-25-04 06:54 PM
Response to Original message
39. The hackers themselves say it's to easy to manipulate the vote.
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Higans Donating Member (819 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-25-04 10:01 PM
Response to Original message
41. the people know the jig is up!
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Higans Donating Member (819 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-26-04 11:23 PM
Response to Original message
44. A kick For Peace
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lonestarnot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-28-04 09:56 AM
Response to Original message
49. Fucking pitchfork isn't proactive! But it cleans up!
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Higans Donating Member (819 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-29-04 12:54 AM
Response to Original message
50. A kick for sanity!
Edited on Wed Dec-29-04 01:05 AM by Higans
What we really need to do now to save the humans is stop killing each other and help each other. To you realize how devistating the Earth can be all by it self! we really nnneed to stop killing each other NOW! and start helpig eachother!!!!!!!!! Please stop the war ad help each other!

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Higans Donating Member (819 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-30-04 06:56 PM
Response to Original message
51. Kick this Because we need to take our country back from hackers
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