When you electronic vote,....

[Riding this Donkey]

does it somehow give you a way to write in a candidate on a secret ballot.

I mean why should you have to go and ask the person running the table for a special ballot if you want to write someone in. Seems to me that at the very least, they will know who you are and that you want to write in a candidate.

Is it a persons right to be able to write someone in????

If it is a law that we have to be able to write someone in, and if you can't do that on a computer, is computer voting discriminatory of someone choosing to write in???

I am not a lawyer, but I have often wondered this and have thought it may be a way around the courts in outlawing voting by computer.

I know you have a right to have your ballot secret, but do you have a right to have a choice to write someone in secretly.

Any help on this would be great.

[meganmonkey]

1. When I voted on a touch-screen it allowed write-ins

on the machine. This was in 1996 - the place where I voted had touch screens back then and you could choose WRITE IN and then a keyboard-like screen came up for me to type out the name. (I have a habit of writing in my mother's name for various offices when there is no decent person running. One year I had this fear that she was going to be put on the library board - there were 2 openings and one person running! :P )

[Riding this Donkey]

4. when the results came out,

did they post your mothers name in the results as receiving a vote?

[meganmonkey]

5. that's a good question...

I was pretty unaware of a lot of things then, so I never would have even thought of looking.

Actually, in my mind at the time, I imagined that her name would just kind of disappear into this machine, never to be seen again! Kinda funny and sad at how true that could be!

[rigel99]

2. you've hit the nail on the head...

this is why in Georgia we are requesting and being denied access to the Diebold CD created to capture the full electronics of a Georgia county voting.... the problem is we have to access how the ballots are defined and when/if the write-in candidate field is available or not.. in most my races I voted in, the write-in was not exposed... this is a very big problem. I'm glad you started this thread.... good work....

www.countpaperballots.com if you want more info.... I'm working with attorneys now and like most things we have to find legal precedent in election code.. I'll take time tonite to read my election code specific to writein candidates.... and get back to you.....

[Riding this Donkey]

3. Will be waiting with baited breath to hear from you again! n/t

[rigel99]

6. OK, I"m bored... so here goes...

Georgia Election code..

21-2-358 Write-in votes.

In elections, electors shall be permitted to cast write-in votes, but no write-in votes may be cast in a run-off primary or run-off election. The design of the ballot card shall permit the managers, in counting the write-in votes, to determine readily whether an elector has cast any write-in vote not authorized by law. The Secretary of State, in specifying the form of the ballot, and the State Election Board, in promulgating rules and regulations respsecting the conduct of elections, shall provide for ballot secrecy in connetion with write-in votes.

*** ok, now this is juicy, your timing is perfect. I do need a lawyer's help and thank heavens meeting with one tomorrow. the 'not authorized by law' part is interesting. I like that they say the Sec. of State must provide for ballot secrecy and this section allows all races to have write-in votes. so, my job is to start requesting the write-in votes for each race from the counties... i'll post back if I'm able to get those.. I do have cobb county's so I'll read thru that.. give me some time I have to run errands....

You have helped me enormously simply posing the question, cause I did not know how I was going to ask a judge for the ballot setup.... here is why we need to see it.... to make sure writeins are allowed for all races.... wow... thanks!

[Riding this Donkey]

7. That's great! But now, I have to somehow

find out what the law is in other states and if they allowed voting on a computerized voting maching.

Anyelse willing to look into their state for the law.

Any others in other states with computerized voting notice if you were allowed to write in a candidate on the screen.

If you have the info, give the state, type of voting machine (if known)

I think there may be something here!

[rigel99]

10. Here is COBB County Diebold WRITE-IN Report

here is the link to a writein report from Diebold... the interesting part is cause some folks put Cobb and others put David Cobb Green, no one ever really tallies how many votes Cobb got, as you'll see in Cobb county, David Cobb got a ton of votes...
http://www.cobbelections.org/results/pdf/nov02-04/nov02-04TSWriteIns.pdf

here is a sample of the presidential write-ins...
10 President Polling 10 Kemp 03 1760 604529 5 Kemp 03 1760 ABSTAIN
Polling 10 Roswell 01 2560 438713 2 Roswell 01 2560 AL GORE
Polling 10 East Piedmont 01 1490 193251 1 East Piedmont 01 1490 AL NADER
Polling 10 Mars Hill 02 2170 247751 0 Mars Hill 02 2170 AL SHARPTON
Polling 10 Kemp 02 1750 464196 6 Kemp 02 1750 ALAN KEYES
Polling 10 Addison 01 1030 447707 5 Addison 01 1030 ALAN KEYES
Polling 10 Sweetwater 03 2850 20284 2 Sweetwater 03 2850 AMANDA SALYARDS
TS Absentee 30 AB Precinct 1 3040 666800 33 TS Absentee 3080 AP KELLY OF
BORDEN, INDIANA
Polling 10 Sewell Mill 01 2610 610307 2 Sewell Mill 01 2610 ARNOLD
SCHWARZENEGGAR
Polling 10 Smyrna 4A 2710 150710 7 Smyrna 4A 2710 BARRY JONES
Polling 10 Smyrna 5B 2740 497016 7 Smyrna 5B 2740 BILL CLINTON
Polling 10 Smyrna 5A 2730 153173 3 Smyrna 5A 2730 BILL CLINTON
Polling 10 Powder Springs 1A 2460 447925 3 Powder Springs 1A 2460 C. MONTGOMERY
BURNS
Polling 10 Kennesaw 2B 1680 649085 15 Kennesaw 2B 1680 C0BB
Polling 10 Fair Oaks 05 1550 649152 4 Fair Oaks 05 1550 C0NSTITUTION
PARTY CANIDATE
TS Absentee 30 AB Precinct 1 3040 43164 40 TS Absentee 3080 CCHWWALDROOP
Polling 10 Tritt 02 2950 509475 3 Tritt 02 2950 CHARLIE WARENDH
Polling 10 Smyrna 1A 2660 38693 4 Smyrna 1A 2660 COBB/ LAMARCHE
TS Absentee 30 AB Precinct 1 3040 711721 57 TS Absentee 3080 COLIN POWELL
Polling 10 Murdock 01 1940 196956 0 Murdock 01 1940 COLIN POWEL
Polling 10 Mt Bethel 04 2220 526622 10 Mt Bethel 04 2220 COLIN POWELL
Polling 10 Sope Creek 03 2810 615786 8 Sope Creek 03 2810 COLIN POWELL
TS Absentee 30 AB Precinct 1 3040 659530 1 TS Absentee 3080 COLIN POWELL
Polling 10 Kennesaw 2B 1680 177081 4 Kennesaw 2B 1680 COLIN POWELL
TS Absentee 30 AB Precinct 1 3040 70358 9 TS Absentee 3080 COLIN POWELLL
Polling 10 Smyrna 3A 2690 34301 10 Smyrna 3A 2690 CONDALISA RICE
Polling 10 Bryant 01 1160 124169 7 Bryant 01 1160 DANIEL CUYLER
TS Absentee 30 AB Precinct 1 3040 368688 1 TS Absentee 3080 DAVE BARRY
Polling 10 Kennesaw 5B 1720 71250 11 Kennesaw 5B 1720 DAVID BYRNE
Polling 10 Kennesaw 3A 1690 284231 1 Kennesaw 3A 1690 DAVID BYRNE
Polling 10 Due West 01 1390 662060 2 Due West 01 1390 DAVID C. BYRNE
Polling 10 Acworth 1A 1000 646980 13 Acworth 1A 1000 DAVID C0BB
Polling 10 Marietta 6A 2120 7323 5 Marietta 6A 2120 DAVID COBB
Polling 10 Bullard 01 1180 656360 2 Bullard 01 1180 DAVID COBB
Polling 10 Dowell 01 1350 419927 0 Dowell 01 1350 DAVID COBB
Polling 10 Paces Mill 01 2400 701066 4 Paces Mill 01 2400 DAVID COBB
General Election
Cobb County
November 2, 2004
Nov 8, 2004
9: 12: 44AM
Page: 2 AccuVote- TS Write- In Report Id Id Id Race Report Unit Counter Group Write- In Id Vote Center Mach Ballot SN
Polling 10 Smyrna 5B 2740 480831 5 Smyrna 5B 2740 DAVID COBB
Polling 10 Bullard 01 1180 33710 4 Bullard 01 1180 DAVID COBB
Polling 10 Fair Oaks 01 1510 671530 15 Fair Oaks 01 1510 DAVID COBB
Polling 10 Terrell Mill 01 2900 165440 1 Terrell Mill 01 2900 DAVID COBB
TS Absentee 30 AB Precinct 1 3040 554407 3 TS Absentee 3080 DAVID COBB
Polling 10 Kemp 01 1740 225904 5 Kemp 01 1740 DAVID COBB
TS Absentee 30 AB Precinct 1 3040 129930 37 TS Absentee 3080 DAVID COBB
Polling 10 Bells Ferry 03 1080 217802 19 Bells Ferry 03 1080 DAVID COBB
TS Absentee 30 AB Precinct 1 3040 376034 51 TS Absentee 3080 DAVID COBB
Polling 10 Marietta 4D 2080 62867 0 Marietta 4D 2080 DAVID COBB
Polling 10 Kennesaw 2B 1680 573335 14 Kennesaw 2B 1680 DAVID COBB
Polling 10 Cheatham Hill 02 1240 635902 2 Cheatham Hill 02 1240 DAVID COBB
Polling 10 Mableton 04 1890 169963 3 Mableton 04 1890 DAVID COBB
Polling 10 Harmony- Leland 01 1620 351776 10 Harmony- Leland 01 1620 DAVID COBB GREEN
PARTY
Polling 10 Roswell 02 2570 109019 6 Roswell 02 2570 DAVID COBB -
PRESIDENT
PATRICIA LAMARCHE
- VICE PRESIDENT
Polling 10 Sewell Mill 03 2630 478683 12 Sewell Mill 03 2630 DAVID COBB- GREEN
PARTY
Polling 10 Sweetwater 01 2830 602822 6 Sweetwater 01 2830 DAVID COBB,
PRESIDENT
Polling 10 Elizabeth 05 1470 330114 5 Elizabeth 05 1470 DAVID COBB/ PAT
LAMARCHE
Polling 10 Mt Bethel 03 2210 219917 10 Mt Bethel 03 2210 DAVID HANSON
BOEYE
Polling 10 Mars Hill 02 2170 625210 2 Mars Hill 02 2170 DAVID MCLEMORE
Polling 10 Gritters 01 1610 213982 7 Gritters 01 1610 DAVID MEVIS
Polling 10 Smyrna 3A 2690 129481 0 Smyrna 3A 2690 DAVID R JOHNSON
Polling 10 Oregon 02 2300 2977 4 Oregon 02 2300 DAVIE COBB -
PRESIDENT PAT
LAMARCHE -VICE
PRESIDENT GREEN
PARTY
Polling 10 Norton Park 02 2260 277603 5 Norton Park 02 2260 DENNIS KENNIICH
Polling 10 Norton Park 02 2260 216065 6 Norton Park 02 2260 DENNIS KUCINICH
Polling 10 Oregon 04 2320 317739 0 Oregon 04 2320 DERREN BURSE
Polling 10 Acworth 1C 1020 162200 9 Acworth 1C 1020 DIONNE WOODS

** AS you can see folks have terrible spelling "KENNIICH" and I even spotted more than I should have spotted of Mike Vick (our Falcons quarterback) indicating perhaps Americans take this voting as a joke, I don't know but thought 535 pages of write-in candidates with things like Mickey Mouse, etc. was a good sign folks are fedup with politicians....

[Bill Bored]

8. Write-ins, GA, Rigel, etc.

I like this idea of scamming the scammers with these write-ins in GA and elsewhere. Can't we just see what the vote totals show without all this auditing, records requests, etc? If 10 people wrote in "Bill Bored" or "Bill Board" or whatever, and we know this to be true, why not just check the election results published on the county or statewide totals, and see if these votes are there or not?

In Ohio, Cobb used this argument when he only got 24 votes but knew for a fact that more people than that had voted for him.

So my question is: Why is it taking so long to prove counting fraud in GA? I'm not criticizing anybody's work, I'm just curious.

For this technique to work, it has to be done before the powers that be catch on to it. Otherwise, they might just count all the "write-ins' correctly and hack the rest of the votes. So what's going on? Do they not publish the write-in totals?

[rigel99]

9. I AGREE let's speed it up...

I want to speed things up you have no idea... the problem is that so far it's been MY MONEY (to the tune of thousands and I lost my job so being unemployed adds to the problem of stress), I have 6 county packets so think they are bigger than a large Fedex envelope filled to the brim, and the DRE tapes are long and unwieldy... the answer to your question are 2 fold:

1. I dont understand the diebold tape monikers enough to know what I"m counting, examples: ballots cast vs. cards cast, is the diff. in these 2 numbers the novote/undervotes or just plain machine malfunction?
I don't understand the 2 fields public counter and system counter and why there are sometimes 10,000 off in the counting? I don't get the absentee handwritten sheets and where those number match the diebold accumulation totals (and if they don't match, which I've found, why?)
2. I don't understand the stupid/complicated process enough to compare absentees with provisional totals with the DRE accumulation totals.
that's why my strategy as you'll see on my website is to put ALL THE DATA online and let the DU world help me count it as well as have an audit party of citizens with calculators.. but I still have to get the info. on how it works and Douglasville is letting me go in and meet with a diebold tech to ask these questions so it's happneing only slower than I like.. tomorrow I meet the lawyer, I'm in parallel trying to fundraise and then also, I spoke 1.5 hours to Lynn Landis cause she's a maven of this industry and had of course a lot to update me on....

write-ins is a good idea, but I'm not sure that's enough to get a Judge in a lower court to give access to the CD which is my #1 goal. I think I have to find the 'flaws' and use that to get the CD. I do have some flaws already, but don't want to share them and by no means think it's enough for a judge to grant access... that's why I spend till 2 am reading stupid DRE tapes and reports, etc... if anyone can explain all this I'd be very very very grateful...

and then there's legal strategy like picking the right judge which I think I've done and hoping a lawyer works your case honestly and efficiently..... I don't mean to pry, billbored, but what can you add to this process that I'm missing? Cause I'm working fulltime on this and don't seem to have an army of people willing to help... if you know the magic solution, let me know, otherwise I'm putting stuff online and posting like crazy... that's all I know how to do....

[Bill Bored]

11. Actually, I thought write-ins were you idea

in a post you made a while back.

As to your question, here's a page with links to some Diebold manuals and GEMS s/w:
<http://www.equalccw.com/dieboldtestnotes.html>

If you go to this one:
<http://freespeech.metacolo.com/pimaupgrade.zip>
it's a 54-Meg zip file that contains the s/w and an Accuvote TS Users Guide PDF which has some stuff about audit logs and a glossary.
I haven't had time to read it all yet, however Ballots Cast and Votes Cast seem to be what you describe yet they are not called that in the reports. I don't see a definition for Cards Cast. But this is probably the voter card you get from poll worker. Then there's your ballot and your actual vote. Make sense?

See what your tech contact says and read the manual when you get a chance. Hope you're not using dial-up though!

[rigel99]

12. Billbored...

i love you man,
this is exactly what I"ve been looking for..

you're the best..
the writeins was the idea of the person starting this thread....

I have other angles that might be even more punitive to go after, but the write ins is a good back pocket legal angle to have prepared for court....