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MelissaB Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-26-05 09:56 PM
Original message
Americans Speak Out on Election Fraud 2004

Saturday 26th February 2005 (17h04) :

Americans Speak Out on Election Fraud 2004





Here are some other things you must also believe if you believe that Duh-bya won the election:

1- That the exit polls were WRONG.

2- That Zogby’s 5pm election day calls for Kerry winning OH and FL were WRONG. He was exactly RIGHT in his 2000 final poll.

3- That Harris’ last minute polling for Kerry was WRONG. He was exactly RIGHT in his 2000 final poll.

4- That the Incumbent Rule (that undecideds break for the challenger) was WRONG.

5- That the 50% Rule was WRONG (that an incumbent doesn’t do better than his final polling)

6- That the Approval Rating Rule was WRONG (that an incumbent with less than 50% approval will most likely lose the election)

7- That Greg Palast was WRONG when he said that even before the election, 1 million votes were stolen from Kerry. He was the ONLY reporter to break the fact that 90,000 Florida blacks were disenfranchised in 2000.

8- That it was just a COINCIDENCE that the exit polls were CORRECT where there WAS a PAPER TRAIL and INCORRECT (+5% for Bush) where there was NO PAPER TRAIL.

9- That the surge in new young voters had NO positive effect for Kerry.

10- That Bush BEAT 99-1 mathematical odds in winning the election.

11- That Kerry did WORSE than Gore against an opponent who LOST the support of SCORES of Republican newspapers who were for Bush in 2000.

12- That Bush did better than an 18 national poll average which showed him tied with Kerry at 47. In other words, Bush got 80% of the undecided vote to end up with a 51-48 majority - when ALL professional pollsters agree that the undecided vote ALWAYS goes to the challenger.

13- That voting machines made by Republicans with no paper trail and with no software publication, which have been proven by thousands of computer scientists to be vulnerable in scores of ways, were NOT tampered with in this election.

14. That people who voted for Bush were not anxious to speak to exit pollsters in the states that Bush had to win (like Florida and Ohio) where the exit polls were off, but wanted to be polled in states that he had sewn up (like Arizona, Louisiana and Arkansas) where the exit polls were exactly correct.

15. That Democrats who voted for Kerry were very anxious to be exit-polled, especially in Florida and Ohio (and that this is what accounts for the discrepancy between the exit polls and the actual votes in these two critical states).

16. That women were much more likely to be polled early in the day in Florida and Ohio. That is another reason why the exit polls were wrong in those states. In those states in which the exit polls were correct to within one percent, women did not come out early.

17. That network newscasters who claim that those who consider the possibility of fraud are just wild conspiracy theorists do not have an agenda.

18. That it is just a coincidence that only since the 2000 presidential election have exit polls failed to agree with the actual vote - and that Bush won both disputed elections.

19. That exit polls are not to be trusted in the United States, even though they are used throughout the world to monitor elections for fraud.

20. That even though more votes were cast than there were eligible voters in many precincts of critical states, it is not an issue that needs to be covered in the media.

21. That the absence of a paper ballot trail for touch screen computers does not encourage fraud, even though they have been proven by hundreds of computer experts to be highly vulnerable to fraudulent attack.

22. That statistical tests which indicate a high probability of fraud are just conspiratorial junk science.

23. That Bush’s vote tallies could exceed his exit poll percentage in FL by 4%. Based on 2846 individuals exit polled, the polling margin of error was 1.84%. The odds of this occurrence: 1 out of 1667.

24. That his vote tallies could exceed his exit poll percentage in OH by 3%. Based on 1963 individuals exit polled, the polling margin of error was 2.21%. The odds of this occurrence: 1 out of 333.

25. That his vote tallies could exceed his exit poll percentages in 41 out of 51 states. The odds of this occurrence: 1 out of 135,000.

26. That his vote tallies could exceed the margin of error in 16 states. Not one state vote tally exceeded the MOE for Kerry. The odds of this occurrence: 1 out of 13.5 Trillion.

27. That his vote tallies could exceed a 2% exit poll margin of error in 23 states. The probability of this occurrence: as close to ZERO as you can get.

28. That of 88 documented touch screen incidents, 86 voters would see their vote for Kerry come up Bush - and only TWO from Bush to Kerry. The probability of this occurrence: as close to ZERO as you can get.

29. That Mitofsky (who ran the exit polls), with 25 years of experience, has lost his exit polling touch.

30. That by disputing the Ukrainian elections, the Bush administration would base its case on the accuracy of U.S. sponsored exit polling, while at the same time ignoring exit polls in the U.S. presidential election, which the media reported Kerry was winning handily.

31. That Bush could overcome Kerry’s 50.8% - 48.2% lead in the National Exit Poll Sub-sample (13,047 polled) and win the popular vote: 51.2% - 48.4%, a 3.0% increase from the exit poll to the vote tally, far beyond the 0.86% margin of error. The odds of this occurrence: 1 out of 282 Billion.


>>>snip

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

If anyone believes beyond any doubt that Bush won the election hands-down, they should have no problem with the election being fully investigated and having all votes re-counted every which way.

Anyone who attempts to stand in the way of this happening has something to hide (Ken Blackwell, this means you ... get a good lawyer.)


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

>>>snip

“It is the duty of the patriot to protect his country from the government.
Thomas Paine

“A President is impeachable if he attempts to subvert the Constitution”.
— President James Madison

“If ever time should come, when vain and aspiring men shall possess the highest seats in government, our country will stand in need of its experienced patriots to prevent its ruin.”
Samuel Adams

“This country, with its institutions, belongs to the people who inhabit it. Whenever they shall grow weary of the existing government, they can exercise their constitutional right of amending it, or exercise their revolutionary right to overthrow it.”
President Abraham Lincoln

“Patriotism means to stand by the country. It does not mean to stand by the President.”
President Theodore Roosevelt

“The ultimate measure of a man is not where he stands in moments of comfort, and convenience, but where he stands at times of challenge and controversy.”
Dr. Martin Luther King


Much more here:
http://bellaciao.org/en/article.php3?id_article=5384

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Maine-i-acs Donating Member (989 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-26-05 10:32 PM
Response to Original message
1. That was my quote in the middle there!
"If anyone believes beyond any doubt that Bush won the election hands-down, they should have no problem with the election being fully investigated and having all votes re-counted every which way.

Anyone who attempts to stand in the way of this happening has something to hide (Ken Blackwell, this means you ... get a good lawyer.) "



That thread is a great read! I was glad to post into the fray.
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MelissaB Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-27-05 09:36 AM
Response to Reply #1
6. Congratulations, Maine-i-acs!
You are famous! :hi:
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omega minimo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-26-05 10:35 PM
Response to Original message
2. Bout bloody time
How can Bush "spread" democracy if we don't have it here?
What kind of democracy is it that Americans think they don't have to EMBODY?
What are the Democrats in Congress afraid of? :nuke:

Gods bless Barbara Boxer.

As I write this, Dylan is singing:
"They say patriotism is the last refuge
To which a scoundrel clings
Steal a little and they throw you in jail
Steal a lot and they make you a king"
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Independent_Liberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-26-05 10:39 PM
Response to Original message
3. Well said...
>>>snip

“It is the duty of the patriot to protect his country from the government.
Thomas Paine

“A President is impeachable if he attempts to subvert the Constitution”.
— President James Madison

“If ever time should come, when vain and aspiring men shall possess the highest seats in government, our country will stand in need of its experienced patriots to prevent its ruin.”
Samuel Adams

“This country, with its institutions, belongs to the people who inhabit it. Whenever they shall grow weary of the existing government, they can exercise their constitutional right of amending it, or exercise their revolutionary right to overthrow it.”
President Abraham Lincoln

“Patriotism means to stand by the country. It does not mean to stand by the President.”
President Theodore Roosevelt

“The ultimate measure of a man is not where he stands in moments of comfort, and convenience, but where he stands at times of challenge and controversy.”
Dr. Martin Luther King

>
>
>

AND DON'T YOU FORGET IT!
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Patchuli Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-27-05 12:13 AM
Response to Original message
4. We here in Sacramento agree!!!!
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MelissaB Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-27-05 09:35 AM
Response to Reply #4
5. Thank you for posting
these. I hadn't seen them.
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Patchuli Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-27-05 06:27 PM
Response to Reply #5
13. You are welcome
and I'm in that picture too. I'm not telling you which person because
I hate the pic :eyes: but I think I got my point across that day! LOL
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omega minimo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-27-05 03:10 PM
Response to Reply #4
10. What are Sacramentans doing NOW to speak out and organize
Edited on Sun Feb-27-05 03:13 PM by omega minimo
against the fraudulent election?

Any other communities/groups active on this?

Oh, let's "reframe" it pre-emptively:

:kick: Turning Sour Grapes to Wine.

edit: ohwait! That'll become "Turning Sour Grapes to Whine."

Howzabout: WHINE LOUDER!

:smoke:
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Patchuli Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-27-05 06:24 PM
Response to Reply #10
12. We have quite a few groups
going in this area regarding impeachment, election reform, etc.

Remember though, we are fighting a Bush Wannabe too - The Governator
who considers people like me (school employee) and my sister (nurse)
to be 'special interests' while he accepts more special interest money (from car dealers) than any other governor in California history. Ahnie wants to raise the patient/nurse ratio so each nurse
is spread even thinner (and patients suffer!) and he wants to take
away the pension waiting at the end of a long and not very profitable
road to educating the next generation. He's truly an insufferable
ASS.

We got the double whammy!

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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-27-05 07:41 PM
Response to Reply #12
14. Yes, it's a full court press. Come and help in the CA forum! Need you!
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Patchuli Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-28-05 02:09 AM
Response to Reply #14
15. I will...nt
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Peace Patriot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-27-05 12:31 PM
Response to Original message
7. The case against the Bush win is even stronger than these points say:
#9: "That the surge in new young voters had NO positive effect for Kerry."

The Democrats had a blowout success in new voter registration--57% Dem vs. 41% Repub. Did all those people register Democratic to vote for Bush? Did their family, friends and co-workers--all the people urging them to register and vote for the first time--go to the polls to vote for Bush, or forget to vote themselves? Not possible.

Nearly all Nader voters jumped to Kerry (80+%). And when you add these numbers up--the newly registered DEMOCRATS, the Nader voters, and the repeat voters from Gore 2000--you get a 4 to 8 million vote margin for Kerry that just somehow disappeared on election day. (--2nd report by Dr. Steven Freeman)

And when you add in the pre-election opinion polls on Bush, the post-election opinion polls on Bush and on his policies (such as the Iraq war), Bush's approval rating sinking to 48% (!) on his Inauguration Day (!), and ALL OTHER INDICATORS (for instance, the large, spontaneous crowds for K/E vs. the dismal, vetted, Borg-like, pre-packaged crowds for Bush), Bush's idiot performance in the debates, the LACK OF EVIDENCE of any big rightwing church effort or any big B/C voter reg success (the reasons given by B/C and the lapdog press for their "winning"), what you end up with is an unsolvable puzzle..

...unless you know who was "counting" the votes behind their secret "Wizard of Oz" curtain.

-----

#14: "That people who voted for Bush were not anxious to speak to exit pollsters in the states that Bush had to win (like Florida and Ohio) where the exit polls were off, but wanted to be polled in states that he had sewn up (like Arizona, Louisiana and Arkansas) where the exit polls were exactly correct."

The new UScountvotes report--written by 9 Ph.D.s--says that, not only does the data NOT support this screwy Bush Cartel "talking point" (that Republicans were shy of the pollsters), the data SHOWS JUST THE OPPOSITE, that the exit polls were actually SKEWED TO BUSH, and that this means that Kerry's margin WAS EVEN BIGGER than the Exit Poll 3%.

-----

#22: "That statistical tests which indicate a high probability of fraud are just conspiratorial junk science."

Junk science? These experts from leading universities say otherwise:

Dr. Steven Freeman: Professor, Center for Organizational Dynamics, Univ. of Penn.; Karel Steuer Chair for entrepreneurship, Univ. de San Andreas, Buenos Aires; Professor of Management, Central Amer. Inst. of Business Administration (INCAE),
http://www.appliedresearch.us/sf/epdiscrep.htm
"The Unexplained Exit Poll Discrepancy," and "Hypotheses for Explaining the Exit Poll-Official Count Discrepancy in the 2004 US Presidential Election"
http://www.inthesetimes.com/site/main/article/1970

Dr. Ron Baiman: Economist/Statistician - senior research specialist, Institute of Government and Public Affairs at the University of Illinois at Chicago; teaches at the University of Chicago.
http://www.freepress.org/departments/display/19/2004/997
Baiman: "I conclude that, based on the best exit sample data currently available, neither the national popular vote, or many of the certified state election results, are credible and should not be regarded as a true reflection of the intent of national electorate, or of many state voters, until a complete and thorough investigation…."

Dr. Webb Mealy: http://www.selftest.net/redshift.htm (Bush vote skewed to the Electoral Votes that were needed to win.)

Nine Ph.D's from leading universities call for investigation of 2004 Election:
http://uscountvotes.org/ucvAnalysis/US/USCountVotes_Re_Mitofsky-Edison.pdf

Josh Mitteldorf, Ph.D. - Temple University Statistics Department
Steven F. Freeman, PhD - Center for Organizational Dynamics, University of Pennsylvania
Brian Joiner, PhD - Prof. of Statistics and Director of Statistical Consulting (ret), University of Wisconsin
Frank Stenger, PhD in mathematics - School of Computing, University of Utah
Richard G. Sheehan, PhD - Department of Finance, University of Notre Dame
Elizabeth Liddle, MA - (UK) PhD candidate at the University of Nottingham
Paul F. Velleman, Ph.D. - Department of Statistical Sciences, Cornell University
Victoria Lovegren, Ph.D. - Department of Mathematics, Case Western Reserve University
Campbell B. Read, Ph.D., Professor Emeritus, Department of Statistical Science, Southern Methodist University
Kathy Dopp, MS in mathematics - USCountVotes, President
Also Peer Reviewed by USCountVotes’ core group of statisticians and independent reviewers.

Florida: 130,000 to 230,000 phantom votes for Bush--paper vs. electronic voting--call for investigation:
http://ucdata.berkeley.edu
Report issued by Dr. Michael Haut, & UC Berkeley Quantitative Methods Research Team; Haut is a nationally-known expert on statistical methods and member of the National Academy of Sciences and the UC Berkeley Survey Research Center
Press release: http://www.commondreams.org/news2004/1118-14.htm

In addition:

TV networks alteration of the Exit Polls to fit the "official tally" (& Zogby prediction of Kerry win):
http://www.exitpollz.org/

Johns Hopkins report on insecurity of electronic voting: http://www.scoop.co.nz/mason/stories/HL0307/S00196.htm#5

Easy demo of how insecure voting machines are:
http://www.chuckherrin.com/hackthevote.htm

"Myth Breakers: Facts About Electronic Elections" (2nd edition): www.votersunite.org

57,000 machine malfunction/vote suppression complaints to Congress:
http://www.votersunite.org/article.asp?id=3961

Greg Palast (reporter, investigator): "Kerry won – just count the votes at the back of the bus!"
http://www.tompaine.com/articles/kerry_won.php

Jonathan Simon (statistician/investigator):
http://www.scoop.co.nz/mason/stories/HL0411/S00142.htm

Democratic Underground (ignatzmouse):
(North Carolina: absentee ballot vs. electronic, inexplicable 9% edge to Bush in electronic:)
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=203x45003
(also at:) http://www.dailykos.com/story/2004/11/12/233831/06

Democratic Underground (TruthIsAll): "To believe Bush won, you have to believe…"

Part 1
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=132&topic_id=1316010

Part 2
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=132&topic_id=1358806

Part 3
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=203x197878

Democratic Underground (TruthIsAll): The Time Zone Discrepancy
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=203x318693

In progress compilations of various articles and materials on 2004 Election Fraud:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=203x311105

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=203&topic_id=304579





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MelissaB Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-27-05 01:01 PM
Response to Reply #7
8. Peace Patriot, you amaze me!
You must be one of the most organized people I know (on the internets). Thank you! :yourock:
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omega minimo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-27-05 02:58 PM
Response to Reply #7
9. Then why is W in office?
WHERE is the OUTRAGE?





:boring: Did they put sleeping pills in the US water supply?
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ginnyinWI Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-27-05 03:53 PM
Response to Original message
11. it's a good summary
of the main problems with the election.

However, I most strenuously disagree with the assertion, toward the end of the link, that Kerry/Edwards were in any way involved in throwing the election to Bush! The site offers no "evidence" other than Kerry's failure to contest the election, which is not evidence, it's circumstantial. And I also do not agree that the corporate-owned media selected Kerry to run. I think they would have much preferred a weaker candidate, and one who might have given them more controversial news stories. As it was, Kerry and Edwards gave Bushco a real run for their money.
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ClintCooper2003 Donating Member (629 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-28-05 02:33 AM
Response to Original message
16. Yep, scary stuff indeed...
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