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Blue in the face Donating Member (210 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-18-04 10:13 AM
Original message
Freepers concerned with computer voting
As I was giving a Freeper on another message board that I post on a warm glass of shut the hell up, I found this:

"Foreign Ownership of U.S. Vote-Counting?
No serious discussion of the major vote-counting companies in this country would be complete without mention of Sequoia Pacific, based in Jamestown, New York. It is the supplier of both optical scanning and direct-record computer vote-counting equipment and goes head-to-head with BRC in several regions of the country. To give some idea of its importance in the industry, the firm was recently awarded the mammoth New York City contract for its direct-record machines. Relevance has learned that Sequoia Pacific is owned by Jefferson Smurfit Group, p.l.c., a massive transnational conglomerate which is the largest paper-based packaging company in the world, with over 8 billion dollars per year in revenue. Jefferson Smurfit has 43,000 employees in 23 countries, including a strong presence in the U.S., which is headquartered in St. Louis. What we found most interesting is that, according to its 1995 annual report, Jefferson Smurfit is an Irish firm based in Dublin and it boasts many "heavy hitters" on its board, including Albert Reynolds, the former Prime Minister of Ireland, Ray MacSharry, a former member of the European Commission and the European Parliament; Eoin Ryan, a former Irish Senator and member of the board of the Central Bank of Ireland; a number of top Irish or European banking and air line officials, and Dr. T.A. Reynolds, Jr., a member of the board of Gannett News Services, one of the largest newspaper chains in America. This might owe in part to the fact that Jefferson Smurfit is the number four supplier of newsprint in the United States.

We asked Penelope Bonsall of the Federal Elections Commission's Office of Election Administration in Washington whether her office had concerns about foreign control of U.S. vote-counting. Without casting aspersions on the integrity of this highly-respected firm, we questioned the propriety of such an arrangement and its implications. With so many reports of industrial espionage being perpetrated by our allies in Japan, Israel and France, to name a few, we wondered if it was wise to have a foreign firm, with unknown safeguards against criminal or foreign intelligence penetration of its computer source-code, counting the U.S. vote. She responded: "I suppose that anything is theoretically possible but the likelihood of that happening is virtually impossible. The structure of our electoral process in this country does not lend itself to this." She was equally unconcerned about another foreign-owned company which is eyeing the U.S. vote-counting market-Computer Devices Canada.

This type of glib, yet unreassuring, response to serious questions seems to be the standard among defenders of the current computer voting system. Their trump card remains the argument that there is no evidence that there is a serious problem. Which brings us to the closest thing to a smoking gun yet to appear in the electronic voting controversy.

The "Machine Politics" of Computer Voting
On election night 1995 in an affluent New Orleans suburb, a few hours after the polls had closed, Republican Susan Bernecker, a popular first-time challenger for Jefferson Parish Council, was nowhere to be found in the reported election returns. "The night of the election the numbers came in for everybody but me for an hour and a half. When my numbers didn't come in everyone in my party went wild." Later, despite major popular support for her grassroots insurgency against the Jefferson Parish machine, she went down to defeat by a 22% to 58% margin. In a recent phone interview, Bernecker told Relevance "In all of the 54 precincts the percentages were in the same one third/two third range-even in ones that I didn't get out and pound the pavement." She cites another female candidate in the Orleans Parish who got 33% of the vote in every precinct. Bernecker noted that the candidate also contested her election, but the technical expert she hired wasn't allowed to examine the machines. She states that the two parishes were the only ones in the state that used Sequoia Pacific's direct-record computers.

...."



http://www.freerepublic.com/forum/a370cfb281136.htm

So the Freepers figured out if you can't beat em, take em over and know that your Democratic opponents won't say shit because they were doing it too?

I love the comments from the Freepers at the bottom of the page. Are these the same people who are now calling us internet conspiracy theorists?:

"In summation: Computerized voting + national vote fraud + foreign control of vote counting + foreign campaign contributions = President Bill Clinton

The worst president in U.S. history wasn't even elected.

Posted by: jedediah smith (emailname) *
04/08/99 11:53:28 PDT

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
To: jedediah smith
Last Novembers elections, I was watching the local news and they were talking to the official local county elections officer in charge. They were asking her what all they do on election day, etct.
So, the elections official is giving a play by play of how her morning went, and she says that everything went fine, except, they had a false fire-alarm in the building (real early, when not too many people were there) where everyone had to leave the building for about 15 minutes.

Nothing more mentioned or thought of about this inccident. But, that night, for the first time, in like 50-60 years, a Democrat WON the election. According to local news, a moderate Democrat, beat out an extreme Conservative.
From: jungleboy (emailname) *
04/08/99 12:26:23 PDT


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
To: jedediah smith
Great Post, Jedediah.
This is why "getting out and voting Republican" will not work, no matter how hard we try.
From: Clarence () *
04/08/99 13:22:01 PDT


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
To: NDCORUP
From page 12 of the article, here's a typical vote counting machine with an internal modem.



The caption reads:

"Although there are no telltale phone handsets on the outside, many vote-counting machines like this one contain internal modems. We were told the modem is protected against outside access from hackers by protective software-which we cannot view because it is a trade secret. What is the protection against inside access by the handful of companies which are enjoying ever increasing control over the election process?"

1 Posted on 02/07/2000 07:29:04 PST by jedediah smith
< Reply | Private Reply | Top | Last >


To: jedediah smith
The Republicans had better do something about this because the Democrats will not stop at ANYTHING to win.

3 Posted on 02/07/2000 08:11:51 PST by Cowgirl
< Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | Top | Last >



To: Cowgirl
The Republicans had better do something about this because the Democrats will not stop at ANYTHING to win.

You might want to start thinking in terms of Nationalists v. Globalists. It will make the actions of the Republican leadership easier to swallow.

5 Posted on 02/07/2000 14:17:48 PST by Askel5
< Reply | Private Reply | To 3 | Top | Last >
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ewagner Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-18-04 10:18 AM
Response to Original message
1. From psychology 101
Displacement.........
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LiberalAndProud Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-18-04 10:20 AM
Response to Original message
2. This is NOT a partisan issue. This is an American issue.
An election should never be decided on the basis of who cheats best. The majority of Republicans will be on our side in this fight.
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TalkingDog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-18-04 10:35 AM
Response to Original message
3. new meme: democrats cheat at e-voting
That'll get their asses off the couch.

Convincing them with logic will obviously do no good. They work best when responding to implanted fears.

If you want voting reform get the whole country on it's feet. 1/2 with reasoned logic, the other by prodding the reptilian parts of their brain. (which seem to have considerable control)
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buddysmellgood Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-18-04 10:44 AM
Response to Original message
4.  a warm glass of shut the hell up
That is mother beautiful. Thanks for that.
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crispini Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-18-04 11:07 AM
Response to Original message
5. As they fucking SHOULD be
this is a nonpartisan issue. we're all lucky we're didn't elect President Bugs Bunny.

or maybe not. that might be better....
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bmoney07 Donating Member (304 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-18-04 12:14 PM
Response to Reply #5
7. Bugs Bunny
Bugs Bunny should ask Bush "Whats up Doc"
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KansDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-18-04 04:32 PM
Response to Reply #7
13. The fact that President Bunny would even ask "What's up Doc?"
demonstrates he is intellectually curious, something the Chimp seriously lacks...

And this would make Bugs the better President.
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progressoid Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-18-04 11:11 AM
Response to Original message
6. Those freepers are an interesting (and confused) lot

I can't wait to hear the rest of the repugs bitch about needing a verifiable voting system when the numbers start to change in our favor. Better yet I can't wait to get a real Attorney General that will convict some people.
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Ducks In A Row Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-18-04 01:19 PM
Response to Original message
8. so if the freepers help get rid of e-voting because their too stupid...
to realize it about getting rethugs into office, let them shoot themselves in the foot.

go for it freepers. get rid of e-voting. dare ya'



oh, and shut up ya' stupid freepers.








:)

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jhgatiss Donating Member (369 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-18-04 01:36 PM
Response to Original message
9. Did he just imply that...
Bill Clinton was the worst President in US history?

Do these people honestly believe that? Do they smoke crack?
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dbonds Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-18-04 01:56 PM
Response to Reply #9
10. Yes (they think that) and Yes
Edited on Thu Nov-18-04 01:56 PM by dbonds
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jhgatiss Donating Member (369 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-18-04 03:55 PM
Response to Reply #9
11. Well if we live long enough....
I think history will beg to differ!
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silverweb Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-18-04 04:25 PM
Response to Original message
12. Let the groundswell begin.
Start demanding it loudly and now:

(1) Simple paper ballots, securely guarded at all times.

(2) Hand counting, witnessed and videotaped the FIRST time, beginning immediately after the polls close.

(3) Certification for each polling place by representatives of all parties at the end of the first count.

(4) Absentee and provisional ballots undergoing simultaneous, witnessed and videotaped counting/certification at the Registrar's Office or some similar secure location for each district.

What could be simpler and more secure from tampering? Anyone objecting to this type of process would have to be suspect, because it favors no party or ideology -- only a clean, secure, true count. The process certainly couldn't be any more expensive and prolonged than the nonsense we're putting up with now!
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