Busy weekend for Derby hopefuls

[Justpat]

http://tcm.bloodhorse.com/viewstory.asp?id=37747


At Gulfstream, Nobiz Like Shobiz goes in the Fountain of Youth.
Also on the Gulfstream card is the Hutchison for three year olds
run at 7 1/2 on the dirt.

At Santa Anita, Great Hunter goes in the Robert B. Lewis stakes for
three year olds.

And at Turfway, the John Battaglia at 1 1/16.

I don't see where Street Sense is entered anywhere yet.

[two gun sid]

1. Street Sense works strongly en route to his 2007 debut

From DRF:
Street Sense has been pretty much out of sight and out of mind since unleashing that devastating stretch run in winning the Breeders' Cup Juvenile nearly four months ago. But the way he worked five furlongs at Palm Meadows training center on Tuesday, he should not be forgotten.

On the surface, Street Sense's time of 1:00.21 may not appear all that special. It was the manner in which the son of Street Cry did it that so impressed the handful of onlookers, including his trainer, Carl Nafzger.

With regular rider Calvin Borel aboard for the important work, Street Sense broke off in a little better than a two-minute lick from the six-furlong pole and was still going along at a relatively slow pace for the opening three furlongs with fractions of 12.43 seconds, 25.13, and 37.59. But reminiscent of his performance in the BC Juvenile, once leaving the quarter pole and turning into the stretch, Street Sense clearly had hit another gear, as he came flying through his final quarter in 22.62 while under only mild urging from Borel. He galloped out six furlongs in 1:11.07 (that's an additional eighth in 11.85) and seven-eighths to the middle of the turn in 1:25.45.

"He's been building up to this all winter, and this is why we brought Calvin down here this morning," said Nafzger. "I wanted him to finish up strong and that's exactly what he did. This work really moved us up a long way."

http://www.drf.com/news/article/82870.html

[Justpat]

2. That is a great work for Palm Meadows.

It is pretty deep. Only the really good horses work in decent time
over it.

[two gun sid]

3. I think the plan is to only give him two prep races...

before the Derby.

I am waiting for Stormello and Liquidity to race again. I really like the way Liquidity looks. Stormello is a nice horse but, he seems kind of one dimensional and I really think that compromises his chances at Churchill Downs come the first Saturday in May.

Buffalo Man is off the trail with bone chips.

Circular Quay is supposed to start again soon. I think in LA.

OT, but, I'm ready for the breeding and foaling season to start. I actually like this more than racing.

[Justpat]

10. Carl Nafzger knows how to get one ready.

I wouldn't worry about that horse's fitness. Carl is one of the best.


I've gotten so I like the breeding end of a lot better myself. I want
to get to where I can breed one that will sell for tons of money.

[two gun sid]

13. Mr. Nafzger is very good at what he does...

and he has more Derby wins than I do so I'd never second guess him. I see several of the Derby contenders are going with a 2 race schedule. I like the fact that a trainer will think outside the box and try new approaches. The breed has changed since the '70's and training methods need to change too. I'd like to see our equine heroes stick around for a full 3YO campaign and not get hurt.

I love breeding and I love the babies and I love to sit and read pedigrees on a cold winter night and dream of all the champions I'm gonna breed. Racing makes me nervous and I am a piss poor loser. Racing brings out all my bad qualities because I can be very competitive and sometimes petty. But, winning a race? Well, I'm a lot of fun to be around. I hate to admit that about myself.

[aaronbees]

4. I think if anyone can pull off a two-prep plan,

it's Nafzger. I trust him with this horse and think he's prepping him right even if against the odds; Street Sense had a good foundation last year so I'm less worried about the two-prep deal. Honestly the only others that look like Derby winners right now are Nobiz and Ravel. I'm a little worried about Nobiz's dillydallying down the lane, though I still think he can shape up to be a monster. This Saturday, it sounds like he's going up against Stormello and Drums of Thunder in the Fountain of Youth -- sweet race! Shame about Buffalo Man; he was kind of a shaping up to be a good sleeper pick.

Oh, and it looks like Discreet Cat's racing Thursday.

And thanks for the b-day wishes. I'll put some extra candles on my cake next week to celebrate 'ol John Henry too.

[jakefrep]

5. Discreet Cat, Thor's Echo to make seasonal debuts in Dubai

Thor's Echo will be the likely favorite in the G3 Marju Mahab Al Shimaal. Discreet Cat will take on Maktoum Challenge Round 1 winner Imperialista in the G3 Lahan Burj Nahaar.

More Dubai stuff here:

http://www.emiratesracing.com/era/index.cfm

and here:

http://blog.dubairacingclub.com/

[two gun sid]

6. There is some really good racing over in Dubai right now....

I will probably catch the race replays this weekend.

How's everything in OH, jakefrep? I'll bet you're pretty busy this time of year.

[jakefrep]

8. I would love to go to Dubai sometime...

...if the Middle East ever settles down (and the Maktoums don't get overthrown in the process).

We got some bad news from our trainer today - our 3yo Lindy Lane gelding suffered a tendon injury that will put him on the shelf indefinitely. Dad was pretty crestfallen when he heard from the trainer today. All 3 of our 2yo fillies are training well though - we have a Chip Chip Hooray that we're pretty high on.

[Justpat]

16. How early do standardbred's run as two year olds?

When are the first races carded?

Ours are getting less and less every year. It seems we don't
breed many early developers any more. Not much two year old
racing till the fall.

I have always wanted to have a quick two year old to win one
of those graded stakes for two year olds at Belmont in the summer.

[two gun sid]

17. Mistake

Let jakefrep answer your question as I think he can give some insight on the Grand Circuit. I've never had a horse that could race there.

[Justpat]

18. thanks.

You guys are my only source of info for the trotters.

[jakefrep]

19. The county fairs start in mid- to late June

And the raceways will card "baby races" at about the same time. More serious stake races start in early July.

[Justpat]

23. I have several friends who are exercize riders

who have gone to Dubai for six months at a time. They love it.
They said everyone treats them well. Most of them go back and
forth from Dubai to Belmont/Saratoga.

[two gun sid]

7. HRTV to Re-Air John Henry Special

From The Bloodhorse:
HorseRacing TV will re-air its original presentation of "John Henry: Standing Tall at 30" March 2 at 8 p.m. ET.

The re-airing of the one-hour documentary, which originally debuted in 2005, will coincide with the champion being honored the following day as the first horse to win the Santa Anita Handicap (gr. I) twice (1981, '82). The Big 'Cap, one of the sport's premier races for older horses, is being held at Santa Anita Saturday.

The show contains a number of vignettes on John Henry, who was twice Horse of the Year (1981 and 1984), as well as all 12 of his wins at Santa Anita. It also includes interviews with John Henry's former trainer, Ron McAnally, and two of his former jockeys, Laffit Pincay Jr. and the late Bill Shoemaker.

John Henry retired in 1985, earning more than $6.5 million and winning 39 from 83 starts. He captured 30 stakes races, 14 of which were grade I events, and was equally adept on either turf or dirt.

http://news.bloodhorse.com/viewstory.asp?id=37778

[two gun sid]

9. Lava Man draws the 7 hole for the Santa Anita Handicap...

Boboman gets 9lbs from Lava Man and draws post position 3.

[two gun sid]

14. Lava Man Red-Hot Choice for Big 'Cap Repeat

From The Bloodhorse:
Lava Man, the most prosperous claiming purchase in racing history, will be out to lay claim to another distinction on Saturday when the 6-year-old gelding will be an overwhelming favorite to win a second $1 million Santa Anita Handicap presented by San Manual Indian Bingo & Casino (gr. I).

If successful, the 4-5 morning line favorite among nine entrants in the 70th Big ’Cap would have something more in common with John Henry on the 25th anniversary of that rags-to-riches racing legend becoming the first repeat winner of the 1 1/4-mile event that began as the sport’s first “hundred-grander.”

By adding the winner’s share of $600,000, Lava Man’s earnings since being claimed for $50,000 by STD Racing Stable and Jason Wood at Del Mar in August of 2004 would become $4,581,103. His career total would reach $4,682,706 from 16 victories in 36 starts, 12 of the wins coming since being haltered by trainer Doug O’Neill.

The parallel to John Henry, whom Sam Rubin purchased sight unseen for $25,000 in 1978, is dramatic. While going on to earn $6,591,680 from 39 wins on both dirt and grass in 83 starts, the gelded son of Old Bob Bowers was retired at the age of 9. Lava Man, a winner of 7 of 8 starts and $2,770,000 last year, began his sixth year with a handy victory in Santa Anita’s Jan. 27 Sunshine Millions Turf.

http://racing.bloodhorse.com/viewstory.asp?id=37787

[jakefrep]

11. Thor's Echo 6th, Discreet Cat scratched in Dubai

Thor's Echo was sixth in his seasonal debut in Dubai today while spotting 7lb to the rest of the field. Discreet Cat was scratched from his race. Eu Tambem (Brz) won the final leg of the Maktoum Challenge series, a key prep for the 3/31 Dubai World Cup.

Results here:

http://www.emiratesracing.com/eq/Results.cfm?racefile_id=5701

[two gun sid]

12. Discreet Cat is gonna remain undefeated ....

why does his 'fever' not suprise me. Discreet Cat is not a racehorse, he's a stallion prospect.

[jakefrep]

15. Unfortunately, it will ever be thus....

...as long as breeding is a significantly more lucrative enterprise than racing. In the stratosphere Godolphin, et al play in, a bad race can cost millions in stud fees.

[Awsi Dooger]

21. Makes it a lot less interesting to me

I was reading an article in the DRF by Watchmaker, that many of the top Derby hopefuls would only have two preps at 3. It used to be I knew the intended paths of all the top 3-year-olds. Now I barely know the names and haven't seen many of them race. Hell, for the most part they don't race.

Maybe the idea is to be strapped for cash and do what Secretariat's owners were forced to do, syndicate and insure him before his first start as a 3-year-old. At least that allowed him to be run often and aggressively, even if you already knew he'd never make it to the track at four.

[jakefrep]

22. There was another article in DRF...

...earlier this week lamenting the decline of the Santa Anita Handicap and handicap racing in general. The track handicappers are having difficulty compiling a meaningful scale of weights due to the fact that horses don't race as frequently as they once did.

[Awsi Dooger]

24. I read that article also

It went back to 1982 and the Santa Anita Handicap with John Henry, looking at the weight assignments compared to now and recent. I was in college in LA at that time and attending the races. The writer listed some of the recent high weights and they astonished me. Sometimes no horse has carried more than 118 or 119.

[aaronbees]

20. Asiatic Boy won impressively....

with Day Pass looming for a while and then folding. That's a horse to keep an eye on.

[two gun sid]

25. Texcess and Oonagh Maccool retired

From Thoroughbred Times:

Texcess: http://www.thoroughbredtimes.com/racing-news/2007/March/01/Multiple-graded-stakes-placed-Texcess-retired.aspx

Oonagh MacCool: http://www.thoroughbredtimes.com/racing-news/2007/February/28/Grade-2-winner-Oonagh-Maccool-retired.aspx

Both are nice horses I have enjoyed watching race. Texcess was just a real classy old pro and Oonagh MacCool showed flashes of brilliance. Good luck to both of them.

[two gun sid]

26. Stormello Tests Gulfstream After Frantic Flight

From The Bloodhorse:
The trip from California to South Florida behind him, Alvin Eisman and Bill Currin's Stormello tried the Gulfstream Park main track Friday morning for the first time ahead of his challenge in Saturday’s $350,000 Fountain of Youth Stakes (gr. II).

The 3-year-old son of Stormy Atlantic galloped a little more than a mile in his first chance to stretch his legs since arriving late Wednesday night. His long trip to take on leading Kentucky Derby Presented by Yum! Brands (gr. I) contender Nobiz Like Shobiz began almost 18 hours earlier Wednesday morning in California with a frantically arranged flight.

“This was his first chance to see the track and his first time on the surface,” co-breeder and co-owner Currin, who also trains Stormello. “He needed to acclimate to the climate a little bit.”

While the trip was long, Currin downplayed any trouble with the flight arrangements and pointed to how well adjusted Stormello looked and acted. The 70-year-old horseman is traveling a familiar road after globe-trotting in 2003 with the talented 3-year-old Outta Here.

http://tcm.bloodhorse.com/viewstory.asp?id=37827

Yes, I'm touting this horse. I like him a lot. I don't think he is better than Nobiz or Street Sense but, I think he is pretty handy and could jump up and suprise some folks this year.

[two gun sid]

27. Come on, old man. Come on, old man!

9 YO Evening Attire splits horses in the stretch and draws off by 2 1/2 to win the Stymie Handicap. Final time of 1:49:59. Paid 19.60 9.60 4.50.

He looked great in the winners circle. What an old pro.

[aaronbees]

28. 3 minutes to post for the FOY!

Nobiz looks like a beast. I missed Evening Attire -- glad to hear that gallant old man won! Half Ours just ran a smokin' race in the Richter Breeders Cup and remains undefeated.

[aaronbees]

29. Scat Daddy by a nose ....

over Stormello. Nobiz a neck back in third. Thrilling race!

[two gun sid]

30. Hold all tickets, please...

wow, I hate to see my horse get gutted like that this time of the year. That was awfully hard on all 4 horses.

Scat Daddy, I had written him off. Nice win by him though, I give him credit.

Final time 1:49:11

[aaronbees]

31. I'd written off Scat Daddy too...

Good call by Currin to take Stormello east, eh? He's a gutsy horse. Nobiz ran a bit green again at the head of the stretch.

[Justpat]

32. Stormello ran game as hell.

That was a good performance and if he had a jock who could
ride in a forward manner without hitting the poor bastard in
the head for a sixteenth of a mile, Stormello might have won
by a nose.

It's hard to like Scat Daddy, but I can't take anything away from
that performance. He ran on through the stretch like a freight train.

[aaronbees]

36. Hard for me to root for Pletcher horses

but I have to hand it to him, he had a great day today (King of the Roxy ran great in the Hutcheson). I think Nobiz needs some blinkers -- is it he you think bled? Could be but he turns his head like that in every race .... he's still sort of a dingaling in some ways.

And I agree with you, Sid, I'd still like to be in Tagg's shoes.

Derby picture just got a whole lot more interesting!

[Justpat]

33. I'll bet he bled.

He had his head turned sideways a bit through the stretch.

[two gun sid]

35. OB, is that a tell-tale sign of bleeding?

[Justpat]

39. Usually just fading in the stretch -

but some horses will tilt their head like that if they are bleeding
or if they can't get their air. Maybe he was just tired.
We'll see what Barclay tells the press tomorrow.

[two gun sid]

40. Thank you....

I have always looked for a horse that just plain stopped. It makes sense that some horses would react differently and the amount of bleeding could affect how they react. I always learn something new here.

Hey, give Ty a scratch for me.

[two gun sid]

34. Nobiz will be alright I think....

he ran a good race and hopefully he got something out of this. I would still place him as a co-favorite with Street Sense for the Derby. He has tons of class.

Stormello has talent no doubt, but he needs to be able to lay-off the pace if he wants to win a race like the Derby. I liked the way he fought back in the stretch but, how much did it take out of him? I have the same question about Scat Daddy.

Of the top four finishers, I think I'd rather be in Barclay Tagg's shoes right now.

[aaronbees]

37. I wouldn't count Stormello out ....

He's got some mad heart, that guy; he just got a spot in my top five for sure. I wonder if he'll swing back west for the Santa Anita Derby .... hey, bring him to Arkansas, Currin! :o

[two gun sid]

41. Stormello is a nice one....

but, he has to be able to win those close races. He's lost a couple.

His running style makes him a hostage to his post position in very good company.

I still like the hell outta him. Just not as a Derby pick. Preakness, maybe, if he stays sound. I don't worry about his mental toughness.

I wish I could make the Rebel.

[Justpat]

43. Barclay said before the race that he didn't want to beat him up this time.

I know he is leaving something in the tank for next time. Funny Cide
got beat in the FOY too and then went on to win the Derby.

[Justpat]

58. He was only beaten a length.

[two gun sid]

59. Yep, and he wasn't pushed hard like the top two...

Nobiz is a very formidable Derby horse.

[two gun sid]

38. We are going a mile on the turf at Santa Anita....

in the Frank E. Kilroe Mile. I'm rootin' for Milk It Mick who is at 10-1. *NOTICE* I said rooting for not betting on.

[two gun sid]

42. Kip Deville wins it...

Final time 1:33.88. Milk It Mick fades in the stretch, but still, ran a nice race.

Bobby Frankel's Three Valleys was an also ran.

[aaronbees]

44. Kip Deville's a nice horse

and an Oklahoma bred to boot.

Robert B. Lewis Stakes up in about 20 minutes. I like Great Hunter and Boutros here.

[two gun sid]

47. I like Great Hunter, too.

[aaronbees]

49. Very impressive win....

He went wide a whole bunch of the race, too. Contender!

[two gun sid]

50. Holy shit, that was awesome...

he really is a quick sonuvagun.

[two gun sid]

60. "Take your gold watch and shove it!"

From the NYRA Aqueduct site:
Stymie himself would have been proud.

Nine-year-old Evening Attire, who had not won in seven starts since a neck victory in the Stuyvesant Handicap here in November of 2005, split horses in the lane and galloped on to a 2 ¼-length victory in Saturday’s 52nd running of the $72,605 Stymie Handicap for three-year-olds and up at nine furlongs on Aqueduct’s fast inner dirt track.

Like Hall of Famer Stymie, who started 131 times and had his most financially profitable season at age six when he won seven handicap races, including a defeat of Triple Crown winner Assault and Phalanx in the International Gold Cup at Belmont Park in 1947, Evening Attire proved that age means little if you have class.

This was the 13th victory of Evening Attire’s 53-race career, and often, he has been victimized by slow starts at the gate and by paceless races. Like Stymie, he is a stretch runner and needs a legitimate pace to be at his best.

http://www.nyra.com/aqueduct/stories/Stymie.html


It really tickles me that Evening Attire won this race. He was game yesterday and he looks great. There are still plenty of good races he can be competitive in and I hope his connections pick his spots well. No more Optional Claimers for this $2.5M lifetime winner.

Chalk one up for us old-timers.

[Justpat]

45. That bunch in the Battaglia at Turfway was not too thrilling.

I know they don't run very fast on poly-track, but it was very
slow time and the winner was the worst mover in the bunch. I can't
figure out this poly-track thing yet.

[two gun sid]

46. Shit, I missed it....

went to turn the chicken breasts on the grill and got side-tracked. Who won?

[Justpat]

48. Catman Running.

Joe Got Even - even money favorite second.
Cobrador third.

[Justpat]

51. Great Hunter wins Robert Lewis stake

Sam P second
Saint Paul third.


Went the 1 1/16th in 1:42 and change.

galloped away from the field galloping out.
Good effort by Sam P.



*%&#ing Stronach doesn't allow his signal to TVG so I had to
watch it on a tiny screen from the CA bred web site.

[aaronbees]

52. Is that calracing.com?

Great site ... I watch all my races online since I don't have TVG or HRTV so I check in there a lot.


Big Cap coming up in 10. Interested to see what Boboman does here. But I think it's all Lava Man.

[Justpat]

57. Yes, that's the site.

I signed up in two seconds and managed to see the stretch run of
the Robt. Lewis.

It was a pretty good picture as far as those little screens go.

[two gun sid]

53. It's Lava Man in the Big 'Cap

in 2:02.11. Slow first quater and half. :24.06 and :48.27.

Molengao 2nd Boboman finishes 3rd.

Hurray for Lava Man!

[aaronbees]

55. They were crawling at the start.

No one wanted the lead! You know, I hope they take him to Dubai and give it a go on traveling outside of Cali again.

[two gun sid]

56. I agree. Take him on the road....

he deserves another chance outside of Cali. Try him on the turf somewhere. Maybe Arlington Park in August for the Million.

That horse is a wonder. He deserves a lot more respect than he gets.

[aaronbees]

54. Lava Man wins the Santa Anita Handicap

He's such a pro. For all his faults, he sure is a fun horse to see win. Molengao second, Boboman third. Time was 2:02.11.

[two gun sid]

61. Who's the daddy of them all?

From The Guardian UK:
Ninety-five per cent of today's thoroughbreds can be traced back to Eclipse, the undefeated 18th-century champion whose astonishing story is matched only by that of the rogue who owned him. Nicholas Clee tells the tale of brothels and royalty, prison and portrait painting that surrounds the horse whose direct line includes Desert Orchid, Arkle and the past six Derby winners

Eclipse first, the rest nowhere: the most famous prediction in horse racing was made on 3 May 1769 at a betting post on Epsom Downs. Eclipse, who had just galloped to an easy victory in the first heat of the Noblemen and Gentlemen's Plate, was enjoying a rub down, and perhaps a tot of whisky, in preparation for heat two. Everyone knew that he was going to win again; the only angle for the punter lay in finding some more exotic bet. Dennis O'Kelly found it.

http://sport.guardian.co.uk/horseracing/osm/story/0,,2023483,00.html

[two gun sid]

62. Hey Handicappers, check out this new tool to help you...

from the Louisville Currier-Journal: http://www.courier-journal.com/cjsports/trackside/database/index.html

I have been looking up all my horses and getting dosages. Cool.

[aaronbees]

63. Cool link!

Now I'm even more confused. :P

Sid, I'm curious, do you still hold much stock in dosage when it comes to the Derby? I think more and more the old standards of what makes a Derby winner are going to be shattered in these upcoming years, but dosage is something I'm frankly not too knowledgeable about.


In other news, looks like Tagg will probably take Nobiz to the Wood and put blinkers on him (Source: http://www.drf.com/news/article/83012.html -- the whole thing is a good read). I like this move and am feeling a little more upbeat about Nobiz. Sort of wish he had one extra race to figure things out. Stormello may go to the Santa Anita or Florida derbies. (Rewatched his Hollywood Futurity last night and must say I'm now a fan, even if he gets beat on Derby day.)

[Awsi Dooger]

64. I agree, great link

Very handy with all the categories.

I still believe in dosage but obviously the dual qualifier theory has been pathetic in recent years. Still, it produced enough winners for me 10-20 years ago that I'll never complain.

The relevant questions were brought up in that DRF article last week, whether the old reliables like 2-year-old foundation, minimum of 3 starts at age 3, and a prep race reasonably close to Derby day are still valid, given all the top contenders who are increasingly willing to sidestep one or all of those criteria.

I would still be wary of a horse above 4.00 dosage, especially if lacking in stamina points.

[aaronbees]

66. Barbaro definitely challenged the status quo in some ways

With the Florida Derby win giving him five weeks to wait until the big Derby. And he barely had three starts last year before Kentucky. His Tropical Park Derby was Jan. 1. I think we could see more two-preps-before-the-Derby early 3-yr-old campaigns, trainers hoping to save a bit more for the whole Triple Crown. With Street Sense and Great Hunter this year, that could actually work (not with Ravel, I believe, unless he's a superfreak).

[two gun sid]

70. Yes. Dosage can help you throw some horses out....

but, it is a very, very small part of my handicapping. I'm no pro, though. I like to see class and racing style and race shapes and speed. I do like to know if a horse is bred to get the distance.

If I see a horse that can rate off the pace and is fast enough and classy enough and seems to make his own racing luck I wouldn't throw him out on dosage. I might bet bigger if his dosage was right.

Something I have always felt about the Derby is: With the size of the field, luck can play a big part.

When it's all said and done I like handicapping for the fun of it. I don't bet big and I just like to watch horses race. Some people watch baseball or football. I watch Thoroughbreds. If they had horse trading cards I would collect them.

[aaronbees]

65. Anyone wanna buy a horse?

Fasig-Tipton Two-Year-Old in Training sale workout videos: http://fasigtipton.sitespace.com/default.asp?p=1

I really like hip #298, a More Than Ready - Fortunate Card filly.

And #252, a Mineshaft - Coral Sea colt. (I'd name him Depth Charge.)

[Justpat]

67. What say we pool our money and get #299

The Macho Uno colt. I like him better than the other two.

Also, the #211 Vindication filly. nice mover. I didn't care for the
other Vindication colts.

[two gun sid]

71. OB, if I have the winning Mega Millions Lotto ticket in my pocket...

We'll buy both.

You have no idea how much I would enjoy that.

[Justpat]

73. OK!

You be the owner - we'll train it.

[aaronbees]

81. That Vindication filly is lovely and looks strong

No wonder she went for a million ... we'd need all of DU to raise that kinda cash ;)

[Justpat]

76. Results

http://www.fasigtipton.com/results/2007/results030607.asp

My Vindication filly went for a million.
There were a lot not sold. There are about twenty more to go through
the ring.

[two gun sid]

78. Keep a good thought. They draw the winning numbers for

Mega Millions at 1100pm.

[aaronbees]

83. Did ya win?

:D

[two gun sid]

87. Nope. Just as well. Demi O'Byrne bought my Strom Cat colt....

out from under me. That wee Irish bastard.

Actually he wasn't all that great looking but, he was out of a Mr. P mare and if OB could have gotten him a GI win as a 2YO I'd have syndicated him and then retired him. Home-Run Horse!

http://www.fasigtipton.com/catalogs/2007/0306/71.pdf

[Awsi Dooger]

84. I put Vindication's 2002 Breeders Cup Juvenile win on YouTube

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vitfKle0Dvk

All this talk about Vindication's offspring got me to look for the race on YouTube. I assumed one of the regular horse racing uploaders had already included it, but when I didn't see it I put my clip up. He did look quite a bit like Slew. In 2003 I remember they tried to get him ready for the Breeders Cup but when that wasn't on pace they finally retired him, never racing again after age 2.

[two gun sid]

91. Thanks for the link and the video...

I am in the crowd at the 1/4 pole. Man, that wind was cold that day.

[bread_and_roses]

68. Anyone heard of Cobalt Blue? Why does Steve Haskin call him

a "monster in the making" in today's column? I like Great Hunter (best name of the lot, my "handicapping" tool), but "Cobalt Blue" has a vivid, intense aura to it.

[two gun sid]

69. Owned by Merv Griffin and seems to be coming to hand...

just before the Derby. He is a winner of a allowance race or just broke his maiden(?)one or the other. Did it in good fashion from what I heard.

[two gun sid]

72. kenzee13, I found you a couple of links....

http://www.brisnet.com/cgi-bin/editorial/news/article.cgi?id=7001

http://c-jonline.com/derby/horse.php?DerbyID=78

[bread_and_roses]

77. Thanks, sid, especially for the Brisnet article

I was happy to read that he is exceptionally well put together, since I looked up some photos of him today and thought he was quite handsome. Of course, I think they're all beautiful (with a few rare exceptions - I've seen some photos of Seabiscuit in which he looks really homely, even to my eye), just some are more beautiful even than others.

[two gun sid]

80. Post a pic of your Cobalt Blue...

I haven't seen him.

[bread_and_roses]

85. I don't know how

to post a pic :(. I looked at photos of him over at horsephotos.com, and they all have a large "C" superimposed.

[Justpat]

86. The ones with the C are copywrited material.

You can't use it without the photographers permission.

Two Gun Sid helped me with posting pics a while ago. I was too
dumb to do it and he made it so even I could understand the instructions.
Too bad I didn't write them down. :D

[two gun sid]

88. It's very easy kenzee13....

just right click on the picture. Click on 'copy image location'. Then paste that into your post.

Like OB says, if it is copyrighted you must have the owners permission. Don't do anything to get yourself in trouble my friend.

[bread_and_roses]

89. Thank You! As soon as I find a photo that isn't

copyrighted, I'll paste it here then (I thought "image location" would just give the URL. Thanks!)

[aaronbees]

82. I think Great Hunter is ....

at the top of my Derby Top Five now off of that performance, even if I'm still pulling for Nobiz. Last six Derby winners have had three syllable names, so Great Hunter fits that bill too. :D

And the winners of the three big preps this past weekend were #8 horses, same as the winners of each race in last year's Triple Crown. :think:

[two gun sid]

74. Kentucky Derby Lore.

In 1927, C.V. Whitney was deputized to represent his family when his father Harry Payne Whitney's horse, Whiskery, won the Derby. The young Whitney got lost in the crowd and never made it to the race.

Later that night he returned to the farm and witnessed several of the farm employees in front of a bonfire, with a single old mare around which they had gathered to sing. That mare was Regret, Harry Payne Whitney's champion who had won the Derby a dozen years before.

Feel free to add any old Derby history you care to post.


Regret

[Justpat]

75. I had heard that Regret was small

but she looks like she weighs 700lbs tops in that picture.

She must have been made of cast iron.

[two gun sid]

79. I had read she was small. I don't know though. She looks really...

tucked up in that picture. I think she only raced 11 times in four years. But, she took on the boys and beat their brains out so she must have been tough.

[two gun sid]

90. More Kentucky Derby Stories.

In 1918 Willis Sharpe Kilmer brought his 2yo champ, Sun Briar, now a 3YO, to Louisville for the Derby. He had purchased a horse to use as a workmate for Sun Briar to sharpen him for the race. The workmate kept beating the champ in his pre-Derby works. Kilmer thought Sun Briar was not fit and the other horse wasn't "fast enough to run past me". He opted to not run Sun Briar.

Derby impresario Col. Matt Winn talked Kilmer into entering the horse he had bought to prompt his champion. The work horse went off at nearly 30-1 and rolled home by about a length and a half.

This report was filed by Thomas Rust Underwood and has since gone down in racing lore: "The clouds just wouldn't roll by. First rain fell (from the sky) to make the scene of the Kentucky Derby muddy. Then Exterminator dropped from them to win the event."

Exterminator, better known to his many fans as "Old Bones", went on to a racing career that won him a spot in the Hall of Fame. He was a winner of 50 races out of 100 starts (Some say 99). Finally retired at age 9 to his owners farm in New York he lived, with his best friend, a pony named Peanuts, until he was 30 YO.

Upon his death, one sports writer wrote:"...he was a horse that stirred more genuine affection in the hearts of men than any other thoroughbred the American turf has ever known."


Exterminator

[Awsi Dooger]

92. In high school I memorized the name of every Kentucky Derby winner

Starting with Aristides in 1875. I still know them and can rattle them off. The fun time was when I was in the Derby museum at Churchill Downs with my dad. He was having me turn my back to the silks and go down the line naming the horses. A small crowd gathered and they were getting a kick out of it.

There's a sportsbook manager here in Las Vegas who quizzes me on a handful of Derby winners every year, reading them off the promotional Derby glass that his casino makes and gives away every year. He gives me a comp to one of the nice restaurants after I nail the answers.

Here's the mistake he makes, asking me the older names assuming they are more difficult. They are a piece of cake since I memorized them decades ago and have a system to remember. The names flow in sequence plus I use the top of the decade as a reference point. For example, if someone asks 1912 I instantly remember that Donau was the 1910 winner. So I start at that point during the rundown, Donau ...Meridian...and that leads you to Worth, the 1912 champion.

Much more difficult are the newer winners, the ones added after I initially memorized the list. Those names don't flow at all. I run down the winners shortly after the newest Derby winner crosses the wire and I often get stuck with obscure names, like in the mid '90s when you get to the Go For Gin and Thunder Gulch-type winners.

[bread_and_roses]

98. My all-time favorite horse

I read "Old Bones, the Wonder Horse" as a child and fell in love. I have been to his grave; the now-owner of the Pet Cemetar where he is buried told me that every year still there are roses placed there at Derby time. I love this photo because it shows what a gawky but alert and intellegent looking three-year old he was:



(there, I did it sid! thanks.)

[two gun sid]

100. Another day, another Derby story...

In the mid 1950's, Jack Price, a jet-engine parts manufacturer, was busily blowing his retirement nest egg on thoroughbreds.

Price took ownership of an obscure mare for $150 as partial payment on an overdue board bill at his Ohio farm and kicked in another $150 to seal the deal. He bred his mare to a $400 stallion. The resulting colt turned into one of the toughest competitors of the early 1960's and was known as "The People's Horse".

The 3YO stretch runner finished 3rd in the Fountain of Youth, 1st in the Florida Derby and 2nd in the Wood Memorial. He arrived in Louisville as the race day and fan favorite.

When the gates opened for the start of the 1961 Derby, Jack Price's horse broke late and at the 1/2 he was 11th, 18 lengths back of the leader. By the time they came into the stretch he was 4th, 4 1/2 lengths back and under a drive. When they crossed the finish line he was the winner, 3/4's of a length in front of Crozier.

And that is how the son of Saggy, out of the mare Joppy, won the 1961 Kentucky Derby. The horse? Carry Back.

At the end of Carry Back's career, owner-trainer Jack Price said, "I'd have just been a statistic if not for Carry Back. He changed our lives. We had two daughters, but came to regard Carry Back as our son."


Carry Back

[Justpat]

93. Ravel is lightly raced, but I'm starting to like this horse.

He seems to be one of the few sane Fusaichi Pegasus'.

Dosage: 13-6-19-0-0
Dosage Index: 3
Center of Distribution: 0.74

Beautiful pedigree. By FuPeg out of Let by AP Indy.
He should have no problem with distance.

I don't know what they have planned for him in the next month,
but I'll keep an eye on him.

[Awsi Dooger]

95. I think he's atop my Derby list right now

Not that I've paid as much attention as typical due to ridiculously few starts by the top tier, but Ravel's move in his recent win jumped out at me. I've watched it many times. He had to be patient then go around horses yet was still eager at the wire. It even looked like he was jumping just before the finish. I saw 20/1 on him in one future book the other day and it looked tempting. Heck, might be higher odds available. I didn't check elsewhere.

I don't want to get excited about horses like Great Hunter, who was dusted by Street Sense in the Breeders Cup. Great Hunter looks too much like a sucker horse to me with four place finishes, then a third in the juvenile. My instinct is to throw that type out and look at Street Sense or someone who wasn't in that Breeders Cup Juvenile. Circular Quay does have two wins at Churchill but I'm not thrilled to back a deep stretch runner in the Derby. Took much racing luck required in a field of that size with all the horses stopping in front of him.

Here's a YouTube link to that Ravel victory in the Sham Stakes:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s1KVpQb-x8g

[Justpat]

99. Well, we know he doesn't mind dirt in his face

or being in tight quarters. A very impressive effort.

Thanks for posting that clip of the race.

[aaronbees]

96. Santa Anita Derby is it for him

He's a wonderful horse and that was quite a move in the Sham. But the Kentucky Derby is shaping up to be his fifth race and only third stakes race. His class may shine through that day though.

[Justpat]

94. Dr. Steve Roman's dosage profiles of all the KD contenders here:

http://chef-de-race.com/dosage/classics/2007/2007_classic_contenders_expanded.htm

[aaronbees]

97. Hard Spun likely to skip Rebel, opt for Lane's End

Hard Spun likely to opt for Lane's End

By Mary Rampellini
Daily Racing Form

HOT SPRINGS, Ark. -- Hard Spun will likely pass the Grade 3, $300,000 Rebel Stakes at Oaklawn Park on March 17 in favor of the Grade 2, $500,000 Lane's End at Turfway Park on March 24, his trainer, Larry Jones, said on Tuesday.

Jones said he doesn't think Hard Spun is handling the racing surface at Oaklawn. He discussed the matter with owner Rick Porter after Hard Spun worked a half-mile in 50 seconds here Monday. Before committing to the Lane's End, Jones wants to make sure Hard spun has enough earnings to be guaranteed a spot in the starting gate.

"I've got to call Turfway first, and make sure there's no way that we will not make the cut," he said. "I don't know what the cutoff is. He's got <$173,470> in earnings, $60,000 something of them are in graded - you've got to think he'll make the cut. I just need to contact Turfway. But if we're guaranteed a , he'll be shipping up this weekend."

The Lane's End field is limited to 12 starters. According to the nomination sheet, if it is oversubscribed the first preference is given to graded or group stakes winners, with Grade 1 winners getting preference over Grade 2 winners, and Grade 2 winners preference over Grade 3 winners. The second preference is stakes winners, then highest career earnings. Hard Spun's most prestigious win came in the Grade 3 Lecomte at Fair Grounds.

Source and rest of the story: http://sports.espn.go.com/sports/horse/news/story?id=2789518

[two gun sid]

101. Street Sense zeroes in on Tampa Bay Derby

From Thoroughbred Times:
After Street Sense worked on Thursday at Palm Meadows Training Center, trainer Carl Nafzger said the champion two-year-old male is on target to make his first start of the year in the Tampa Bay Derby (G3) on March 17.

The Street Cry (Ire) colt drilled five furlongs handily in 1:01 under regular jockey Calvin Borel. The move was the second-fastest of 16 at the distance.

“The horse relaxed and responded good to Calvin,” Nafzger said. “He worked nice. He’s on target, and if everything goes well now he’ll run in the Tampa Bay Derby.”

Street Sense has not raced since his record ten-length victory in the Bessemer Trust Breeders’ Cup Juvenile (G1) on November 4 at Churchill Downs. He has recorded nine published workouts since resuming serious training in January. Borel also was aboard for a five-furlong move in 1:00.20 on February 27.

http://www.thoroughbredtimes.com/racing-news/2007/March/08/Street-Sense-zeroes-in-on-Tampa-Bay-Derby.aspx

[Awsi Dooger]

102. Then on to the Blue Grass

I like the sound of that. When I was a kid the Derby prep was always the Wood or Blue Grass. I still can't get used to the long layoffs and horses coming in from Arkansas or wherever. The Blue Grass used to be too close to the Derby, 9 days earlier, so they eventually lost major horses and had to move it back. I think Spectacular Bid prepped in the Blue Grass but I can't remember a recent Derby winner to come out of that race.

Yesterday I was watching the tape of the 2006 juvenile and gulped at how impressive Street Sense was. I wish he had a race under his belt but hard for me to dismiss the November dominance. There isn't a good clip on YouTube, at least not one with sound, but the race is available by clicking on video at the right of this link. Still strange that Trevor Denman blew the call so badly, getting excited about phantom moves by Great Hunter and Circular Quay but never identifying Street Sense until he's about six lengths clear.

http://www.ntra.com/bc_division_pages.aspx?id=18425

[two gun sid]

103. The Blue Grass no longer seems to be a serious prep...

horses run in it to get enough graded stakes earnings for the Derby if they are on the bubble. No one really points to it anymore. I can't think of a recent Derby winner to come out of it. Charismatic prepped in the Lexington. That was only a couple of weeks before his Derby.

I like Street Sense. I like the way he moves and he has a ton of ability. I like him to win the Derby. So, that is my prediction. Street Sense: 2007 Kentucky Derby winner. The BC Juvenile jinx is broken.

[two gun sid]

104. Thunder Gulch prepped in the Blue Grass...

finished 4th. I had to look that up.

[aaronbees]

105. Happy Birthday, John Henry

Grand old grizzled guy, you made me a fan for life.


John Henry
Thoroughbred Bay Gelding, (foaled March 9, 1975 in Kentucky)
15.1 hands
by Ole Bob Bowers - Once Double, by Double Jay
Breeder: Golden Chance Farm
Owner: Samuel and Dorothy Rubin (Dotsam Stables)
Trainer: Ron McAnally

Accomplishments
Voted 7 Eclipse Awards
Voted Horse of the Year 1981 and 1984
Only horse to win Horse of the Year more than once but not in consecutive years
Voted Champion Older Horse 1981
Oldest horse to win Horse of the Year - at age 9
Oldest horse to win a Grade 1 race - at age 9
Voted Champion Turf Horse - 1980, 1981, 1982, 1984
Won 30 stakes races
Only horse to win the Arlington Million(G1) twice - 1981 & 1984
Only horse to win the Santa Anita Handicap(G1) twice - 1981 & 1982
Won more grade stakes than any other Thoroughbred - 25
Voted racehorse of the decade for the 1980's
Still the richest gelding of any breed in history
Retired as the world's richest thoroughbred - July 28, 1985
Inducted into Racing's Hall of Fame in 1990
Voted 23rd best racehorse of the 20th Century

http://www.kyhorsepark.com/khp/champions/john.asp

And the Blood Horse story: http://news.bloodhorse.com/viewstory.asp?id=37911 (John Henry at 32: 'Mean and Nasty As Ever')

[two gun sid]

106. Circular Quay Leads Field for Louisiana Derby

From The Bloodhorse:
Michael and Doreen Tabor's Circular Quay has been installed as the 9-5 morning-line favorite in a field of eight 3-year-olds for the 94th running of the Louisiana Derby (gr. II) at Fair Grounds March 10.

The $600,000 race, to be contested at 1 1/16 miles, is the last of five stakes contests on Louisiana Derby Day presented by Budweiser. Approximate post time is 5:43 p.m. ET.

Circular Quay, who is trained and will be ridden by Eclipse Award winners Todd Pletcher and John Velazquez, respectively, is coming off a fifth-place finish in the Risen Star Stakes (gr. III) at Fair Grounds last month, a race in which his chances of winning were compromised by a spill near the top of the stretch.

As a 2-year-old, Circular Quay won the Hopeful Stakes (gr. I) at Saratoga and the Bashford Manor Stakes (gr. III) at Churchill Downs. He capped his 2006 campaign with a second-place finish behind Street Sense in the Bessemer Trust Breeders' Cup Juvenile (gr. I) at Churchill.

http://tcm.bloodhorse.com/viewstory.asp?id=37857

1. Circular Quay, Todd Pletcher, John Velazquez, 122, 9-5
2. Ketchikan, Al Stall Jr., Larry Melancon, 122, 8-1
3. Slew’s Tizzy, Gregory Fox, Julien Leparoux, 122, 15-1
4. Birdbirdistheword, Kenneth McPeek, Robby Albarado, 122, 6-1
5. Liquidity, Doug O’Neill, Corey Nakatani, 122, 7-2
6. Zanjero, Steve Asmussen, Garrett Gomez, 122, 4-1
7. Soaring By, Todd Pletcher, Edgar Prado, 122, 8-1
8. Imawildandcrazyguy, William Kaplan, Fernando Jara, 122, 10-1

Let's see if my wise guy horse, Liquidity, can run some.

[aaronbees]

107. Looks like the pace sets up well for him....

Did you see Liquidity is 30-1 on the future book for the Derby? That is a steal as I think he's likely to improve. I like Circular Quay to bounce back up here and, as he's a Louisiana-based horse, gotta pull for Birdbird (whom I saw last year on Super Derby day). The Whirlaway should be a nice race Saturday, too.

[aaronbees]

110. Pletcher Gets a Gotham Winner

Cowtown Cat by nearly three over Wafi City (a Darley runner). Summer Doldrums nosed out for third.

[jakefrep]

108. Folk takes UAE Oaks, may challenge colts next...

...in the UAE Derby on Dubai World Cup day:

http://www.thoroughbredtimes.com/international-news/2007/March/08/Folk-takes-aim-on-UAE-Derby-after-easy-UAE-Oaks-win.aspx

[aaronbees]

109. Have fun at stud, Holy Roman Emperor

What a joke. x(

Source: http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/other_sports/horse_racing/6438143.stm

Leading Irish racehorse Holy Roman Emperor will replace George Washington at stud after the 2,000 Guineas winner developed 'fertility problems'.
Holy Roman Emperor had been second favourite behind old rival Teofilo for this year's Classic at Newmarket.
A statement from the Coolmore Stud said: "In the very early stages of George Washington's stud career, his fertility has been questioned."
The horse had been nicknamed 'Gorgeous George' by the breeding operation.

[jakefrep]

111. That sucks bilgewater.

From what I read on racingpost.co.uk, Holy Roman Emperor was training quite well. If I held a booking to George Washington at this point I'd be royally pissed.

[aaronbees]

112. Exactly...

Why does "Gorgeous" George need a replacement? That's what I don't get. The economics of this game is ruining the racing side.

[jakefrep]

119. The Times of London says it best....

http://timesonline.co.uk/tol/sport/racing/article1499724.ece

[two gun sid]

113. Circular Quay wins LA Derby

Ketchikan 2nd Zanjero 3rd final time of 1:43 flat.

Liquidity? Up the track.

[aaronbees]

114. Impressive, sustained run by CQ

He's right there every single time. Hope he gets a clear run like that in the Derby. Liquidity/BirdBird = pretenders. Oh well, guess the future book got it right on Liquidity - kind of a bummer.

** edited to add last comment **

[two gun sid]

115. Liquidity is not the horse I thought he was....

the handicappers were right. I was wrong.

Goddamn it, I'm starting to hate Pletcher.

[aaronbees]

116. Pletcher has an embarrassment of riches

He seems to get it done ... somehow ... but I wonder sometimes on the "how." ;)

I hate that moment when you realize a hopeful Derby prospect just isn't all that. I just hope I don't have to eat my words on Nobiz. We'll see ... he's getting cheater blinkers next out.

My top five Derby list now:

1) Great Hunter
2) Circular Quay
3) Nobiz Like Shobiz
4) Stormello
5) Street Sense

But if you ask me tomorrow that list could change -- these wacky horses are just not distinguishing themselves yet.

[two gun sid]

117. I love broodmares....

I spent this morning at the track in the new trainer's barn getting nipped at by racehorses as I mucked stalls, gave water and fed the noon meal.

My partner and I then went and loaded, then unloaded a trailer full of hay.

Then we gave the yearling some vacinations. Holy shit! Those guys need to learn some manners. You'd think we were stabbing them with knives instead of #20 gauge needles.

Then we vaccinated the open mares prior to breeding. How nice it is to be around professional horses. It's just a real honor to know those girls.

[Justpat]

121. I wish we had an owner like you.

[two gun sid]

122. Do you think a hands-on owner helps or hinders?

and let me say this, we never tell a trainer how to train our horses. The only request I've ever made is that if a horse is ready and it comes down to a race at Hazel Park or Jackson, my horse races at Jackson, in my hometown. Size of the purse is not taken into consideration. Our meet is only April 24 to Mid-July. If we are racing on the Fair Circuit, OK, we stay in the more lucrative fair races.

Anyhow, at the level you race, would an owner be a help or a hinderance in your barn? I wouldn't want to play this game if I couldn't handle the horses on the weekends. The loading and unloading hay ain't so much fun. I'm allergic to that stuff.

[Justpat]

123. As long as the person doesn't tell us what to do,

we don't mind having owners at the barn either.

Finery's owner is a very hands on type also. She is a good
horsewoman in her own right. So when she comes to the barn
she walks her herself and helps out around the barn.

It is the ones that come by every day with a condition book
that we drop like hot potatoes.

[two gun sid]

124. I salute the owner that walks her own horse...

that is cool and should be publicized. People like her should be front and center in the selling of this sport to the public.

[two gun sid]

118. Smokey Stover wins Bay Meadows BC Sprint Handicap...

Nice race by Smokey. Trickey Trevor jumped out to the lead with Smokey pressuring him. At the turn Smokey made his move and put the race away. He is a nice one.

Times in 5ths: :22/3 :44/2 :56 1:08/2

Race Chart: http://www.drf.com/drfPDFChartRacesIndexAction.do?filename=BM0311030.pdf

[Justpat]

120. Rags To Riches wins Santa Anita Oaks

Yikes. What a wonderful filly.

http://racing.bloodhorse.com/viewstory.asp?id=37966


Pletcher leaves door open for Derby run.