Pat Riley as Coach

[erpowers]

On a number of occasions I have heard people question whether Phil Jackson is that great of a coach since he does not seem to win championships without star players. Today, I would like to ask the same question of Pat Riley. Is Riley really that great of a coach? As far as I know Riley has not won a championship without major stars on his teams. This year with Shaq being unhealthy and slowing down (I know they traded him)the Heat have had a terrible season. They are now 9-40 for the season, have lost seven games in a row, and for the first time in franchise history the team has lost 22 of 23 games. I realize that a number of his players have been injured this year, does all this prove that Riley is not that great of a coach?

[fishwax]

1. NBA Coaches don't win championships without star players

It's truer in the NBA than in any other league, because one player can have more of an impact in the NBA than in any other professional league. Sure Pat Riley has never won a championship without star players (Shaq and Wade in Miami, Magic and Company in LA), but neither has any other coach.

Sometimes people talk about the 2004 Pistons as an exception, but that's mainly because they were noted for teamwork and defense rather than superstars. But even though none of those players were megastars in the way that Shaq/Kobe/Magic/Jordan are, they had one of the best defensive players in the game in Ben Wallace (who was the only Piston to make the All-Star game that year, I believe), a star point guard in Billups, and a couple of past/future All-Stars in Rasheed Wallace and Richard Hamilton. Prince is the only starter from that team to have never made the all-star team.

Aside from that, though, I don't know the last time a coach or team won a championship without a major star. Five players (Magic, Bird, Jordan, Duncan, and Shaq) have won 22 of the last 28 NBA Championships. (To be fair, Shaq was not the driving force on the '06 Heat, but he was still an important component.) Throw in Olajuwan and Isaiah Thomas and you've covered 26 of the last 28. (The exceptions: Dr. J and Moses Malone on the '83 '76ers and the aforementioned Pistons.)

[bluescribbler]

3. Two points

1. Dr. J was not a star player? Moses Malone was not a star player? I don't know where you get that.

b. Red Auerbach never won a championship without a star player. He never won without Bill Russell.

[fishwax]

4. Hell yes they were stars--that's not what I said at all

"1. Dr. J was not a star player? Moses Malone was not a star player? I don't know where you get that."

I don't know where you get that I said that :) I said that seven different stars have accounted for 26 of the last 28 NBA titles, and that one of the remaining two titles was won by Dr. J's and Malone's 76'ers.

"b. Red Auerbach never won a championship without a star player. He never won without Bill Russell."

Agreed--the argument that Riley isn't a great coach b/c he's never won without a star is kind of silly, since no coach in the NBA ever wins without a star player.

[Moses2SandyKoufax]

5. The only exception I can think of would be Lenny Wilkins,

and the '78-'79 Supersonics (As long as you don't think of Jack Sikma, Dennis Johnson, or Paul Silas as "star players").

[TalkAgain]

2. Both are awesome....nt

[Awsi Dooger]

6. Riley is really an impressive guy

That's my only summation, after being in Miami since mid December. He's always available to the media including long sit down sessions with local sportscasters, and calling Jim Mandich's radio show two weeks ago for a candid discussion of the Shaq trade. Such a contrast from a jackass like Nick Saban who was comically outmatched by the South Florida media.

Riley always has a positive expression and tone but won't insult you with PR based crap. He's very candid, regarding his own failings in recent personnel evaluation and the overall problems with the team.