Young gays look beyond marriage

[kweerwolf]

A GENERATION GAP in the gay rights movement is growing wider every day, and it’s all due to the increasingly single-minded focus on marriage equality.

On the anniversary of the first legal same-sex marriages performed in Massachusetts, everyone — gay and straight — should celebrate the freedom of equality under the law.

But for gay youth, the celebration is bittersweet. The elevation of marriage equality as the most important issue in the contemporary gay rights movement has obscured the fact that marriage is, for the most part, not even an issue for us.

<snip>

Current gay activists pay heed. In 10 years, we younger gays will be the next generation of gay activists. The gay rights movement must reorient itself as representative of all gay people, not just the few who have power now.

http://www.washblade.com/2005/5-20/view/columns/young.cfm

[GodlessBiker]

1. Yes, I'm older, but please forgive me if I have a touch more deference

and respect for the generation (before mine) that brought us Stonewall and the birth of the gay rights movement in the United States and who now, after all these years would like to marry their long-term partners, than I do for this younger person who "need(s) to hear about how to negotiate safe sex." (Here's a hint: It's non-negotiable...you simply do it.)

[ladeuxiemevoiture]

2. Please try to adopt a more supportive tone.

Your "hint" reminds me of the heterosexual guy I knew who said in exasperation, "Safe sex education?? What's so difficult!? Read the instructions on the side of the box of condoms!"

The fact is that the condom use rate with younger gays having new sexual partners is declining (anecdotally, approaching abysmally low rates for heterosexuals), for a number of reasons. "Just do it" makes a good sneaker ad, but won't do anything towards helping younger gays realize the importance of using condoms.

[GodlessBiker]

3. Your point about safe sex is well taken, and the facts have to be

made plain, but my tone was appropriate. This college kid acts as if marriage should not be a centerpiece of the agenda because his generation doesn't care about it.

I submit most respectfully that, while there is a lot to be done about gay youth issues, he doesn't realize how good it is for his generation. I don't want to have to fall back on the old saying, "In my day...," but there is so much information out there now concerning the issues he writes about, I fear that he thinks he is the first one to actually see the issues as problems.

I am confident, however, that folks with your attitude will prevail as folks with my attitude will just throw up their hands and say, "ungrateful kids."

[mitchtv]

4. sad really, the last several gay rights demos`

were full of people my age 50's and 60's The youth are not interested. The last Move on demo (Strate people) was the same. It seems like I've been doing this forever= (since the mid sixties) Ungrateful? I wouldn't say that; Oblivious ? maybe. I don't understand what it is that is so much more important, and why they are not out on the streets fighting for it like the stonewall generation did. It can't be all about AIDS , since so many of us are negative, and wish to go on with our lives, I have lost most of my peers/friends to it. sorry if this is a disjointed rant. But it would be nice to think SOMEONE would take over SOMEDAY.

[Brian_Expat]

5. This is such utter and total HORSE SHIT

28 year old gay American here, who detest the scene and the shallow bullshit in the scene.

Not all of we young gays are club whores or people who are too wimpy to come out without support. We understand that the older generation had it tougher and that most of the gains we've made at home and at work are due to their hard work.

And we understand that idiotic demands for reorienting the movement to get unconditional universal acceptance of gay people are idiotic.

Marriage IS the most important issue for gay relationships because marriage represents a powerful stabilising force in our own lives. Our parents and others might disapprove of us (and no gay movement's going to change that if that's the case) but marriage will provide us with stable platforms for our relationships and give us power over our own lives.

I wish "young gays" who write the sort of crap in the article would stop whining, get their chins up, and start fighting for themselves, rather than demand that the gay community take away all the hurt and pain that exists. Not all that hurt and pain will ever be banished. Be REALISTIC.

[mitchtv]

6. never thought I'd be saying "here , Here" Brian

but I am. This is a case of pure incrementalism. You cannot look beyond the step you are in the middle oftaking. If you can't help, don't expect us to take the next step with you or for you. There is a lot of taking for granted going on, as is in the women's movement.

[khashka]

16. So there is no alternative between marriage and the scene?

I have no use for "the scene", I also have no use for aping heterosexual marriage. I'll support gay marriage because it has manifest benefits that we should be entitled to simply as human beings. But monogamy has never worked for me - so are my relationships only stable if I engage in a system that doesn't even work that great for heterosexuals? Do my relationships only have meaning and value within that system? Is my humanity, my citizenship, my access to rights and responsibilities only valid within that system?

Fuck that shit.

I actually was married. To a woman. She married two other men. It was stable. It worked. We raised a beautiful and wonderful daughter. And we accepted her female lover (and her daughter) as part of our family. God what a weaselly statement! They ARE our family.

I don't want to be allowed to live by such narrow rules - I want to change the rules.

Khash.

[benevolent dictator]

7. Hey, I'm a "gay youth"

- ok, lesbian youth - who thinks legalizing same-sex marriage is the most important thing right now.

Marriage isn't my ultimate goal, but I do think it's the best one to focus on for right now. Yes, discrimination and safe-sex issues are things we should work on too, but I also think that being an accepted, legally recognized part of society will go a long way toward helping those issues. I think that the more visible we become and the more people learn that the myths and stereotypes aren't true, there is and will continue to be a lot more tolerance. Most of the people majorly against same-sex marriage (at least in my personal experience) have been older people, or people with very religious/bigoted parents who are against it.

I mean, think about it, I know older people who didn't know what gay people were until they were in college or later, now we've got GSAs in high schools and people hear about it all the time. Granted there are always some crazies who want the tolerance posters taken down and want to "protect" their precious kids (who probably watch violent movies and swear all the time) from "the gays," but just the fact that there is debate now is something, no? I think the only way we will see any major backslides in workplace/school tolerance is if we DON'T win the same-sex marriage fight. If we allow them to say, "we don't have to recognize you or your relationships!" Basically relegate us to second class citizens, to use a catch phrase. If they can do that, well then, they can discriminate against us in everything else with a clean conscience, too.

I, like many of my peers, am also "career-oriented" and want to go to college and get a job and all that, but that doesn't mean I don't EVER want to get married, and when I get a good paying job and benefits and everything, I sure as hell want to be able to share them with my partner. Plus you know, the whole visiting them in the hospital and all those other rights...

[Maven]

8. THIS 23-year-old gay guy is marching tomorrow for marriage equality

This article is a bunch of CRAP--in fact, it's the assumption BEHIND the article that's the problem with gay youth--the idea that you don't need to get involved with any cause unless it directly affects your own life...i.e., self-interest (and short-term self-interest) as the only motivating factor for activism.

And let's face it, we're mostly talking about the guys here. I hate to say it, but it's true. Look at how many lesbians have made a huge contribution to the fight against HIV/AIDS and related issues of care and anti-discrimination when it's a disease for which they are the least at risk of all demographic groups. I would love to say that young gay men would do the same for their gay sisters, but sadly, I just can't.

[kweerwolf]

9. I see a lot of merit in the original article

I'm not of the younger generation of gays, so I can't presume to speak for them ... but I definitely agree that the marriage issue is being forced on us by the national "inside the Beltway" LGBT organizations who are out of touch with what is important to those of us in the rest of the country.

I'm not saying it lacks importance. Sure, property rights, visitation rights, inheritance rights and other issues are very important to gay and lesbian couples ... and I support those rights 100 percent. But it just seems like the national organizations have put all their eggs in one basket with the marriage issue. And, frankly, the marriage issue does affect the majority of gays and lesbians. Personally, it makes me a little squamish that we are trying to immitate the breeders who have centuries of a head start on making "marriage" work, but still fuck it up to the point where half of all marriages end in divorce.

It was the same way with the gays in the military issue that Clinton made such a centerpiece of his campaign in '92. Sure, it's nice if the military doesn't conduct witchhunts to ferret out gays and lesbians. But in the bigger picture, how many people did that really effect? Yet all the national LGBT groups went gaga over it as though it would be a panacea.

It's interesting that in the same issue of the Washington Blade that the above article comes from, there's another article on the new head of the Human Rights Campaign wrapping up a trip to "red states." According to the article:

"He (Joe Solmonese) added that everywhere he went, workplace issues topped the concerns of gay men and lesbians."

But then the very next paragraph says:

“It’s not surprising to me that economic activity and workplace issues are important,” Solmonese said. “That’s why marriage is important.”

http://www.washblade.com/2005/5-20/news/national/tour.cfm

D'uh! No wonder a large segment of LGBTs feel their national organizations don't represent them or their concerns when they can tour the flyover part of the country, get told again and again that employment issues are of the highest importance, and then turn around and try to tie it back to the marriage issue.

[Cornus]

10. I agree

My partner and I have been together since 1972. Neither of us has any interest in being married. I respect those who want to get married but hope that they would also recognize the fact that there are many of us who couldn't care less about *getting married*.

[mitchtv]

11. getting married is mothing,but when you are a senior citizen

and you own property as "tenants in common" with right of survivorship ; one partner dies, and the state decides to re assess the property (partner's ha;f being a "gift"). You are on a fixed income, you'll wish you were married when you lose your home. This doesn't happen to a married couple, and it can't be fixed with a contract. I hope i said that right.

[Cornus]

12. JTWROS

We recently sold the home we had been living in since 1972 and bought another. Our lawyer advised that we put the new deed in both names with JTWROS...Joint Tenants with Right of Survivorship. Evidently, that *ROS* makes a big difference from just a plain *JT* deed, which is the way our original deed read. No one ever advised us about this back in 1972. Not so sure you're right about the partner's half being a "gift". From what I've read about JTWROS it's assumed that both parties own 100 per cent of whatever.

More info at: http://www.planetout.com/money/article.html?sernum=12

[GodlessBiker]

14. JTWROS passes to the surviving tenant outside the will,

but I believe that for tax purposes (except for federally recognized married persons who inherit what their spouse left to them estate-tax free), the IRS assumes that the dead tenant contributed 100% of the money needed to purchase the property and thus the entire property is taxable to the non-spouse beneficiary. The surviving tenant has the burden to prove any contributions h/se made to the joint property to have the estate-tax burden reduced.

[mitchtv]

15. more importantly, The COUNTY will reassess

at a new value-title change- not so for widows(ers).

[xchrom]

13. everything in it's own time.

viva la difference!

you've just described every new generation with the possible exception of the viet nam war folks.
remember stonewall happened in a very important context the anti-war movement, civil rights, feminism, etc

younger will support the ideas that will matter to them -- as they develop.

we're not all the same -- and people who's agendas are not mine don't represent a crisis.