I need advice...my daughter

[cally]

My daughter has told me once or twice that she is bi. I always thought she was hetero. She's 17. Yeah, this is cryptic but I'm trying to understand what I just heard. I always thought she was straight and her telling me she is bi was a test of whether I would love her whatever.

She has been dealing with severe depression. We all have been dealing with it. She left for counseling telling me that she wished she were a boy. I told her that was ridiculous. I knew she was a girl but she might be a lesbian. She came home from group counseling telling me that she's bi and how some lesbians are scary. She likes men but she's also attracted to girls. Her words.

OK. I'm sort of getting the point that she's lesbian and she needs help accepting that. Help, please.

Before I get flamed. I don't care. To be honest, yeah I wish she was straight because it's easier in this society. I want life to be happy and easy. That may not be reality so I need to show my support and love. Again, help.

[saracat]

1. I think she is what she says she is. Or maybe she is hetero and curious!

Why are you so insistant that she is gay? Why couldn't she be bisexual as she says?

[cally]

3. Don't know. Just what I heard today

:shrug:

[Tandalayo_Scheisskopf]

2. Has she tried counseling...

Wit a GLBT-friendly counselor/therapist? That might help.

[bigwillq]

4. Maybe you need counseling too!

Seriously. This is hard for you. That's what my mom did. She saw someone on her own to help deal with this situation.


But she's your daughter and you'll always love and support her.
Give her time to figure out about herself. Support her and try to steer her in the right direction, which is to accept who she is and be comfortable in her own skin, whether she's gay, bi, straight....

You also need to put your own expectations aside for now.
Like daughter getting married and having kids, etc....


One of the first things my mom flipped out about is "Oh, so now you're never going to get married and have kids"

Find out her wants and needs. They may be different than yours and that's o.k.

Now, go give her a kiss and a hug and tell her that she can always come to you and talk about anything. Be open and available for discussion. You may not always like to hear what's coming out of her mouth but listen and give her the best advice you can.

Best of luck. Feel free to PM me if you need someone to talk to.

Coming out was the worst period of my life but it also was the best decision I ever made.:hug:

[Frances]

7. This sounds like good advice to me

It sounds to me as though your daughter is trying to work things out in her own mind.

I think the best thing you can do is just listen. Your daughter will probably contradict herself as she speaks, but my advice is to listen and let your daughter work things out as she talks to you.

Also, I strongly agree that you need a support group for yourself so other people can listen to you!

[Maat]

22. And it is not true that GLBT individuals cannot be blessed with ..

children.

And, hopefully soon, same-sex marriage rights will come to fruition, at least in several states.

God bless!

(This retired social worker understands how difficult it can be calmly discussing these issues with your kids.)

Great advice by those who have walked down the road before.

[bigwillq]

25. I'm well aware that GLBT can have kids

I was just trying to tell her not to freak out about that situation right away b/c there's more important things to deal with right now.:hi:

[FreepFryer]

5. Just tell her there is plenty of time for her to decide, and to make sure

that she always associates with people who treat her with respect and care for her.

The more it 'gets' you, the more importance it may have in her life.

If you trust she can make good decisions, then leave it up to her and you may indeed find this is a phase.

If not, and she identifies as gay or bi moving forward, don't let up your guard one bit about the women in her life. Be as critical and truthful as you would be if they were men, and she'll stand the best chance of finding a great love and living a happy life.

Just express support for her judgment, and love for her, every chance you get!

And thanks for writing for support - it tells me you'll both be fine!

[queeg]

6. Patience is required

Do not tell her that her emotions are ridiculous, that can hurt right to the bone. Sometimes its more important to be a friend than to be mom.

emphasize that being 17 sucks right off the bat, and that while she may think one thing today tomorrow might be different. but dont tell her that verbatim... sort of sneak up on it.

Emphasize education above all else, and suggest that in college she may be able to find more people than she now has that will be more like her. Friends and thoughts in high school are much more fleeting than friends in college who you may end up knowing your entire life. Go someplace good for school. Have fun in school. Its always good at this age to tell her she can be a boy-girl-green-purple or whatnot as long as she has a good education.

And tell her that as a 40 year old white guy with a daughter, I can agree with her that some lesbians are scary...

[freeplessinseattle]

10. "some lesbians are scary" how so?

and how is this related to you having a daughter? are you afraid som lesbians are predatorial? more than straight guys?

[queeg]

14. nope

say it with a smile and a wink

[freeplessinseattle]

8. don't get hung up on labels

that alone will make life easier for her. Just be loving and accepting, let her define herself, don't oush her to pic "bi" or "straight" or a gender identity. She's confused enough right now and she's trying to read your response, trying to be what she feels you want her to be will only make her more conflicted, she feels pulled in so many directions right now. I think she's telling you not bc she's seeking any advice, she just really wants to feel accepted and loved for who she is from the most important person in her life. It is an honor that she told you, I could never talk to either of my parents about my bisexuality. All the best to both of you!

[koopie57]

9. I can hear how scared and confused you are

and one thing I have learned the importance of is to listen and to not to dismiss her feelings by referring to them as ridiculous or other negative words. It is hard, but it might be better to say that You are glad she is a girl and to ask her about these feelings of wanting to be a boy. I have found that the more information you get from them, the more you have to work with both for yourself and for her.

One other thing is she might be saying it to get a reaction from you, to test your love or cuz she is curious about the feelings she is having and want to say them out loud to see how it feels, if it sounds funny to her or a relief.

I know how hard this is, the confusion, hurt, anger ... all those feelings, but that is the way it is right now. It won't be this way forever, but just for now.

[Fridays Child]

11. Please read about unconditional positive regard (UCR)...

...if you're unfamiliar with the term. The basic idea is that you love her because of who she is, not in spite of who she is. She needs to hear this from you.

Also, please don't respond to her remarks about herself with "That's ridiculous." You mean well, I know, when you try to disencumber her of her notions. But she needs validation. She needs to know that how she feels is ok and that it's ok to tell you about it.

In addition to UCR, try using reflection, when she talks about herself: listen to what she's saying and give her confirmational responses, without repeating her words verbatim. Using your own words, say, something like, "So what you're telling me is...."

Reflection and UCR, when used consistently, will provide her with validation, which is the basis of self-acceptance.

[Warpy]

12. My best guess

is to contact the closest PFLAG chapter and find a sympathetic therapist for her to talk to in order to explore these issues. If you're in New England, I remember the Boston Homophile Union used to do wonderful work along those lines, saving the lives of a lot of depressed gay kids who were having a rotten time coming to terms with who they were surrounded by rotten high school kids. There may be a similar organization near you.

Good luck to you both.

[TriMetFan]

13. Wow

First get in touch with your local PFLAG. I think they can help you out. Also I would say just do as my parents did. They just told me that they loved me and would help me accept who I was. I was a little scared and that was the best thing my parents could have done. This was 25 years ago and I got to say my relationship with my parents is even more strong then ever.

It's good that you don't care and that you just love your kid.

[Rowdyboy]

15. She knows you love her but reassure her anyway....

Hell, she may not figure it out for years (I didn't until I was 25). Give her time and room and love.

[murielm99]

16. When my daughter first came out, she told me she was bi.

She was 19, and she was in her first relationship with a woman.

Before that, she had dated boys and had been sexually active with one boy. I just accepted what she told me, and welcomed her partner.

My gay brother told me that he thought it was a cop-out. He told me that gay people who are just coming out are often unsure of themselves, and they may say that they are bisexual. He told me that it takes time for people to figure things out.

I gave her the benefit of the doubt. After all, there are bisexual people in the world. Who knows? Maybe your daughter is bi? That would not be so terrible.

After awhile, my daughter was comfortable being a Lesbian. She told me about her first crush on a girl at 17. She told me how, at 17, when she was winning every academic and musical award under the sun, she wanted to end her life. I felt so terrible that I was not there for her. But she did not tell me or her father. She had to sort out her own feelings.

I did feel a sense of loss when she first told me. Yes, it would be easier to have a hetero daughter. It would be easier for her, not me.
And she does want to have children someday. There is no reason why she can't do that. She wants to marry her partner someday, too. I hope that day comes.

Please do go to PFLAG. Get some counseling for yourself. It is a process of acceptance for parents, as well as gay or bi children. If they can suggest appropriate counseling for your daughter, please get it for her. I regret that my daughter went through so much anguish and pain on her own, even though it did turn out all right in the end. Get all the help you need.

[Divernan]

17. Who exactly were in the "group" in her group counseling?

Because that is evidently where she ran into a situation leading to her comment that "some lesbians are scary". I hate to think that an adolescent who is at this point unsure of her sexual orientation was somehow placed into a counseling group which contained lesbians so butch as to be scary. I ran into that kind of situation when I signed up for a women's self-defense course back in the 70's (advertised at my university) and turned out to be the only straight woman in a group of about 20. I was married with kids but got aggressively propositioned because they assumed I wouldn't have signed up for the course if I wasn't in the closet. Actually, I just didn't want to take a self-defense course in which I wouild have to physically confront strange men.

I've taught women's studies classes, and I saw situations where being lesbian was considered more of a political than a sexual decision. The lesbians felt that any woman in a hetero relationship was consorting with the enemy, and they put a lot of pressure on other women to switch from hetero to gay. I would guess it's not easy to find a counselor who truly has no bias one way or the other re sexual orientation. But in any case, at this stage of your daughter's development and maturity, I think she should get some one-on-one counseling and not "group therapy".

And as others have said, there is no rush on her decision - she is also at the stage in life where she has to decide what career path she wants to train for and follow - and she'd be better off to focus her primary energies on her schoolwork for now.

[readmoreoften]

19. why are butches scary?

are queens scary? is gender diversity scary? is being socially unacceptable to straights scary? is 'looking queer' scary?

I doubt that this girl is being harrassed by lesbian separatists. I am 34 years old and I have taught gender studies at the university level and I have taken women's studies courses and lesbians have not hassled straight women for 'consorting with the enemy' since the lesbian separatist movement in the 70s. And those same lesbian separatists alienated butches and femmes from their college, upper-class, white movement as well. Many of those 'political choice' lesbians 'chose' to be conservative heterosexuals once they 'grew up'.

Since then the whole 'girls coercing girls into political lesbianism' is a myth perpetuated by the right. If this woman's daughter finds lesbians 'scary', it might be because they are so 'out' and she is afraid to be out. It also might be that they are very serious and politically active with the realities of our communities face, and this girl just wants to fuck around and have sex.

Speaking as a femme, most dykes refused to accept me as a dyke throughout the 90s and assumed I was a straight girl looking for fun or 'not a real lesbian'. In my experience lesbians are not eager to claim straight girls as their own.

[readmoreoften]

18. there is only one thing you can do

You can say, "Okay, I love you whoever you are."

Maybe she is bisexual now and will be straight in the future.
Maybe she is bisexual now and will be bisexual in the future.
Maybe she is bisexual now and will be a lesbian in the future.
Maybe she is bisexual now and will consider herself polysexual.
Maybe she will discover that she is not a lesbian or a bisexual woman, but that she is actually a heterosexual, bisexual, or even a gay male. And being transgendered is not 'ridiculous'; it is a reality for thousands of people.

But in the end, your daughter will be a legal adult in a matter of months and it is not your place to 'help her figure out' who she wants to be sexually. She will figure herself out through dating and by relating or not-relating to the lives of other open, out GLBT people.

Because you have an agenda for her, your weighing in on this issue will only confuse her. Just tell her that you love her no matter what and teach her about safe sex.

Discovering who you are sexually is a life-long process, not an event and your parents have little to do with it.

[cally]

20. Thanks all

I've read and re-read each post. I'm thinking about all of what you have posted. Thanks all for the advice.

(I think my initial post didn't work)

[BlackVelvetElvis]

21. There's some excellent advice in this thread.

My cousin just went through those exact stages (and the depression) and finally accepted herself after 5 years of struggling.
I agree with those here that dismissing her feelings won't help her at all and that counseling for yourself (PFLAG) is a wonderful idea. Parents there have all been through the same thing.
Make your home an emotionally safe environment for her. My cousin's family didn't and that made it much harder on everyone. Let her feel like you will love her no matter what. Listen to what she has to say and give advice if it is asked for.
I hope it works out.

[Boomer]

23. I don't have any advice...

...since so many others have done a great job on that score. So, I just thought I'd add a few comments about your post.

>> To be honest, yeah I wish she was straight because it's easier in this society. <<

Ironically, I think I've had it easier because I'm a gay woman. I know that isn't everyone's experience, and I'm not denying being gay can be difficult for many people, but in my case it's had more benefits than disadvantages.

Overall, it's a lot safer getting involved with women than men. Many of my straight women friends have had at least one or two violent episodes with a boyfriend or close escapes from date rape. Their chances of an unwanted pregnancy are higher -- with the accompanying derailment of college or career plans. They are more likely to have conflicts in their marriage if their career outshines hubby, or to feel overwhelmed by the demands of being a mother, a housewife, and a full-time professional. Not to mention, they are at a greater risk of getting AIDS from a straight man than I am from a gay women.

>> how some lesbians are scary <<

I'm a 50-year-old lesbian and I confess I've also encountered a few lesbians that were a little scary. But not nearly as scary as a whole lot of straight men I've met through the years. In general, men are bigger, stronger and capable of inflicting serious damage if they get violent, and even the non-violent ones can be incredibly persistent in their sexual advances. Most straight women just accept that risk while searching for Mr. Right.

I'll take my chances with women, thank you very much, because more often than not the biggest danger I would ever face with them is an unpleasant scene with some shouting and tears or a slap on the face. As it is, I've never had any woman make a sexual advance that couldn't be deflected with a softly spoken, "Uh, thanks, but no thanks." Just try using that line on a guy who's trying to feel you up while riding on the subway and you'll appreciate just how scary men can be.

[xchrom]

24. the depression and the sexual identity question

may be linked -- but the depression part is the part that would concern me.

that may have less to do with sexuality in the long run.
and that's why i would get counseling for myself at that point.
as well as contact an organization like pflag.

depression can be a long term condition -- and may be organically based{i.e. brain chemistry} and need sophisticated treatment.

remember it's about healthy relationships that bolster a loving self esteem that's more important than the gender of the person loving your daughter.

[cally]

26. Again thanks....I would like to explain the 'scary lesbian'

comment. I should have explained in my first post. When she was 16 she went on a retreat for school and ended up rooming with rainbow alliance folks. I think they assumed she was over 18. She ended up having a good time and most started treating her as a little sister when they realized how young she was. I know she doesn't think all lesbians are scary since she has had out friends.

[freestyle]

27. PFLAG, local GLBT community center or bookstore

Depending on where you live, any of those could be good resources for you and your daughter. PFLAG, Parents Friends and Family of LGBT People, is a great organization that can be especially helpful through the questioning or coming out process. Also, for the depression, make sure that the therapist is truly accepting of all people.

Those teen years are tough anyway. Let your daughter know how much you love her, and that you support her on her journey, wherever it may end up. Sexuality is fluid, and she may not be in the same place at 27 that she is at 17, but will still be person in need of love, respect, and support. Good luck to both of you.

[UncleSepp]

28. "I told her that was ridiculous"

Cally, honey, I'm glad you're asking. :hug: But telling your daughter that what she feels and wishes is ridiculous is not at all being supportive. I think you know that.

Your daughter has told you she likes boys and girls, and also that she wishes she were a boy. You've heard this clearly enough to reiterate it here, but you seem to have decided that what she really meant was that she is a lesbian. Why? It sounds like she is telling you that she's transgendered and bi.

You're right, it is easier in this society to be straight. It's still easier to be just about anything except for transgendered. Being transgendered is not ridiculous. It's hard, it can be heartbreaking, but it is not deserving of ridicule. Your daughter is not deserving of ridicule.

It is possible that her "I wish I were a boy" comment was just an offhanded comment, but it would be safe to take it seriously. Help her find books and movies and websites about female to male transsexuals, about lesbian people, about bisexual people. The gesture may get you a slammed door or a "get out of my business" and some rolled eyes (she's 17, right?), but she'll appreciate the gesture of acceptance, and the information will be useful.

Your daughter may be different from what you expected, but she is who she is. Being gay, bi, lesbian, transsexual, or a combination of any of the above is not a sentence to a life of unhappiness. You'll both be okay.

Just listen to her. Hear what she's saying, not what you think she's saying. Believe her when she describes her own feelings, noone can know her feelings better than her.

:hug: I have got to run to work now. Please PM me if you like. By the way, I'm a bi female, 33, who has been transgender-identified for some time. I knew as a little kid (5) that I wanted to be a boy. I am a successful professional with a good life in a nice town. I wear suits and ties at work, flirt with girls sometimes in the hall, and nobody gives a hoot. :-)

[cally]

29. I didn't relate the entire conversation

I agree that it was not the best of terms but the entire conversation had much more to it. I had listened a long time before I said that. My whole comment was something like, It sounds like you may be bi or a lesbian. That's OK but it doesn't mean you want to be a boy. She then said, you're right. Then laughed. We talked more and that's when I said, "It's ridiculous." I'm not perfect but I think I handled the conversation fairly well since she left knowing I accepted her and feeling it's OK to discuss this with others.

[Jamastiene]

30. I agree with you on this one

I think you have given good advice and it's information I wish I had had years ago for myself.

And to the OP:
What AuntJen said about being gblt doesn't necessarily mean living a life of unhappiness it true too. I'm the exception to the rule on that actually. MOST gblt people ARE the happiest people because they have reached a point where they have found themselves AND overcome a lot of hardships. You can't protect your daughter from all unhappy events in life, but you can be supportive and I am glad you are at least trying to learn more. My parents just say they are supportive and think they need no further information and some of the things they say to me and about me have caused me more pain than they will ever know. THAT's when it's the worse for a younger person trying to come out and find people who will be supportive. I give you credit for trying and I want to let you know I appreciate that you ARE trying even though you aren't my parent. At least some other poor young person won't have to live the life I have lived and still have adolescent feelings of inferiority, depression, and alienation at the age of 34 like I do. Bravo to you that you actually want things to go well for your kid. My mother makes damn sure she punches me in the gut figuratively every chance she gets.