How does an atheist cope with death of a loved one?

[wryter2000]

I consider myself an agnostic. My husband is more of an atheist. I've always avoided thinking about what happens after death because I believe nothing happens after death, but that answer doesn't make me particularly happy.

My husband's dying now, and he isn't suffering, so I don't have to worry about that. I'm finding that I'm coping very well with the thought of losing him. But I can't get past the idea that he'll cease to exist. He's not rational now, and he can't talk so that I can understand him, anyway. So, there's no way he can reassure me that he's accepting what's happening to him.

Has anyone dealt with a death this close to them without the comfort of a hereafter? Can you share any advice on how to cope with the end of someone you love?

TIA

[YankeyMCC]

1. My father died earlier this month

While atheist seems a little to simplistic to describe how I view the universe (pantheist might be closer...I'm still working that out) that is probably the best description for me that is handy and easily understood.

Suffice to say I don't believe in a personified god or single intelligent force designing and controlling the universe and I don't believe in an afterlife. And I don't believe what we do here should be determined by what we think might happen to us after we die - in other words do good or kill infidels just so we can go to heaven or whatever.

How the people who we love that die before us live on is through us. Through our memories and in the ways they have shaped our lives. So for me dealing with my father's death is coming in two ways.

I'm trying to capture memories of him. He was on the Maddox during the Tokin Gulf incident, kicking off the VN War. He was interviewed about that just after I was born so now I have a project to try and find that footage.

I'm also holding myself up to the mirror of his example. He has shaped my life greatly, but I see that I could be doing more. He was a good man that affected many lives, particularly children. I am trying to do better in bringing other people into my life and helping to fill the hole left by his death in the lives of his grandchildren.

So I'm couping by ensuring his life continues to have meaning to those of us who are still alive. His example will continue to inspire, I an others will continue to talk about him and tell his story.

Hope that makes some sense and helps you.

[wryter2000]

2. That does make sense

And it's a great help. Thank you. :yourock:

[lapislzi]

10. My condolences, YMCC

I lost my dad 2 weeks ago. He was a WWII vet who hated war because he lived through one.

You try to follow their example, honor their sacrifices, and patch the holes where you can.

I brought out every photo I could find of my dad, and when people came to call, I was surprised at how everyone responded to these. The photos enabled our family and friends to assemble a mosaic of a man's life with many different perspectives. It was therapeutic for everyone, and I learned more than a little about someone with whom I didn't always have the smoothest of relationships.

I hope you're doing OK. Be sure to take extra good care of yourself over the coming weeks and months. You miss 'em around the corners.

Peace and hugs to you.

[fshrink]

3. It's a long painful process

which amounts to cutting one by one the multitude of tiny bonds between us and the person, each time taking a little bit of him/her inside of us, integrating him/her to us. WE, those who keep on living, are the "thereafter". That's how we still carry bits of all of our ancestors from hundreds of generations past. Coping is so personal that I can't see any general principle, I guess we just go through it as best as we can... As to him accepting, you can bet on it; our brain is an extremely powerful organ which protects us against suffering until after we stop breathing (5' or 6' after in fact). Endorphins and a host of other stuff are protecting him and will protect and care for him until the end. Hang in there!

[wryter2000]

5. Thank you

Great ideas. And very comforting. :yourock:

[trotsky]

4. I'd be lying if I said it wasn't difficult.

It's one of the least appealing aspects of atheism. Although one could be an atheist and still believe in some sort of afterlife, since technically atheism just means lacking a belief in *gods*. Everything else is still in play.

Myself, I don't believe in any of it. Just as I did not exist before I was born, so I will cease to exist when I die. For me, that's not a problem - ceasing to exist, it's not like I'll "miss" living. But when it comes to losing loved ones, it's very hard. I know I'll never see them again. It is my opinion that religion really "hooks" into people when it comes to death - they're vulnerable, they want to believe they'll see their family members again, etc. However just because something sounds good doesn't make it true.

I like what YankeyMCC wrote. The person lives on through you. A beautiful analogy I heard one time was to compare humanity to a giant tree. Each of us starts as a bud on a branch, grows into a leaf, and provides the tree with a little bit of sustenance before we grow old and fall. Each of us in our own way contributes to the tree of humanity, and our contribution can never be taken away.

[wryter2000]

6. Fabulous

I was so happy when I woke up this morning and thought of this group. As much as I appreciate friends who will keep Hal and me in their prayers, their prayers couldn't give me any answers I could use. I knew you guys would.

:loveya:

[devinsgram]

7. Several years ago

I worked as an aide in hospice. Most to of the time I was assigned patients that were close to their deaths and some of the time, I was there with them when the time came. One gentleman remains quite vivid in my memory. He was an elderly man that had lost his wife about five years before. He was a resident in a very nice church related home. I was with him about a month when he started his decline due to cancer. The morning he died, I had arrived to find him doing very poorly and I was told his death was eminent. I sat by his side and held his hand telling him his family was on their way and assured him I would not leave him. I told him that it was ok for him to go and that his family would understand, because I could tell he was trying to hold on till they arrived so he could say goodbye. As I was talking to him I could see the gold chain around his neck was twisting into knots, sort of like when you put a chain in a drawer and it gets mixed up with other chains and knots up, almost impossible to untangle. It was the only necklace on his neck and I just thought that was kind of weird, how could it have gotten so knotted like that.

Anyway, he looked at me and nodded and within moments he slipped away. I immediately went to get the nurse to let her know that he was gone and then I preceded to get his body ready for his family to view him on their arrival. As I was preparing him I noticed that the necklace that had been so knotted just moments before was completely untwisted and laying around his neck just like it always did before. I could not believe my eyes, it was perfectly straightened out.

I asked the nurse if she had done something to his necklace and she said she hadn't touched anything, because she knew I would take care of everything. I'm not sure what had happened, but it has always stayed with me.

Many of the nurses I worked with told many different stories about what had happened with their patients, but we all agreed that when the time came their was definitely something they could feel happen. Most of the time, the word used the most to describe was "peaceful". It was as though the air was full of energy and then it was "peaceful."

[wryter2000]

8. Thank you!

I'm waiting for a hospice referral so I can bring Hal home. IMHO, hospice workers are saints. If I know at the end that he's at peace, I'll be able to accept his going.

:loveya:

[Behind the Aegis]

9. Some ideas and advice

First let me say, my heart goes out to you. Second, I consider myself a pagan, so this may not be what you are looking for, but I hope it will provide insight. So here it goes...

Atheist, agnostic, pagan, Jew, Christian, whatever, all cope with death in a variety of ways, not just based on their beliefs. Grief is universal and knows no bounds. Grief is natural and should not be avoided, but embraced and worked through. It is on-going and does not have an "expiration" date. Everyone deals with grief in their own way! It is one of the most personal emotions we have, IMO.

You asked "Has anyone dealt with a death this close to them without the comfort of a hereafter?" I have not, so I can't address this except from an 'academic' point of view. I will say this, however; many of us with 'faith' in an afterlife use that belief as a crutch. We use it as a way to subside our pain in thinking..."they are at peace, they are better off, the are with (insert deity)," and this is a way to avoid with a sense of loss. To deny the "goodness" of the afterlife, causes those with faith to own up to their own loss and pain. Faith provides a "cover" of "I am OK, because s/he is with..." This often leaves the person left behind in need of much healing. This is not to say that all people of faith do not heal from loss, but many disguise their pain, because not to do so, might show that they do not have "true" faith in their beliefs.

What I suggest is you talk about your feelings with those close to you or a grief counselor (make sure they are religious neutral as that could compound your pain). I also feel you should be honest with yourself...if you are sad..cry..get mad...whatever you feel, express it, don't repress it! Do it safely. Do not let other tell you how to grieve or feel about your upcoming loss. You can take advice, but make it your own. Do things that remind you of times the two of you had together that brought you joy. Take someone with you who doesn't mind a damp shoulder, and talk about all the good times you had. Also, know that one emotion that shows itself during this time is anger. This is also OK. Embrace it with a strong person and work though it as well. Enough of the academics. I am not sure if it is helpful, but I hope it is.

I have been called a 'story-teller' by my best friend. She says that I tell stories about myself that allows people to feel what I feel and also see things for themselves. So, I will tell you a story and I mean no disrespect. I am not trying to take away from your pain, but trying to let you see mine, in hopes that my pain will help you.

This story is about my Aunt Becky (on my mom's side by marriage). She was a kind woman. She married her high-school sweetheart, my uncle, and had two children. While she was pregnant with her second child and a week after my birth, he (my uncle) was killed in a car accident. My aunt never recovered from his death. She never remarried, never even dated, and raised their two children alone without government assistance. She was a kind woman with a big heart. She loved her children, her grandchildren, and her nephews.

On March 15th of this year, she passed away at 53. She had been very sick, and it looked like she was getting better, but her liver just gave out on her. One of my brothers called me at 10am in the morning to tell me she was gone. I was devastated. I was talking on AIM with my partner at the time and told him what had happened. He offered to come home, I told him I would come pick him up, but I had to call my mom. My mother and my aunt were as close as sisters. My mom was at her side when she passed away. The year before, my mom held her own mother and father's hands as they passed on. My mom was emotionally destroyed. I am very, very close to my mom (but, must of us gay guys are :)), but I knew I needed to deal with my own pain.

After I got of the phone with mom, I went and got Tracy (my partner), and we came home. I sobbed for an hour. Sobbed, not cried. I was sobbing so hard, I lost my breath a few times. As I calmed myself, I knew I would have to be strong for others, so I prepared a "script." It went something like..."Aunt Becky wanted to be with Uncle Mike again, and she is. She got to see her grandchildren and she knew she was loved." I did believe what I was saying, but I also knew that my life was now more empty. I knew that I could never pick up the phone and call her and make her giggle, as I often did. I knew that she "knew" I was gay, as she had met Tracy just a few months before, but I would never be able to tell her. I knew it didn't matter to her and that she loved me no matter what. I knew that Tracy would never get to really know her and that made me so sad.

So here we are in December 2004, almost 9 months have passed. I still cry sometimes when I think of her. I am crying now. But, that is OK. It is how I deal with her loss. I tell others how beautiful she was, how special to me she was and is. I still have the wrapping paper from her last Christmas gift to me. I believe people move to another plane of existence, but that still does not take away the pain I have that she is not here with me! I acknowledge the good times I had with her, and mourn the times I will not have with her. I hold onto the the fact that my life is brighter because she was/is in it! That is how I deal with her leaving.

As I said earlier, I do not mean to take away from your pain. I want you to see that I can express my feelings about my loved one and hope you will do the same. I do pray. I also pray for people that leave us, but I pray more for the people left behind. I do not mean to offend you, but I will pray that you will have friends come to your side and support you and love you. And, I pray that, in one of your weakest moments, you find strength. You know your husband is an atheist, take heart in that he is OK with what is happening, but is probably just as sad that he is leaving you. Just because death is a part of life, doesn't mean we have to greet it with joy.

I hope you share your happy thoughts of him with us here at DU. I hope you share your memories of good times with your loved ones. May your last days with him be as happy as possible. May you also know that this Du'er has you in his thoughts!

[wryter2000]

11. Thank you so much

I do not mean to offend you, but I will pray that you will have friends come to your side and support you and love you. And, I pray that, in one of your weakest moments, you find strength. You know your husband is an atheist, take heart in that he is OK with what is happening, but is probably just as sad that he is leaving you.

Please do pray for us. Both of us.

I hope I can reassure him that I will be okay. I'm grieving plenty, and I'll continue to do so. But I'm very strong, and having Hal's love for 26 years has made me stronger.

I'm sorry for your loss of your Aunt Becky. 53 is so young to die. Mostly, I'm sorry for her loss of her husband. That must have been terrible for her to bear.

[PassingFair]

13. Wryter, it may not help much now...

but as an atheist, I know that when my atheist father died, I felt nothing but undiluted, unclouded, pure grief. My face literally hurt for weeks afterwards from being contorted by grief.
The GOOD news is that I seem to have gotten over his death faster than those with unanswered questions and theories. Being a naturally emotional type, I still tear up thinking about him a couple of times a year, but I am MUCH more likely to find myself smiling about one of his comments or jokes. Or how much he loved us. The bottom line is that there is nothing you can do about it; and that time, while it may not exactly HEAL all wounds, at least takes the sting away.
When my husband's father died, his family was so mad at him that even the catholic high mass did nothing to comfort any of them. I think they are still angry and have never moved beyond that, let alone grieved properly.

[wryter2000]

15. Thanks

I know I'll be all right...eventually.

[arwalden]

12. After his death, Carl Sagan's wife and co-author Ann Druyan wrote...

http://www.csicop.org/si/2003-11/ann-druyan.html
(scroll to bottom of page to find the complete text)

When my husband died, ... many people would ... ask me if Carl changed at the end and converted to a belief in an afterlife. ... Carl faced his death with unflagging courage and never sought refuge in illusions. ... I don't ever expect to be reunited with Carl. ... Every single moment that we were alive and we were together was miraculous — not miraculous in the sense of inexplicable or supernatural. ... We found each other in the cosmos, and that was wonderful.

---

Carl Sagan suffered from a rare blood disorder that led to cancer and ultimately to his death on 20 December 1996. He remained skeptical until the end, saying, "If some good evidence for life after death were announced, I'd be eager to examine it; but it would have to be scientific data, not mere anecdote. ... Better the hard truth, I say, than the comforting fantasy."

Demon-Haunted World, p. 204.

[wryter2000]

14. I should have thought of Sagan

I also should see if I can find any words of wisdom from Stephen Jay Gould when he knew he was dying. Thanks for pointing me in this direction.

[wryter2000]

16. Hi, all

Hal passed away quietly in his sleep on Wednesday morning. I finally concluded that, no matter what happened, I'd have his love because that lived inside me.

Thanks for sharing your wisdom.

[arwalden]

17. My Sincere Condolences To You, And To All Who Loved Hal!

I know the next few days and weeks will be difficult for you. I hope you and your family will all be able to give each other the comfort and support and love to make things easier to handle.

Always,
-- Allen :hug:

[JNelson6563]

20. Encouragement to you Allen!

And remember that Hal will always be alive as long as you keep him so. My dad was the hardest death I've ever experienced, we'd always been very close. Many years later I still think of him every day. I recall his wisdom, his humor and his compassion with great fondness. I am grateful for all I learned from him and in some ways, he will be with me until my own death. I have shared much about him with those who are dear to me and he will also live on through some of them.

Best wishes for you in this difficult time-
Julie

[YankeyMCC]

18. My sympathies...

And I'm glad that the people here were able to help you think about how to deal with this.

[Commie Pinko Dirtbag]

19. Better, I believe

Because no mean bearded guy in the sky took your loved one DELIBERATELY. Example: if I had lost my entire family in the tsunami AND I believed in God I think I would go crazy.

I can accept chance, because it is truly fair. It isn't after anyone in particular, and it doesn't hold grudges.

My sympathies for your loss. :hug: