This may help with current pessimism on Kerry's chances

[karynnj]

This is from ONE WEEK before the Iowa caucuses - the title telles all they are saying the campaign is in a death spiral.

http://www.gregabbott.org/C1911143254/E1559797904/index.html

I also found a late spring - yes, after the primaries - article saying the Democrats should offer Kerry a Supreme court position (presumable if the Democrats won) and nominate someone more electable - like Edwards or maybe a governor. (They didn't answer why Kerry creamed the elecable Edwards in the primaries.) The media was brutal.

I was trying to use google to find the poll where hospitality (hotel, resteraunt people picked Kerry - with no success.

[Island Blue]

1. Wow, could whoever wrote this have possibly been more wrong?

I don't think so. This is why there's no use in getting too worked up about anything at this point. (Polls, articles, etc.) I wonder how many more stories just like this one were written pre-Iowa?

[karynnj]

2. Many

Because I was googling (Iowa hotel restaurant poll Kerry), I got lots of Iowa stuff - if anything it was far worse than the pre-joke time period. It was sick as well - Mickey Kaus and others with long ramblings trying to answer the question of why Kerry was so unlikeable. One pundit listed his favorite Listing several democrats, then a Clark Bush tie, then everyone listed in the telephone books of 20(?) major cities/ Kerry.

[politicasista]

3. Wow

Speaking of the primaries, there is a small post at the JK blog about 08, saying that the "botched" joke won't hurt Kerry's chances for 08, but that he may have trouble beating Hillary and Obama in the primaries.

It's one person's opinion and it's very, very early, but the article sums it up above and blm's threads about waiting until the prmmary debates and letting the voter's decide the candidate, which IMHO is the best approach.

It is becoming very clear that the corporate media is pushing Hillary, Obama, McCain, Guilani (and even Condi--from an MSNBC headline about the women and "purses" and how it could impact 08).

The American media is lazy, biased and image oriented, so we have to be the media now.

[karynnj]

4. It's very interesting that the Kerry people posted it

I think the biggest problem is that the media is trying to replace the image of Kerry at the debates with Kerry making this one statement. I don't think it will work - unless Kerry makes other misstatements.

I also think that when you consider Hillary and Obama vs Guillini and McCain - if the war on terror and Iraq are still issues, I think Hillary and Obama will both have a tough time being seen as someone who can lead the country. (Edwards too) Someone posted an article here saying that only Gore, Kerry and Clark can do this on the Democratic side.

In 2004, Kerry used a network of veterans and firefighters as the core of his support. Joke not withstanding, who do you think is likely to get the veteran vote in the primaries? My quess is Kerry - if he reaches out to them enough. Remember that Cleland still supports Kerry. (Clark is the only other one who may - though it might be that he would be seen as too far removed as a General.) I really doubt that Obama or Hillary could get them.

[Inuca]

5. Quite a read... thank you

I am one of those who started to be interested in Kerry late in the 04 cycle, and started REALLY liking him and learning more about him only after the election. I am 1000s of miles behind most of you guys... At the time of the Iowa primaries, I knew about Dean and not much else (and would probably voted for him if I had the chance). I know close to nothing about what went on before the primaries, etc. Reading the little article linked in your post was quite an eye opener. I now wish with all my heart for Kerry to get the nomination and then win, we are in such an unbelievable and horrible mess, and dragging much of the world into moving sands with us, that it is easy to get utterly demoralized. I want somebody with lots of brains, and a soul to match at the helm. It is a selfish wish, I often think that the situation now is so bad, that no matter who will be in charge in the near future, history may not treat him kindly, unfair as it may be. Among all the others that are mentioned, the only one whose brains and soul I trust (though not as much as JK's) is Obama, but I do think that experience matters an awful lot, and he most clearly does not have it yet. I will be truly disappointed in him if he decides to run, unless he clearly runs aiming for the 2nd spot (how do you do that?) for which I think he would be ideal. Following the news, the various talking heads, etc., especially lately, I often get discouraged about Kerry's chances. It's truly disgusting how he almost seems to be an object of ridicule. Well.... we shall see.

[karynnj]

6. I wonder if he really will run

He has seen jow nasty things are and knows that anything that can be used against him will be. He has too young kids - the youngest is about 6. His wife, Michelle opted to stay in Chicago so their lifes would not be disrupted. From a person who was met them, they are awesome.

I've noticed one thing with the talking heads, they may ridicule Kerry when he is not there - but he ends up doing better on their shows than anyone else I can think of. (Clinton, as an ex-President gets a different level of deference - but the Fox show was the only one where he was pushed at all - and he over reacted. McCain is usually all but bowed to - but when questioned even gentlely is horrible.)

It may come down to Gore's decision. If Gore doesn't run - the anti Clinton race looks like Kerry, Obama and Edwards. What Kerry did for the party was real - and is known by the people he helped. They also saw who helped them and who helped Kerry when he was down - many of these people were vets Kerry helped. Dean was fantastic in his comment about Kerry - likely because he is a real person and has experienced the same thing. Even in the Fox interview - Kerry was able to lay out his agenda.

[TayTay]

7. There is so much to go through before the first '08 vote

Remember, in Iowa in '04, a lot of people did not make up their minds until the weekend before that Monday vote. The people who actually vote have a way of making all the prognosticators and pundits look foolish. They vote based on whatever is current and accumulated at that moment.

We have so much to go through in the next year. It matters that the Senate changed hands and that Democratic Senators now have to power to subpeona witnesses and compel testimony about oversight and accountability in the Bush Administration. Sen. Kerry alone, can call for hearings in his Commerce Committee role as chair of the sub-committee on Technology, Innovation and Competitiveness. (Gawd, think about all that is covered in that one committee.) Sen. Kerry chairs one of the smallest committees in Finance, that of the Long Term Debt of the US and how to address it. He also chairs the sub-committee on Asian and South Pacific affairs for Foreign Relations.

Then there is the full Chairmanship of Small Business. It might be possible to combine all these roles and really and truly call for a hearing, with compelling legal authority to issue subpeonas and investigate why the contracts were awarded the way they were after Katrina. Why did Halliburton subsidiaries get those SBA contracts? (There is a lot more, but just think about that for a second.)

All the Senators have that. Sen. Kerry will now be about the 16th or so most senior Member of the Senate. (He was around 18th or 19th. Sen. Sarbanes had more senority, but he retired. Sen. Jeffords of Vt also retired.)

This is real power. These are incredibly important venues from which to push your issues. (Health Care for kids. Sponsoring innovation in science for dealing with environmental issues, etc.) We have no idear at this point how this will play out. But there is real reason to think that this is a chance to really distinguish the issues and the Senators who guide them.

[JI7]

8. one year ago it was Mark Warner who was seen as the big shot

and we all know what happened to that.

one thing i find funny is that Vilsack has announced he will run but we don't really see much promoting him or even speaking out against him. i guess he doesn't have much support and those who support others don't view him as a threat.

notice the difference with Kerry. people say how horrible a candidate he is and insist nobody likes him yet they feel to need to continue putting out articles and posts about how nobody likes him.

[ProSense]

9. Here's a disgusting accusation:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=132&topic_id=2986632&mesg_id=2986632

[ProSense]

10. Here is

my response:

http://www.dailykos.com/comments/2006/11/25/12733/213/386#c386

[JI7]

11. it's an opinion and the person is not accusing Kerry of plagiarism

they are saying people like KErry, Edwards etc are also following Clark's ideas. i disagree with the poster. but he isn't accusing Kerry or anyone else of plagiarism.

the person is saying something similar to what KerryGoddess posted on the big 3 automobible industry accepting Kerry's ideas.

[ProSense]

12. Unlike KG's, post

where the ideas were attributed to Kerry because he advocated them during the campaign, this is about Kerry adopting Clark's ideas. I disagree with that opinion. But this:

Want proof that I am right? Well, I have watched on countless occasions when Edwards or Kerry took the words right out of Clark's mouth AFTER they saw it meet with enthusiastic approval. That is leadership. When your ideas get adopted by your opponents. (Well, it is also plagiarism but that's another post)

The statement at the end looks like an accusation to me!

[JI7]

13. yeah, but it's just a poster on KOS

it's not really worth it to get outraged over and make a thread on it on DU. it's not a published piece or anything. just respond back on the Kos thread.

[ProSense]

14. I found it

unsual! I wouldn't say I was outraged, just wanted to set the record straight. There is a rule here where you can't call out other DU posters, but people do pick up post from other forums, including RW blogs, and comment on them.

[JI7]

16. it's not worth it, it just causes people to argue over things that are not

necessary.

we could easily find comments like that on Kos and many other threads. and Clark people, plus Edwards, Hillary etc can all find the same. i don't think anyone at DU wants to see the board filled with people picking out comments from random people that they don't agree with on the internet.

if you want to set the record straight than just answer back to the poster on that Kos thread.

[ProSense]

17. You're right!

I did resond after I posted the thread here. Originally, I didn't want to jump into the thread at Kos. You know, I should have left the link out of the thread here and respond as a rebuttal!

[WildEyedLiberal]

delete dupe n/t

[WildEyedLiberal]

15. I agree

I don't see how one Kossack Clarkie's opinion merits a thread on DU - plenty of people on Dkos and elsewhere have foolish opinions. You can't overreact to every single individual poster who makes a comment in a thread that you don't like. This wasn't even its own diary.

[MBS]

18. I know the article/poll you're talking about

(about Kerry and staff being favorites of hotel staffs , waitstaffs, etc) and I"m pretty sure I even saved it; it was so revealing about who Kerry and his staff were all about. It's buried in my stuff, but if/when I find it , I will be sure to post it here.