Do people sometimes listen to politicians before they applaude them

[Mass]

Some people have been acclaiming Feingold as a god this morning and now, they are all surprised that Reid says he does not want the Patriot Act to expire. Feingold said exactly the same thing, tough, this morning and yesterday.

[rox63]

1. They want to change it

to remove the sections that seriously violate people's civil liberties.

[Mass]

2. I know, but some people apparently did not understand that.

[kerrygoddess]

4. LOL! Because they do not listen!

For some it is not the substance but the packaging and I'm sure if that is the right phrasing.

[ProSense]

7. It's symptomatic of the knee-jerk response.

A lot of people respond to passing comments or only read bits and pieces of information put before them rather than to actually seek out the facts.

I think people who respond in this way never focus on the big picture. That's why they keep throwing out all these candidates as THE "great" one. I'm beginning to see articles about Corzine's tenure in the Congress, describing him as having little legislative impact. One of the things I remember from Kerry's farewell speech yesterday is the expertise in business and wall street affairs Corzine brought to the senate. Corzine also has a lot of passion and charisma. IMO, there is a lot more to a leader than his or her senate record. I'll take Corzine over Feingold any day.


Here's a good comment on Corzine:

WASHINGTON -- As he neared the end of his Capitol Hill career Friday, New Jersey Sen. Jon Corzine made one last pitch for a social cause, introducing a bill banning police from using racial profiling.

Like other liberal causes he has championed in his five years as senator, such as expanded health care and a higher minimum wage, the racial profiling bill isn't expected to go far in a Republican-ruled body.

"Jon showed that if you care about the issues, you don't worry about the odds on the other side," said New Jersey Sen. Frank Lautenberg, a fellow Democrat. "You go ahead and you do what you think is right."

http://www.thedailyjournal.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20051217/NEWS01/512170330/1002

[Inuca]

8. Racial profiling,,,

... was a very hot issue in NJ a few years ago (maybe still is, don't know, used to live there, moved to IL a bit over 2 years ago), several quite outrageous cases.

[ProSense]

11. In the early 1990s, it was awful!

The NJ Turnpike was like profile row. When the media got hold of the story, people were indeed outraged. Its still a very big issue.

[Inuca]

13. Indeed...

... the turnpike, and also the Gardenstate which I was using a lot. But as a white middle aged female I was feeling reasonably safe at 80 mph :)

[politicasista]

19. Hi Inuca!

Welcome! :hi:

[Inuca]

20. Thanks! (n/t)

[karynnj]

14. The little impact statement is so stupid

He spent most of the time in a Republican dominated Senate as a freshman. As such, if you just look for his name on things, it's not there. I liked that Kerry, both when campaigning for Corzine and in the Senate speech mentioned that he had a huge amount to do with the Sarbanes/Oxley bill. This is important legislation and as a legacy for 5 years as Senator is not bad - even if he did nothing else.

In NJ, (at the risk of miquoting) my memory was Kerry said that Corzine wrote most of the bill. In the Senate, Kerry mentioned that Sarbanes commended Corzine on all he did on that bill. My guess is that the NJ comment is more accurate, but saying it in the Senate would violate protocal. It's clear Sarbanes has his name on it because he's a very senior Senator.

I doubt that many people are aware of how big programs rarely end up named for Junior Senators - I didn't know this. It was well into the GE, that I knew that Kerry had anything to do with either the COPS program or the S-CHIP program. (Even in Hillary's book - she mentions working behind the scenes with Kennedy on this, calling it the biggest increase in government medical health insurance since 1965 - Kerry's name doesn't come up. I think she brings this up in the book as a balance to the failure of her plan. I am so glad that Kennedy will be on Kerry's side if both run. It could lead to an interesting exchange if she made the same claim in a 2008 debate - because it oddly shows that Kerry/Kennedy had a far more savvy plan that worked.

[ProSense]

16. You're right.

They kept repeating similar nonsense about Kerry during the campaign.

[JI7]

3. they react on the biases they have

rather than actually looking at what is going on.

there was a vote a while ago and Feingold voted with the Republicans while Feinstein voted with the Dems. don't remember which one it was, possibly some judge confirmation vote. but some started bashing Feinstein for the vote. so they didn't even take the time to read the name. just saw the first few letters and assumed it was Feinstein. and i can understand that since she does have a history of voting with them on some issues.

but you would think people would at least take the time to get the names right and try to understand what is going on.

[wisteria]

5. Feingold seems to be the flavor of the week. n/t

[ProSense]

6. I read his floor statement

It's posted on Common Dreams. Did nothing for me.

[Inuca]

9. Feingold is OK....

... the original vote against the Patriot Act is defnitely noteworthy, and in a way yesterday was "his day". Good for him!

[ProSense]

10. I agree. I applaud his efforts.

And understandably, Feingold is one of the most progressive senators. I still believe there is more to being an exceptional leader than how a senator votes. It makes no sense to jump the bandwagon of a member of Congress based on how he or she votes on a certain hot-button issue.


Welcome Inuca!

:hi:

[Inuca]

12. Agree to your agreement :-)

He's a very good senator/ He is also kind of bland, IMHO. As for presidential aspirations, even if I thought he was the greatest, I don't think it is realistic, things being as they are.

[karynnj]

15. I think the initial vote was noteworthy - but I understand why 99 voted

for it. They put the sunshine clause in because they were concerned about the same issues as Feingold. The problem was that there were things that really needed fixing and their was a sense of urgency.

It must have been a source of frustration to people like Kerry who had for at least 5 years been arguing for some of what was included to make it harder for terrorist to pass money around. If people would have taken Kerry's call seriously - a bill could have been written in a more thoughtful way that would have been far better.

The odd thing is that it was the preception that we have to something immediately after 911 when we were in reality no less safe than in 1996. I think in the wake of 911, the Senators wanted to fix certain obvious security flaws immediately - and the administration slipped in a few things that wouldn't have been accepted if more time was allowed to examine each one. The sunset clause was the compromise to get stuff started immediately.

I actually think that that vote - good in the primaries would be used in really negative ways in the general election. (There were important provisions)

[ProSense]

17. Excellent point! n/t

[politicasista]

18. It's cause of two things: IWR and Patriot Act

I agree there seems to always be a flavor of the week/month.