Time to get your emails geared up! Moving Keith? They'd better not!

[Clark2008]

http://www.mediabistro.com/tvnewser/msnbc/a_prime_schedule_shift_msnbc_may_move_carlson_to_8pm_develop_crime_show_20651.asp


Nothing is set in stone, but the ideas are on the table. Imagine Tucker Carlson at 8pm, a courts and crime show at 9pm, Joe in Scarborough Country at 10pm, and Countdown with Keith Olbermann at 11pm. It's just one of several scenarios that may perk executive ears, according to sources.

carlsonsoon.jpgA couple of things are certain: The network is very excited about Carlson's show, which is very tentatively slated to premiere in the next month. Pilot programs are underway. Perhaps it would fare better at 8pm, against O'Reilly and Zahn, than it would at 9pm, against King, Hannity and Colmes. (Is it a more natural lead-in after Hardball?)

The network is considering a Nancy Grace clone at 9pm -- not unlike what Dan Abrams has been doing, plugging the time slot vacated by Deborah Norville in January. lisadaniels.jpgLisa Daniels is a rising star at MSNBC, and some insiders believe she should have a shot at primetime. Perhaps the Friday at 4pm show was a tryout. Crime at 9 would serve as counterprogramming. (Plus, you've got Grace at 8 and Greta at 10.)

Some people believe Countdown would work well later in the evening. It's especially attractive to the key 25-54 demographic. Again: The changes are by no means guaranteed. But there's a buzz in Secaucus. Let's see if it gets louder...

Who in the hell would WATCH that line up when they already have Faux News?
Granted, all this is speculation, but I say that it's time to put an END to the rumors and force MSNBC's hand.

[Clark2008]

1. Kicking my own thread to add:

I've put the word out on other blogs, as well.

We really need an organized effort unless, of course, Keith WANTS to move to 11 p.m. (which I doubt - why would one want to move out of prime time?)

But, we really need to nip this one in the bud!

[Catchawave]

17. Ya know....

Jon Stewart does fabulous at 11pm ! BUT, I don't want Keith up against him either.

Remember, I was the one trying for Keith to get Koppel's gig, since network television may bring him more viewers and "tie money" :)

Imagine how our guy could let loose after "family hour" !

Time slot changes don't bother me, I just don't want to lose Keith and the Countdown snark!

[WhirlyGirl]

24. No kidding, what's left of my sanity would go right out the window ...

. . . though I don't believe any departure is in the offing. And like you, I'll stay with him no matter the time slot or network.

I said once I think we're all imprinted on Keith now, like little ducklings, and will waddle after him wherever he goes! :-)

(seito?-- got a duck family smilie?)

[gkhouston]

26. Whirly, I think he'd appreciate a *little* privacy...

I'm imagining a line of ducks following him into a baseball park while KO tries to explain them to the gate attendant, LOL!

[WhirlyGirl]

30. Yeah, might be embarrassing on dates, as well. Hafta get him a duck-sitter

. . . for such occasions.

[gkhouston]

32. WG, *no one* in their right mind

would voluntarily be a sitter for the KOEB. And there's no room left on Sparky's t-shirt to add another title. :-)

[WhirlyGirl]

35. That's right! So we'll just have to find somebody crazy enough to do it!

. . . Otherwise, somebody's up to his butt in disorderly duckies!

Botany's got the knowledge -- but I'm not sure he has the discipline Rev, for example, requires (and desires)...

[CC]

44. here ya go

[WhirlyGirl]

49. LOL - now multiply those two by about 10 or twelve, and it should just abt

. . . represent the KOEB.

(Btw, who's the female with "Keith"?)

[Clark2008]

55. I don't want his followers to waddle after him

I mean... I get what you're saying, but he needs... America needs to pay attention to him.
Not like ducklings after the Mommy, but as people who need truth in their lives.

Oh.. I'm not a Teen Beat sorta gal and this duckling thing bothers me.

No offense WG.

[WhirlyGirl]

58. Clark, I first came to appreciate Keith through his WRITING; now, what --

. . . does that tell you?

When I was lurking DU I spent many an hour, as I raked the yard and washed the dishes, pondering this group, trying to get my brain around the KOEB phenomenon. I knew it was sociologically significant, that it represented a positive social development of some kind, but it took me a while to identify and pin down the purpose it serves. Then it came to me.

From an early age, girls love to get together in clutches and cathect over cute guys. The need really seems to be hard-wired.

It also appears to have health benefits, perhaps from stimulation of the heart and circulatory system and the release of endophins. My mom's 87 and sharp as a tack; she still likes to discuss cute guys, and I kinda think that may have something to do with her being mentally sharp at 87. Seriously.

For about a quarter of a century, feminism drove group swooning underground as being undignified behavior for women who wished to be taken seriously, and that made women sad.

Now the tradition is reasserting itself. Once again it's becoming almost acceptable to giggle, swoon, and act silly over cute guys -- and I can't imagine this change arriving at a more welcome moment in our history. Or how we could have so lucked out as to have someone of Keith's intellectual attainments and professional integrity to swoon over.

For what thinking woman need be embarrassed about being swept away by someone of Keith's stature? In fact, I think Keith may have unconsciously tapped into this re-emerging female joyousness with his Playgirl campaign.

"Smart AND sexy."

That describes him -- and it also describes women who cheerfully appreciate him on every level. Far from identifying us as superficial airheads, what's happening every night within the KOEB is healthy normal feminine affiliative high spirits, and it's good for us!

[WhirlyGirl]

59. (Whew!-- is that some kind of Whirly Manifesto or what? LOL!)

[gkhouston]

63. actually, I've never been much of one for

drooling over cute guys, whether alone or in groups, but that's just me. You can imagine how well this went over in junior high school.

As for Clark's comment about not wanting to be a duckling, I wouldn't be following Keith to another venue out of blind devotion. I'd be doing it because he fills a niche that no one else does and it's worth rearranging my schedule or programming the VCR to see his show. There just isn't anyone else out there covering the news with the sort of even-handed thoughtful coverage he tries to bring to the airwaves every night.

[WhirlyGirl]

64. Yes, gk, you summed up perfectly why we would follow him anywhere ...

. . . The image of ducklings trailing after the bird they've imprinted on is, of course, how we'd appear to those looking on, and it's funny. But it's also an expression of my confidence in KO.

It doesn't surprise me that the good things I perceived in him have subsequently been confirmed by accounts of his actions in the past. I understand what it is about Keith which sets him apart. We've seen it reflected in his approach to his job, as you observed.

[Clark2008]

66. Hahahaha!

And I always thought it was because girls matured earlier than boys so we always "fell" for the older stars. ;)

[WhirlyGirl]

69. I had mad crushes on boys my own age, mostly. Was very particular...

. . . about the musical or Hollywood types I flipped for.

Didn't like the way teen magazines tried to convince us who the next "idol" should be. Their choices were usually sort of dopey-looking -- some middle-aged guy's concept of a girl's fantasy. Good luck! They guessed uniformly wrong in my case.

[CBHagman]

2. Why do they keep ramming Tucker Carlson down our throats?

Let's see. He's had his own show on CNN, albeit as a co-host. He had his own show on PBS, apparently thanks to Pat Mitchell worrying that Carlson was being confined to just one type of show (Poor Tucker only had a father employed in public broadcasting, unlike the elites on this message board). Now MSNBC's flinging Carlson at us again.

I mean, does Carlson have naked pictures of everybody or something? What exactly has he done to merit a place in prime time on any network? I sincerely don't see what he brings.

Then again, someone put Chris Matthews and Joe Scarborough on MSNBC, so I guess the human mind is just completely unfathomable.

[WhirlyGirl]

5. CBH, when I see a talentless guy getting an opportunity like this ...

. . . I think, "He must be (Lewinsky)ing somebody."

[CBHagman]

8. Looks more like a case of connections.

Everything I've read about Carlson suggests that he simply was born into the right family and married the right woman. It's not hard work and talent, from what I can tell.

Look at his bio:


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tucker_Carlson

[WhirlyGirl]

9. Nah, I *STILL* say . . . ;-)

. . . I mean -- look at that face!

[Catchawave]

16. I agree CB

I don't understand the Tucker Carlson promotion either, unless controversial pundits (is he even a journalist?) just mean higher ratings? He definitely has the cutesy factor, if you're into bow ties!

I never did see his PBS show, was it any good in a nonpartisan way?

Sadly, I hear rumors PBS and NPR are leaning more conservative/ corporate media for those hefty donations to keep them on the air.

To tell you the truth, I think Scarborough and Hannity were separated at birth!

Chris Matthews just gets on my nerves, even when he's agreeing with the "good guys"
:banghead:

[gkhouston]

20. If Scarborough and Hannity were separated at birth

which one of them got the brain? :shrug:

[WhirlyGirl]

37. I just re-read that subject line and gagged.

. . . ACK! ACK!

[Clark2008]

3. My letter.

Dear MSNBC:

Once again rumors of your changing line-up have made the Internet, this time, however, complete with a story on TV Newser.

The Newser article states that you are planning to move Countdown from 8 to 11 p.m. and put Tucker Carlson in at the 8 p.m. slot, followed by the new Dietl & Daniels Show at 9 p.m. Scarborough Country would follow, ending with Keith Olbermann's show.

I realize this site trades in industry gossip and this may be no more than someone's idea to float a schedule change, but I'd have to wonder why anyone would want to make these changes.

Let's be honest, who would watch this line-up when they already have the Fox News Channel? It's bad enough that you have two right wing pundits on in one evening, but to move the only decent news show in all of cabledom out of prime time and into a time slot when most Americans on the East coast are getting their late-night local news is a bit ludicrous.

Keith Olbermann's Countdown has become a steady tradition in my household for nearly two years, now. Olbermann's ability to flesh out issues by asking beautifully-crafted questions and his nose for digging up stories the other media do not, or will not, tell is refreshing. And, after the accolades he received for his Papal coverage, I cannot imagine his being relegated to the tail-end of MSNBC's Prime Time line-up to make room for a man who even Jon Stewart alleges is "harming America." (I agree with that assessment, by the way).

If MSNBC were smart, your executives would realize there is a thirst for unbiased news presented in an entertaining fashion out here. I, for one, am tired of television news covering half the bases on stories, asking inane questions of and/or yelling at their guests and probing no deeper than the top layer of any given issue. To compete with Fox News and CNN (who is becoming Fox Lite), MSNBC should offer its viewers more in-depth coverage with a nice "snark" like that that Olbermann presents.

Maybe Olbermann wants to move his show to 11 p.m., but I cannot think of one reason why he'd willingly leave a 'prime' Prime Time slot to be put up against local news in nearly every market in the Eastern Time Zone. However, I don't speak for him and can only speak for myself when I say that 8 p.m. is, in my home, Countdown time - when all other activities are stopped for viewing pleasure.

That said, I won't stop watching Olbermann, but you won't find me watching any of the rest of this line-up, either (personally, I'd rather you keep Dan Abrams somewhere in this line-up, as well). I seriously hope that this Internet industry news blog has this wrong; or, that your executives were floating ideas for feedback and that my feedback is considered and appreciated.

Sincerely,

Write to: [e-mail]

[WhirlyGirl]

4. Very readable, Clark. Clear and to the point.

. . . Kaplan seems set on putting bowtie boy in the 9pm slot so I'm not super-worried about Keith losing his 8 o'clock berth to him. But the ways of the networks are often as illogical as they are capricious, so I plan to lend my full my support to your "Save 8 P.M. for Keith" campaign, Clark.

I suspect that this is, as you suggest, an intentionally-leaked "trial balloon" to test viewer dedication to the various shows in MSNBC's line-up -- and if that's the case, we better try and get an "A" on this one!

[Berry Cool]

6. These rumors of a schedule change are only getting worse

because yesterday the executive producer of the Today Show was fired and Phil Griffin, MSNBC's VP of primetime, is now to be his replacement:

http://insidecable.blogsome.com/2005/04/20/phil-griffing-to-the-today-show/

So all we know is that there will be someone new calling the shots on MSNBC's primetime lineup. You're right. It's important that we let whoever it is know that we do not want change!

[WhirlyGirl]

7. But Kaplan, MSNBC's president, already announced Carlson's show at 9

. . . about a month ago. The new program guy will still have to implement Kaplan's wishes.

If the schedule is already set, it's not an issue anyway, right?

[Catchawave]

25. Uh Oh.....

And Imus was ranting this morning that Katie Couric was getting "long in the tooth" and needs to be replaced by one of the news bunnies at MSNBC ! He's such an a*hole sometimes. Though I burned out on Katie and Matt a long time ago. I think Today jumped the shark when Al got his stomach stapled.

I like GMA much better. BUT, I rather "watch" Imus.

[gkhouston]

27. Imus is longer in the tooth in Katie

did he say when his replacement will be starting? :D

(we need a smiley for batting eyelashes innocently)

[gkhouston]

28. off-topic, Catch

discussion and voting on your poll seems to have tapered off. If you're going to be at the meeting tonight, why don't you bring it up in the thread and see if anyone else has anything further to add? If not, perhaps we should discuss a moving date?

[gkhouston]

12. actually, Clark

the 11pm Eastern showing would put him up against the local news in my time zone, too, and I mentioned that in my letter. I also pointed out that the proposed change would remove the only two shows from their primetime hours that my husband and I had any desire to see. Got no idea what we'll watch during primetime if they go ahead with this farce, but it sure as hell won't be MSNBC.

You think this is some weird-ass game of chicken with KO? Some attempt to diminish him at a time when the broadcast networks might be sniffing around for replacement talent that's a little offbeat? If so, it could backfire; if they shit on him enough, he might walk when he wasn't otherwise inclined to do so.

[WhirlyGirl]

13. gk, you seem to have accepted this unattributed item as fact.

. . . Nobody even knows if this is TRUE.

IMO, it is all the more questionable coming right on the heels of another rumor which was unequivocally denied by Keith's agent yesterday.

My advice: Be skeptical until you hear something with a NAME attached to it.

[gkhouston]

14. no, I didn't

in my letter, I clearly identified it as a rumor, and told them how I'd respond if the rumor actually were true and they chose to follow through on that proposed schedule.

I think this particular rumor may be a trial balloon. The "can't handle the stress, international stories too complex for me" is such obvious wishful thinking bullshit that I suspect its origin would be one of KO's rivals, not one of his bosses.

[WhirlyGirl]

15. Good, that's what I think, too. :-) ... Keith's rivals are Lilliputians--

. . . which of course makes Keith a cross between Gulliver & a Houyhnhnm (Houyhnhnms were ultracivilized and brilliant, plus horses have* 6 lumbar vertebrae.)

*Remember, I've vowed to stay focused above the equator. ;-)

[WhirlyGirl]

18. Should've said *most* horses . . .

. . . I guess those fast little Arabians and a lot of the original horses the Conquistadors brought to the new world have 5 -- but many of those have 6, or 5 true lumbar plus 1 "transitional" vertebra.

In the interest of accuracy, and because I bet we have some horse people here!

[gkhouston]

21. :-) He's not a little Arabian

17 hands, at least.

[WhirlyGirl]

33. '17 hands' - I know there's a joke there, I just can't think of it now :-)

[gkhouston]

34. I can think of several

but I'm going to sit here and smile quietly. I like sitting.

[WhirlyGirl]

36. :-D

[Berry Cool]

42. Sheesh, why is it that on the Internet, somebody or other is always...

...comparing KO to a horse?

(And I meant concerning his SPINE, of course)

[WhirlyGirl]

45. Just his spine.

. . . All else is useless conjecture.

The beauty of it is, you can imagine anything you want. Except us genteel girls, who never think about such matters! O8)

[WhirlyGirl]

47. Ha-ha! can you believe someone just e-mailed me THIS? - talk about...

. . . timing!

http://carcino.gen.nz/images/index.php/4745ed0f/7e33469f

:rofl:

[Berry Cool]

50. I dunno, Whirly. Seems to me your equator is movin' further south

all the time!

Just kiddin'.

Actually, there's plenty to admire north of the equator. The eyes, the expressive eyebrows, the little bow in the upper lip, the chin cleft with the dimple one could trip and fall into and be lost for a week...

*slapping self* Somebody stop me. Now I have to go get one of my Windex wipes and clean the drool off my keyboard and screen.

I am properly ashamed.

[WhirlyGirl]

51. Yes yes yes yes, oh Yes! YES! YESSSSSSSSSSSSS!

. . . <sighhhhhhhhhhhh> (And that was just for the top half!)

OMG, Berry, you love all the same things I do! I can't believe...
the little bow in his upper lip! Yes! OMG!!!

:loveya::loveya::loveya::loveya::loveya::loveya::loveya::loveya::loveya::loveya::loveya::loveya::loveya::loveya::loveya::loveya::loveya::loveya::loveya::loveya::loveya::loveya::loveya::loveya::loveya::loveya::loveya::loveya::loveya::loveya::loveya::loveya::loveya::loveya::loveya::loveya::loveya::loveya::loveya::loveya::loveya::loveya::loveya::loveya::loveya::loveya::loveya::loveya::loveya::loveya::loveya::loveya::loveya::loveya::loveya::loveya::loveya::loveya::loveya::loveya:

[Berry Cool]

52. Whoa, looks like I set off a chain reaction!

Whirly may need sedation after my comment on that little bow in the upper lip...

Oh, did I mention it again? For shame!

Ed Grimley: "Oh dear, I must say, if we don't stop mentioning the bow in Mr. Olbermann's upper lip, why, WhirlyGirl just might be found DEAD from excitement, y'know?...And wouldn't that just be the WORST, I must say?...I mean, I'd *hardly* want to live with THAT on my conscience, y'know?"

[WhirlyGirl]

54. Grimley, cont'd- "Yes but I was having a fairly decent time, ah must say!"

. . . and it wasn't just the lip, but you're the first person to mention that sweet little detail, which I always groove on! :loveya:

[Berry Cool]

62. It *is* a sweet little detail, isn't it?

--not as obvious as the eyes, or the chin dimple, or the big hands with the lovely long slender tapered fingers, or even the hair on the wrists...

Oh man, that's it. I have to stop now. I'm out of Windex wipes, and I'm thoroughly disgusted with myself.

Must...remember...love KO for his mind alone...love KO for his mind alone...there, that's better.

Maybe someday I'll even convince myself.

[WhirlyGirl]

65. LOL - give it up, Berry. The minute you see him tonight ...

. . . you'll lose your composure all over again!

Me, too . . .

I'n't it GREAT??!!! :loveya::rofl::loveya:

[Catchawave]

19. Great letter Clark!!

Especially the shout out for Dan ! Isn't he great after Keith!!!! In my perfect world Keith at 9, Dan at 10. Let them put Tucker up against O'Reilly and Nancy Grace for the Bullsh*t hour :)

I'm just loving Dan's Oh PLEAs rants....

[gkhouston]

10. This makes no sense at all

If I understand what I've been reading from some of the other tvnewser articles (which tend to fawn on FOX NEWS), when Nancy Grace first started on CNN, she was kicking MSNBC's butt in the ratings. Now, MSNBC usually kicks CNN's butt but only during the 8-9pm time slot when Keith is actually hosting "Countdown". They want to give that advantage away? :silly:

[WhirlyGirl]

11. The story's not attributed to anyone. "According to sources"--? C'mon.

. . . They want to know the strength of our commitment. Fine.

It only took me two and a half sentences to make that clear.

[Catchawave]

22. Not to worry.....

I think we all understand that MSNBC/Keith is shown in a lot less markets, which translates to lower ratings. But he beats everybody at the midnight rebroadcast ? If that's true, they may be working towards that late night crowd demo ?

Didn't he dedicate a bloggerman explaining ratings to this? WhirlyG should have this! (only because I'm too lazy to look for it, TIA WG)

We have to pick our battles! So far, it's all been internet heresay, so as long as our Keef stays on the air, I'm not fussed :loveya:

[gkhouston]

23. I know it's shown in fewer markets

which is why it's so impressive that he's outperforming Nancy Grace in the 8-9pm timeslot in the key demos (and sometimes in overall numbers). Imagine what it would be like if they were on a level playing field.

on edit: Nancy's doing better than Headline News was doing a year ago, but basically, when Keith's on the air, he generally wins the 8-9pm hour. She outdoes MSNBC for the rest of her show. At least that's my read of the articles. TV Newser is so enamored of Faux News it's sometimes difficult to tease anything positive about other networks out of their articles.

[Catchawave]

29. I'm just mad that CNN-HN changed it's format....

Like the Weather Channel, I just want a place to go for just news updates!

And we all know the Weather Channel kicks butt during Hurricane Season! So I'm wondering what boring time of the the news year those Nielsons were taken to compare NG to HN ?

Edit: can't spell worth a darn, again!

[gkhouston]

31. NG??

I know what HN is. I love the Weather Channel; great background noise. I actually watch the Food channel sometimes, too. I love Iron Chef. I've seen promos for old episodes of the American version of Iron Chef where Anderson Cooper was apparently one of the celebrity judges. It made me wonder imagine what it would be like if they'd had an Iron Chef with a panel of celebrity judges of news commentators -- Cooper, and O'Reilly, who would mistake the falafel dish for a loofah and go off on some tangent, and KO, who wouldn't be able to taste some of the dishes because they'd been prepared with wheat products. :7

[Catchawave]

39. Nancy Grace, sorry, was trying to be DU Hip...LOL

[Berry Cool]

41. Why couldn't they have "Iron Chef Gluten-Free"?

--with Keith as the chef?

LOL! Can you just imagine him in one of those tall hats, looking so solemn...knife in hand...

[gkhouston]

46. knife in hand I can imagine... solemn, no

giggling maniacally is more like it. Maybe they should have an Iron Chef where the secret ingredient is to NOT use something (i.e., gluten). :7

[Clark2008]

56. Heh.

Like this:

[gkhouston]

61. Exactly. Those sous-chefs would HUSTLE! n/t

[WhirlyGirl]

38. As soon as I recall the context. Anyone recall?

------------
<< Didn't he dedicate a bloggerman explaining ratings to this? WhirlyG should have this! (only because I'm too lazy to look for it, TIA WG) >> Catch

[Catchawave]

40. ::;sigh::: it's in the Bloggermann archives:

around March 20

Sorry to have bothered you :) I thought you were club historian!

[WhirlyGirl]

43. LOL - I have to stick Post-Its up everywhere to remember stuff! I'm sure--

. . . there's someone else here who's better at instant recall.

If I know the context I can usually come up with the detail, tho. Sorry.

[Greylyn58]

48. I sincerely hope this isn't true

I will watch Keith's show wherever it's moved, but it burns me to think of that little, bow tie wearing snot taking KO's prime time slot.

Keith is one of the few news persons out there that speaks to the truth and reports it and we need him in a time where he can be seen and heard by the majority of the public. Sticking him in such a slot would diminish his impact and if it happens then I believe it is a deliberate act.

Just my take on this.

[New Earth]

53. i agree, it would be delilberate

we must not wake up the sleeping sheep :eyes:

[Clark2008]

57. Hi Faye!

OMG! I've missed you and your lovely Eye of Ra!
(That's the hieroglyphic of my son's name - I have that symbol all over my house... so I notice it when its gone - and you with it!)
:hug:

[New Earth]

60. aww

that's so cool....i have it everywhere too! But it's the Eye of Horus for me :)

God knows I need some order, healing, and protection :crazy:

[Clark2008]

67. Ra is Horus

Ra-Harakhte (Horus of the two horizons).
Same thing. :D

[New Earth]

68. haha NO

try telling that to my 'comrades' in the Kemetic Orthodox religion....they are completely separate entities, even as Ra-Horakhte :P

Ra is of the Sun, Horus is of the sky :P

[Clark2008]

70. Ahh... well I'm not that deeply involved it from a religious standpoint

I actually know it peripherally from hieroglyphics - was researching the use of hieroglyphics for Ramses because my son is named Ramzey and that's what I came up with.

:)