Where Dems go most wrong, politically, and make it easier for mediawhores.

[blm]

In my view, the biggest mistake that Democrats make is one the Republicans don't make at all. And it's the only one postive, REAL strength of the Republican party that Democrats should emulate.

Democrats DESERT. Republicans STICK.

When Carter left office - he was mocked and kicked to the curb - Democrats should have spent the next 4 years saying Carter was right, Reagan's breaking the budget. Carter was right, ad nauseum.

The Republicans would have.

Dukakis should have been held up as an icon and the word COMPETENT should have been hailed on a regular basis, not ridiculed.

Remember how Repubs started that whole bumpersticker campaign after Clinton took office - even though Clinton was already turning things around with his budget? They took the PERCEIVED problems and defeats and plastered DON'T BLAME ME I VOTED FOR BUSH stickers all over the country.

Then they took the house and senate.

Democrats let the media define Gore as if they were unsure themselves of all Gore's finer attributes. They did the same with Kerry. As a party, they do not know how to STICK.

After Bush took office, and ESPECIALLY after 9-11, I didn't let up once that Al Gore would have READ the Hart-Rudman report on Global Terror the day it was handed to him, and would have moved to implement its urgent propsals for this nation's security. It was my answer to all that CONTRIVED MEDIA CRAP about "Aren't you glad Gore isn't president now?" "God chose Bush to be president because of 9-11" BULLSHIT that we were fed 24/7 for months after. My intention was to SHAME Bush supporters by sticking WITH Gore and WITH The TRUTH.


But, where was the Dem party and the left media, as a whole, making this simple case over and over again, till people realized alot SOONER how bad Bush screwed up?

We have to learn that even in defeat WE ARE RIGHT. We should never have stopped saying that GORE WAS RIGHT ON EVERYTHING he said during the campaign. Now we shouldn't stop saying that everything Gore and KERRY said proved to be right and everything Bush said proved to be wrong.

The Republicans would be doing it if the roles were reversed. Instead of people wanting to adopt the GOPs negative tactics, why not adopt their only positive tactic - they STICK.

You will hear every GOP spokesperson and lawmaker say whatever is needed to protect Bush, and they don't care if it is a proven lie - they say it as if they mean it, and that makes it effective.

Democrats have to get used to supporting the truth and the strengths of their leaders and issues as steadfastly as a GOP will lie for theirs.

[Hugin]

1. Say it where?

The corporatists own the news media.

[blm]

4. I know - but after 9-11 - there were opportunities reHart-Rudman that

should have surfaced sooner and the case made in the LEFT MEDIA and by the Clinton-MacAuliffe crowd who controlled the fortunes of the Dem party as a whole at that point.

Of course, the way it is now, the Dems HAVE to expose the GOP control of media to get any traction for their own issues. It's gone too far, and they better ALL wake up before November.

[Dr Fate]

7. On those TV interview shows I see Dean & Kerry on every week.

That is where.

Also, they could say it in major newspaper Op-Eds, or even initally use Air America, The Daily Show or The Colbert Report to produce "hot" sound bites and clips that could get picked up elsewhere.

If they use "hot" confrontational talking points, RWers with media access will unwittingly repeat it for them.

[Jackpine Radical]

17. Bumpers, blogs, billboards

The "B-"Media.

[blm]

19. Repubs did it immediately after Clinton took office, and even obscured his

successes by creating an image of chaos and corruption where ther was none, and making Joe Public think that they should have stuck with Bush - and THAT is what led to their success in 94 election.

It all started with a bumpersticker - Don't Blame Me I Voted for Bush. Of course, after that, all their investments in corporate media started to payoff, and they got Clinton impeached.

[redqueen]

2. AMEN!

Dean staffers... take note. :)

[Dunvegan]

3. I hear you. Gore was right. Kerry was was the better man.

And the next Democratic candidate ANYWHERE, ANYTIME is where I'm volunteering my blood, sweat and tears until further notice.

We can weed when we have a garden. No good throwing the soil at each other at present.

[JeffR]

8. We can weed when we have a garden.

Absolutely brilliant. Deserves its own thread!

:toast:

[Alamom]

11. Words of wisdom. n/t

[blm]

25. So simple. So wise.

And some weeds even have their merits. We just have to be smart enough to recognize their use.

[rodeodance]

5. yeah, we just have not learned how to LIE.

[Dr Fate]

10. No, we have not learned to stick with the truth.

DEMS "strategists" are more likely to sway with media peception than to stick with the truth.

Example:

"Gee- there are no WMDs- but the public thinks so- I guess we better support the war and not say Bush is lying about them...They might say we are weak on defense if we tell the truth..."

Example:

"Everyone has been saying for years that the media is Liberal- we would look ridiculous if we tell the truth and accuse them of bias- best not to call them on it or we will look crazy..."

etc, etc.

[blm]

15. Or "Yes, Bush WAS good with 9-11." Instead of, "If Gore were president

he would have IMMEDIATELY read the Hart-Rudman Report on Global Terror that was handed to him on Jan 30, 2001, and implemented its most urgent proposals for real Homeland Security."

How difficult would that have been? It's the TRUTH. Why can't the truth be a lot easier than defending against the GOPs lies all the time?

We all know the Repubs would've impeached Gore right there if 9-11 happened while he was president.

That was a missed opportunity for Democrats to speak the truth and it was up to the head of the Dem party at that time to tell everyone to stay on the same page - Because THAT is what made the GOPs a power that the media could easily follow.

[Dr Fate]

18. Or even better: "Bush failed to prevent 9-11" as a response to...

...Cheney's comment that "If Kerry, wins we will be attacked."

Kerry's repsonse should have been- "Excuse me, but you are the ones who failed to prevent 9-11, not Democrats. If anyone has a record of failing to protect America, it is Bush."

The Kerry "strategists" failed to tell the truth, and instead, went a long with the fake media perception that "Bush did a great job on 9-11."

It's not just us DEMs on the ground who need to learn how to stick with a story- the high-ups need to do it too.

[blm]

21. I agree - but also acknowledge that it's gotta be tough when you're also

being put into the position to counter Clinton when he's the one who'd been doing most of the public agreeing with Bush and supporting his policies since he took office.

Did you read Robert Parry's article yesterday?

[mrcheerful]

6. Sorry but I do not want to be a part of a party that talks one thing then

turns around and contradicts its self after elections. One party of lier's and crooks is bad enough as it is, why would you want a second? What we need to drive home is Dem's don't just talk the talk but also walk the walk. I'd rather have a dem stand up and say yes that persons wrong then one who agrees with everything to the point of lying to the people to cover that persons ass. As far as pukes sticking with their man, well I suggest you look around and see how many of the pukes are abandoning the ship. Look at jack off and delay, how many pukes stuck by them. Or how about cunningham, I saw no puke sticking by him either.

[blm]

9. That's not what was said at all. I'm saying USE THE TRUTH as EFFECTIVELY

and steadfastly to STICK by our leaders as the Republicans will lie so steadfastly to protect the Bush family.

[mrcheerful]

14. Thats what I mean, when a Dem does wrong dems should call him out on it

thats called morals. I will never lie about how I feel about Carter, His major problem was he didn't want to offend anyone so he tried doing everything everybody wanted him to do. I think if Carter would have stuck to his convictions instead of trying to keep everyone happy, he might have not seemed so wishy washy at the time of the Iran hostage crisis. I liked JFK, but he was a womanizer, facts that would have sunk him in todays world. LBJ, was a texan with a chip on his shoulder who I couldn't stand because like GW he felt that he was John Wayne. To be honest I liked Clinton the best of them all, I think his greatest moment was when he said it depends on what is is.

[blm]

16. But there were alot of things that Carter was right about that we could

have kept out there instead of succumbing to the image being created about Reagan. That would have benefitted the NEXT match up in 1984. See, everything WE DO after defeat effects the NEXT election, whether we see it or not.

That's the greater point. If you give in and say yeah, our guy was a loser, instead of emphasizing all the guy said that was RIGHT ON, then it doesn't FORCE the public to confront all the facts and issues they ignored.

[Armstead]

12. Good point --- It also applies to positions

That, IMO, is the central problem with the Democratic Party.

Instead of holding onto liberl and progressive principles, the Democrats scurried away when the GOP conservatism made some gains.

Rather than fighting back, the democrats were complicit in helping the right wing make good old Liberalism and Progressive Populism seem to be some exotic ideology of the fringe.

If Democrats had stuck to their guns and principles, even when it didn;t seem politicaly expedient, they'd be in a lot stronger position now that the crap of GOP conservatism is rising to the surface.

[blm]

23. It took them a while to wake up and smell the fascism, but, like anything

else, it takes distance from being around it everyday - then, when you awaken, the smell of fascism must hit like a ton of bricks.

[Armstead]

13. Good point --- It also applies to positions

That, IMO, is the central problem with the Democratic Party.

Instead of holding onto liberl and progressive principles, the Democrats scurried away when the GOP conservatism made some gains.

Rather than fighting back, the democrats were complicit in helping the right wing make good old Liberalism and Progressive Populism seem to be some exotic ideology of the fringe.

If Democrats had stuck to their guns and principles, even when it didn;t seem politicaly expedient, they'd be in a lot stronger position now that the crap of GOP conservatism is rising to the surface.

[KoKo]

20. I don't know what to think about some of our Dem Leaders anymore.

I have hope that the House Progressive and Black Caucus can be the beginning of a fresh movement to clean up government and fight back against the Right Wing ideology and corporatism that work hand in hand to ruin what we thought our Constitution and Bill of Rights stood for.

The ones that are too co-opted to stand for anything anymore are the ones invited on the pundit shows. To get heard one has to write a book.

I'm tired of wondering why we have leaders like Reid and Pelosi. I'm tired of wondering why polls and campaign ops are the only folks listened to. Tired of wondering why Carter, Clinton, Gore and Kerry weren't defended. Tired of wondering why mavericks like Feingold aren't appreciated.

We need to weed out the weeds in our party. All the Lakoff training didn't seem to help much and neither did Harry Reid's supposed "War Room."

I look to the Progressives and the new Populist movement to bring a change.
:shrug:

[Squeech]

22. Exactly

The other side used to refer to it as "Reagan's Eleventh Commandment." It said, "Thou shalt not speak ill of another Republican."

They don't always honor it-- for example, in hard fought North Carolina primaries where push polls might make a difference, heh heh-- but even their moderates and mavericks demonstrate solidarity when the cameras are rolling. They have no Lieberman equivalents.

[blm]

24. Yet Dems want to adopt their negative aspects instead of GOPs only

positive trait.