pnwmom
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Wed May-24-06 09:50 AM
Original message |
What was the origin of the now ubiquitous term |
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"corporatization"? Is it a Green term? A Nader term? Or what? (When I hit "check spelling" it doesn't show up in the choices, so it's a nonstandard word.)
So, excuse me for being dumb, but what does it mean . . . exactly?
Are all NAFTA or CAFTA politicians automatically corporatists? Was Bill Clinton a corporatist?
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davepc
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Wed May-24-06 09:54 AM
Response to Original message |
1. the term goes back to a Pope in the late 1800's |
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Edited on Wed May-24-06 10:04 AM by davepc
by the early 1920's some other Italians had adopted the idea and refined it a bit.
They were called fascists.
" Fascism should more appropriately be called Corporatism because it is a merger of State and corporate power." -- Benito Mussolini
but corporatism as a political or economic system in one form or another is probably as old as capitalism.
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pnwmom
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Wed May-24-06 10:31 AM
Response to Reply #1 |
4. So when DU'ers say a politician is a corporatist, what they really mean is |
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Edited on Wed May-24-06 10:32 AM by pnwmom
that person is a fascist?
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The2ndWheel
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Wed May-24-06 10:38 AM
Response to Reply #4 |
5. If you go by Mussolini's definition, nt |
davepc
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Wed May-24-06 11:03 AM
Response to Reply #4 |
7. 'fascist' has a lot more baggage then just its economic underpinnings |
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so to call some one a corpratist isn't necessarily to compare them to Mussolini or Hitler.
Both "classical" Laissez-faire free market capitalism and modern social democratic philosophy adhere to a separation of corporate and state power, with the former (at its ideological purity) believe corporate power is best left to be regulated by the forces of the free market, and the later believing government exists in part to be a check against corporate power excess.
fascists/corporatists believe that governments JOB is to promote and assist corporate power. "whats good for GM is good for America!" etc.
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redqueen
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Wed May-24-06 10:19 AM
Response to Original message |
2. NAFTA and CAFTA defenders, who do not agree |
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that any reforms are needed in order to make the setup more fair to labor and more protective of the local environment... those are corporatists.
And yes, Bill Clinton is a corporatist.
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pnwmom
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Wed May-24-06 10:29 AM
Response to Reply #2 |
3. Do you agree with the first poster? So does that make Clinton a fascist? |
redqueen
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Wed May-24-06 10:59 AM
Response to Reply #3 |
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However, wasn't the whole 'free speech zones' thing started under his watch? Perhaps fascism-enabler is more accurate.
Also, I think you're twisting the other poster's words. They said if you use Mussolini's definition, then yes... not that they agreed that this was the case.
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coalition_unwilling
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Wed May-24-06 11:07 AM
Response to Reply #3 |
8. Fascism strives for a one-party state |
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under a banner of extreme nationalism, militarism and anti-individualism, according to Robert Paxton's "Anatomy of Fascism." By that token, I would argue that Clinton was more a "right- centrist" than a "fascist."
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pnwmom
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Wed May-24-06 02:20 PM
Response to Reply #8 |
9. Why a right-centrist? Why not just a centrist, |
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given that some of his positions were more on the left?
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coalition_unwilling
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Wed May-24-06 03:11 PM
Response to Reply #9 |
10. The principal reason I place him at the right-center is |
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welfare reform, which took a bad situation and made it much worse for the poor and working poor. Then there's "Don't Ask, Don't Tell" which I see as a center-right solution to the issue of gays in the military. (Contrast it with Truman's executive order desegrating the armed forces. Truman was no radical leftist, either.)
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davepc
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Thu May-25-06 10:53 AM
Response to Reply #10 |
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Biggest backstab of the labor movement by the left up till that time.
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coalition_unwilling
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Thu May-25-06 11:01 AM
Response to Reply #11 |
12. True, I had forgotten about NAFTA -- we are now |
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reaping its whirlwind, in the form of massive migration of workers from south of the border. Many of them were forced northward by economic exigencies brought on by NAFTA.
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