MSNBC poll: Did Bush administration mislead Americans on the Iraq war?

[boise1]

Do you think the Bush administration misled Americans on the Iraq war?

Yes - As Sen. John McCain said, statements like "mission accomplished" underestimated the task ahead.
86%

No - The administration has always made clear the challenges facing the military in Iraq.
13%

I don't know or don't care.
1%

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/14479271/

[MorningGlow]

1. Sweet!

Still unfreeped, I take it?

[OhioChick]

2. Done

Why do they have to add in: "As John McCain said?"
Makes it sound like this is some new revelation........

[Mr_Jefferson_24]

37. They (corporate media) knew what kind of results...

...this poll would have---it's purpose is to bolster McCains image.

[babylonsister]

3. What a b.s. poll, calling up McCain's name as if he's been a

critic from the get-go.:eyes:

[Solly Mack]

7. What you said

!

[BlooInBloo]

33. What you said she said.

[Solly Mack]

41. Oooh, it's the telephone game!

:)

[boise1]

8. I think this may be the *hugger squirming into position for 2008 n/t

[alfredo]

15. The picture of him hugging bush could kill his chances

of being president. It was a very unflattering picture. It made him look infantile.

[ComerPerro]

10. No kidding. How about mention, oh, I don't know, any Dem?

[rman]

28. Not only that -

"statements like "mission accomplished" underestimated the task ahead"
implies that W was deceptive -during- the war, -about- the war - not so much that he was deceptive about reasons to go to war in the first place, even though the poll question seems to suggest that's what the poll is about.

[Junkdrawer]

45. Spinning "Bush lied us into Iraq" into "Bush didn't tell us how hard...

establishing democracy in Iraq would be."


Big difference.

[ima_sinnic]

47. ding!ding!ding! my thoughts exactly! (nt)

[Johonny]

49. Yeah

I refuse to vote on this poll.

[Old and In the Way]

50. A little subconscious manipulation?

They already know a clear majority of Americans know Bush lied. Now they are trying to imprint that it is a Republican who is leading the opposition on this. Bullshit. McCain will continue the war without end....no question in my mind.

[Scout1071]

65. My thoughts exactly. Who the hell would phrase it like that if they

weren't trying to help McCain? Smells fishy.

[Pale Blue Dot]

4. Gosh, I wish the Democrats had made statements like that.

Praise be to MSNBC for highlighting the first person, a Republican, to criticize the Iraq war.

:eyes:

[Sherman A1]

5. 26000 + replys

86% say Yes........

[ixion]

6. don't you just love the embedded spin in the sub definitions there

no mention of lies, only of 'challenges' and 'tasks'... and, oh, John McCain. :eyes:

[alfredo]

9. Good results. I hope it is representative of the nation

[janx]

11. It's a bit LATE for this question...n/t

[Hepburn]

12. You have to be deaf, dumb and blind..

...to not know by now that Bush LIED about Iraq.

Hopefully the 86% represents that the American public is NOT those things.

:applause:

[spanone]

13. Why the fuck qoute McCain in this poll. Bias and Bogus.

It's a not so subtle plug for McCain and a slam against the democrats. They should have qouted someone who opposed the war, this sucks.

[ComerPerro]

14. I remember reading the word "lie" in print almost daily

when Clinton was president.

"Is the president lying"

"The president lies about"

"The president lied when"


But why can't we now use that word to describe what Bush did?


Misled?


Fuck that.

Its not nearly as innocent as they are trying to make it sound.

[kenny blankenship]

16. An amazing bit of manipulation in itself this poll is

If you believe Bush misled on the war, you are being conditioned to believe that you agree with John McCain. (and that McCain was an opponent of the war and that you always should have taken his advice). And the idea of what how Bush "misled" us into war is framed only as an soft-selling underestimation of how hard it would be to accomplish the military objectives of the war--leaving the poll respondent to assume that the goals of the war were always what the Bush Administration now says they are (the full transformation of Iraqi society, rather than destroying mythical weapons of mass destruction, deposing Saddam Hussein to punish him for his supposed "involvement" in 9-11) and that there was no misleading deception by Bush about what the goals were, or whether they were justified even if based on truth rather than misleading information, or are justifiable now.

[pooja]

17. You didn't fool this American!!! I had to be the only lone voicein

a sea of idiots.. saying lets go to Iraq. They were obsessed and salvating on it. Oh well, what has been done, is done. Time to move forward and towards peace.

[Double T]

18. YES, DONE!!!

NO QUESTION HE DID!!

[warrens]

19. It goes way beyond mislead

To flat out lying. But I'll take it. If the entire country believes they were misled, no one backing the war can escape the tarring. It's not that the war is HARDER, although that is an element, it's that the war was NECESSARY is the point. We fought this war for lies; it's all about protecting Israel and controlling the mideast and its oil. It has nothing to do with terrorism, except as an afterthought.

[blm]

20. Uh - why didn't they use Kerry's name like this in 2003, 2004, 2005, 2006?

They are already WHORING for McCain now.

[bluestateguy]

21. No, they did not mislead us

They lied.

[sinkingfeeling]

22. Stupid poll. Now they ask, because John McCain started questioning.

Where the hell have they and Sen. McCain been for the last 3 years?

[bdamomma]

59. kissing bush's ass

[oc2002]

23. thats a PUSH POLL if I ever saw one. McCain there is a flaw.

nt.

[electropop]

24. Done: 86% MISLED

Though the question is pathetically soft: "underestimated" is not what the cabal did. They lied about everything: motive (WMD, democracy, terra, whateva - all lies), then lied about the cost (fired the guy who predicted $100 billion - we passed that $200 billion ago), then lied about the duration ("six days, six weeks, certainly not six months"), the reception ("candies and flowers"), and a myriad of other things. Calling this pack of lies a misunderestimate is like calling the surface of the Sun "warm."

[rman]

31. Mislead about "the task ahead",

not about reasons to go to war. In spite of the fact that the latter is why so many now dispise Bush.

[WiseButAngrySara]

25. Like McCain is responsible for reporting this knowledge? This angers

me in a way! Give credit for 'truth' only if it is uttered by a Republican; that's the M$M for you!

[wisteria]

26. I an not going to vote in this one. Senator Kerry in 04 and others said

this a long time ago, "we were mislead". Now, because saint McCain says it- it is true? Let me know when he starts using the phrase, we were lied to by this administration, then that will show real guts.

[WiseButAngrySara]

27. knr'd ....n/t

[Jack Rabbit]

29. Actually, this poll doesn't get at the real issue

I'm less concerned about being misled by statements like "mission accomplished" than by statements like "Iraq is an immediate threat".

"Mission accomplished" was just a silly thing to say. The pre-war line was a deliberate deception to build support for an unnecessary war and to mask the fact that it was imperial in nature and not at all defensive. That kind of deception is a war crime in and of itself.

[filer]

30. Plenty of Americans were happily "misled".

They were ready to whup some ass and The Monkey gave them an excuse. I remember how unseemly the rush to war was. Come on really, did any reasonable person feel threatened by Iraq? I guess they save face by saying they were misled.

[boise1]

32. This poll was a "vote" add-on to the msnbc headline about McCain

Which is probably why they tie it to his statements. Don't be surprised, however, if MSNBC states that "more than 4 out of 5 Americans seem to be embracing John McCain".

[Festivito]

34. Another pro-RepubliCON poll, pro-McCain, downplays, uses always...

Gee, did McCain come to the rescue?
NO, HE'S A DUFUSS, yet I have to vote for him here.

Gee, was the problem an underestimation of the TASK?
UNDERESTIMATION? TRY COMPLETE FABRICATION.
TASK? TRY WAR AND OCCUPATION.

Gee, was it just that the Bushivites did not ALWAYS get it right?
NO, THEY MORE NEARLY GOT IT ALL WRONG.

Gee, is it okay not to care?
Gee, it must be okay since you asked the question here?
NO, IT'S OUR YOUNG PEOPLE DYING, IT'S NOT OKAY.

[helderheid]

35. DUne!

Yes - As Sen. John McCain said, statements like "mission accomplished" underestimated the task ahead.
86%
No - The administration has always made clear the challenges facing the military in Iraq.
13%
I don't know or don't care.
1%

[citizen snips]

36. done

n/t

[lisainmilo]

38. I will not take this poll!

No way am I taking this poll! This is just advertisement for McCain. I believe if McCain had his way, he would institute the draft.

[Az_lefty]

39. Like McCain said???? Might as well quote Lieberman...

these assholes got us into this disaster.
:puke:

[Canuckistanian]

46. Why didn't they quote Feingold or Dean or Kucinich?

Watching McCain is like seeing a fish flopping around on the ground.

[Nothing Without Hope]

61. Not at all. You're seeing the deliberate reframing of John McCain to be

Mr. Honest, Mr. Compassionate, Mr. Tough, Mr. Not-Like-Bush. He's going to be the GOP presidential candidate for 2008, barring something unforseen, so they have to set up the propaganda and lying this way. Even with voter suppression and hacked voting machines, people might get upset if the GOP candidate "comes from behind at the last moment" by, say, 20%. So they have to get enough voters for McCain to make another stolen election believable and to do this they have to paint him as something he is very clearly not. This reframing campaign on McCain has been going on for some time and now it is starting to kick into a higher gear. The GOP want Hillary Clinton as the Dem candidate and McCain as the GOP candidate. They might even win that one WITHOUT as much election fraud and voter suppression as it took to get Bush for the last two elections.

This is all timed, planned and scripted.

[Marr]

40. No, they lied.

[magellan]

42. Oh screw this

Misled?? Anyone with half a brain knew it wasn't going to be the slam dunk the dumbshits in the WH kept saying it'd be.

The focus should be on how BushCo intentionally lied about the evidence they had to terrorize everyone into supporting the forthcoming invasion.

So nice to see MSRNC is plumbing the depths of irresponsibility right alongside FAUX.

[butterfly77]

43. They always have some type of catch...

they ask: Like sen. Mc cain said. NO. like I say and a large majority say. Mc cain didn't say a damn thing but " stay the course". I didn't vote, and they set it up that way.

[Canuckistanian]

44. 86% for 32,800 responses

Somehow, I don't think Freepers can turn this one around....

[catnhatnh]

48. Yeah-the McCain thing....

But it IS interesting how openly the msm is throwing Bush under the train....

[emald]

51. mcgain is a gop tool

ol chipmunk cheeks lies like he was still in a viet prison. kissing a man like gwbushit showed me all I ever need to know about this asshat.
BTW, the word is not "mislead", it is "LIED"...the administration LIED us into an immoral and bankrupting war. Lied with malice aforethought. Prison is too good for these ugly men.

[leesa]

52. Totally ignoring the reality of lying to get us into the war in the first

place. Totally ignoring that Bush lied to Congress to start a war, which is an impeachable offense. This is just PR for McCain.

[Nothing Without Hope]

53. Notice how the most popular choice offered is a lying propaganda push for

McCain. Oh yes, he's going to be the GOP presidential candidate in 2008. The propaganda and lies have been flying for some time now. I think an opening salvo was the propaganda monument that supposedly represented McCain's life - a made-for-TV movie last year. It was promoted endlessly on TV and in the printed media; clearly it was designed and targettedto reach as many voters as possible:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x1818584
thread title (May 30, 2005): Framing for the presidency: TV Movie is pure pro-McCain propaganda

So when you vote for Bush misleading on Iraq in this MSNBCpoll, it's highly significant that you will actually be saying, according to the wording, that McCain was wise and truth-telling about this issue. This is not only a bald-faced lie but also, qite deliberately, part of the pre-election reframing of his image.

[IChing]

54. John McCain Rocks!!!!!!!!

[EstimatedProphet]

55. Done

What kind of an idiot thinks the administration has be CLEAR on this?!?

[yorkiemommie1]

56. He LIED

n/t

[Nothing Without Hope]

57. Here's the pro-McCain MSNBC article that is the background for this "poll"

which sure looks to me like its primary function is to push McCain's presidential bid:

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/14475828

McCain faults Bush administration on Iraq: Americans led to believe war would be a ‘day at the beach,’ senator says

Updated: 9:35 a.m. ET Aug 23, 2006
COLUMBUS, Ohio - Republican Sen. John McCain, a staunch defender of the Iraq war, on Tuesday faulted the Bush administration for misleading Americans into believing the conflict would be “some kind of day at the beach.”

The potential 2008 presidential candidate, who a day earlier had rejected calls for withdrawing U.S. forces, said the administration had failed to make clear the challenges facing the military.

“I think one of the biggest mistakes we made was underestimating the size of the task and the sacrifices that would be required,” McCain said. “Stuff happens, mission accomplished, last throes, a few dead-enders. I’m just more familiar with those statements than anyone else because it grieves me so much that we had not told the American people how tough and difficult this task would be.”

Those phrases are closely associated with top members of the Bush administration, including the president.

(snip)

There's a video of McCain straining to look earnest and leaderly as he chides the Administration for "misleading." As if he wasn't at the center of it all along with the others.

Oh yes, the 2008 race is shaping up and the corporate press has begun serious backing of their preferred candidate. It will be McCain vs Hillary Clinton unless we can manage to defeat the Democratic leadership in their destructive plans. No doubt about it, if we don't take action to get the truth out and fight fear and apathy, McCain would win and the destruction of the US democracy would continue.

Edited to add: Keith Olbermann will be covering this story tonight, according to his emailed newsletter:

From: [e-mail]
Subject: McCain's Positioning
Date: August 23, 2006 1:24:17 PM EDT
To: [e-mail]
Reply-To: [e-mail]

------------------------------------------------------
Tonight on Countdown
------------------------------------------------------
Republican Sen. John McCain, a staunch defender of the Iraq war, on Tuesday faulted the Bush administration for misleading Americans into believing the conflict would be "some kind of day at the beach." The potential 2008 presidential candidate, who a day earlier had rejected calls for withdrawing U.S. forces, said the administration had failed to make clear the challenges facing the military. "I think one of the biggest mistakes we made was underestimating the size of the task and the sacrifices that would be required," McCain said. http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/14475828/

Countdown w/ Keith Olbermann broadcasts LIVE at 8 pm et, and the count is never complete without you. Join us.

(snip - the email also covers the other stories, but this one is the first one described as well as the title story for the email)

Do note the title of the Keith Olbermann email: "McCain's Positioning." I'm hoping that he will be saying something about how this is so obviously a deliberate, carefully timed and planned political reframing and not anything like honesty or truth.

[bdamomma]

58. mc cain is such a hypocrite, they kissed up to bush now they

are trying to distance themselves away from him. What a bunch of BS. They really insult my intelligence!!!!!!!!!!!

[Nothing Without Hope]

60. Keith Olbermann will be covering McCain's "repositioning" tonight:

according to his emailed newsletter:

From: [e-mail]
Subject: McCain's Positioning
Date: August 23, 2006 1:24:17 PM EDT
To: [e-mail]
Reply-To: [e-mail]

------------------------------------------------------
Tonight on Countdown
------------------------------------------------------
Republican Sen. John McCain, a staunch defender of the Iraq war, on Tuesday faulted the Bush administration for misleading Americans into believing the conflict would be "some kind of day at the beach." The potential 2008 presidential candidate, who a day earlier had rejected calls for withdrawing U.S. forces, said the administration had failed to make clear the challenges facing the military. "I think one of the biggest mistakes we made was underestimating the size of the task and the sacrifices that would be required," McCain said. http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/14475828/

Countdown w/ Keith Olbermann broadcasts LIVE at 8 pm et, and the count is never complete without you. Join us.

(snip - the email also covers the other stories, but this one is the first one described as well as the title story for the email)

Do note the title of the Keith Olbermann email: "McCain's Positioning." I'm hoping that he will be saying something about how this is so obviously a deliberate, carefully timed and planned political reframing and not anything like honesty or truth.

[Laurab]

62. Done - down to 85% needs help. How heroic McCain is

I believe the shrub gave them "permission" to disagree with the war - I think I read that somewhere on here not too long ago. They couldn't win elections otherwise.

That's the ONLY reason any of these rethugs are backing off from it, or challenging it. Daddy said it was ok. What a bunch of cowardly hypocrites - and McCain is at the top of that list.

[me b zola]

63. The CM helping McCain distance himself from bush*

The gop stratagy is to distance certain candidates from bush*. What is fricking over the top is that McCain backed bush*s bullshit war every step of the way. Instead of coming out and saying that he was wrong, he is just going to portray--with a lot of help from the corporate media--that he has been a critic from the beginning. McCain=POS.

That said, I voted--85% say bush LIED!

[Booster]

64. The 1% "I don't know or don't care" indicates Bush may have

voted in this poll.

[Random_Australian]

66. 85% A one percent slide!

[Subdivisions]

67. I was loathe to participate in this poll, but

I did it anyway.

I think it was a shitty way to frame the answers and for that reason my first impulse was to hit the back button.

Then I said, wtf? I went back and looked at it again and I knew clicking yes was basically an endorsement of sorts of McCain but only to those who view it that way.

My answer to the actual question is "Yes" and I don't think anyone has been fooled by this obviously slanted propoganda. After all, it jumped right out at me and I'm mostly a dumbass.

[minnesota_liberal]

68. MSNBC always does that

They never ask a straightforward question with a yes/no answer.

[WillyT]

69. Done !!! - K & R !!!

:kick:

[Ganja Ninja]

70. I'm not going to bother.

The yes answer sucks "Yes - As Sen. John McCain said, statements like "mission accomplished" underestimated the task ahead."
It implies that Bush only lied about how hard the war would be and not about the reasons for going to war in the first place. No thanks I'm not going to play.

[gatorboy]

71. Pffft! Typical "Maverick" blow jop piece

McCain has been a fucking "Stay the Course" cheerleader since day one. That they've ignored his pro-war comments of the past only proves who the MSM is rooting for in '08

[Prisoner_Number_Six]

72. "Updated: 7:10 a.m. CT Aug 23, 2006"

Yet another poll stuck in oblivion once the trend slapped 'em in the face

[madokie]

73. Done, still at 85%