Democratic Underground Latest Greatest Lobby Journals Search Options Help Login
Google

The aftermath of the devastation in Western New York

Printer-friendly format Printer-friendly format
Printer-friendly format Email this thread to a friend
Printer-friendly format Bookmark this thread
This topic is archived.
Home » Discuss » Archives » General Discussion (01/01/06 through 01/22/2007) Donate to DU
 
jumptheshadow Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-15-06 09:46 AM
Original message
The aftermath of the devastation in Western New York
>>Frederick Law Olmsted would be devastated.

The jewels of his vision, the stately maples, oaks and ash trees lining Buffalo's parkways and parks have been clobbered, and recovery might take generations.

A preliminary estimate has found that roughly 90 percent of the 5,700 trees in Delaware Park and its three nearby parkways were damaged in the 16-hour snowstorm that hit Thursday.<<

http://www.buffalonews.com/editorial/20061015/1035840.asp

I just talked to my brother who says that the storm damage looks "like a neutron bomb hit only the trees" in the Buffalo area.

What a blow to a city that has hemorrhaged jobs, wealth and creative people for decades now. One of its long-standing amenities has always been the beauty of its trees and parks.

My brother said they brought in huge snowplows and plowed the trees to the sides of the streets. His girlfriend -- luckily, it turns out -- was out of town for the storm. She owns a ranch house surrounded by a forest and has no idea what damage her property has sustained.

The power is still out for 375,000 customers and businesses, and will remain off for many days to come, stretching into this upcoming weekend and possibly into next week. The hospitals have treated more than 150 people, mostly children, for carbon monoxide poisoning as people have turned on stoves and generators to warm themselves during the cold nights.

True, Buffalonians are a hearty breed. But this storm is a major blow, and I hope that people in other cities rally to help Western New York recover the beauty of its greenery.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
aquart Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-15-06 10:02 AM
Response to Original message
1. This is the greenest state in the country.
Edited on Sun Oct-15-06 10:02 AM by aquart
It will take ten minutes for new trees to take root and start to grow. They just have to import some bigger ones that are already a bit tall to speed up the process.

A stupid ugly tree outside my mom's house got broken off to the stump. She hated that tree and wasn't sorry. She was going to call the Parks Department to pull out the stump. Then she saw the leaves growing from the splintered top and around the bottom. No one's allowed to touch that valiant courageous tree now. She waters it.

Buffalo's trees will come back.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
TankLV Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-15-06 11:17 AM
Response to Reply #1
13. City has NO MONEY - trees are mostly DESTROYED and will need to be removed
Buffalo is STILL not recovered from the Dutch Elm disease of the 60's that destroyed ALL the Elm trees that created a great canopy over the streets - and that was over 40 years ago!

They may come back, but it ain't gonna happen for a LONG time...
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
SmokingJacket Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-15-06 04:08 PM
Response to Reply #1
22. Yes and no. Maples grow slowly, and they're not doing so well
up here these days, anyway. The big old maples and oaks will be replaced with little shrubby trees that don't interfere with the wires. It's been happening upstate since I was a kid, and after this snow (which only affected a small part of the state, incidentally) the process will be speeded up.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
boobooday Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-15-06 10:02 AM
Response to Original message
2. This is just heartbreaking
The destruction of massive numbers of trees like that is so tragic! I've seen it a few times, and it's always depressing.

Best of luck to them in recovering.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
KittyWampus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-15-06 12:41 PM
Response to Reply #2
19. here's an image...
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
boobooday Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-16-06 09:16 AM
Response to Reply #19
30. And your screenname describes the image perfectly
Very sad.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
TAPat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-15-06 10:07 AM
Response to Original message
3. My heart breaks for the trees
and the folks.

I can hear Rush now: Now, Ladies and Gentlemen, I told you there's no global warming. Remember you heard it here from the Rushbo.

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
babylonsister Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-15-06 10:07 AM
Response to Original message
4. And true to the MSM, we haven't heard squat about this.
Buffalo is familiar with snow storms though not in October. Why did they plow trees down?
Did man do the damage or the weather?
I did see a man interviewed who compared this snow storm to Katrina and NO; said it wasn't
a big deal in the scheme of things.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Gormy Cuss Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-15-06 10:56 AM
Response to Reply #4
11. Just some guesses here
Deciduous trees that are still leafed out don't do well with heavy snowfall because rather than falling through the spaces with a little on the branches, the snow adheres to the leaves and adds weight. If the storm was packing a lot of wind, the added weight would make it hard for the branches to sway rather than break. Older maples trees in particular would not do well.

That combined with the condition noted in the article, that the ground is wet would also mean that trees would be more likely to split or uproot because the roots aren't in solid ground.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
babylonsister Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-15-06 11:32 AM
Response to Reply #11
16. Thanks for that, Gormy. Sounds logical to me. nt
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Porcupine Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-15-06 10:10 AM
Response to Original message
5. Climate change will strike in weird ways. Get used to it.
If this storm had been "normal" the trees would have shrugged it off. A massive snowstorm hitting green leafed trees is NOT normal.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Cha Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-15-06 11:24 AM
Response to Reply #5
15. That's what I was thinking.
It didn't seem normal to me.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
lynne Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-15-06 05:21 PM
Response to Reply #5
27. Early Storm = Warmer Snowfall Temp = Wet Snow
- which is much heavier resulting in loss of limbs, trees and electrical lines.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
sofa king Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-15-06 05:28 PM
Response to Reply #27
28. I would think the leaves on the trees hurt, too.
More surface area to catch more weight, plus the trees aren't dormant so the sap hasn't solidified in the branches and trunks.

Poor Tonawanda. I never liked it for reasons which had nothing to do with the town, but at least it had beautiful trees.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
July Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-15-06 10:12 AM
Response to Original message
6. My relatives there keep using the term "war zone."
We've all seen some amazing blizzards, but this storm appears to be unprecedented in the effects on trees and power lines. My mother described a cousin's large backyard as "covered with branches -- there's noplace you can walk without stepping on a branch." My sister says that many streets are impassable because of downed trees, and the Buffalo News reports that in her town alone, they estimate a loss of 50,000 trees.

The blizzard of '77 was much worse in terms of deaths, but we didn't lose power, and once the snow was cleared, things went back to normal (took several days, though).

I've had to find out from New Jersey, where I live now, what's been going on with power, emergency shelters, water problems, etc. (using local television websites, the Weather Channel, Buffalo News website) and relay it to my relatives, because they don't have the use of televisions or computers.

People are improvising -- cooking on outdoor grills, for example, but their houses are getting very cold.

Beautiful Olmsted parks throughout Buffalo. I don't know if I want to see what's happened to my beloved Cazenovia Park.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Eurobabe Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-15-06 10:18 AM
Response to Original message
7. Poor trees, if snow didn't get 'em, global warming will...
On second thought, maybe the early snow is attributable to climate change?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
pretzel4gore Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-15-06 10:29 AM
Response to Reply #7
8. local rightwing media goonie said
regards the sudden cold spell 'hey, i want mesome global warming! haha'
those pukkers are THAT stupid!
:shrug:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
nebenaube Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-15-06 03:38 PM
Response to Reply #7
20. nope, just lake effect.... n/t
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
donsu Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-15-06 10:32 AM
Response to Original message
9. the storm made the news but not the aftermath - no electricity

has any govt. help arrived?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
jumptheshadow Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-15-06 10:47 AM
Response to Reply #9
10. Government help
Edited on Sun Oct-15-06 10:55 AM by jumptheshadow
I don't know the specifics. I do know that Gov. Pataki has declared Western New York a disaster area. FEMA will visit this week. Sen. Schumer has told residents that they might be eligible for FEMA help and should keep all their receipts for damage, etc.

Both Democratic senators in the past have been extremely supportive of this area. This is the time, however, to step up over and above the call of duty. While it's true that WNY is in a media blackout, and will be for at least a week, please Sens. Schumer and Clinton don't wait for politically opportune moments to organize relief efforts and private initiatives to help Buffalo get back on its feet and also to rebuild its natural resources.

The situation there is so bad that major governmental offices performing critically important day-to-day duties will be closed for some time to come. Many households don't have electricity, hot water or cooking facilities.

I also hope that some of the private charities and environmental organizations will help here.

On edit: Be patient with the Buffalo News link. It is taking some time to process.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
TankLV Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-15-06 11:15 AM
Response to Original message
12. My 85 YO Aunt in Kenmore has been without power since Thursday.
They're saying that they won't get to restoring power to everyone for at least a week!

Said every tree is down on her street all the way to Delaware Ave. - some limbs from neighbor's house on her garage that was just re-roofed last year!

But at least she doesn't live in a flood zone - unless you count the time us children were in the above ground round pool and swimming fast to creat a whirlpool and the side spilt and we all floated out and down the driveway! - flooded out a few basements that time, and my uncle went out and demolished the pool and created picknick tables out of the former sides, he was so mad!!!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Cha Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-15-06 11:22 AM
Response to Original message
14. That is Sad!
What a freak storm in October..I hope the trees are able to rally and come back to their full oxygen giving beauty.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Canuckistanian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-15-06 12:02 PM
Response to Original message
17. Buffalo is no stranger to severe snowstorms
Edited on Sun Oct-15-06 12:02 PM by Canuckistanian
But this is devastating. I remember that Buffalo always got hit worse than us in Toronto because of the "lake effect" snow.

But freak snowstorms in October?

Now I'm scared.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
jumptheshadow Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-15-06 12:26 PM
Response to Reply #17
18. Some commentary from a direct witness
From Donn Esmonde's excellent column in the Buffalo News:

>>The dig-out is different this time. It is not like any other time before. The legacy of this storm will linger like no other...

Limbs cracking in the crux of the storm sounded like bones breaking. It was the grand old bones of our glorious wealth of old-growth trees, snapped and maimed. We were helpless to stop it, we could only witness the destruction. Some even wept at the sight of it...

It is unsettling, driving down the damaged streets. There is a sense of unbalance, the psychological equivalent of walking on ice. Snow comes and goes. The twisted wreckage of maimed trees makes it seem like we were attacked. The natural order of things was violated. This storm did not just inconvenience us for a few days. It ripped the fabric of the region...<<

http://www.buffalonews.com/editorial/20061015/1047584.asp

Sens. Schumer and Clinton did indeed travel to the region and will help it get aid. But it is hard to descibe the blow that has just been delivered to this long-struggling area that is home to some of the most decent and hard-working people in the country.

I'm not a scientist and I don't know what to think. Is this just a freak occurrence or something that is an indicator of a deeper environmental issue?

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
lovuian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-15-06 04:05 PM
Response to Reply #18
21. It is Environmental... The Oceans are getting less salinity
that slows the Warm conveyor belt that helped keep Northern States less cold

I fear we are in for a HARSH winter over at the Atlantic side Britain Norway Russia Europe
Its why we didn't have Hurricanes in the Atlantic... they say its el Nino

I say its because the Atlantic Ocean is desalinity due to the freshwater icebergs melting

The Earth is decompensating for the CO2
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
SmokingJacket Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-15-06 04:10 PM
Response to Reply #17
23. I was a kid in Buffalo in the 70's. We used to get buttloads of snow
in the winter and spring... but once it snowed on Halloween and that was freaky and weird.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
kestrel91316 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-15-06 04:10 PM
Response to Reply #17
24. When I was in college in CO in the 70s we had an
"early freak snowstorm" that buried us a few feet deep AT THANKSGIVING. That was early enough, thank you. A month earlier is just plain bizarre.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
sweetheart Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-15-06 04:13 PM
Response to Original message
25. 85% of the damaged trees are salvagable
This is very tiny number of trees, probably because they're municipal, its in the 1000's, as any
serious forest planting is 1000-1200 per acre, so this winter, a small investment in some new tree
stocks, perhaps some ash, beech, poplars and more diverse species from elm that the planting not be
so exposed to 'elm disease', can be planted to replace the damage... but surely forestry round
buffalo could easily plant 1000's of trees every year, millions being a more expected tree number
from a serious bug.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
jumptheshadow Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-15-06 05:10 PM
Response to Reply #25
26. 50,000 trees in Tonawanda alone
Edited on Sun Oct-15-06 05:19 PM by jumptheshadow
Fifty thousand trees are damaged or uprooted in the suburb of Tonawanda.

Many of the municipal trees planted as part of Olmstead's plan are very old trees that have been icons for generations.

Even worse is the fact that the city is broke from the loss of a tax base and horrible financial mismanagement. I remember, at one point, even as early as 30 years ago, the city gardener had to find free flowers to plant in the public squares. (I wrote a story about it for the local paper. With Buffalo's continuing slide, I don't see the situation getting much better.)

These trees aren't going to be replaced easily although I hope that the community (and maybe outside communities) band together to help.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Berry Cool Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-15-06 05:47 PM
Response to Original message
29. A similar thing happened in Rochester in 1991.
A March ice storm. Enormous amounts of tree damage. Power out for as long as two weeks for some people--the local gas and electric company's emergency plans totally failed them. Truly awful.

And of course, the huge ice storm in early 1998 that spread from Quebec down to the Adirondacks had a similar effect, even though it was during the winter.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
DU AdBot (1000+ posts) Click to send private message to this author Click to view 
this author's profile Click to add 
this author to your buddy list Click to add 
this author to your Ignore list Tue May 07th 2024, 02:37 PM
Response to Original message
Advertisements [?]
 Top

Home » Discuss » Archives » General Discussion (01/01/06 through 01/22/2007) Donate to DU

Powered by DCForum+ Version 1.1 Copyright 1997-2002 DCScripts.com
Software has been extensively modified by the DU administrators


Important Notices: By participating on this discussion board, visitors agree to abide by the rules outlined on our Rules page. Messages posted on the Democratic Underground Discussion Forums are the opinions of the individuals who post them, and do not necessarily represent the opinions of Democratic Underground, LLC.

Home  |  Discussion Forums  |  Journals |  Store  |  Donate

About DU  |  Contact Us  |  Privacy Policy

Got a message for Democratic Underground? Click here to send us a message.

© 2001 - 2011 Democratic Underground, LLC