Kerry's statements are dead on the money. If people refuse to realize that the

[radwriter0555]

military is indeed the last resort for so many of these kids then they're only lying to themselves.

No one is saying this statement is inaccurate, it appears they just want to PRETEND to be insulted by it.

I know there is a segment of the kids that enlist in the military that believe they're doing something.... of some sort of value, and under any other administration that would have been true.

The fact of the matter is that the US military isn't for the best and the brightest and that frankly job prospects for unskilled kids who have no interest in higher education really really SUCK.

What they don't know is how much worse it is in iraq... so, it comes to mind that perhaps they're not the best and the brightest, but they can hope they're doing the right thing. Sadly it's turning out far too often that they're not necessarily doing the right thing.

But what kerry said wasn't wrong, cruel or dishonest. It's horrifically accurate.

[bobbolink]

1. Bring back the draft, and make believers out of 'em!

Then, join the civilized world and make a college education free to all.

That'll bring about the necessary change.

:evilgrin:

[Connie_Corleone]

2. One more time. It was a joke about Bush.

He wasn't talking about the troops.

[lazyriver]

6. Thank you for understanding what he said

If people here are falling for the RW & media spin, what's happening to the "less enlightened"?

[Glimmer of Hope]

8. Exactly! He wasn't referring to the troops but Bush.

Hasn't anyone seen Kerry's press conference?

[alarimer]

12. It didn't seem that way to me

It is not at all clear he was talking about Bush. I can see how it was misinterpreted. But he doesn't need to apologize. Even if he was referring to the troops, it is still true. The military specifically targets the poor and those who can't afford college and lure them in with promises of an education or a skill to be learned. But unfortunately they pull the bait and switch and they get sent to Iraq.

[Connie_Corleone]

13. He botched the joke, and he explained what he meant during

his press conference that the media seems to be ignoring.

[silverojo]

15. Yeah, I caught onto that the first time

I thought, when I heard it, that it was one kick-ass insult toward Bush: that if you don't get an education, you end up like him, caught in a quagmire.

[GrumpyGreg]

3. His comments were insulting to all who serve.

[Connie_Corleone]

5. They would be if he had mentioned the troops, but he didn't.

[emulatorloo]

7. no, his comments were insulting to the Bush Administration, and you know it

and rightly so.

HE WAS NOT TALKING ABOUT THE TROOPS, and you know it

---

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=364x2528304

If anyone owes our troops in the fields an apology, it is the President and his failed team and a Republican majority in the Congress that has been willing to stamp -- rubber-stamp policies that have done injury to our troops and to their families.

My statement yesterday -- and the White House knows this full well -- was a botched joke about the president and the president's people, not about the troops.

The White House's attempt to distort my true statement is a remarkable testament to their abject failure in making America safe. It's a stunning statement about their willingness to reduce anything in America to raw politics. It's their willingness to distort, their willingness to mislead Americans, their willingness to exploit the troops, as they have so many times at backdrops, at so many speeches at which they have not told the American people the truth.

I'm not going to stand for it.

---

KERRY: Let me tell you something: I'm not going to give them one ounce of daylight to spread one of their lies and to play this game ever, ever again. That is a lesson I learned deep and hard.

And I'll tell you: I will stand up anywhere across this country and take these guys on. This is dishonoring not just the troops themselves by pointing the finger at the troops, it's abusing the troops. They're using the troops. They're trying to make the troops into the target here. I didn't do that, and they know that.

KERRY: And for them to suggest that somebody who served their country, as I did, and has a record like I have in the United States Congress of standing up and fighting for the troops would ever, ever insult the troops is an insult in and of itself.

And they owe us an apology for even daring to use the White House to stand up and make this an issue again. Shame on them. Shame on them.

And may the American people take that shame to the polls with them next Tuesday.

Thank you all.

[TahitiNut]

10. Bullshit.

[Bluerthanblue]

16. no they weren't- you can't speak for them, nor

can I- I CAN speak for the friends of my 23yr old son who believed the reserve LIES that were told them, which claimed their chances of being actually sent overseas were almost nil, 4 years ago, and continued to advertise and claim as recent as a YEAR ago-

Here in our rural NE- those of us without the employment acknowledgment (compensation commensurate with the value of our work) and single parents, who can barely make ends come close to meeting, watch as our youth choose the reserves/Nat'l Guard as their only means of getting an education beyond H.S.-

*'s FALSE- empty, shallow and bull-headed "stay the course" -"I 'feel' your "pain"- "We're not leaving Iraq as long as I'm president" retoric is not only Far more insulting to all who serve, it's spits on the graves of those who died for his lies, and will continue to die for his false bravado.

[Finder]

18. Well all the soldiers with post-grad degrees should speak up then...

but seriously, the only point he was making is ignorance/lack of education leads a society to war.

Whether the intellectual lazy are soldiers, voters or leaders...he is correct.IMO

[SammyWinstonJack]

19. Really? I don't think so.

[lebkuchen]

4. That's why the minimum wage didn't get raised last June

HS kids were graduating, and the Bushies needed them to enlist, hoping they wouldn't find decent work at home or be able to afford higher education.

[TahitiNut]

9. "Volunteer" is a myth. A charade. It's economic coercion, very simply.

It's appalling that the "richest" nation on earth consigns its most disadvantaged to the 'service' of the nation. This is the corruption of elitism ... the 'comfortable' perpetuate an economic system that threatens the least advantaged and ensures that someone else can be hired ("cheap labor") to 'serve' the elite ... from mowing lawns and cleaning bathrooms to military service. Despicable.

[Bluerthanblue]

20. Exactly- unadulterated truth you speak TNut...n/t

[Bushwick Bill]

11. Don't forget what Rumsfailed said!

At a Jan. 7 briefing, a reporter asked Rumsfeld about calls to reinstate the military draft. Some members of Congress say a draft would make America's fighting force more reflective of its population.

Rumsfeld opposes the effort, and sought to explain why.

"If you think back to when we had the draft, people were brought in; they were paid some fraction of what they could make in the civilian manpower market because they were without choices," he said. "Big categories were exempted — people that were in college, people that were teaching, people that were married. It varied from time to time, but there were all kinds of exemptions.

"And what was left was sucked into the intake, trained for a period of months, and then went out, adding no value, no advantage, really, to the United States armed services over any sustained period of time, because the churning that took place, it took enormous amount of effort in terms of training, and then they were gone," he continued.

The suggestion that veterans of past wars "added no value, no advantage" rubbed some people the wrong way.

"These remarks defame the honorable and distinguished service of over 1.7 million draftees during the Vietnam Era," Thomas H. Corey, head of the Vietnam Veterans of America, said on Jan. 15. "The secretary's comments are without foundation at best and insulting at worst."
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2003/01/23/national/main537632.shtml

[Bluerthanblue]

14. you said it

well- as Kerry did-

MOST of the 'reserves' or 'guard' units are full of people who enlisted to be able to afford an education- Every single one I know of, only signed up for the training- and never dreamed they'd be sent to Afghanistan or Iraq-

Kerry spoke the truth- the ugly, "class"isim reality, for many many reservists and guard units-

It would be my sons only hopes of getting themselves a chance at college or tech school- barring some kind of magical scholarship-

[Beelzebud]

17. Similar to when Maher was hammered for his "scraping the bottom of the barrel" comment.

The sad thing is: It's true.

[pointblank]

21. The way I see it

It doesn't fucking matter what Kerry meant. I personally believe what he said was maent for Bush but that is really beside the point.

The real fucking outrage here is the fact that his statement is getting played out in the media and scrutinized by the GOP. The GOP is one who needs to apologize, and be held accountable for the mess we're in... and IMO they know it.

The whole Kerry thing is a distraction and the MSM has fallen right into the GOP trap again by even giving it airtime.