Attacked by Co-Workers about Kerry Gaffe

[Avalux]

I've been out of my office for the past couple of days doing GOTV stuff. I work in a small medical facility, the "co-workers" of which I speak are female nurses who work in the clinic. I'm in a separate area but have research patients and interact with these women on a daily basis.

Anyway - I came in this morning and walked out into the clinic to get my coffee. As soon as they saw me, I got blindsided. It was if they were waiting for me to show up to start in on me, as I've never been quiet about my political affiliation:

"Did you hear what Kerry said?" "So Kerry thinks only stupid people are in the military?" "I can't believe Kerry said such a thing about our troops." "Kerry needs to explain himself".

OK ladies!!! First of all (I told them) - Kerry was making a joke about Bush and it didn't come out the way it should have - he was not criticizing the troops and he certainly wasn't calling tem stupid. The word "stupid" was directed at Bush and his bungled war. Kerry is a decorated Vietnam war veteran - do you really think he'd intentionally say and mean what the Republicans are accusing him of? No he wouldn't. You have all been sucked into a Republican smear of Kerry and the media is an all too willing accomplice. Before you take what they say as truth, it might be a good idea to get the whole story straight.

So then one of them said "well if that's true, then Kerry should set the record straight and explain himself".

OK AGAIN!! I told them he has explained himself with a press conference and further comments but the media has, once again, focused on twisting his words and continued to perpetuate a clearly Republican attack. If you listen to what Kerry said in the first place and his subsequent explanation without outside commentary, it is impossible to conclude he was criticizing the troops.

I then walked away, went to my office and printed Kerry's words, then returned and handed copies to all three of them. A little reading might do you good I said - instead of getting all your news from the TV. I left again and haven't ventured back out there since.

Instead of being upset though, I am looking at this situation as an opportunity to educate those nurses about a few things - my next move is to print the list showing who in office has served in the military. That oughta be an eye opener for them. I plan to keep the conversation going; it will continue at lunch today.

[Lex]

1. Wow, you handled that very nicely.

Sounds like the nurses watch a lot of Fox News. :eyes:

[Avalux]

6. You know what's odd?

They're intelligent women and usually informed, don't know why they were all worked up in a tither. :shrug:

[jumpoffdaplanet]

25. Well, yesterday a bunch of DUers fell for it at first

I personally figured if the MSM was saying Kerry bashed the troops it was a lie.

I was happy to wait for more info first.

Of course it helped that it was started by Tony Snow, so I was able to assumed it was a lie from the start, but I waited for more info anyway.

And lo' I was right, the media was lying through it's teeth, lead by the nose by Snowjob.

So don't let down by your coworkers too much. If DUers could be fooled at first, then the rest of them was just that more easily fooled.


Good job getting the facts to them.

[RaleighNCDUer]

26. maybe, like the general populace, they recognise the RW slant

of Fox, but still believe that CNN is either slanted left or centrist, so they believe what they hear there, and on MSRNC, and all the other corporate media.

[mohinoaklawnillinois]

2. Good for you and keep up the good work.

I despair sometimes about how uninformed most Americans are....

[rockymountaindem]

3. Good for you

We need to educate those around us, because the media sure won't.

[fudge stripe cookays]

4. Do it do it!

You go!

You might also want to include the smearing media pundits who have (NOT) served as well, so they can see that these people have morons backing them up whose only motivation is money and ratings.

Proud of you here! :salute:

[Avalux]

7. Thanks -

I've spent the last two days working campaign stuff, so I'm a bit fired up anyway. I will include media pundits - good idea. :hi:

[C_U_L8R]

5. If your co-workers believe that

then they are the true idiots.

even a halfwit can figure this one out
and anyone who says otherwise
is just distorting the truth.

let em wallow in the stinky republicaness

[gratuitous]

16. The cure for ignorance is education

Get into dialogue, stay in dialogue even when the other person is wallowing in "stinky republicaness," and once they get it out of their systems, a liberal application of facts does wonders to clear out the stinkiness.

[noahmijo]

8. And that's how you do it

That's the problem-when it comes to politics your average American's intelligence is rock bottom-we're talking sub-retarded level. Seriously you could go on tv and say that your opponent once was a professional flasher and people would beleve it.

The neo-con's greatest weapon is in fact this stupidity-they depend on it they live off of it. They know most Americans don't even know simple history like that Iran and Iraq were engaged in war, they know that most Americans will believe anything a person in an expensive suit on tv says.

The only way to counter this stupidity is to dig up multiple "trusted" sources which contain the facts and even then you gotta get passed the "liberal media" blanket statement.

I've given up for the most part personally I've been reduced to just saying "look if you've never heard of corporate welfare, the BCCI scandal, Iran Contra, Massoud and his Northern Alliance I am wasting my time with you pure and simple."

[bobbieinok]

19. many people, even if they have internet access, don't use it for political

and news info.

I had been using the internet for some time for professional and hobby purposes. I hadn't realized I could use it to counter M$M disinformation until I started listening to MMalloy at WLS in 1999-2000. He used to give many website addresses each night.

From Malloy I learned about salon.com and bartcop; later I was led to mediawhoresonline and dailyhowler. The internet really saved my sanity (I was caught in RW and religious right Tulsa with TV pundits as my only outside source of info).

Since then, whenever appropriate, I give out DU and other web addresses. (DU is especially good b/c documentation for info is always provided....or demanded when not provided in the post. This then accustoms readers into doing our own searches.)

[underpants]

9. Well done

Recommended

[madokie]

10. Thats the way I see it too, they gave you the invitation to educate them

and it looks like you're doing it.

[grizmaster]

11. Make an opportunity out of Rove smear

couldn't agree more.

BTW- where did you get the full context of Kerry's words? I can't find the full text.

[Avalux]

18. Media Matters has a good summary:

MSNBC host Chris Matthews read from the AP article during the October 31 edition of Hardball, noting that Kerry "opened his speech ... with several one-liners, joking at one point that Bush had lived in Texas but now 'lives in a state of denial.' Then he said: 'You know, education, if you make the most of it, you study hard, you do your homework and you make an effort to be smart, you can do well. If you don't, you get stuck in Iraq.'" Matthews further described the White House's characterization of Kerry's remarks as a "violent interpretation," then later, during an interview with former House Republican Leader Dick Armey (TX), said:

MATTHEWS: If you listen to the transition of words there, it clearly looks like he was talking about President Bush being in a state of denial, not realizing when he took us into Iraq what he was going to face because he didn't study hard in school. President Bush says today, no, he wasn't saying that. Isolating the few words in the middle of that statement, he said, he was trashing the military for being uneducated and the kinds of people who flunk out of school and end up in the military and then get stuck in Iraq.

Matthews then asked Armey which was the "correct interpretation," and Armey concluded: "Look, I think John Kerry's right. He's making a defense of himself. He's saying, 'Look, I was not maligning the troops. I was maligning the president of the United States.' "

www.mediamatters.org

[grizmaster]

23. I had seen that summary

I'm looking for the few previous comments. Apparently Kerry was referring to bush not knowing the difference between Shiites and Sunnis and that ignorance on bush's part being part of the reason bush didn't understand the consequence of the invasion.

In that context it's completely clear who Kerry was referring to with his comment.

I'll keep looking for the full text to share with everybody, thanks.

[helderheid]

12. This is THE response:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=364x2537249#2537280

[Avalux]

20. Wow - that's great!

Thanks! :hi:

[BeFree]

13. Stand up to the bullies!

Way to go. What a shining example!

Unlike the trolls on the board trying to protect the rovian spin, you have used this situation to score a win.

[sinkingfeeling]

14. My first question to anyone bringing this up to me, is "Why is no one

demanding George W. Bush apology for calling over 70% of Americans 'terrorist supporters' or 'traitors'?"

[KharmaTrain]

15. Ask 'Em If They Thought About Rush's Insult Of MJ Fox Was A Joke?

Or how about boooosh's WMD joke at the National Press Club dinner..."not any here".

[spag68]

17. opponents

I've read all the posts here, and IMHO we have to stop referring to people as idiots or other denigrating names. The average person is too busy to study and be informed on the issues like the people here. Kerry's problem only illustrates my opinion on the matter. We all know R people and must respect them or we will never have any positive influence with them.

[Avalux]

21. Couldn't agree more.

These women are intelligent, and not particularly political. In fact, they can't stand Bush. The problem is they get their information in snippets from TV news. I do respect them, that's why I want to take the time to educate them. :hi:

[SammyWinstonJack]

32. But they're not too busy to spew lies and believe the lies they hear

on their TVs right? :wow: I won't cut them any slack if they come with their right wing talking points, while NOT bothering to take the time to research what they've heard. Why should I?

[Avalux]

33. I look at it this way.

They obviously know I am political and wanted to hear what I had to say (they sought me out). So given the opportunity, I provided them with accurate information.

[peekaloo]

22. Good for you.

But I must ask, do these nurses work with proctologists? :evilgrin:

[Avalux]

24. Hee hee - no

The physicans are all liberals BTW - so I often have discussions with them in front of the nurses, that's how they know my politics. :hi:

[KurtNYC]

27. Call me an optimist but at least they didn't say "apologize"

The problem is the media; NOT Kerry but I think Kerry SHOULD continue to "explain himself"

The media is willfully mis-quoting Kerry and they know it. They drilled him with the Swift Boat lies and his mistake was not fighting back hard enough. I think Kerry may be making the same mistake twice -- he (or the party) has cancelled appearances today.

Shutting up is the last thing Kerry should do at this point. He isn't running for anything this year so let them fire all verbal shots they want at Kerry. But he needs to stick to tight soundbites in his replies. Clinton said "everytime they attack you it gives you a chance to get your message out." Here are some suggestions for Kerry right now:

"These people know I was talking about Bush."
"These people couldn't deal with Mark Foley when he was sitting right next to them -- Should we expect them to EVER find bin Laden?"
"I think Bush should apologize for his WMD jokes."
"I think Rumsfeld should apologize for saying he didn't want this army! (eg "You go to war with the army you have, NOT the one you want to have.")
"Most people think Cheney should apologize for shooting his friend in the face but the GOP does everything backwards."

[Avalux]

29. Yes - problem IS the media.

Makes me so angry they don't do their jobs.

[KurtNYC]

37. They don't do the job WE would like them to do for democracy

But they do do their job for the military contractors who own MSM and pay them.

I have no doubt, zero, that they know they are smearing Kerry falsely. This is afterall the same media that regularly cleans up B*sh's gaffes, going so far as to falsify transcripts of his speeches. When called on it, they will claim something to the effect of "well we all know what he MEANT." They also know who Kerry was referring to as being not a good student and the person who got us stuck in Iraq.

[Avalux]

41. Yeah, they know exactly what they are doing.

There's no integrity in journalism anymore - no desire to report the truth. Jefferson would be appalled.

[buddysmellgood]

28. BRAVO!

[ljm2002]

30. "I can't believe Kerry said such a thing about our troops."

Response: That's because he didn't.

[Touchdown]

31. You too? Not even a "good Morning",

...just "Kerry sure stuck his foot in his mouth last night!"

I tried to explain, but he said that he saw Kerry say those words. I asked if they showed anything he said before or after that one sentence. I got "They showed enough for us to know."

So I printed out Media Matters' article, and told him I have 200 more if he needs them. Then I said that he should start listening to what Democrats say, and not what Republicans say Democrats say!:grr:

[Avalux]

35. We handled it the same way then.

Good work! I'm convinced the best we can do is give the ill-informed the facts and let the chips fall where they may. Those who choose to still not 'get it' - oh well. :hi:

[Clark2008]

34. Great way to handle it.

Bravo.

[OzarkDem]

36. Sadly, there won't be a DU'er in every office

to counter the spin.

[WI_DEM]

38. So the sheeple are buying this garbage?

[OzarkDem]

44. Some people are busy

and don't have the time to do in depth research.

[RedStateShame]

39. Hey, tell 'em if they think Kerry's insulting the troops, prove him wrong and enlist!

Surely they need nurses in Iraq by now.

[baldguy]

40. Ask them if they're referring to what Kerry ACTUALLY said

or to what the GOP propaganda lie machine twisted what he said. If they didn't hear it from Kerry's mouth, then THEY need to explain themselves.

[BoneDaddy]

42. Nurses

supporting Bush. The depths of stupidity of some people is staggering. I love when people who support the republicans vote against their own self interests.

[Avalux]

43. I never said they support Bush.

In fact, they can't stand him; that's why I was a bit taken aback by their outrage over Kerry. The problem is that they are essentially not political and heard a soundbyte on TV news, then, instead of checking it out, took it was truth.

[BoneDaddy]

51. ah

gotcha

[lumpy]

45. This is in Texas. Right ?

nt

[Avalux]

47. Yep. And another thing -

I spent the last two days away from the office doing campaign work - you'd think they'd ask me about that. Nope; had to go on about Kerry, who is irrelevant to the election.

[marions ghost]

46. you did good

:applause: sparosnare

I won't bother to debate this with anybody.

The one question I have for anyone stupid enough to believe this latest rightwing smear:

"Do you ACTUALLY THINK that there is ANY reason for John Kerry to diss soldiers? WHY would he do that?"
THINK--WHY would he do that? There is no benefit or advantage whatsoever.

[AbbyR]

48. Maybe my reading comprehension is off, but...

Even when I heard the Kerry blurb the first time, it never occurred to me that he was talking about the troops. Obviously, I thought, he's talking about the idiot in the White House. Maybe I read too fast or something, but Kerry has been defending and supporting the military for so long I just assumed he was talking about Bush.

What's wrong with people? Or maybe it's just me.

[Avalux]

50. You're more informed than most.

All of us here are; we're involved and we're Democrats. People who don't pay a lot of attention to politics are subject to the whims of the media.

[roamer65]

49. Good job.

You led them right to the Rethuglican smear machine. Hopefully they see it.