DIEBOLD is the GOP's secret weapon this year - but not how you think

[ProfessorPlum]

Too much is at stake for Cheney to let mere voters decide whether or not he will be investigated for his myriad, heinous crimes. Therefore, the Democrats must not/will not be allowed to take over either house.

So what will be done to stop this?

Electronic voting machines, in addition to massive voter fraud, intimidation, and suppression. However, too many people are on to them simply fixing results with their little video game machines disguised as ballot counters. If Democrats are not elected in districts where there are currently massive majorities for them, the game will be up, followed by investigations that reveal the whole slimy truth.

So, instead, when Democrats win, the GOP will suddenly cry "fix!" and point to the unsecure voting machines. Everyone knows that they are not to be trusted, and the GOP will find that distrust to its advantage. They will tie the election up in court battles.

Because the Democratic leaders have not had the stones to tie the previously stolen elections up in court battles, have not had the stones to call attention LOUDLY to the problem with electronic voting machines, they are about to have this issue stolen from them by the GOP. They will use it to their full advantage, probably mobilizing mobs in the streets - another technique that the GOP has the guts to use, which Democratic leaders and rank and filers apparently do not. Witness the elections in the Ukraine in 2004, when Yushchenko was put into office via our (mainly GOP controlled) government supporting mobs in the streets, supporting the results of exit polling instead of the official ballot results. They will do the same thing here.

Fixing the elections via the machines has been a great strategy for them, but they know the jig is nearly up - too many people are on to them, and now the issue is becoming mainstream, witness the HBO documentary on this week. They will turn to the courts instead, where Karl Rove has engineered wins for at least three elections for his candidates long after voting day, and fight to overturn the election of Democratic winners across the country.

Be ready.

[helderheid]

1. Honest to GOG if it means paper ballots, SO BE IT.

[aquart]

3. Yup.

The best possible outcome is for Republicans to insist that these machines be outlawed.

[ProfessorPlum]

10. That WILL be at least one good outcome of this

But it won't help us this election, yet again, because the Democrats have not been beating this drum, or not beating it loudly enough. The electronic machines have just about outlived their usefullness. The GOP will have to rely on more traditional methods of voter suppression from now on, and legal battles, but they'll get one more stolen election out of the machines - by denouncing their results when the Democrats win.

[ClassWarrior]

7. Hey You...

Have a wonderful GOTV weekend, my friend!

B-):thumbsup:

Never Give Up.

[helderheid]

14. Thanks! I have 500 phone calls to make today! NGU YOU!

[helderheid]

12. I've had no coffee. I meant to write GOD not GOG but I think GOG is

what I will type from now on.

[glarius]

32. Didn't the U.S.A use paper ballots before....Didn't they work?..Of course they did!

In Canada we have paper ballots for ALL elections, including federal, provincial and municipal. We just go in behind the curtain and mark our paper ballot. We have "scrutineers" from each party who count the ballots at the polling places when the polls close and we GET OUR ELECTION RELULTS VERY FAST!...There's NEVER any talk of a stolen election....GOOD LUCK!!!!!:)

[ProfessorPlum]

34. Absolutely the best way we could possibly do it.

And it's aboot time we adopt this method. Sorry, couldn't help it.

[aquart]

2. Thank you for your concern.

Unfortunately for them, the voters in their own party will not support those efforts.

[ProfessorPlum]

8. Voters in the GOP won't support them when they go to court

to block Democrats from winning? I think you underestimate their grip on reality.

The GOP leadership (let's call it "Rove") will go into court, and say "How can this be a legitimate election? You can't prove that the results actually reflect the will of the voters. Look how easily these machines can be tampered with." And since there is ample evidence that the machines can be tampered with, Rove will be right, as far as that goes.

And the rank and file GOPers, who depend for their continuing fantasy world on being fed constant lies, will readily believe that it is a Democratic conspiracy to fix the vote.

I'm not sure what you base your comment on.

[ClassWarrior]

9. Can I get a crystal ball too?

:eyes:

NGU.

[ProfessorPlum]

26. It's actually based on what Rove has done in the past

For example:

In 1994, a group called the Business Council of Alabama hired Rove to help run a slate of Republican candidates for the state supreme court. No Republican had been elected to that court in more than a century. The campaign by the Republicans was unprecedented in the state, which had previously only seen low-key contests. After the election, a court battle over absentee and other ballots followed that lasted more than 11 months. It ended when a federal appeals court judge ruled that disputed absentee ballots could not be counted, and ordered the Alabama Secretary of State to certify the Republican candidate for Chief Justice, Perry Hooper, as the winner. An appeal to the Supreme Court by the Democratic candidate was turned down within a few days, making the ruling final. Hooper won by 262 votes.

This was Rove's work.

[blm]

24. They own most media just so they can CREATE the reality.

They created a trashed White House left behind by the Clintons.

They created a war.

They created scandal out of a DROPPED PRONOUN.

They did this because they control most media.

[ClassWarrior]

4. Then we roll our eyes and laugh, and outlaw electronic machines...

...just to be good sports.

:evilgrin:

NGU.

[librechik]

5. I fear you are right, Professor

these dastardly criminals will stop at nothing! Even (shudder) THE LAW.

Let's hope the law is on our side this time, instead of the bad guys.

[ShortnFiery]

6. That's a good thing ... the election will stand

but now we will enjoy Republicans joining us Democrats to DEMAND A VERIFIABLE PAPER TRAIL.

Believe it or not, *fixing elections* is OFTEN but NOT EXCLUSIVELY a republican party dirty trick. :shrug:

Voting Machines ALL must have a verifiable paper trail. AMEN!

[ProfessorPlum]

13. Agreed, the voting machines have just about outlived their

usefullness - so, they will be sacrificed this on this last election, to throw the results (Democratic wins) into question.

[Danieljay]

11. you may be on to something....I tend to agree...

[grizmaster]

15. they've got 7,000 lawyers set to challenge the results

[ProfessorPlum]

17. Who? GOP or the Democrats? nt

[grizmaster]

30. Took me a while to find it

the 7,000 figure is just the dems lawyers. Below is the transcipt from CNN where I heard that. I can't remember where I heard a similar story about the thousands of lawyers the repubs have ready too. But it appears they're at least threatening to challenge a lot of results based on the cr@p voting machines they insisted be used.

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0611/01/sitroom.03.html

CAFFERTY: Well, Paula, in Shakespeare's Henry VI, one of the characters makes an absolutely classic statement. It goes like this. The first thing we do is kill all of the lawyers but not before next Tuesday. The Democratic Party is launching a 50-state voter protection effort to try to be sure that no one is messing around with our votes and they have 7,000 lawyers ready to go to work.

"USA Today" reports there will be thousands of election monitors and volunteers with video cameras. In addition to all those lawyers who will be guarding against problems at the polls, and sadly is expected there will be problems of one kind or another in all 50 states. The Justice Department will send out 800 observers, the most ever for a non-presidential election, to look for evidence of people being denied access to the polls.

So here's the question. Are 7,000 lawyers the answer to the integrity of our elections? E-mail your thoughts to [e-mail] or go to CNN.com/CaffertyFile.

BLITZER: You know, Jack, how we the United States, we send observers to monitor elections in emerging democracies around the world...

CAFFERTY: Yes.

BLITZER: ... some suggesting they're going to be sending observers to monitor how we conduct this election this time.

CAFFERTY: Yes, it's interesting that we're trying to convince Iraq they should have a democratic government and we can't hold elections without having 7,000 lawyers on standby.

[ProfessorPlum]

33. Thanks for the link

I did see that on Crooks and Liars. But the problem is, if we can challenge results based on the machinery of vote counting, so can Rove, if we win. (Those lawyers sound like they are actually going to work on voter suppression, which is a much better avenue, though).

[Hugin]

19. We'll send out our 11,000 lawyers to counter...

They weren't used in 2004 and should be plenty dry and rested.

:eyes:

[Lorax]

16. But

Won't that call into question the results of all past elections using electronic voting machines? Including the last two presidential elections? I don't see how that would benefit them.

[ProfessorPlum]

20. It wouldn't result in John Kerry suddenly coming to power

would it? It's not like the Democrats would be willing or able to push for any consequences based on that knowledge. It's becoming too hard to hide the truth about the machines. The GOP-backed media will just say "well, we should move on for the good of the country" and that will be that.

They only need to keep Congress for two more years, and they will do anything to make that happen.

[Hugin]

18. This is the strategy Rover has in mind when he says "The Math".

They are focusing their slime on the few races they must win to keep control.
Which are known to both parties.

What happened in Ohio in 2004 will be played out in those areas.

How this general election differs is that it's up to those candidates and
constituents in those areas to fight... Instead of one Presidential candidate.

How do we prevent this from happening? Well, being aware of it and educating our
base is the first step... Ignorant intimidated sheep voters are Rover's last card.

[warrens]

21. Lou Dobbs had the Princeton professor on last night

If a mainstream Republican like Lou can get that upset, we have a chance to get these abominations banned for all time. A paper trail is no longer enough for me. I want anything involving a computer GONE. No matter what you do for security, it can be hacked.

Part of me wants them to try to steal this election. I would happily join in a movement to go to the govt warehouses and, er, transfer the machines to a nearby landfill.

[PATRICK]

22. Doesn't sound effective

I think messing with the issue was mainly to discourage and intimidate and the intimidation of them using the machines this way rings hollow. It MAY happen on a small scale with rangling over the majority superceding any of the particular e-voting drama or a Dem win overall making it also a petty aftermath.
Absent any effect of actually DECIDING the control of the house the kicking and screaming should avail little and have less heart in it. TOO big of an issue and the blowback from exposing the e-voting scam in
MSM GOP talking points would be more of a disaster to the GOP than the election itself. Churtzpah on a mean and small scale and little MSM attention. I feel sorry for the people cuahgt in close elections where fraud is a patchwork quilt with GOP nails hooked into it for cover.

Mostly it is about suppression. The few races they can scam without being obvious are being closely watched. it is not a sprawling single national election. They haven't enough local enntusiasm and volunteers, not enough outside props, no big srambly distraction(yet). People they need are going down on Tuesday. The majority is almost without question going to the Dems. They have to rely on a jilted Dem for the Senate. Their own core is fracturing. The old excuses and war cries are weird more than pitiful.

Kerry was going into a close election taking severe hits from vote suppression and totally ignored e-voting. This is not that close and the denfenders, while not 100% successful are active everywhere.

The Rove PR conjunction has fizzled like stink bomb while negative revelations do more damage to the GOP. The goon squads not enough. It would have to be total naked theft but more likely, a glaringly visible line of fraud in key races.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

23. I Don't Understand...

All the polls are pointing to huge Democratic gains...


In order to claim an election is fraudulent I would assume you would have to demonstrate that there are major discrepancies between the actual results (election results) and the expected results (polls).

If the vote confirms the polls a person would look imbecilic to challenge the vote...

[ProfessorPlum]

28. Any less imbecilic than suggesting

that a heavily decorated veteran with an Ivy League degree would suggest that only the uneducated serve in the military?

They will say "fraud" and their moronic base will take to the streets to prevent a lawful transfer of power. And then they will go to the courts and use the Chewbacca defense. It doesn't have to make sense.

And Katie Couric will put on her "concerned" face and ask, "Did the Democratic Party rig the election of (key Democratic victor here)?"

[DemocratSinceBirth]

29. "Everybody " Is Expecting A Democratic "Landslide"

Suspicion usually arises when events defy expectations , not when they confirm them...

[ProfessorPlum]

31. In that case, they can let the machines show a small margin of victory

for the Dems, and then take them to court and argue that all of the absentee ballots, etc., not be counted for whatever cockamamie reason, then they can call the entire results into question, etc. Anything can happen once they get into court.

I'm not really sure what I expect, frankly. But the Democrats have left themselves vulnerable to have their legitimate victories stolen from them in this way by not making a stink about voting machines. And I also know that Dick Cheney is not going to let the unwashed masses force him to suffer any consequences of his crimes. Putting two and two together, along with a press that is willing to lie and pretend to be even more stupid than they really are, you get a Rove induced storm of confusion, obfuscating, legal chicanery, and street violence.

Or maybe not. Someone could come to their senses - it's happened before. We'll see.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

35. You Do Know There Are Nearly Five Hundred Or So Individual Races

...

[ProfessorPlum]

36. Making them that much harder for the media to follow

and shine a light on dirty dealing.

Well, maybe you are right and there is no possible way they can steal this and they won't even try. We can always hope.

[radfringe]

25. rocks

ok - this a bit tongue 'n cheek...

I think we should use rocks. Enter a polling place, and you are give one rock for each race. (all rocks weigh the same)

you drop a rock in a box marked for your candidate

when the polls close - the box is weighed, heaviest box wins.

the winner's box of rocks are stored for the duration of his/her term. should the elected official fall in disfavor with the electorate, the box of rocks is pulled from storage and the angry voters are allowed to remove their rock from the box and throw it at that particular official.

[ProfessorPlum]

27. I like it.

[A Simple Game]

37. Good idea. Almost makes me want to vote for a

Republican once in a while.

ALMOST! I'm sure we would get enough practice on Democratic winners, if not so much the better.