Pardon me for yelling and cussing but...

[walldude]

HAVE YOU PEOPLE GONE FUCKING MENTAL? I go on the road for a week and miss all the fun only to come back and see a debate on IMPEACHMENT. A DEBATE! What's wrong with you people? Look this is pretty simple, we don't even need to talk about "impeachment". All we need to do is start un-impeded investigations into everything starting back from the Cheney Energy Policy meetings. Work our way through 9/11 and the war on terror. By the time the investigations are done it will be pretty clear to every American with half a fucking brain that the entire Bush administration needs to be brought up on charges. Impeachment will come with the turf. I'm shocked that some DU'ers are agreeing that "it's time for bi-partisanship and working together". FUCK THAT! You hear me FUCK THAT! These crazy fucks have wrecked havoc on our constitution, killed tens maybe hundreds of thousands of INNOCENT PEOPLE, WOMEN AND CHILDREN INCLUDED! They put my children in debt! They spent the last 6 years saying we were "supporting the terrorists" among other lovely things. They certainly weren't interested in "bi-partisanship" then and the only reason they are reaching out now is because they know they are in deep shit. I can only imagine, with all the shit I know about them, the shit they have pulled behind closed doors. It's time to kick open the fucking doors and drag these vampires out into the light.
We owe this to the Iraqi people and the rest of the world.

:rant:

[mike_c]

1. K&R! EXCELLENT RANT!

:woohoo:

[karlrschneider]

2. Welcome back!

:D

[TahitiNut]

3. Bizarre, ain't it? The Tutucrats and Quislings are out in force.

:puke:

[Chulanowa]

55. What puzzles me...

Is that apparently all these people coming out of the woodwork in support of, well, inaction, seem to all be donors with 1000+ posts. It's just a little disconcerting O_o

Couldn't agree more with hte OP. Air out all the shit, let Americans smell the stink, and then offer them a shovel.

[truedelphi]

122. I think the American people alreadyhave smelled

The proverbial - they know the smell of stink and the numbers at the end of the day on November 7th prove that they know it.

it is not the America people that will need convincing - it is the guldarn Mass media

[chefgirl]

4. Exactly what I've been trying to say

we don't even need to talk about "impeachment". All we need to do is start un-impeded investigations into everything starting back from the Cheney Energy Policy meetings

Thats exactly my point too, and I really do believe that when Pelosi and Reid say they are going to investigate, what they're really saying is what's between the lines.

We'll get there, I have faith again. :)

-chef-

[femrap]

46. Yep, we'll be watching hearings on C-Span from

now until Elections of '08! Get the popcorn...this is going to be so much fun!!!!!

[steve2470]

5. amen ! k&r

[rubberducky]

6. Seems like a no-brainer,huh!!!

[Change has come]

7. Maybe this is exhibit A ?

snip

WASHINGTON, D.C.-- Rep. John Conyers, Jr., the ranking member of the House Judiciary Committee, is releasing a 370-page report, describing in full numerous instances of lawlessness and misconduct by the Bush Administration. Many members of congress were quick to hail recent court cases, including the Hamdan decision, as “victories” for democracy, but Conyers refuses to buy it. “The unfortunate reality is we are a long way from being out of the constitutional woods under the dangerous combination of an imperial Bush presidency and a compliant GOP Congress,” he writes.

Beginning with post-9/11 false intelligence and public deception, Conyers uses sources including public statements, the Downing Street Memo, CIA reports and intelligence briefings to refute Bush’s carefully constructed propaganda advocating a war with Iraq. Step by step Conyers traces the different reports citing no links between Al-Qaeda and Saddam Hussein, and the lack of evidence of WMDs. Beginning with Bush’s State of the Union claim that “Saddam Hussein recently sought significant quantities of uranium for Africa,” he demonstrates how the CIA, the State Department and the National Intelligence Council all informed the administration that the Niger uranium claim was “equivocally false.” French intelligence authorities went so far to say the Niger story was “bullshit.” And there is no doubt the administration knew they had faulty intelligence. One CIA official recounted his superior giving orders saying, “You know what? If Bush wants to go to war, it’s your job to give him a reason to do so.”

http://www.motherjones.com/washington_dispatch/2006/08/new%20conyers%20report.html

[walldude]

25. Yup.. As Donailin said in post 15

Conyers knows everything. And now he will no longer relegated to a room in the fucking basement. I'm also counting on Henry Waxman and a few others who have been trying to get stuff out in the open.

[Maven]

8. K and RRRRRRRRRRRR

Well, only one R, unfortunately.

Welcome back.

[jhain]

9. start here

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=132&topic_id=2953516&mesg_id=2953516

[buff2]

10. I'm with you

Let the investigations begin.When the truth comes out,there will be no other choice than to follow the rule of law AND the constitution. :hi:

[boolean]

11. FUCKIN A!

:applause:

[Laelth]

12. Hear, hear!

Great rant. k&r

:dem:

-Laelth

[Matariki]

13. Amen to that! Bush is proving his new embrace of bi-partisanship

by nominating Bolton today and trying to push his domestic surveillance program.

[Maraya1969]

97. You're kidding me. Is this man dense or does he know he is just wasting

time and thinks that is OK, especially in the light of the frigging quagmire this country is in.

[populistdriven]

14. I know - its misdirected energy now that the election is over

- I just had to plonk some guy who was looking for a fight - DU needs to work together - let the freeps duke it out

[Donailin]

15. circle gets the square

you're spot on. Pelosi is no dummy, and she sure as shit isnt going to show her hand, or let Conyers tip his.

Anyone posting here for two years or longer knows that Conyers knows everything. EVERYTHING. How? Because DU was among the first of netroots efforts to gather data and inform him personally. Election Fraud data? DU was on top of that before any other blog. The push for the DSM? Huge massive effort from DU on there. 911 Inside Job? Yeah, Conyers has a grip on that too.

We have been patient for six years wondering why the democrats on the hill have kept their powder dry, well know we know. Because they only show their cards when the time is right.

Patience, Grasshoppers. Patience.

[HCE SuiGeneris]

17. As I am new and just came out of my Bush imposed shell ( no, I did it to myself)

thank you all for persevering and re-enabling a real democracy!!!!!

[walldude]

26. Well welcome to DU!

:toast: All who seek the truth are welcome here.

[HCE SuiGeneris]

51. Thank you very much... walldude. I have been posting this... alot

And this is what I consider the truth.

Every single search on Google, every single video on YouTube, is cross-referenced in a database with YOUR name on it. This will not go away even after this admin is gone, unless we understand that corporate America thinks they are your daddy.

Take a look at what these assholes propagate. All the obfuscation and intentional alienation serves to divide and conquer. Divided we stand, because they have campaigned to break our trust. We are in limbo... or so they conceptualize.

Our only, and I truly mean ONLY, deliverance from the hell created by voter apathy, and their preying upon human nature, is to not be a statistically, predictable, entity. So think radically, act rationally, and let's surprise 'our gov't' with a duplicitous personality. One that actually benefits the people that hold democracy sacred.

[Stephanie]

16. precisely

let the investigations proceed, and the impeachment will inevitably follow

[Geek_Girl]

18. I've been wondering What's going on too

Do DUer's really think that the GOP and Bush-co is going to start doing the right thing just because Dems now control the house and senate? These war profiteers still control the military, the Supreme court and the Executive branch of government. And they are going to continue to do every thing in their power to further their interest and destructive agenda. Win or no win I think these scum bags have their eye on Iran, and if the Dems start playing nice we will be in worse shape than we are now.

[lonestarnot]

19. They are some damn varmints alright. Screwed even the pooch.

But I have been thinking we could be spinning the wrong wheels. I won't object if it happens though. I have supported impeachment for a very loooooooooooooong time. I don't know why I'm having second thoughts, just that there is so much to clean up. I want the war stopped, habeas corpus back, the Bill of Rights restored, our money back from the richies and education for my kid and health care for everyone! I prefer seeing money spent on these things than fucking with bushitler. He will pay in the next two years believe me. Oh and I'd like to be able to live too, and have enough so it wouldn't be a chronic worry, so that means energy independence. Oh and I want MJF to have the stem cell research that he and millions need. So I just don't know but I'm going to keep painting my IMPEACH signs until I make up my mind for sure. :hug: peace out

[badgerpup]

43. Can we do all of this?

Damn straight, I'd like to see Bush..AND Cheney...and a few other people as well...not only impeached and convicted, but then sitting at the defendent's table in the Hague for dessert.

But also we've got important, concrete issues which affect people EVERY DAY... like health care, and getting them or their family members the hell out of Iraq...and a living wage...and fixing the Constitution...

There's the BIG stuff...and then the little practical stuff, and it's ALL important.

CAN WE DO IT ALL?? Or do we need to prioritize?
Because as much as I'd like to see a chorus line perp walk, there's important things that need attention FIRST.

[lonestarnot]

64. These are my mixed feelings also, get it all done and look

to 2008. If we make a tribunal out of our power, we may look like we are sqandering our power the people voted on vendetta rather than accomplishments and it will fuck us out of 08. Unless we are careful, tenacious about accomplishment and at the same time exposing the corruption, getting rid of the machines, ending the war, giving back that which has been stolen from the middle class, and then letting the exposure take its natural course, we could be making a mistake.

[Dawgs]

102. Exactly!!

If are biggest concern is bringing down Republicans then we lose out on two years of trying to fix this world's problems.

This thread scares the hell out of me. I hope the new majority doesn't think like the people that are agreeing with the OP.

I hope you all ask yourselves what's more important. Did any of you even watch An Inconvienent Truth?

Do we really want to see the Democrats waste their time investigating Bush and Cheney? I would rather see them work on fixing healthcare, the environment, poverty, and getting our asses out of Iraq.

I just don't get this way of thinking. It's not about playing nice, it's about making this world a better place to live.

[Vincardog]

128. I hope the new majority does think like the people that are agreeing with the OP.

How is investigating the war crimes and plundering of the criminal cabal a wast of time? The Democratic elected officials can walk and chew gum at the same time.

They can pass an increase in minimum wage.
They can repeal the worst aspects of the Bushler agenda.
They can pass public financing of elections.
They can demand paper ballots and open transparent elections.
They can pass universal health care.

AND THEY CAN INVESTIGATE THE CRIMES OF THE CABAL TOO

[Maraya1969]

99. Isn't that where committees come into play. Surely this new Senate

and Congress can multitask. I have a lot of faith in them.

[midnight]

20. That's is right.

I agree with your rant.

[Raffi Ella]

21. .

:applause: :applause: :applause: :applause: :applause: :applause: :applause: :applause: :applause: :applause:



:patriot:

[TheBaldyMan]

22. my thoughts exactly walldude k&r'ed

[LibertyorDeath]

23. Could not agree more

"It's time to kick open the fucking doors and drag these vampires out into the light. "

We can Start with this Lying Fucker

[mmonk]

24. Yes, I've gone mental. Some of them have been investigated before

Guess what? They weren't impeached then. Here they are again.

[walldude]

28. Oh please.. like a Republican Senate and House

really "investigated" anything. These people openly subverted the Constitution. They did it in public and got support for it. I can only imagine what they have done behind closed doors. We didn't "win" anything here. We finally got into the ring. Now it's time for round 1. Sure we might lose. They might actually prove to be more clever than we thought. But we owe it to the rest of the world not to back down.

[zyguh]

27. LOL......I think the thing is that we want to INVESTIGATE everything

Investigate everything just like you said.....every little bit of it. And when all the lies, and the crimes, and the stolen money, etc,etc,etc, come to light then YES, it will be a very simple manner to Impeach Bush.

At that point, once a pile of crimes with 100% proof is presented before the world then the Republicans will have no choice but to vote for Impeachment as well.

Remember.....it takes a 2/3 majority to convict in the case of Impeachment. If we Impeached tomorrow, the Republicans wouldnt vote. If we had pages and pages and pages of undeniable proof then every single Republican would have no choice but to do the right thing and vote with the Dems. If they didnt, if a single one of them attempted to defend him because of his crimes then they would never be elected to office again, anywhere.

We go step by step, slowly but surely. We impeach tomorrow, and all the hundreds of others below him get off scott free. We convict the little guy at the bottom first, the hundreds and hundreds of the little Republicrook cockroaches and work our way up to the top. THAT way not only does HE go to jail, but so does everyone else that helped him pull this crap on the country. We investigate from the bottom up and we get to seize all of Haliburtons assets in order to recover the billions they stole from the country, etc.

So, talking about Impeachment today doesnt help anything. Talk about oversight, and talk about investigations and just let things take their course. Conyers has subpeona power, and has been carrying that list of impeachable offenses with him everyday for a LONG time now. Do you really think that once the investigations start, there could end up being any other outcome.

But, I know where your coming from......I mean the elections were two days ago, why the hell has it taken more than 24 hours for him to have been removed from office? Lol.....I am with ya, and I do know how ya feel.

It'll just be sweeter to let it simmer and grow. Like I said, we do things right we get ALL the crooks. We start yelling IMPEACHMENT right now, and someone does it, and all we get is Bush while everyone else gets off.

[walldude]

31. Welcome to DU!

I had actually put in my post, before I edited it, that I didn't expect or want anything to happen tommorow. I agree with the slow and steady pace. We need to not fuck this up or these guys will get away scott free. Great post. :toast:

[readmoreoften]

29. I don't do bi-partisanship with fascists. n/t

[L0oniX]

38. Amen

[Synnical]

30. Thank you n/t

:thumbsup:

[immoderate]

36. Hey, congratulations to you Cindy, you knocked off Clay Shaw!

Quite the job. :applause:

--IMM

[Synnical]

75. Not my district, sorry

Wasserman Shultz is my Rep. :hi:

[immoderate]

115. Ooops!

I thought you said something about that. I wanted to volunteer for Debbie, but she wasn't even on the ballot. Crazy rules around here: if you are unopposed then you are automatically elected. Not even a chance for a write in.

--IMM

[proudlibal]

32. Hell Yeah

I live in Washington, and I just sent a little friendly reminder to Senators Murray and Cantwell, reminding them of their DUTY to hold these bastards accountable. They spent 6 long years treating all democtates like SHIT! and payback is gonna be a BITCH!!!!! And yes, start with Fucking, Dick "shoot em up" Cheney! :grr:

[immoderate]

33. You got it exactly right, dude!

We've got our job to do. If we do the right thing, it'll all fall into place! :)

--IMM

[EmperorHasNoClothes]

34. Build it and they will come.

Well said. Build the case against Bush and the opinions of American voters will follow, either in the form of support for impeachment, or a blowout in 2008.

[L0oniX]

35. Water board them all then impeach the chimp and his care taker

[ljm2002]

37. Exactly right!

Let's investigate their asses, until the population DEMANDS they be impeached!

We'll show this crew what a valid impeachment proceeding looks like, not that trumped up nonsense that the people never wanted in the first place.

In the meantime, we don't have to lead by shouting for impeachment. Although I sincerely hope it leads to that.

[LibertyorDeath]

39. Dems bristle at Bush's push

Dems bristle at Bush's push

On the same day President Bush promised a new bipartisan era, he urged the outgoing Congress to approve two of his most controversial ambitions before Democrats take the reins of power. He submitted the nomination of John Bolton as U.S. ambassador to the United Nations, and said he wanted to move forward on legislation to authorize a domestic surveillance program.

http://www.cnn.com/2006/POLITICS/11/09/bolton.congress/...

[tomp]

67. such an idiot

bush doesn't seem to realize he is admitting he was not bipartisan before. and in his next breath go on to be unabashedly partisan. what a goddamned idiot! what a goddamned hypocrite!

[mcking]

116. Bush's definition of "bipartisan:" do what I want

[BlueJac]

40. No Fucking Shit!

[meuniermr]

41. Hell Yeah Man!!!

:patriot:

[file83]

42. I think the problem is that all the DU'rs are in complete and utter SHOCK.

Are heads are all spinning. I think in another day or two we'll all have our heads back on straight. Impeachment. But of course!

[jgraz]

44. Cuss all you want -- you fucking rock

[Garbo 2004]

45. Just pragmatically, how long do you figure the investigations would take?

Watergate hearings alone took a year. Public Judiciary Committee deliberations didn't commence for another 5 months after the hearings ended. Shortly after that Nixon resigned.

How long do you think it will take to uncover all the shit these guys have been up to in the last six years? I figure probably about most of the next two years. And then there's the 2008 elections. And I think people (at least I do) don't want to see just investigations but also pushing to make substantive changes on other issues....the list of crap legislation passed that has screwed over the American public is long. Bush wants to veto? Fine. 2008 will come soon enough. And I definitely not only want a Dem Congress but a Dem presidency come 2009.

There's a lot of stuff on the new Congress' plate. Oversight investigations should be real interesting and informative. I just figure that digging into all the stuff that has gone on will take a good portion of the next Congresssional session, just in time for 2008. (Hopefully Cheney will be gone long before then, either to "spend more time with his family," or perhaps due to indictment.)

I just don't think we need to start off shouting "Impeach Now!" as some appear to. Although I certainly understand the sentiment. I've had it for years. Start with the investigations, subpoena power and see where it goes.

[magellan]

59. I don't know about anyone else, but when I say "impeach now"

....I mean start the investigations. Anyone who thinks the Dems can just snap their fingers and vote to impeach Bush/Cheney is either daft or being disingenuous. Impeachment should properly be a careful and in depth process of learning what went wrong, if anything.

The inquiry has been out there for over a year now. It's time to start the investigations.

[AntiFascist]

153. That's exactly right...

those who argue against impeachment really don't want the investigations. The way it should work is: the people scream for impeachment, representatives start serious investigations.

[Duppers]

47. Right on, walldude!

And don't let them tell us that Congress cannot get anything done if it is investigating either.

They took their time looking into Clinton's toe nail clippings (metaphor), fergodssake, when he had done NOTHING wrong ('til he had to lied to protect his marriage).

As you said, the assholes in power have gotten innocent peopled KILLED and have bankrupted this country---drained it of everything from money to world respect. It will take decades for the country, especially the middle class, to recover.

[Hawkowl]

48. Amen Brother! nt

[Norrin Radd]

49. Agreed. lol. n/t

[tiptoe]

50. And we owe it to the America of our Forefathers...and to Ourselves. nt

[Rainscents]

52. AMEN!!!

Great rant. :applause: :woohoo:

[OneBlueSky]

53. impeachment is NOT about justice . . .

the results of impeachment are removal from office -- nothing more . . . it's a POLITICAL action designed to protect the nation from irresponsible and/or criminal officials . . . something that can also be accomplished through Constitutional checks and balances now that we control Congress . . .

if we want justice -- and we certainly do -- we investigate, gather evidence, and build the case . . . and, when the time is right, haul their asses before the appropriate U.S. and international courts . . . where suitable punishment can be meted out . . .

impeachment investigations and proceedings would take up most of the next two years -- when they'll be out of office anyhow . . . it's a waste of time and energy when there is SO-O-O-O-O much else that needs doing . . . and, again, it won't result in punishing the perpetrators for their crimes . . . only the judicial system can do that . . .

two years is a very short time in politics . . . we need to focus our energies on beginning to solve some of the myriad of problems BushCo has created over the past six years . . . that's what Democrats were elected to do -- to address the war, healthcare, minimum wage, jobs, the environment, New Orleans and the Gulf Coast, etc. . . if we can't do that and demonstrate that Democrats can indeed govern, our majority may be very short-lived . . .

[AntiFascist]

137. I disagree, not if the investigations are done right...

it doesn't have to turn into a big media circus either, and judging from the behavior of the media it probably wouldn't become one since they have never been all that eager to attack Bush.

The investigations could conceivably turn up much information on the underlying corruption which could help prevent this from ever happening in the future. We need to push for this NOW while the public is energized, so that the right investigations will be done, otherwise we might as well kiss the opportunity goodbye and wait for all of it to rear its ugly head at some point in the future.

I'm also disgusted by the compromising tone of so many Democrats. Many of us want real change, but it will all converge back into the same status quo, just watch.

[Swamp Rat]

54. IMPEACH BUSH!

:mad:

[deutsey]

56. Let's not bicker and argue about who killed who....

I mean, at least Bush didn't have a blow job in the Oval Office.

:eyes:

[Pooka Fey]

57. Thank you, Walldude - my thoughts exactly

[Hugin]

58. Thanks for the measure of common sense, walldude.

:thumbsup:

For the record, this is my only post in any impeachment thread.

You said it all and what you say is close to my feelings on the matter.

[smirkymonkey]

60. Hear, hear.

:applause:

[Amaya]

61. Absolutey correct!

nt

[Liberal In Texas]

62. Agreed. And I would imagine this is pretty much what most here at DU think.

(Just look at the number of recommendations.)

Investigation and oversight. That should be job 1 in the next congress.

[tomp]

68. there appears to be a solid group that is 100% for impeachment.

i haven't tallied the numbers but you might want to check your imagination just a bit.

[KayLaw]

63. I'm not worried

I've been ignoring these threads because I believe in Waxman. There is no way he's going to let any criminal behavior slip by. He's been waiting and waiting and this is his moment. I believe that there are some extremely serious crimes that will be exposed and certain people will end up in prison - for life. All that's needed is truth and light.

[sagesnow]

65. My feelings exactly! n/t

[sybylla]

66. And we owe it to generations to come

Thanks for that absolutely perfect rant! My thoughts exactly.

[earth mom]

69. We can't forget-otherwise we deserve everything they've dished out.

We must expose & convict the criminals or nothing has changed and this country is over, stick a fork in it, done. If people aren't angry as hell & taking names, then they aren't paying attention!

Screw playing "nice"! Impeach ALL of em! :grr:

[Lars39]

70. Just now saw your thread, walldude. Agree 100%.

[civildisoBDence]

71. First things first. Impeachment, THEN the Hague, then...

once DUHbya's been Hagued, he can be hanged.

Newsprism

[warrens]

72. I have not seen ONE SINGLE PERSON mention bipartisanship

What we are saying is we want OUR congress to get a bunch of stuff done, THEN start investigations. The most important thing facing us is "draining the swamp" for good. New ethics laws, gut the entire lobbying industry, and take away the Repukes' money machine.

As for impeachment, after a few investigations, it will be clear enough whether or not it will succeed. If you want to end up like Gingrich, fine. I don't.

[watercolors]

73. Impeachment and tried in the world court

for war crimes against humanity and profiteering from war! The whole group of them!! I am really angry and history will question why ir was not done.

[Catherine Vincent]

74. Awesome rant!

:thumbsup:

[Lone_Star_Dem]

76. Works for me

Investigate and the rest will follow.

[EnviroBat]

77. RIGHT FUCKING ON!

[SutaUvaca]

78. A Certain Dickhead

in the past accused of of being appeasers, as in Chamberlain vs the Nazis. I'll be damned if I want to see the new Dem leaders now turn appeaser to the any of the criminals that have led our country to ruin and disgrace around the world, that have enriched themselves on the very blood of god knows how many people.

Talk of bipartisanship makes workable press conference chitchat for the moment perhaps, but it is time for the shit to hit the fan.
Go Conyers!! Go Waxman!! Nail their asses, the whole neocon BFEE bloodsucking pile of them.
My vote is to start the investigations immediately, and start with Vader, (Energy cronies, cooked evidence, et al.)

[underpants]

79. Sometime in say March they should take a Friday afternoon

and bring up the charges and vote on it and send it to the Senate where Reid can set up a vote on the next Friday and it will fail (to convict)but the historical record will be established and future generations will view Bush as we do Joe McCarthy or slavery.

Do it short and simple. Take one afternoon and finish it in the House.

First charge-dereliction of duty on and before September 11, 2001.

[pberq]

80. Right on! - the investigations will lead to criminal charges,

then impeachment if that's what the people want. Either way, they MUST be heald accountable!

[Helga Scow Stern]

81. Right f'ing on! n/t

[Porcupine]

82. These guys are beyond criminal, they have crippled the world

with their wars and denial on climate change. History will not blame us for investigating their lies and corruption. Then let the people demand impeachment.

I remember all too well what Enron did to California with the full consent of the BFEE. We all saw Katrina. We all saw * sit there for seven minutes on 9-11. MF'ers gotta pay.

[jasmeel]

83. Nuff said!

[Marie26]

84. We won.

We can calm down now, OK?

[elehhhhna]

85. K&R 90. Well put!

[In Truth We Trust]

86. Hell Yeah! Absofuckinglutely!

[nam78_two]

87. K&R/nt

[Freeusfromthechurch]

88. Can I get a - Hell Yeah

[Dangerously Amused]

89. ~~OH HELL YES!!!~~

Well said. Bravo!


:applause:

[mopinko]

90. you forgot raped the planet

just cleaning up the DU in the middle east will still be costing my grandchilren big money.

[madmunchie]

91. You go guy

I'm with you 150%. This "lets make nice" is bullshit! We owe it to the thousands of lives needlessly ended because of this bunch of creeps. Not to mention everything else that you have listed. We got beat in previous elections because we tried to play nice. We had to let it get so bad that we are now in real trouble. I don't think waiting until we are in real trouble again is too wise a course to choose because one day, we may not be able to recover. We must expose the administration and all of it's supporters in the Government for what they are and what they have done to our country.

[Clinton Crusader]

92. What a great line--->

"It's time to kick open the fucking doors and drag these vampires out into the light."
:yourock:

[moodforaday]

93. Kick and 100th rec

With great pleasure!

[Pacifist Patriot]

94. You're preaching to this choir.

Couldn't agree more.

[AliceWonderland]

95. Agreed -- this administration severely overstepped its constitutional limits.

Start with tough investigations. They would have to lead to impeachment.

Torture, rogue wars, lies, energy scandals... one cannot be bi-partisan over these issues.

[Maraya1969]

96. When they roll back the torture bill Bush is going to lose his "immunity"

that he fought so hard to win. I'm waiting for that one!

[Dawgs]

98. You couldn't be more wrong!!

If you want to lose every seat in 2008, including the Presidency, spend all your time on hearings and investigations.

In three years, Bush and Cheney will be afterthoughts, and you want to ruin our chance at making this country great by killing our chances for 2008.

Do you really want Gingrich or McCain for President? Do you want to lose the Senate after only two years of controlling it?

What-the-fuck-ever!!

[walldude]

101. So you want to let these criminals walk away

because you think somehow that it will ruin our chances in 2008. Good plan. "Bush and Cheney will be afterthoughts". Yeah in some alternate universe the repercussions of the crimes committed by these thugs would disappear in 3 years, in reality however we are going to be trying to reverse what they did for the next 20 years, not to mention actually paying the bill for this fiasco will take another generation or two.

[Dawgs]

106. No. I don't want to let these criminals walk away.

I want them to pay just as much as anyone else, but bringing them to justice isn't going to doing anything to fix all of the things they fucked up.

I'm not against hearings, I just don't think they should be a huge priority. It would be risky strategy that would get us nothing if it backfires.

[Raster]

114. Just start the investigations. It will finish flusing out the debris in 2008.

This country must KNOW AND NEVER FORGET HOW CLOSE WE CAME. NEVER FORGET! Start the investigations. They lead where they lead.
:kick:119!

[porphyrian]

100. I'll kick the shit out of that. - n/t

[Usrename]

103. Bravo!

Kick open the fucking doors.. you betcha!

[JRob]

104. FUCKING "A" RIGHT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Megahurtz]

119. "Fuckin' A Right"

I love that song by the GOTOHELLS!!!:7

[JRob]

150. don't know that one...

[Subdivisions]

105. Thank you. n/t

[Bernardo de La Paz]

107. No impeachment. Waste of time and pol. capital. Investigate, expose.

No impeachment. Pelosi is too smart for that. There are not enough votes to convict in the Senate, so it would be a waste of time and political capital to do it.

Investigate, subpoena, expose. There is a ton of Republican / Bush corruption to expose. If a rotting corpse falls out onto a hearing table that stinks enough to convince enough Republican Senators to convict, then impeach.

[walldude]

123. That's pretty much what I said in my post

we don't even need to discuss impeachment. It will be inevitable once everything is brought to light.

[mistertrickster]

108. I'd rather see CRIMINAL charges. Let BushCo. do hard time. nt

[Kajsa]

109. Kick and Recommended!

:kick:

[Major Hogwash]

110. It's gonna be a bright, bright, bright . . sunshiny day!

I can see clearly now the rain is gone
I can see all obstacles in my way
Gone are the dark clouds that had me blind
It's gonna be a bright, bright, bright sunshiny day
Yeah it's gonna be a bright, bright bright sunshiny day

I think I can make it now, the pain is gone
All of the bad feelings have disappeared
Here is the rainbow I've been prayin' for
It's gonna be a bright, bright, bright sunshiny day


Look all around, there's nothing but blue skies
Look straight ahead, there's nothing but blue skies

[butterfly77]

111. Let the investigations begin!

We need to let our representatives know this is why they got our vote,lets fill their mailboxes with e-mails till they over flow!

These evil ass bastards have destroyed too many lives and if they would have won think about what they would be doing and saying right now...Don't ever,ever,ever,ever,ever,
ever,ever,ever,ever,ever,ever,ever,ever,ever,ever,ever,ever,ever,ever,ever,ever,ever,ever,ever,ever,
ever,ever,ever,ever,ever,ever,ever,ever,ever,ever,ever,ever,ever,ever,ever,ever,ever,ever,ever,ever,
NEVER FORGET THAT THESE ARE SOME OF THE EVILEST,LYING,HYPOCRITICAL,DIRTY BASTARDS and they are plotting and planning how they can destroy us as we speak. COME TOGETHER IN A BIPARTASIAN MANNER HELL!

[FogerRox]

112. I could not agree more, KNR

[11 Bravo]

113. In the words of the immortal Gus Grissom, "Fuckin' A, Bubba!"

[ClayZ]

117. Hear Hear! Hearings!

No Doubt the Universe is unfolding as it should!

[Warren Stupidity]

118. Exactly. Investigate. The rest will follow. NT.

[PATRICK]

120. A theme became a distraction

The real business and power of the abused legislative branch is extremely effective in undoing while doing the required business of the nation. The power of the purse is not about criminal prosecution and oversight is not a police force set up. These mundane activities can undo the war and take it apart for misdeeds. AFTER getting into its real function, such extraordinary things as impeachment can take their course. Even if we hit a home run we have to round the bases. First base is simply restoring the activities and power of the legislative branch, a mammoth blow against the Bush despotism. if you forget to touch base...

On the other hand the issue must be kept heated and strong new that the oppression of state spying and oppression MIGHT be lifted by the executive. Realistically you can't expect people to parse exactly the way things should go nor that going silent on impeachment altogether won't be misinterpreted as surrender to a great crime, a lack of popular will.

So at the risk of seeming a fence straddler with a post up my posterior I applaud both the impeachment zealots and those defending the necessary and productive wisdom of getting the Constitutional juggernaut back in motion in its own just course. Would that wisdom reigned in prudence, but it doesn't. It has to be ALL out there and realistically, we know the Congress will do things their way even if we got millions more shouting "impeachment first" from every street corner. But roasting some national feet to keep this moving is absolutely required looking at the past record and the fact not ALL new Democratic reps are courageously progressive firebrands OR hot for impeachment. There not enough votes for even a quick beginning.

[Strawman]

121. Any kind of responsible new leadership has to do its due dillegence

We have to investigate to really determine the extent of the mess we're in. I know independent journalists and others have done this, but we desperately need a full-fledged congressional investigation on Iraq, Energy, and lots of other things. And I gotta believe that what will be uncovered in due process of said official congressional investigations will be conducive to impeachment.

I don't believe that governance and impeachment are mutually exclusive. It's just a matter of timing and sequence. Investigate because we need to in order to govern. We would be derelict if we did not. Establish the facts through Congressional investigations and then take appropriate action based on those facts.

I don't think we should say impeach now before we do this. What's important is that we investigate dilligently and I think then the facts will speak for themselves.

[Goblinmonger]

124. Let me give you a FUCK YEAH, brother.

Exactly right.

[Hubert Flottz]

125. Be careful you may hurt some little lurking troll's feelings.

Be nice like the GOP!

[Vincardog]

126. walldude got it in one. Open the doors and let the sun shine in

watch the vampires run or turn to dust

[novalib]

127. WE OWE IT TO THE FUTURE!!!

We certainly owe it to the Iraqi people and the rest of the world!

But we ALSO OWE IT TO FUTURE GENERATIONS!!

Bush and his gang of thugs and murderers and enablers MUST -- MUST!!!!!!! -- be held accountable for their awful crimes against humanity!!!!

WHAT IS THE POINT OF GAINING POWER IF YOU DO NOT USE IT FOR GOOD????!!!!!!

[Joanne98]

129. I agree 100%! No bi-partsianship for me. I WANT JUSTICE!

[callous taoboy]

130. Bring 'em on! Excellent rant, Mr. Walldude, dude....n/t

[Phrogman]

131. "A dictatorship would be a lot easier....."-W

almost lost the country to a modern day Hitler and we're worried about being nice to him.


Only in America.

[Seabiscuit]

132. And pardon me for entertaining the same thoughts every day for 6 years

[cspanlovr]

133. And they will come back, if we don't show them for what they are.

[happydreams]

136. Yep! They will come back if they aren't forced to face the music.

[buddysmellgood]

134. "FUCK THAT! You hear me FUCK THAT! " AMEN!!!!

You are my hero Walldude.

[Truebrit71sbruv]

135. You were ranting?...

... all sounds perfectly reasonable to me...

I'll bring the stakes...

[mtnester]

138. When my Grandpa, a WWII Vet, has to decide if he can afford medicine

there is ZERO debate for me....

Impeachment is the LAST of the worries and troubles of this country. Sure, it can still be used as an ace in the pocket, but we need to get busy on verified voting, Iraq, health care, alternative fuel, poverty, educatio..I can think of about 100 more things that are way more important, including simple congressional oversight and perhaps hearings.

The very effing last thing I want this country to be bogged down in is another war.

[newsdude]

139. It ain't so simple

If you want the Democrats to spend two years spending that much energy on investigating the last six years, what will you end up with?
And seriously, politically, what is there to gain?
Many of the Democrats in Washington voted for the patriot act, voted to give Bush the Iraq war.

You've already weakened the Repubs. Further investigation, even if the Dems had the stomach for it, isn't going to win any more votes.

You could convict the Repubs of orchestrating 9-11, and they'll still have 30 percent of the vote.

As much as I'd love to see them pay for it, and as much as Americans deserve the truth about the last six years of hell, I just don't see this as a political reality.

[walldude]

142. I'm looking for the sarcasm smiliey...

We're supposed to just forget everything they've done? I know you are new here, Welcome to DU, but maybe you should look through some of the archives to see the extent of what this administration has done. To let them walk away would do 2 things. It would prove that they are right about liberals being pansies and it would embolden them to continue to dismantle the constitution. I don't care about "winning more votes", this isn't about "politics". I'd rather show the world and especially the Iraqi people that America can be what it used to be, that we stand for justice, honesty, and truth. That we don't kill innocent children in order to steal their oil, I mean bring them democracy, that we don't torture people, that we don't rob from the poor to give to the rich, shit I could go on all day. Take a look at some of the research forums, maybe you'll come back as angry as me..

[mogster]

140. Garlic!

[emdee]

141. When you get 140 replies and 140 votes for the greatest....

I think that means that you cannot go on another road trip!
Welcome back and I agree!
emdee

[walldude]

143. Hehe.. this is easily my most popular thread ever

guess I struck a chord.. As far as the road, well that's what I do. Luckily things slow down a little during the holiday season so I'll be around. Now if our tour bus would get Internet access back, I wouldn't have to worry about it... :toast:

[bluestateboomer]

144. Once again the RW Noise Machine got us!

It occurred to me that the wing nut spin Meister's knew they were going to lose so they started hitting the media with the "Democrats are crazy with hatred" lies. This allowed them to frame the after election debate. Now all of our victorious politicians are afraid because they might appear to be extreme and partisan. Even after all the hatred and partisanship we have had directed against us, we can't even stand up for what's right because the wing nuts have framed the issues.:argh:

[Mynameissalvatore]

145. I agree

When the Repubs won in 94 they didn't wait long before they started messing with Clinton with his picks for Attorney General and Whitewater. They didn't decide on bipartisanship and this was long before Clinton even had a chance to show what he was made of as far as being presidential. We have had 6 years of this admin and we know what they are made of.
We need to clean house. I mean think about Cheney and Rumsfeld. They were remnants of the Nixon admin. If we don't get some indictments they will only come back recycled in a few years to wreak havok again

[The Doctor.]

146. Thankyou.

Been feeling the same way.

[rhiannon55]

147. Thank you for yelling and cussing, walldude

You are yelling and cussing for so many people! We can't let our newly empowered representatives and senators make too nice with those people. We demand that they investigate their actions and let the people know what they discover. We can't just let this go and "move on". Hell no.

[WillyT]

148. Amen walldude !!! - A-Fucking-Men !!! - K & R !!!

:bounce::yourock::bounce:

:kick:

[Clarkie1]

149. I disagree with you, Walldude. Investigations do not exclude bi-partisanship.

It is important we work together with all the representatives of the people, and the President, to find common ground to move America forward.

You make a mistake to think that upholding our values and investigating wrongdoing excludes that. If we let it exclude working together, I guarantee you will will lose 2 years hence.

[AntiFascist]

154. There is a middle ground on this issue...

Many fiscally conservative Republicans voted Democratic in this election because they were fed up with excess war spending and all the corruption. Undoubtedly, there must be moderate Republicans in Congress who feel the same way, eventhough they may not wish to go public with their thoughts. They must also realize that the machinery underlying this corruption must all be exposed and dealt with before it will go away completely.

[tlsmith1963]

151. The Only Bi-Partisanship I Want is...

...with the moderate Republicans & Independents. Sure, I would like to ask them, "What the Hell were you *thinking*?!! But they gave our party a chance. They finally realized how horrible Bush & the others are (I wish they had realized it sooner, but there you go). If we push them away, I guarantee we will lose the next election. When it comes to the neocons & fundies, though, I have no desire to come together with them. They hate us anyway, so why even try? There is no hope for that bunch.

[Terri S]

152. Well said, Walldude!!!

And not to worry. Everyone knows Conyers has been waiting for this for a LOOOOONG time! Once REAL investigations start on all of the crap they've pulled, it's all over! Just give em a chance to get started.

I'm enjoying the hell out of watching the Repub melt down already..and it hasn't even heated up yet!!

[Nothing Without Hope]

155. K & R, Totally agree. The last time there was "tolerance" and "bi-partisanship"

for government criminals, Iran-Contra and so much more was swept into secrecy and the criminals maintained power to commit ever more crimes. One of them is up for Sec'y of Defense right now...

It makes me so very angry to hear the brainless, thoughtless, clueless babbling about making nice with these treaonous, murderous criminals. Hello? Make nice to a sociopath and he laughs at you and takes advantage. Same goes. And for our government, only a thorough cleansing will remove the corrupt legislation and precedents from the fascists. Ignore all this in favor of a smiley face at EVERYONE's peril.

[orleans]

156. YES! you're completely right on! (don't go off for a week again!) n/t

[Swede]

157. Truth is beauty.

And beauty truth.

[Nothing Without Hope]

158. Robert Parry agrees with you: "Hey Democrats, the Truth Matters!"

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=103x245299

Link to full article in that thread. here's an excerpt:

(clip)

If the full story of George H.W. Bush’s role in secret deals with Iraq and Iran had ever been made public, the Bush Family’s reputation would have been damaged to such a degree that George W. Bush’s candidacy would not have been conceivable.

Not only did Clinton inadvertently clear the way for the Bush restoration, but the Right’s political ascendancy wiped away much of the Clinton legacy, including a balanced federal budget and progress on income inequality. A poorly informed American public also was easily misled on what to do about U.S. relations with Iraq and Iran.

In retrospect, Clinton’s tolerance of Reagan-Bush cover-ups was a lose-lose-lose – the public was denied information it needed to understand dangerous complexities in the Middle East, George W. Bush built his presidential ambitions on the nation’s fuzzy memories of his dad, and Republicans got to enact a conservative agenda.

Clinton’s approach also reflected a lack of appreciation for the importance of truth in a democratic Republic. If the American people are expected to do their part in making sure democracy works, they need to be given at least a chance of being an informed electorate.

(clip)

[sce56]

159. We had better be damm carefull we don't take too long They have shredded most of our rights

from the constitution!


October 17, 2006,Will be remembered as the Enabling day of the 21st Century!
"The government will make use of these powers only insofar as they are essential for carrying out vitally necessary measures..."
~Adolf Hitler, March 23, 1933, before the German Parliament (Reichstag) as he urged them to pass his "Enabling Act"

Got Fascism Yet?


http://www.georgewalkerbush.net/bush-nazilinkconfirmed.htm



Fascism Accomplished!

[kerry-is-my-prez]

160. Impeachment will only happen when the public demands it - plain and simple.

And that should be the BIGGEST part of our job. Inform people of WHY he should be impeached. Bug the media to inform people. The pols only do whatever their constituents want them to do - for the most part.

[elf]

161. Absolutely brilliant rant!!!!!!!!!!

:bounce:

[XOKCowboy]

162. Kicking for my brother...

You have a way of tellin' it like it is. Keep it up.

[walldude]

163. Thanks man... home for 3 weeks.. Call ya soon

we'll do lunch... hehe

[blindpig]

164. kick n/t