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3 guesses as to who Carville wanted as Al Gore's running mate (in 2000, of course).

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Pale Blue Dot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-11-06 12:34 PM
Original message
3 guesses as to who Carville wanted as Al Gore's running mate (in 2000, of course).
Edited on Sat Nov-11-06 12:56 PM by Finnfan
http://www.findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m1316/is_6_32/ai_63165531

ZELL MILLER

By choosing former Georgia governor Zell Miller as his running mate, Al Gore could add intellectual brainpower, rhetorical firepower, and lots of plain old populist piss-and-vinegar to this staid election.

<snip>

Miller would bring to the ticket a compelling personal story. In an election in which the final four candidates were the sons of a bank president, an admiral, a senator, and a president, Zell Miller was the son of a teacher--a teacher who died when Miller was just two weeks old. Raised by his mother in Appalachia, in a rock house she built herself, Miller found his focus in the United States Marine Corps, and his unabashed patriotism, combined with his down-home populism, makes him an American classic.

Zell Miller is also a world-class campaigner and orator. His keynote address to the 1992 Democratic convention ranks with Barbara Jordan's and Mario Cuomo's as one of the finest examples of powerful rhetoric and partisan passion.

At a time when politics seems moribund, Zell would bring energy. When people are looking for heroes, Zell's the real thing. And when Democrats need someone who's not afraid to open up a can of whupass on the radical right, they need look no further than Zell Miller.

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Straight Shooter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-11-06 12:35 PM
Response to Original message
1. Kick Carville to the curb. n/t
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ChairmanAgnostic Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-11-06 12:36 PM
Response to Original message
2. crazy? Zell's not crazy. Sheeet, he's just like me and Mary.
I guess the days of anyone caring what this twit has to say are way over the falls. Niagara Falls.
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in_cog_ni_to Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-11-06 12:36 PM
Response to Original message
3. OK...no more James Carville books for me. He has seen the LAST of my money.
Zell MILLER???&^%$#@#$%^&

Geezusf**ckingkrist!
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napi21 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-11-06 12:37 PM
Response to Original message
4. I can't believe he's still talking about Zell! Hell, I live in N. Ga. and
I ignore his existance! I used to really like Carville when he was running Clinton's campaign, but something has happened to his brain! Mary Matlin most likely!
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Garbo 2004 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-11-06 12:48 PM
Response to Reply #4
13. The Carville/Begala article is dated June 2000 n/t.
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Rosemary2205 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-11-06 12:37 PM
Original message
Well this year Zell did election ads for GA Gov Purdue (R)
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Adenoid_Hynkel Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-11-06 04:45 PM
Response to Original message
25. and he campaigned for man-boy ralph reed in the primary
for lt. governor
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Totally Committed Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-11-06 12:37 PM
Response to Original message
5. As I've said before.... He and Begala ran Zell Miller's last campaign...
Edited on Sat Nov-11-06 12:38 PM by Totally Committed
They are responsible for inflicting that POS on this Party.

They actually LIKE Miller, fercripessake, but then, Carville also seems to think the Republicans outclassed us in this election.... :crazy:

Whatever, Jimmy.

TC

Edited to add: With Lieberman, what we got was Zell Miller minus the frothing at the mouth. Not much better.
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cali Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-11-06 12:59 PM
Original message
No kidding?
You mean Zell's pro-choice, pro civil unions, gay adoption, an environmentalit and an advocate of civil rights? I didn't know that.
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Goblinmonger Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-11-06 12:39 PM
Response to Original message
6. Let's assume for a moment
that Miller isn't batshitcrazyinsane.

Why would you run someone from TN with someone from GA? That is just fucking stupid.
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deadmessengers Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-11-06 12:45 PM
Response to Reply #6
11. Because Zell is the only Democrat that could have carried GA.
And, that would have given us President Gore.
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Alexander Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-11-06 01:04 PM
Response to Reply #11
21. More like Nader would've reached his goal of 5% of the vote.
Liberal Democrats were already plenty turned off by Gore, Lieberman, and advisors clamoring for a rush to the center, abandoning the populist themes that are the backbone of the Democratic Party.

As it was, most of them still held their noses and came home, and Nader only got 2.74% of the vote in 2000.

But with Zell? Nader would have qualified for funding from the Green Party, which was his goal in the first place - to reach 5% and get that funding.

With friends like these...
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Goblinmonger Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-11-06 01:05 PM
Response to Reply #11
22. You could say that for any state that went Bush
My point is that it is incredibly stupid to pick a Pres and VP candidate from the same region. I understand your scenario, but we don't know how much the northeast would have been put off. You want to spread things out a bit.
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deadmessengers Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-11-06 11:24 PM
Response to Reply #22
27. Not necessarily stupid.
Bill Clinton and Al Gore were from neighboring Southern states, and things seemed to work out pretty well for them.

I would agree completely that 2 Northeasterners couldn't get elected on the same ticket, simply because of the general perception that most people have about Northeastern arrogance.

And, I don't think the Northeast would have been put off by 2 Southerners on the ticket - Bill Clinton and Al Gore carried the NE as a block both times.

Here's a question (wholly theoretical, of course) - did the fact that Joementum was Jewish hurt the the Gore campaign more in the South and Midwest more than Zellout as VP would have hurt them in the Northeast? I think it might have.

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Nite Owl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-11-06 12:41 PM
Response to Original message
7. Sure makes his marriage to
Mary Matilin more understandable doesn't it.
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NYCGirl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-11-06 12:41 PM
Response to Original message
8. Wow! The one Democrat who's WORSE than Lieberman. Although Lieberman
back in 2000 was not the same guy we see today; I guess "9/11 changed everything" for him.
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Anarcho-Socialist Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-11-06 12:41 PM
Response to Original message
9. Zell should have gone with the other Dixiecrats
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deadmessengers Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-11-06 12:44 PM
Response to Original message
10. I can see it
Before everyone jumps up and down and starts screaming about Carville, you really should consider the timing nd context.

In June of 2000, when this article was written, Zellout was a wildly popular former Governor of Georgia, and an unquestioned Democrat. People here in Georgia respected him. It wasn't until July of 2000, when Paul Coverdell died and Roy Barnes appointed Zellout to the Senate that he became the turncoat we all know and despise today. Hell, I volunteered for his campaign in the special election that followed his appointment, and I felt just as pissed at Zell as everyone else did when he turned his back on us.

It wasn't until he'd been in the Senate for a few years that Zellout betrayed us all. But, in June of 2000, there was no reason to believe that he would, and you should consider that before you condemn James Carville for suggesting that he would have made a good VP.
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Divernan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-11-06 12:57 PM
Response to Reply #10
19. Thanks for the factual background and realistic perspective.
Increasingly rare on the DU boards these days. Seems very few posts on threads in general reflect having read the link provided in OPs, let alone doing a little basic research to contribute something of value, ie., facts, to a discussion.
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undeterred Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-11-06 12:47 PM
Response to Original message
12. Carville's mind has deteriorated while sleeping with the enemy.
He's amusing, but in a sick kind of way.
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patricia92243 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-11-06 12:51 PM
Response to Original message
14. Which came first - the chicken or the egg? Did Zell turn Republican because he was angry that he go
got passed over for VP candidate or did he get passed over for VP candidate because he is a Republican (I know he is a registered Democrat)
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Pale Blue Dot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-11-06 12:54 PM
Response to Reply #14
17. You're right - I hadn't thought of that...
Change parties and idealogies because you were passed up for a promotion... betray your ideals and your conscience because you didn't get your way....

It is TOTALLY Al Gore's fault that Zell became a Republican!

:sarcasm:
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Kerrytravelers Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-11-06 12:52 PM
Response to Original message
15. Did you notice the copyright dates?
COPYRIGHT 2000 Washington Monthly Company
COPYRIGHT 2002 Gale Group




Kind of makes a difference, doesn't it.

Not a fan of Carville here, but fair is fair.
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Pale Blue Dot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-11-06 12:55 PM
Response to Reply #15
18. I really didn't think that anyone would think that he would be endorsing Al Gore
Edited on Sat Nov-11-06 12:56 PM by Finnfan
for the Democratic nomination today. But I changed the thread title anyway.
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Kerrytravelers Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-11-06 12:59 PM
Response to Reply #18
20. ?
:shrug:


Many people still like Gore for '08 (I have no preference at this time.) I have no idea who Carville is pushing. I have no reason to think it is or isn't Gore. And Zell Miller may not have been quite a taken with the taste of the kool-aid as he is today. The circumstances in 2000 is far different than the ones today, so, this article is more historic than currently relevant, unless there has been some breaking story I've missed. If that is the case, then I apologize in advance for my analysis.
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The Backlash Cometh Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-11-06 12:52 PM
Response to Original message
16. After the Clinton election, what did Carville do right?
"It's my comfortable life-style, stupid!"
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burythehatchet Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-11-06 01:05 PM
Response to Original message
23. Good find.
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lcordero2 Donating Member (832 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-11-06 04:41 PM
Response to Original message
24. *ahem*
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Hippo_Tron Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-11-06 04:52 PM
Response to Original message
26. Lets be fair here, Zell hadn't turned to the dark side in 2000
Edited on Sat Nov-11-06 04:52 PM by Hippo_Tron
This is a speech that I think everybody should read if they haven't yet.

Zell Miller’s Keynote Address: Democratic National Convention
NEW YORK, July 13, 1992

Listen to this voice.

It’s a voice flavored by the Blue Ridge; a voice straight out of a remote valley hidden among the peaks and hollows of the Appalachian Mountains - a voice that’s been described as more barbed wire than honeysuckle.

That this kind of voice could travel here from a forgotten corner of Appalachia is a testament to the grace of God and the greatness of the Democratic Party.

This week we are gathered here to nominate a man from a remote, rural corner of Arkansas to be president of the United States of America.

That is powerful proof that the American dream still lives - at least in the Democratic Party.

Bill Clinton is the only candidate for president who feels our pain, shares our hopes and will work his heart out to fulfill our dreams.

You see, I understand why Bill Clinton is so eager to see the American dream kept alive for a new generation.

Because I, too, was a product of that dream.

I was born during the worst of the Depression on a cold winter’s day in the drafty bedroom of a rented house, and I was my parent’s hope for the future.

Franklin Roosevelt was elected that year, and would soon replace generations of neglect with a whirlwind of activity, bringing to our little valley a very welcome supply of God’s most precious commodity - hope.

My father, a teacher, died when I was two weeks old, leaving a young widow with two small children.

But with my mother’s faith in God - and Mr. Roosevelt’s voice on the radio - we kept going.

After my father’s death, my mother with her own hands cleared a small piece of rugged land.

Every day she waded into a neighbor’s cold mountain creek, carrying out thousands of smooth stones to build a house.

I grew up watching my mother complete that house from the rocks she’d lifted from the creek and cement she mixed in a wheelbarrow - cement that today still bears her hand prints.

Her son bears her hand prints, too.

She pressed her pride and her hopes and her dreams deep into my soul.

So, you see, I know what Dan Quayle means when he says it’s best for children to have two parents.

You bet it is!

And it would be nice for them to have trust funds, too.

But we can’t all be born rich and handsome and lucky. That’s why we have a Democratic Party.

My family would still be isolated and destitute if we had not had FDR’s Democratic brand of government. I made it because Franklin Delano Roosevelt energized this nation. I made it because Harry Truman fought for working families like mine. I made it because John Kennedy’s rising tide lifted even our tiny boat.

I made it because Lyndon Johnson showed America that people who were born poor didn’t have to die poor. And I made it because a man with whom I served in the Georgia Senate - a man named Jimmy Carter - brought honesty and decency and integrity to public service.

But what of the kids of today? Who fights for the child of a single mother today? Because without a government that is on their side, those children have no hope. And when a child has no hope, a nation has no future.

I am a Democrat because we are the party of hope. For twelve dark years the Republicans have dealt in cynicism and skepticism. They’ve mastered the art of division and diversion, and they have robbed us of our hope.

Too many mothers today cannot tell their children what my mother told me - that working hard and playing by the rules can make your dreams come true. For millions, the American dream has become what the poet called “a dream deferred.” And if you recall the words of that poet-prophet, he warned us that a dream deferred can explode.

Robbed of hope, the voices of anger rise up, rise up from working Americans, who are tired of paying more in taxes and getting less in services. And George Bush doesn’t get it?

Americans cannot understand why some can buy the best health care in the world, but all the rest of us get is rising costs and cuts in coverage - or no health insurance at all. And George Bush doesn’t get it?

Americans cannot walk our streets in safety, because our ”tough-on-crime” President has waged a phony war on drugs, posing for pictures while cutting police, prosecutors and prisons. And George Bush doesn’t get it?

Americans have seen plants closed down, jobs shipped overseas and our hopes fade away as our economic position collapses right before our very eyes. And George Bush does not get it!

Four years ago, Mr. Bush told us he was a quiet man, who hears the voices of quiet people. Today, we know the truth: George Bush is a timid man who hears only the voices of caution and the status quo.

Let’s face facts: George Bush just doesn’t get it. He doesn’t see it; he doesn’t feel it, and he’s done nothing about it.

That’s why we cannot afford four more years.

If the “education president” gets another term, even our kids won’t be able to spell potato.

If the “law and order president” gets another term, the criminals will run wild, because our commander-in-chief talks like Dirty Harry, but acts like Barney Fife.

If the “environmental president” gets another term, the fish he catches off Kennebunkport will have three eyes.

And folks, after January, George Bush is going to have plenty of time to go fishing.

So much for the millionaire. But we’ve still got ourselves a billionaire. A billionaire!

He says he’s an outsider who will shake up the system in Washington. But as far back as 1974 he was lobbying Congress for tax breaks. He tried to turn $55,000 in contributions into a special $15 million tax loophole that was tailor-made for him. Sounds to me like instead of shaking the system up, Mr. Perot’s been shaking it down.

Ross says he’ll clean out the barn, but he’s been knee deep in it for years.

If Ross Perot’s an outsider, folks, I’m from Brooklyn. Mr. Perot’s giving us salesmanship, not leadership. And we’re not buying it.

And so the choice in this election is clear - we’ve got us a race between an aristocrat, an autocrat and a Democrat.

I know who I’m for. I’m for Bill Clinton because he is a Democrat who does not have to read a book or be briefed about the struggles of single-parent families, or what it means to work hard for everything he’s ever received in life.

There was no silver spoon in sight when he was born, three months after his father died. No one ever gave Bill Clinton a free ride as he worked his way through college and law school. And the people at Yale couldn’t believe it when he turned down a good job in Washington to return to Arkansas and teach.

Bill Clinton is a Democrat who has the courage to tell some of those liberals who think welfare should continue forever, and some of those conservatives who think there should be no welfare at all, that they’re both wrong. He’s a Democrat who will move people off the welfare rolls and onto the job rolls.

Bill Clinton is a Democrat who has the courage to lead a real war on crime here at home. And around the world he will be the kind of commander-in-chief this old Marine sergeant would be proud to follow.

That either one of us was able, one growing up in an Appalachian valley and the other in rural Arkansas, to eventually become governors of our states is a tribute to the American dream and yes, the Democratic Party that makes it a reality.

When I was growing up back in the mountains, whenever I felt like one of life’s losers, my mother used to point to the one and only paved road in our valley - a narrow little strip that disappeared winding its way through a distant gap – and she’d say, “You know what’s so great about this place? You can get anywhere in the world from here.”

Thanks to her and to God, the United States Marine Corps and the Democratic Party, I did go somewhere. But I’ve never really left that mountain valley. Shirley and I, our children and their children still live in the Appalachian town of Young Harris, Georgia, and tonight, one of my sons is sitting in front of the television set in the living room of that same rock house my mother and her neighbors built so many years ago.

Tonight, let our message be heard in every living room in every home in America. Wherever families and friends are gathered, let them know this:

We have a leader and a party and a platform that says to the everyday working people of this country: We will fight your fight; we will ease your burden; we will carry your cause.

We will hear all the voices of America - from the silky harmonies of the Gospel choirs to the rough-edged rhythms of a hot country band; from the razor’s edge rap of the inner city to the soaring beauty of the finest soprano.

We hear your voice, America.

We hear your voice. We will answer your call. We will keep the faith. And we will restore your hope.

Thank you. God bless you. And God bless America.




The fact is that Zell wasn't always an ass. Either that or he pretended not to be for a very long time. That being said, I'm not defending Carville for his comments regarding Howard Dean.

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