DUer's post (The Witch) featured on Michelle Malkin's site

[wicket]

Michael "Sticky Fingers?" Moore

Moore's red meat (or rather, blue meat) got thumbs up from Daily Kos commenters. But not all the lefties on the Internet are singing Moore's praises.

Jim Hoft noticed this long Democratic Underground thread by a liberal blogger justifiably upset with Moore's apparent cribbing of her open letter to dismayed conservatives published five days before Moore's.

Here is more info: You guys are getting me all riled up about this Michael Moore business.

[The Witch]

1. (0.o)

Oi.

[JudyM]

8. A friend forwarded me an email Mr Moore had sent to his listserve

it was the notorious list of pledges.

[pecwae]

10. I like yours better, tho.

It was more heartfelt, sincere, I don't know, down to earth. Could just be because you're a DU'er;)

[Ian David]

11. It's a good thing you gave Mr. Moore permission in advance to use it...

and specifically asked that you remain anonymous.

It's no wonder Malkin is confused.

[The Witch]

29. Yes... now we can get back to Project Z.

The ph34r n1nj4s are ready to strike. The owl hoots at midnight.

[wicket]

43. I thought the sparrows are flying at midnight?

:P

[flowomo]

18. Witch, watch the end of the video linked in Post #14

what do you think?

[The Witch]

26. i think I don't care.

And I can't watch videos at work. Send me a transcript if it's so important.

[flowomo]

28. it shows Michael Moore delivering the manifesto verbally in 2004

[The Witch]

30. yes, i've gotten that impression. what are you trying to convince me of?

[flowomo]

31. Perhaps a thread from you saying you're convinced....

if you are convinced that no plagiarism was involved here. When RW sites pick up on the question, it might matter to have a central figure such as yourself speak out with more than "I don't care."

[The Witch]

35. I don't care what they say, either.

And there's no mileage they can get out of this that they wouldn't take other ways if this wasn't here. Unlike *, I don't make my decisions based on what the terrorists want.

[Maddy McCall]

2. Good God.

People are making more of this than is actually there.

I've read both. Just not plagiarism.

[The Witch]

7. I don't give a care at this point whether it's plagiarism or not.

I have too much work to do. The best I can hope for out of this is for it to die down quickly, as I think my chances of turning it into a career as a pundit are slim to none (that's sarcasm, for the MalkinLurkers out there).

[SmokingJacket]

21. At the very least, you should be incredibly flattered!

You do good work: good enough to steal, or be inspired by, or to simultaneously appear in the mind of one of our contemporary icons!

As someone who has read a bunch of student writing and has spookily good radar for plagiarism, I think Moore's thing is too similar to yours to be mere coincidence -- I think he read your thing or someone told him about it and he ran with it. It's not *exactly* plagiarism since the word choices are different, but it's an ethical mistake not to give credit in this kind of situation. Since he's not selling it in a book and your goals are presumably his, it's not a huge deal -- but it would have been nice to give you credit, since you're not a big famous guy like he is and it might help your writing career (and if you don't have one, maybe this is a sign you should?) :hi:

KEEP WRITING, WITCH!!!

[omega minimo]

20. What DO you call it? Heavy Lifting?

[Bandit]

3. Isn't it possible that "Great minds think alike"

Instead of plagerism? :shrug: either way at least the message is getting out there...

[omega minimo]

22. Not to that extent--

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

4. This is just a case of great minds thining alike.

It ain't plagiarism.

[The Witch]

9. See #7

[Exiled in America]

12. It's almost exactly identical. Have you seen the line by line comparison?

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

13. Yes, I've seen the line by line comparison.

They're not identical in the least. The thoughts are similar, but it's only the same thoughts that everybody is thinking.

See posts #3 and #4 in this thread for example.

[omega minimo]

23. Bullshit. MM's piece used TW's as an outline

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

24. Baloney.

The Witch's line by line comparison takes Moore's quotes out of sequence in order to make that comparison. She says as much in her post.

[The Witch]

25. Guys. I don't care. Why should you?

Really. in terms of choosing our battles, this is not something we should be sniping at each other about. Really.

[flowomo]

27. Witch, have you seen the video yet?

It's important.

[The Witch]

36. I had a little look at it.

I'm glad the sentiments are shared. I'm not convinced it was plagiarism; I'm not convinced it wasn't. In the end, it doesn't. Freaking. Matter.

[Exiled in America]

37. I don't care that much, but I just think its hard to deny what happened.

No big deal, until people refuse to acknolwedge it.

[flowomo]

38. see post #16....

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

40. Because false accusations of plagiarism are bullshit.

Not that I'm accusing you, but people like Malkin.

And if you don't care, then it's clearly a false accusation.

[omega minimo]

34. Nonsense. The framework is there. Any writer can see it.

[Norquist Nemesis]

5. Great. Now she's trying to link us up with terrorists

by sending Chademulators over to DU!

More sewer scum.

[durrrty libby]

6. Good grief...If that's all she can find to squawk about, then

times must be desperate

:hangover: :dunce: :boring: :spank:

[leopardtweezer]

14. 2004, BITCHES

http://www.michaelmoore.com/_media/ontheroad/UTAH_WeAreTheMajority.mov

[wicket]

15. 2006, bitches!!! DEMOCRATIC LANDSLIDE!

:shrug:

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

17. delete

misinterpretation.

[The Witch]

32. Fine with me. I am glad the ideas are out there.

Now go worry about getting that health care moving.

[Swamp Rat]

39. Welcome to DU!

:hi:

[flowomo]

16. Read Post #14 and WATCH the END of the video....

It's from 2004 and should settle this once and for all.

[newworld]

19. Well that settles it...

[Jack Rabbit]

33. We should expect this of Michelle Malkin

She uses the similarities in the two pieces in an attempt to "prove" that Michale Moore is guilty of plagiarism. She expresses no view on the sentiment expressed by either Mr. Moore or The Witch.

For my part, let me add this pledge, just for Ms. Malkin: I pledge not to seek the personal information of those with whom I disagree; and, if I should come across such information, I pledge to do nothing with it, certainly not post it.

I wonder if Ms. Malkin feels the same way.

[praeclarus]

41. The Witch... how can you "not care"?

I read your original post when you first put it up
and liked it very much.

I also read the thread that you started with the
line by line comparo with the MM piece.

When I read that I came to the conclusion that it was
blatant plagiarism. Clear as day. I was on your side
of the matter. Also, it seems clear you posted that
precisely to call out the plagiarism.

With that thread, the thing took on a life of it's own
and spread beyond the borders of DU, giving ammunition
to the MM bashers.

Now that it has come to light that MM was publicly
stating this "manifesto" two years ago, you suddenly
don't care? WTF?

You cared enough to post up a detailed comparison.

How about caring enough to post up a detailed apology?
I think you owe one.

In fact, if I was the cynical sort, I might start
wondering how your OP that was eerily similar to MM
came to be.

[Name removed]

42. Deleted sub-thread

Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[The Witch]

44. I've been plagiarized on the Net before.

Last time, it was a 60-page story that took me a year to write.

This time, it was something that took me five minutes.

FWIW, my suspicion is that one of his staffers did see my post, because of all the posts I've made since I got into blogging, that one got the most play. So it's the one that's most likely to have been seen. (It was linked to via Salon and all that).

But what's that going to get me?

As for saying "I'm sorry I ever brought it up," that's something I won't do because I'm not. I saw something that seemed to be problematic and I talked about it. That's what I do when I see problems; I talk to people abou them. In this case, some people believe me and some don't. In the end, it doesn't matter. There's no money involved here. There's no supposed fame I could have achieved. But that doesn't mean I'm sorry for saying something.

The question is, why is it so important to YOU that I come out one way or another? You're not the staffer who did this, by any chance? ;)

[greyl]

45. This isn't one of those times. nt

[TroglodyteScholar]

46. If anything, MM's words from 2004 were lingering in your subconscious...

Saying you don't care doesn't make you right.

Edit: typo