Healthcare and the Free Market

[wilt the stilt]

I had a typical discussion with a "conservative" friend of mine about healthcare and like the typical nitwits who think the free market will work they just don't get it. We are in the free market right now. I own my own(1 person company) so I have to pay an individual rate. Here is what I get for $800.00 per month 6 visits to the doctor with a $40.00 copay. $250 towards a physical for my wife and me and nothing for my kids. Out of pocket would be $5500 for me $ 5500 for my wife and $5500 for my kids. If I go out of network there is no cap on out of pocket. $300 deductible for each member for pharmacy. For dental I have a cap of $1,000 reimbursement and they pay about 40% for fillings. Checkouts are not covered and goes against my deductible. My friend tells me to go shop for lower insurance however if you switch insurance they will not cover preexisting conditions. My daughter has a preexisting condition.

These wingnuts just don't get it. This guy has prostate cancer and he is 58 years old. If he lost his job and couldn't find another(pretty easy with his age) he would find himself with no coverage for his cancer. He still swears by the free market. He is an imbecile(Can't happen to me).

[eleny]

1. health care doesn't belong in the "free market"

that should be left to playstation 3's, yachts and other optionals in all price levels.

[Dora]

2. Insurance and pension plans are a BIG SPECTRE on the horizon.

Corporate America has discovered they simply can't provide health insurance as part of their pension plans because nobody's paying for it. In other words, if retiree benefits include health insurance, it's a big fat cost to the employer that hasn't been offset by employee contributions. This same problem is happening to public employees.

What's going to happen, is that we're going to have more and more retirees without any health insurance whatsoever.

Imagine that.

[Jackpine Radical]

3. Oh, yeah, the free market.

You're in an accident & rendered unconscious. The police summon an ambulance. You rise out of your coma long enough to ask them how much they're gonna charge. You ask the cops for a phone book & call some more ambulance companes for quotes. You find a better deal & send these guys away. Now all you have to do is stay conscious long enough to call several hospitals for price comparisons so you can tell the ambulance guys where to take you. Then you can slip gratefully back into unconsciousness for a while, ntil it comes time to start hunting around for the best deal on the emergency brain surgery you're going to need. Don't forget to comparison shop for all those little sundries like medications, bloodwork and sutures--they can really drive up the price of your hospitalization if you don't stay on top of them.

[wilt the stilt]

5. good one n/t

[antigop]

9. When Cheney shot that guy in the face....

did they shop around for who was running a "blue-light special" on buckshot removal that day?

[Union Thug]

4. First, there is no 'free market'.

But more to the point, human beings are more important than profits. Health care should NOT be for profit. Ever.

Healthcare should be recognized as a fundamental human right and that's where it begins and ends. When it comes to healthcare, fuck the markets.

[wilt the stilt]

7. It is a free market

Single insured people have no power because they are a single entity. Large corporations can bargain so if you work for them you get better and more affordable insurance. Many of the companies(guardian) do not write individual policies so the single insured has a very small pool to choose from. This system is pathetic.

[Union Thug]

11. Yeah, it's free for the corporations, because our government,

the entity that is rightfully ours - the creation of we the peope - has been hijacked by the rich. But the point is, the market is created by government, in the laws that we pass, in the public works that are essential to their functioning, etc. Sadly, Americans would rather live in squalor than make the effort it would take to recapture what is rightfully ours - 'the system'.

I understand what you mean about trying to purchase insurance as an individual. The only reason I didn't leave my job to explore other, more interesting opportunities, last month is because, even with a significant raise doing contract work, I could not purchase the insurance coverage I have through the corp. In this sense, I am trapped. I had 12000$ to spend on insurance, and I could not purchase half the coverage that I get through my job. I absolutely HATE every minute I'm at my job, but I have a family and health insurance is more important that my salary in a lot of ways. So I stay.

If we had universal coverage, lives would stabilize, people would not fear leaving their jobs to explore other opportunities, people would be freed up to explore their entrepreneurial callings. We would be much better prepared to pursue our interests and passions. But America is no longer about the 'american dream', its about greed and hegemony and protecting the interests of the rich.

[prolesunited]

12. You make a great point

"universal coverage, lives would stabilize, people would not fear leaving their jobs to explore other opportunities, people would be freed up to explore their entrepreneurial callings"

That's exactly what our corporate masters DON'T want. They need a captive wage (slave) class that lives in fear of losing their job and will do whatever it takes to keep it, will accept low wages while they gobble up million-dollar bonuses, and will have no opportunity to become the competition.

The free market is anything BUT. It's a stacked deck against the working and middle class.

[OzarkDem]

6. Every voter is facing this

and they sent a message loud and clear last week that they want a change.

Everyone in DC had better listen. There are many, many affordable alternatives to our current broken down system.

[brook]

8. So many people

don't look beyond the end of their noses. Health care, education costs, infrastructure...all the things that make up "the American Life"...require understanding and attention. IOW, we need to be aware and active 52 weeks a year, not just a few November Tuesdays.

I've just embarked on a mission to have our town look into municipal broadband service. So far, they're looking at me as if I had two green heads.
I want them to see how they can strengthen their emergency responses, city services integration, business opportunities, etc.- instead of letting the Telcomms dictate what we can/can't have and soaking us for the privilege.

[Greyhound]

10. They've been sold this corporate line of shit for so long, I think they are

too embarrassed to admit how gullible they've been. I can't think of any other reason to keep defending this immoral travesty, every single fact available shows how horrible our system is, yet even here I've seen people defend it as it is, or proposals to create some kind of tiered system where those that can pay get substandard care and those that can't get aspirin clinics.

[Cleita]

13. First there is no free market. All our laws and most of our

corrupt officials pander to the Corporations giving them the tax breaks and subsidies that they need to post profits. They would not survive in a free market. If the government allowed companies and individuals to buy into Medicare, the for-profits would be pushed out of business because the adminstrative costs are so much lower. I'd say it's time.