"Orgasm for Peace?" Guys, you're not helping

[Ian_rd]

Calif. Couple Calls for Orgasm for Peace

SAN FRANCISCO (AP) -- Two peace activists have planned a massive anti-war demonstration for the first day of winter.

But they don't want you marching in the streets. They'd much rather you just stay home.

The Global Orgasm for Peace was conceived by Donna Sheehan, 76, and Paul Reffell, 55, whose immodest goal is for everyone in the world to have an orgasm Dec. 22 while focusing on world peace.

"The orgasm gives out an incredible feeling of peace during it and after it," Reffell said Sunday. "Your mind is like a blank. It's like a meditative state. And mass meditations have been shown to make a change."

The couple are no strangers to sex and social activism. Sheehan, no relation to anti-war activist Cindy Sheehan, brought together nearly 50 women in 2002 who stripped naked and spelled out the word "Peace."

The stunt spawned a mini-movement called Baring Witness that led to similar unclothed demonstrations worldwide.

Full Story

Are these people trying to cheapen the campaign to end the war? Hmmm. How can we assist the right-wing media and best portray the peace movement as nothing more than a bunch of brainless hippies acting on their godless feel-good desires? How about Smoke Pot with Your Kids for Peace? Or Public Anal Sex Day for Peace? This is the Left's version of KKK rallies for Republicans - it serves to hurt us more than help. We have the issues, morals, and logic on our side. We don't need naked people in public hoping to dedicate an orgasm to our cause and confirm the right-wing's bogeyman of the Democratic Party's "San Francisco Values" weakening our nation.

[helderheid]

1. oh c'mon.... make love, not war!

:evilgrin:

[kpete]

7. I am with you helderheid - Make Love/Not War!!!

Sounds like a beautiful artistic collaboration to me...

[stellanoir]

14. I'm with helderheid & kpete

and since I'm so obsessed with energetics this seems plausible to me.

Before I get "oooga, boooga, woooga, smoooga"ed again though, and people start saying that this couple is saying all we have to do is make love and not do anything else, I'll say that this certainly can't hurt and would be SUPPLEMENTAL to more conventional efforts.

[helderheid]

21. besides, what FUN!!

:evilgrin:

[hootinholler]

73. Count me in...

Always wanted to try a group thing.
:evilgrin:

-Hoot

[mongo]

113. If it hurts -- you're doing it wrong...

:toast:

[rosesaylavee]

203. stellanoir

been meaning to thank you for the election results on 11/7! I think Rove hadn't considered the ooga booga. Seriously, you post helped me calm down - I was so sick from worry I had stopped eating and sleeping properly for several days prior to that Tuesday.

:hi:

[Irreverend IX]

98. Some people need to quit playing Chicken Little.

The public is already against the Iraq war, and this thing will barely be a blip on the media's radar screen. If you want to improve the public's opinion of the liberal cause, focus on ways to promote progressive thinking and don't get into a panic over random, obscure news items.

[helderheid]

106. Hey, I just like orgasms.

:shrug:

:evilgrin:

[Oeditpus Rex]

125. Surely, you don't refer to the Mer'kin media

They'll be all over this.

It won't have legs, but it'll be big headlines for a day.




Okay, I'll stop calling you Shirley.

[ThomCat]

135. Absolutely!

No harm comes from this and some good may. Good for them!

[Hippo_Tron]

236. I saw a sign at a Bush protest that said "Fuck, don't fight"

The crowd loved it.

[annabanana]

2. (huh - I think it's kind of cute)

But then I'm one of those live & let live folks.

[Lex]

3. Eh, it takes all kinds. I didn't even know about it

until you posted it.

[The Count]

4. Kinda like "draft for peace" of "F*cking for Virginity"

On DU, it will be embraced.

[Ian_rd]

5. And guess what just popped up on Drudge Report .... *sigh*

[Warren DeMontague]

94. Oh NOoooooooooooooo!!!!!!!!! Not Drudge!!!!!!!!!

Maybe the American Public isn't as dumb and knee-jerk right wing as you (and the republican party) assume they are, Jack. Witness Terri Schiavo. Witness the recent election.

[Saboburns]

109. Cause us typers on the internet are SAVING THE WORLD

And you guys are just not up to snuff.

Now, kiss my ring, hippie.

[kikiek]

6. Shows where the press priorities are too.

[Bassic]

8. Yeah that sounds lilke a pretty bizarre idea to me.

So, what the hell are orgasms supposed to do against war?

[Porcupine]

202. Deny WalMart and it's ilk a few bucks for starters.

If people were a little less hung up about sex then they might spend Saturday afternoons in bed with a good friend rather than shopping for crap to push into their storage unit.

Sex is friendly.
Sex is a renewable resource after you have sex, you can have sex again.
Sex is good exercise.
Sex supports local economies. If you're paying for your sex it's easier to get it close to home.
Sex is carbon neutral. (what your vibrator uses is saved by you non-trip to WalMart)
Good sex in non-violent.
Sex promotes good sleep. No need for Ambien.
Sex reduces symptoms of depression.

Finally- if teenage boys KNEW they were going to get more sex outside of the Army than in it there would be a lack of cannon fodder. It's what kept ME out of the military. I was washing dishes but I had a live-in girlfreind at 18. Joining the military was a distinct step in the wrong direction.

The war is inexplicably tied up with the demands of our consumer culture. Sex is revolutionary in that it satisfies people without requiring a motor vehicle or purchase of crap to put in it. Thereby reducing the need for war.

[Bassic]

208. I agree with that, yet I fail to see what good it can do as an anti-war protest

save give ammunition to wingnuts and dumbass pundits to play off the "immorality" of pacifists.

[NewJeffCT]

9. To each their own

While I'm sure if this is picked up by Fox, CNN, Rush, etc, they will mock it as a bunch of out-of-touch hippies.

But, if they think this will get positive attention to the peace movement, I'm not going to judge them.

We need more hippies like this to make a withdrawal plan seem more mainstream, too. If they want to cum of peace and the media portrays them as a bunch of looney hippies, then the Murtha redeployment plan that was mocked as "cut & run" now seems more mainstream.

[greyl]

10. More bullshit from the Princeton's Global Consciousness Project (EGGS)

http://www.globalorgasm.org/ (graphics at the link may be innapropriate at your job)

The Science

The Global Consciousness Project (http://noosphere.princeton.edu), Princeton University, runs a network of Random Event Generators (REGs) around the world, which record changes in randomness during global events. The results show that human consciousness can be measured to have a global effect on matter and energy during widely-watched events such as 9/11 and the Indian Ocean tsunami. There have also been measurable results during mass meditations and prayers.

The Zero Point Field or Quantum Field surrounds and is part of everything in the universe. It can be affected by human consciousness, as can be seen when simple observation of a subatomic particle changes the particle’s state.

We hope that a huge influx of physical, mental and spiritual energy with conscious peaceful intent will not only show up on Princeton’s REGs, but will have profound positive effects that will change the violent state of the human world.

Great intentions, but zero science behind it.

edit: evidence for my pov here.

[shadowknows69]

13. There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio, Than are dreamt of in your philosophy

n/t

[greyl]

16. Do you understand the original context of that quote and

that repeating it amounts to providing zero evidence?

[shadowknows69]

17. I realize it provides zero evidence

and IIRC it's what Hamlet said to Horatio when he had doubts that Hamlet had been chatting it up with his dearly departed daddy so I think I used it in the correct context. Just dropping my unsolicited two cents. Peace and unquantifiable magick be with you.

[greyl]

19. The dreamy philosophy in this case is... ? nt

[shadowknows69]

24. I don't have time to engage in an unwinnable debate right now

I was only trying to make the point that just because our current level of science hasn't learned how to quantify a certain aspect of the universe does not automatically mean it does not exist. I concede to your arguement. I plead posting before coffee. Won't happen again.

[greyl]

30. I'm having coffee with you.

Maybe if we stir in the proper amount of SwissMiss at the same time, we can save the whales.
Couldn't hurt.

Take care of your goodness. :)

[shadowknows69]

38. My point exactly

Couldn't hurt.

[greyl]

42. See, but that's a crap point really.

I think you misunderstood part of my post.
No big woop, this too shall pass.

Be wary of how this garbage is used to marginalize the left.

[sui generis]

56. and I have a problem with goatherders walking on water too

great intentions, zero science behind the bible too.

You can either take it literally or as a philosophy; but the literalists even think of the philosophers as impure and lacking in salvation.

Fundamentalism about transubstantial versus consubstantial orgasms on DU - that's just a riot. Oh my. :rofl:

[greyl]

58. Actually, it's possible he was walking on ice.

Do the research in your own way and see what you come up with.

[sui generis]

59. at the risk of sounding like a snob

which I am, this has nothing to do with red herrings, non sequitors, straw men, or bad research.

The bible as a subject of research is just mythology, worthy of no more than a perfunctory bullfinch review.

Not only do I not believe that jesus existed at all ever, I also don't believe that parlor tricks like walking on water ever happened except as a storyteller's exercise to demonstrate the divinity of their subject.

You can "research" all you want, first let's find out if your research subject ever existed in anything other than parable form.

[greyl]

65. You're saying, with certainty, it's impossible?

I'm saying it's possible.
You've made some unwarranted assumptions, so now you've added "hasty conclusion" to your collection of fallacies here.
Please, read for comprehension.

[sui generis]

77. jousting at windmills

you just like the sound of your own typing now?

[greyl]

81. I can no longer take your posts in this thread seriously. nt

[sui generis]

86. I'm sorry

What got your hardon going for me anyway? Was it something I said?

You didn't address a single thing I said, just started posturing.

As soon as you address any point I've made your weighty opinion might begin to matter to more people than yourself.

As to your ability to fight using ad hominems - even that is amateur.

-peace & better posting later.

[Ian David]

152. If Jesus never existed, then why does he keep showing up on tortilla shells?

Hmm, Mister Smarty Pants?

[sui generis]

233. heh; guess this thread has been dead long enough

Long Live the Vulva of Guadalupe!



No more bitchy pills for you miss cranky pants.

[mongo]

115. So should dems scorn prayer vigils for peace too?

Because there's zero science behind that too.

Might make us look bad to atheists.

[greyl]

116. Scorn? No.

Prayer vigils generally don't have high dollar pseudoscientific web sites behind them whose central claim is demonstrably false.

[mongo]

117. So, praying according to the sky god's religious industry's rules

is OK based on there literal interpretation of a fictional work written thousands of years ago is OK, and not "demonstrably false", but jacking or jilling for peace (a new age version of a prayerful act) is bad....

Riiiggghht....

Prayer vigils generally don't have high dollar pseudoscientific web sites behind them whose central claim is demonstrably false.

Nope -- prayer vigils just have members of a far more popular cult behind them - and that somehow makes it OK.

[Kelly Rupert]

122. The difference is in perception.

Prayer vigils are stupid and do absolutely nothing for anything (except the desires of the participants to "do something") but since most Americans like them, we have to go along in order to win votes--it identifies us with voters' values, and so we do it. The reward of fighting it is nil; the reward of going along is an increased probability of gaining the power to pass a positive domestic agenda.

Most Americans rightly recognize that this is garbage, though, and so it's perfectly fine--and in fact, good for the party--to scorn this.

[mongo]

127. Where have I heard this argument before?

Oh yeah... WHY THEM DEMS SHOULD NOT SUPPORT GAY MARRIAGE

:puke:

[Kelly Rupert]

132. There's a world of difference.

Not supporting gay marriage does palpable harm, and supporting gay marriage would end this harm. Supporting a prayer vigil does nobody any harm or any good, and makes it more likely that Democrats will be elected--Democrats, mind you, who will have much more progressive attitudes than their Republican opponents. Supporting this nonsense does nobody any harm or any good, but conversely makes it less likely that Democrats will be elected.

[mongo]

223. Supporting this "nonsense" fosters a progressive sex-positive view

Something that is surely lacking in your life...

[greyl]

229. Then the movement's focus should be fostering a progressive

sex-positive view, not ending war. If it wants to be seen as truly progressive, it should also avoid association with pseudoscientific bullshit.

[mongo]

231. Or only association with accepted pseudoscientific bullshit?

Like prayer vigils?

Mainstream religious superstition good, new age superstition bad. Got it.

[greyl]

232. No, you don't get it.

Firstly, I'm an agnostic atheist with little respect for the organizing forces behind the salvationist religions.
Second, if you clearly define how you're using the word "scorn" I may say, yes, prayer vigils should be scorned. As yet, I wouldn't use that word.

[Kelly Rupert]

238. I'm not talking about my world-view.

Unlike many people here, it seems, I am fully capable of setting aside my own views to look at a situation through the eyes of other people, and understand that the purpose of protest is to change people's minds.

Jesus Christ. I'm a bisexual in an open relationship. There's very little I haven't tried. This isn't about me, and I'm rather surprised that people can't tell the difference between "I think that's awful" and "You realize that most people aren't going to like that."

[greyl]

143. Read for comprehension, please.

My position in no way resembles your straw representation of it.

[Cessna Invesco Palin]

139. Greyl, you know I normally agree with you...

...but in this case I'm going to side with the people supporting multiple, massively parallel, simultaneous orgasms. Just this once.

[greyl]

146. Hehe. :)

I doubt you can find a statement of mine in opposition to that.

[Ian David]

147. What if they over do it?

I'm afraid that Gaia will ejaculate all of us out into space in a giant panspermic fertilization of the Cosmos.

It would be a sort of Scientific Pantheism version of The Rapture, except we all explosively decompress outside the atmosphere, so our corpses can spread their DNA among the stars.

Damn you, Giant Orgasm People! How dare you gamble with our lives!

[nomo]

11. Well, I was planning on having an orgasm that day anyway.

[helderheid]

22. ROFL!

:rofl:

Welcome to DU!

:hi:

[Minnesota_Lib]

199. Excuse me while I wipe the coffee off of my monitor. Too funny

:rofl: :rofl:

[acmejack]

12. We were kinda planning to participate.

edit: sounds like a bunch of you people aren't getting enough! We know the republiclowns will be down on the idea they never get laid, unless they pay for it. But Duers down on sex? Lighten up!

[itsmesgd]

15. a 76 year old woman and a 55 year old man.....

The thought of that is preventing me from achieveing "world peace" right now if you catch my drift. Why not Angelina Jolie and......anyone else.

[Le Taz Hot]

32. Ohh!!!!!!!!!!!

to the pits of Republican hell with you, youngblood! What? You think just because you pass some magic age you can't make love and feel oh-so-sexual????? And what, prey tell, IS the magic age? 30? 40? Do YOU look like Brad Pitt/Angelina Jolie?

What the hell kind of ageism is THAT????? :argh:

[plcdude]

48. Hey long time

no read. Yeah compete ageism. I have found that the older I get the better I get at achieving meaningful orgasms.

[itsmesgd]

50. not an ageist, just don't like the imagery/marketing

No, I don't look like Pitt or Jolie, but that's the attraction. I know that there is age limit on sexuality.
Who would draw more attention to the cause of a Orgasms For World Peace Day in the public spotlight? The Pitts and Jolies or Betty White and John Madden. If you are trying to use "sex" as the selling tool, make it "attractive" to the masses. I think that it's great that people have sex well into their 80's and 90's. I just don't want to see it on youtube.

[hootinholler]

80. Betty White and John Madden...

This isn't about making amature porn, although I find the idea of watching those two compelling.

-Hoot

[sui generis]

18. they've already succeeded. See, you're talking about it.

And what the heck is wrong with orgasms? Why does that "cheapen" anything, unless you think there's something unwholesome about sex?

And about knocking those hippies. "public anal sex day" for peace? What rock did you crawl out from under?

Don't answer that - I don't want to have to be really mean to you this early on a Monday.

[greyl]

23. Talking about protesting in the streets on Dec 22nd would be better.

(I'm just speculating.)

[sui generis]

26. yeah but the OP seems to have a problem with sex.

all of it.

Plus, if everyone did the same thing then they'd all be the same person. What's wrong with someone promoting all kinds of ideas instead of just one?

[greyl]

29. That's a different issue altogether.

Plus, if everyone did the same thing then they'd all be the same person. What's wrong with someone promoting all kinds of ideas instead of just one?

You are implying that I'm in favor of some kind of homogenization - I'm not.
I'm against bullshit being marketed as fact when there's zero evidence to support it.
When a web site has a link called "The Science", I expect to find science there.

[sui generis]

I didn't address you personally

at least that was not my intent. If I elect to put words in your mouth, you will be the very first to know, because I'll tell you I'm doing it.

At any rate MY idea is that there are no hawks. They're all fucking buzzards. You want peace, eject the buzzards from government, both the republicans and especially the democrats.

Finally, if a website says red is blue, I'll have to trust my own judgement, without rancor. Getting angry at an authority for misrepresenting what you disagree with is kind of silly, doncha think?

[greyl]

47. That's why I used "imply".

I don't see how the remainder of your post relates to the issue at hand.

[sui generis]

49. I honestly don't have a clue what you're talking about

It's all lost in the posturing.

Sex is not a bad thing. Who gives a shit whether the OP likes it or not. Clear?

[greyl]

55. I believe you.

Your red herrings, sraw arguments, and non sequiturs aren't fun.

[Name removed]

57. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Ian_rd]

60. By avoiding the issue and continuing to imply on this forum ...

that I have an aversion to sex is dishonest and cheapens your argument to the depths of the most despicable political manipulators of our day. Your use of personal attacks will not make up for your lack of reading comprehension or debate skills.

[Name removed]

63. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Ian_rd]

69. Your childish attitude requires no "search" button.

You've displayed everything we need to know. And your desperate use of laughing smiley faces doesn't change what is certainly red-faced shame at what you've shown of yourself. You prove me right with every post. Go ahead, post another. I won't respond. I'll leave you to your lonely playground.

[sui generis]

79. your use of the phrase "we"

tells everyone else besides the royal you everything they need to know.

Yes, research is fundamental.

[Ian_rd]

45. You are missing the whole point of my post

No. I do not "have a problem with sex" or hippies as you so ridiculously say. In our constant national debate I am always considering how our opponents can be convinced of our argument and what they think of our efforts. We have to be concerned about this if we want to turn public opinion to our side. This silly orgasm business is nothing more than a gift to the people who try to portray all of us as I described in the main post. It makes it easier for them to say "See, I told you they were all a bunch of <insert right-wing crap here>!"

I do not dislike or disagree with these people, but I think this campaign of theirs is completely ridiculous and will do anything but help. In other words, I believe it will do no good for anyone or anything except right-wing propagandists who are sure to cover this topic more than anyone else as a means to prevent their audience from considering differing opinions.

[sui generis]

51. you're posturing about their very existence.

So have your judgement and eat it too, but who cares what anyone is going to think about it?

Seriously. If we worry about what everyone else is doing and how we THINK the other side is going to respond to it, then we're already being manipulated.

Personally I'm all for this kind of diversity. I think it's silly, but silly in a fun sort of way. Other than that, I don't have any opinion at all about it. I'm glad they exist and glad they're involved.

[Mz Pip]

85. I think it's silly

Sex is cool and fun but this just seems silly.

How about "Bake a cake for peace" or "Rake your yard for peace." One thing doesn't really have much to do with the other.

People can do what they want for peace but I don't have to agree that whatever they come up with is necessarily a good idea or the least bit effective.

Somehow this trivializes the anti-war movement. I am sure there are many young men and women who are putting their life at risk for this awful war wishing they had the chance to have sex with a loved one.

I take my opposition to the war quite seriously. Walking around grinning about sex just seems like a bad joke.

Mz Pip
:dem:

[RoyGBiv]

211. So ...

The first thing you thought to do while not helping was to post about it on a forum that gets more hits per day than the event's website would ever have seen if not for an AP story about it.

Makes sense, I guess.

Hell, I ran across this website a long time ago, shrugged my shoulders, and moved on to other things.

If you think they're silly, fine, think they're silly. But if you spend your time worrying over what the right-wing thinks of you or your actions and modifying your behavior accordingly to fit with their perception of what is proper, then you may as well build a cabin in the woods and drop out of society so as not to offend them or even risk offending them ... or rather not since the right-wing could use that to point out how you're anti-social and not a positive contributing member of society. Democratic politicians, especially Presidential candidates, have been playing that game of modifying behavior to fit with perceptions of conservative appropriateness for awhile now, and it's not worked out real well for them.

Guess we're all screwed.

Here's the thing. The right-wing attack machine points to *this website* as an example of the lunatic left, and people here, no matter where they fall along the political spectrum, are lunatics by association simply with the site itself. Do you think the DU admins should put in place a code of conduct that prevents people from saying things the right-wing might be able to use to say, "See, I told you they were a bunch of <insert right-wing crap here>!"?

Screw 'em. I don't let them define me or what I am or how I behave.

Yeah, I think this is a bit silly, but the point is the people who are into this don't, and they have every right to believe and act as they want to believe and act as you do. To suggest that a bunch of people want to have a communal, mass orgasm is a part of the problem when the real problem is that we, as a nation, are killing hundreds of people every day ... that's not silly. It's wrong.

[CornField]

20. I'm all for orgasms... I'm all for peace...

I'm not sure if I agree this 'cheapens' the movement... since the 'movement' began and has continued thanks to these types of individuals (Make love not war).

The reason so many peace groups have such a difficult go of it is because so many are unwilling to view the thoughts of others as appropriate responses to what we face. That is, within any given peace group you'll find several different types of people. Within mine there are nuns, religious activists, professionals, humanitarians, pacifists and, yes, even a few hippies. While the belief in peace is central to them all, each has his/her own approach. Some may wish to protest on a street corner once a week. Others may like to host events to feed the hungry within our own community. Others may subscribe to civil disobedience while others find such action offensive.

The primary point we need to remember is that we need to reach a wide cut of the population in order to enact change. Just the very fact that we have such diversity within our peace groups should give us reason to celebrate, not bicker because it means we are one step closer to the general populace.

In short, the peace movement doesn't belong to you, to me or anyone in particular. It takes all kinds -- and it should.

[mongo]

76. Thanks for that post Cornfield

You said it more coherently and politely than I possibly could today.

So much anti-sex stuff on DU today :sigh:

[Ariana Celeste]

192. I love it!

Great reply! You are so right... diversity is a beautiful thing and can only help! :)

[BoneDaddy]

25. Sounds like

somebody needs to get laid.

So what if this is the way some people want to express themselves. You buy into the puritanical nonsense of the "right" by having such a negative issue with sex. If people are choosing to create a scenario where pleasure replaces pain, who cares.

San Francisco values...come on.

[Atman]

27. So, this is a call for everyone to DO THEIR PART.

Or someone else's. Whatever works.

.

[ScreamingMeemie]

28. Hmmm... I don't know how that "cheapens" the campaign to end war.

Unless one is uptight and, dare I say, a prude.

[HarukaTheTrophyWife]

138. Oh please...

you just want to go smoke weed with your kid and then engage in public anal sex for peace.

:rofl:

[ScreamingMeemie]

180. ...

:spray:


*gasp* I've been found out. :rofl: :hug:

[Atman]

31. What happens if there is an early pull out?

"Splooging for Peace?"

"Wet Spots Against The War?"

This one tour in which I'd hope to get stop-lossed.

.

[InvisibleTouch]

33. I have to say...

...I like it!

And in my experience it's absolutely true that focused attention and intention can have a measurable effect on the world. (I believe it was Albert Einstein who said "The universe is not only stranger than we know, it's stranger than we can know.") Even if that were not the case, as some would contend, the very least that can happen is that a large number of people deliberately take some time out of their day to experience pleasure - and the anti-war effort remains a topic of conversation. I just don't see any downside.

The self-righteous posturing of Rethug hypocrites is just an amusing bonus. Gives us yet another opportunity to point out that they'd rather prey on underage kids than live and let live as consenting adults.

[greyl]

39. That wasn't Einstein, it was Forrest Sawyer.

http://www.interx.net/~dhubcal/whirlpower/pearl/vera.html

I'm half joking, but even if Albert did say that(which he very well may have), your use of it here is an Appeal to Ignorance.

[InvisibleTouch]

43. I think what's ignorant is...

...to believe we have all the answers, or that we ever will, no matter how rigorous our investigative methods are. Note that doesn't mean we shrug our shoulders and say "Let's not even bother trying" - but it's arrogant to think we can learn everything about everything, if only we had enough time.

On edit: Thanks for the link. Neat page!

[greyl]

46. Anyone who believes that IS ignorant.

I'm not aware that a person like that exists. Are you?

[InvisibleTouch]

52. Actually I've known several...

...who were convinced that humans would eventually work out all the unknowns of the universe and solve all their problems, if only they don't destroy themselves first. My contention is that, by definition, this is impossible - because every species has limits to its senses, and our technology is only an extension of our senses.

That gets away from the original topic of this thread, but, anyway.

[RaleighNCDUer]

34. Naked people in public?

It doesn't suggest any such thing - in fact, says 'stay home and get busy for peace'.

This is on the same line as mass prayer, or mass meditation. Metaphysical bullshit.

Doesn't mean it wouldn't be fun, anyway.

[Lone_Star_Dem]

35. Glad to do my part to bring peace

I'm marking it in ink on my date planner right now. :D

[Beelzebud]

36. Peace BAD - Draft GOOD

[rman]

91. says who?

[bloom]

37. It sounds reminiscent of the John and Yoko thing.

If the people were advocating sex in the streets - I could see your problem - but that's not what it is.


I suppose it might make a difference in how you viewed the whole Vietnam peace movement. Like if you thought that that was a bad thing. For instance - I don't think of the Hippies as brainless. Certainly there were some people at the time didn't get it - maybe it's not portrayed well in the media and the history books or whatever. That's not a surprise.


The social consciousness efforts of liberal people (and others) should not have to be dictated by the "morals" and perceptions of people like Santorum and other right-wing-nuts. Who wants to be like them, anyway?

[greyl]

41. Yet different, and not in a good way. nt

[mongo]

84. Does this mean you'll be participating?

It's nice to be on the same side of the fence for a change.

[shain from kane]

40. Iraq used to be the Garden of Eden. Give Adam and Eve another

chance. As Adam said to Eve, "Stand back. I'm not sure how big this thing is going to get."

[xchrom]

44. sounds like a fine idea to me.

and actually -- given the rampant fundamentalism running amok in the the world and ''fucking'' things up left and right -- this becomes an interesting statement for peace.

[TallahasseeGrannie]

53. So like what if we're at work?

Which puts me in a room of second graders. Not likely to happen!

[Crim_n al]

190. Teachers must work even longer hours now than I used to.

:shrug:

[madmusic]

54. The date needs changed.

To voting day. And it should be day off, and throw in a little bit of civil disobedience, legal, an orgasmic revolution against the fundies. Our country was founded on being naughty, not robotic.

[demnan]

61. That's so John and Yoko

n/t

[greyl]

72. No, John and Yoko had a flawless platform as I recall.

This is based on false claims about "science".

[greyl]

105. to clarify:

John said they wanted to utilize the space they'd occupy in the media when they got married, with a commercial for peace.
I'm re-watching Imagine and confirming that my statement about their flawless platform is true.
Never once during the 7 day event, did Yoko or John say anything pseudoscientific.


edit: clarity, lol

[Crim_n al]

191. Must remember : "Never take a stand on a floorless platform."

:hippie: :party:

[EdwardM]

62. How the hell can you compare this to the KKK?

How many black people did they lynch? How many churches did the firebomb? There is nothing wrong with orgasms. There is everything wrong with the KKK. It is sad that our country has such a big hangup on sex, yet has no problem with violence.

[Crandor]

66. It isn't as bad as the KKK of course

but, since it will be more closely associated with the Democrats and the anti-war movement in general than the KKK is associated with Republicans, it will have about the same effect on people's perceptions.

[grizmaster]

137. comparing masturbation to genocide

has got to be the most absurd comparison I've ever seen on DU.


....and I've seen some doozies here.

[La Lioness Priyanka]

64. since when did freedom of expression go against democratic values?

what sort of idiotic "toe the line else we may not win an election" nonsense is this?

[greyl]

67. Since when is buying into irrational bullshit a liberal value? nt

[La Lioness Priyanka]

71. no one is mandating that you personally need to have an orgasm for peace

but if some people feel that it would somehow help the world, why cant they state it?

[greyl]

74. You're misrepresenting my expression.

If you want to be so respectful of expression in the world, why not read carefully and avoid leaping to unwarranted conclusions?

I am not saying they shouldn't be allowed to state something, I'm saying what they're stating is bullshit.
Check out the "science" upon which this effort is based.

[La Lioness Priyanka]

82. well you didnt really state that in your first post...it was just a small phrase ...

i wasnt deliberately trying to leap to conclusions...

i agree with you in that i do think there is no science behind this...

i still dont think we should have the attitude that people should stop saying things because it makes us look bad...that is stifling especially in the arts...

[greyl]

87. That's fine, I see.

The "making us look bad" thing isn't close to my primary concern with regard to this issue, and I would never try to convince someone to stop being truthful "because it makes us look bad" to assholes with inadequate skills of perception. :)

edit: It shouldn't say "isn't close to my primary concern", because I think I only have 2 concerns. That would make this one adjacent to my primary concern. ;)

[La Lioness Priyanka]

88. hey look at us..we had a civilized argument.

i think this is a momentous occasion in gd.

[greyl]

89. :) It can happen. I like post #85. nt

[sui generis]

104. yeah, my problem with it was this follow up:

"How about Smoke Pot with Your Kids for Peace? Or Public Anal Sex Day for Peace? This is the Left's version of KKK rallies for Republicans."

Somebody has issues . . . . or just really profoundly bad judgement.

By comparing "orgasms" for peace to "distasteful" activities, such as drugs and buttfucking, rather than "baking pies for peace" or "prayers for peace", somebody showed his hand at the table and he's been told that, and he's nevertheless still trying to bluff.

You're a saint lioness. Me, more :evilgrin:.

[Ian_rd]

75. This is completely ridiculous

There are many posts on this forum trying to imply that if you disagree with this orgasm campaign, you are on some personal mission to destroy free speech and stifle differing opinions. The point of the original post and a few people that have agreed with it is that this message will not be effective and might even be a detriment to the cause of peace. We are not saying that people can't say this or can't do that. Criticizing someone's speech is not the same as wanting to stifle it.

[La Lioness Priyanka]

78. i agree with you....criticizing is not the same as stifling...

and you can critique the science of it...i think its stupid too

what i am against is the premise that if something makes us look bad to the rightwing we should stop doing it.

that i think is where i think we are stifling speech...critiquing the premise of orgasms leading to peace is fine.

[greyl]

83. Well, showing how there's no good science behind it goes so far,

and then mentioning that the RW (ie Drudge) will use this against us goes a just a bit farther.

Let's go all the way. (sly fox reference)

[sui generis]

90. right there with you

I took the whole effort as tongue in cheek to begin with; that's why I'm so surprised anyone here is taking it seriously. That and they should read more Heinlein or something.

Oh well, I guess some people just like to kvetch. I know I do. :P

[Warren DeMontague]

96. That's right. And I'm not stifling you in the least if I tell you that

if you hate orgasms so much, continue to avoid them at all costs.

[Crandor]

68. So should we go around saying we hate America then?

Freedom of expression allows us to do that. It's still not a good idea.

[La_Fourmi_Rouge]

70. My jaw hurts! My lips are numb!

[Crim_n al]

193. That must have really sucked.

:9

[greyl]

92. "Think Critically for Peace" and make love to celebrate.

I don't have a link.

[Warren DeMontague]

93. You know what? This place can USE more "brainless hippies acting on their

godless feel good desires".

If you don't like it, go suck a lemon for peace if it makes you feel better.

[greyl]

95. Hippies with brains are much better.

Whose lead do you think the brainless ones were following?

[Warren DeMontague]

97. Yeah, well, I've been at a few rigorously organized, well-attended

peace protests. Many of them before the start of this clusterfuck known as the Iraq war.

I've watched the media ignore 'em, undercount the numbers, focus on one or two mohawked kids lighting mailboxes on fire, and give "equal time" to five freepers at a pro-war counter-rally.

No, Orgasms for peace probably aren't going to accomplish a whole lot. But neither is "legitimate", "smart", "respectable" protest.

[greyl]

103. This "movement" has a serious flaw which most others don't.

Its gimmick is bad science marketed as truth. I can't imagine how this is as good as legitimate, smart, respectable, protest.
I'm not at all against bringing attention to a Peace Movement, I'm against the inclusion of falsifiable claims in this particular Media Event.

[Warren DeMontague]

173. I agree with you about the "science".

What I don't agree with is the tone of the OP, which is a continuation of several other idiotic memes regarding how "we" have to "present ourselves" so that "they" can't claim that we're, for instance, "long-haired godless hippies".

Fuck that. I *AM* a long-haired godless hippie.

[greyl]

181. Thanks.

The pseudoscience of the movement was what I picked up on, not the OP's motives.
I'd rather not speculate on those.

:hippie:

[yurbud]

99. thank right wingers for all their contributions and say every future orgasm of theirs will be a vote

for peace.

They'll hold it in until their nads explode.

[Crim_n al]

194. First you'd have to explain to the right-winger women

what an orgasm is.

They still believe it's just the thing that makes men's faces turn red
and look like they're going to explode.

[yurbud]

218. they might accidentally get one if their polyester pants are too tight.

[Warren DeMontague]

100. So should I cut my hair, stop listening to the dead, move to Iowa

and convert to Christianity?

because God knows I don't want to confirm any right-winger's bogeyman impression of liberals as godless Northern California hippies.

Even though I am a godless Northern California hippie.

[CornField]

102. Why the slam on Iowa?

Just to clear things up for you, Iowa isn't one of the big Bible-thumpin' states, it's actually quite tolerant. (Take a drive through Kansas, Oklahoma and/or Missouri -- hell, especially Missouri which scared the hell out of this former Oklahoman turned Iowan)

Other than that one objection, however, I agree with ya. :)

[Warren DeMontague]

161. Wasn't intended as a slam on Iowa. I like Iowa. A good friend of mine went to Iowa State.

I grew up in the midwest, myself.

It was more a generalized geographical thing, as in, "away from San Francisco". Not intended to be a slam, really! :patriot:

[Kelly Rupert]

101. I totally agree.

Nothing is more futile than protest. Seriously. Protests have not accomplished anything in since the end of the civil rights movement. (Don't say that it turned Americans against the Iraq war. The ongoing hemorrhaging of lives, time, and money did that for us.) Now all protest looks like egocentric grandstanding--and this is a perfect example of that. Somebody has sex "to end war"? All that gets rid of is an erection.

Also, "And mass meditations have been shown to make a change"? Garbage. I've seen the ongoing "Electrogaiagram" study. It's a mockery of the scientific method.

[Missy Vixen]

107. I'm a bit confused. What's your point?

>Are these people trying to cheapen the campaign to end the war?<

It seems they're trying to start a bit of dialogue on the subject. It's working, at least here.

>We don't need naked people in public hoping to dedicate an orgasm to our cause<

I read the attached article yesterday. I don't recall anything in it about "naked people in public". This effort also does not appear to be endorsed by the Democratic Party, so you can put aside your worries about the "San Francisco Values" of the party weakening our nation.

If you don't want to participate, then DON'T. God knows we'd better not do anything that's enjoyable, ever.

Julie

[Red Right and BLUE]

108. It's a fun and positive thing to do.

Whether it makes a damn bit of difference, who CARES?? At least those who participate will feel like they aren't alone in wanting something horrible and wrong to be over. What the hell is wrong with that? Cheapens the campaign to end the war... how?

Seriously, way to be a RW mouthpiece. This thread is another one of those instances where the complaint is much more stupid than what's being complained about. If you're really this... I dunno, "irritable" or "uptight" then I hope you'll join in on the 22nd. Or maybe even as early as today. Sounds like you could use it.

[greyl]

111. "mass meditations have been shown to make a change" is a false statement.

Because the gimmick is sex, unlike John & Yoko's which was uabashed love, it will get a lot of attention.
Unfortunately, good rationale & strategies for ending the war probably won't be the topic of discussion.

[sui generis]

119. a true statement and the truth are not the same thing

oh master logician. :sarcasm:

[Red Right and BLUE]

169. Please point me to the place where I made said statement.

I'm not arguing that it will get ANY attention, much less that it will make a change. I doubt that either will happen. I'm only saying it sounds fun and it makes a lot more sense to participate than to complain about it (especially while the OP is full of false statements itself). If you're looking for an argument about this you're barking up the wrong tree; find someone else, because I think this whole this is pointless. I'm sorry if you missed that.

[greyl]

183. You didn't. That's from globalorgasm.org.

Did you miss it?

As I stated much earlier in this thread, protesting in the streets would be better than incorporating demonstrably false pseudoscience in a movement to raise awareness about people being blown to bits in a war.

[Red Right and BLUE]

185. No I didn't.

I did read the article. But I've already stated that I don't think this is going to make a difference either way, so your posts to me make no sense whatsoever. Did you miss that?

Your point about protesting in the streets is one that you need to make to the OP, not to me, or BETTER YET, if you need to make this point SOOO BADLY, then percraps you could go start your own protest in the streets, no?

I've already said it would be a fun, positive thing for anyone to do if they so choose. Crying about its futility, though, is an even bigger waste of time. So either go protest, or find someone else to delight with your cranial prowess.

[sui generis]

118. a-fucking-men to that.

and the guy keeps coming back like herpes to try to convince us we're wrong. :eyes:

[walldude]

110. Wow... pretty pissed about this huh....

Maybe you should practice.. you'll feel better ;)

[Montauk6]

112. Please don't buy into the manipulation

There have been dozens of anti-peace efforts that probably you or I don't even know about because such projects get blacked out by the Corporate Media.

So, now you've got some adhocsters, two to be exact, doin' the humpty-hump to end the war, big deal. No problem.

What IS the problem is how the MSM takes this ONE element of a HUGE movement and school of thought and gives it the significance of an AP news story

Limbaugh used to do this all the time with his Updates back in the 80s; I know because I'm a recovering dittohead. His team of producers would comb the news stories far and wide to pick out the most outlandish copy and present that as what's going on in the Peace or AIDS or Environmental movement. And idiots like me would, of course, suck it all in while guffawing at the way Rush would skewer these people with his sharp wit (y'know, I guess it's much easier to win a debate against a news story as opposed to the actual participants, whom he'd never had on his show) while walking away CONVINCED that the wackiness defines the movement.

The right-wing keeps this up whenever they want to cry "political correctness" or speak out against the "war on Christmas" and so forth.

[Sapere aude]

123. Mega dildos Rush! I think you proved my theory. That is that a thinking person

cannot be a ditto head for long. And that some people listen to Rush to find out what their opinion should be on an issue.

[Arkana]

114. Erm...

Yeah, not helping.

[Ariana Celeste]

120. If it makes people talk about peace, then GOOD.

[Kelly Rupert]

124. "Those idiot lefties are masturbating for peace?"

"What the hell? That's just twisted. I can't imagine anyone doing that. Those people and everything they stand for are sick."

Yep. Good.

[Ariana Celeste]

128. Anybody who is looking for "idiot lefties",

probably ain't lookin' for peace. And apparently this campaign isn't aimed at you, the OP, or anyone who is concerned about preserving the image of the left. :eyes:

[Kelly Rupert]

133. It's an illustration.

People are by and large repulsed by these displays. When "liberal" and "peace" are mentioned repeatedly with "masturbating old hippies," it links the first two concepts, however slightly, with the negative feelings the third concept brings. Subliminal linking is how Newt and his minions turned "liberal" into a dirty word. We don't need to turn the same gun on ourselves.

[grizmaster]

145. as a masturbating old hippy I take offense

that I'm to be hidden away for fear the I'll provide an opportunity for the rightwingnutosphere to smear liberals.

[Kelly Rupert]

150. I don't give a damn if they smear us or not. They will regardless.

The problem is when we smear ourselves using the same tactics, even if unintentionally.

[grizmaster]

154. ummm... are you sure you want to use the phrase

"smear ourselves" in this case? (pardon any images of old hippies that brings to mind)

It sounds an awful lot like you do care if they smear us. We could go to church three times a day looking the Ma and Pa Cleaver and because of what we represent they'd still smear us.

I'm sorry but I'm a supporter of gorilla theater. It's way more effective at reaching people who normally don't engage in political debate than a hundred well thought pundit columns.

[sui generis]

121. Involuntary Circumcisions for Peace!

Yee haw!

Discuss.

[Oeditpus Rex]

126. The OP is correct

Stunts such as this persuade no one and would only alienate many on the fence.

Imagine Teresa Heinz-Kerry getting naked at the 2004 convention and shouting "Breasts, not bombs!"




I meant imagine the repercussions, ya pervs. :eyes:

[mongo]

131. Yeah, lets not alienate anyone on the fence

The dems could start opposing gay marraige and abortion too.

:sarcasm:

[Oeditpus Rex]

134. Are you *intentionally* missing the point?

Or just giddy and cock-sure over the mid-terms?

Until the Democrats enjoy a commanding majority of the popular vote, attitudes such as yours will help lose elections.

[Warren DeMontague]

167. Ah, the old "you people are losing us elections" line.

Geeezus, that's tired.

[Oeditpus Rex]

184. Not as tired as automatic dismissals

Tell you what — ask any Dem politician if they think this will help get them re-elected.

Go ahead. We'll wait.

[Warren DeMontague]

206. I'm an atheist. I've been told that the mere act of my opening my mouth and admitting it

"loses us elections".

Fuck it, I'm tired of that. I don't care if the orgasms for peace "makes" "us" look bad to the people who listen to Rush or log on to Drudge. They're not all-powerful and frankly, I don't give a shit anymore.

[grizmaster]

142. how would masturbation make someone want to continue

the pointless slaughter in Iraq? Somebody with that shoddy of a cognitive sense isn't likely to be persuaded by any argument or action. Or worse they'll flip-flop at anything.

And they're asking people to do it in private not on a national stage.

And one more point, if you were propositioned with a good orgasm to listen to listen to the peace side of the debate can you honestly say you'd turn it down? I'm embarrassed to think what arguments I would listen to for the sake of a good orgasm.

[Oeditpus Rex]

155. But they're asking in public

C'mon — Clinton had to fire Surgeon General Jocelyn Elders in the backlash over her saying masturbation should be taught as an alternative to unsafe sex. What she said was turned into "The Democrats want to teach our children to masturbate" and she became a political liability — regardless of whether she was right. (And I think she was.)

This isn't about what's right or "the way things should be." It's about political realities. And one reality is you don't give your political enemy even a shred of something that can be turned against you.

[Warren DeMontague]

168. No, Clinton DIDN'T have to fire Jocelyn Elders.

Bush has people in similar positions who think it should be against the law for women to take the birth control pill. You can't tell me that's a less extreme position than saying "Masturbation is the safest sex there is".


What Clinton SHOULD have done was stood up for her and said, "You know what? She's right."

Just like what Clinton should have done with Monica was said "You know what? She gave me a blow job, not like it's any of your god-damn business. Now, lets get back to work".

When Clinton succeeded it was because he DIDN'T play that kowtow to the Culture War nabobs game. When he got his ass kicked, it was because he DID.

[Oeditpus Rex]

178. Okay, I'll bend on semantics

He didn't "have to" fire her; he made the decision to fire her based on the politics surrounding her and his administration as a result of what she said. It was a "good faith" move, similar to a TV news division firing an anchor who said something inflammatory during a broadcast. It's debatable whether such moves are necessary, but consider how we react to such things from the other side — we often call for heads to roll.

Much of politics — way too much — is about dealing, giving and taking, doing X so you can do Y. As I said earlier, it isn't about what's right or what should be. It's simply political reality, and it's the rare politician who's willing to stare down controversy. Sad, but true.

[grizmaster]

175. These people aren't running for surgeon general

they're using their free speech.

And they aren't aren't advocating teaching children to masturbate. They're suggesting people as an act of solidarity and in the privacy of their own homes have an orgasm. And those who are our enemies and hate us will hate us whether we have orgasms or not.

[Oeditpus Rex]

186. And they'll point to this and say

"See how silly and irreverent the Dems are? And everything's about SEX with them!"

Again — you don't give your enemy anything they can use against you, even if they have to stretch it beyond recognition to make it work in their favor, because that's exactly what they'll do. Look at how effective the Republics were with "flip-flop."

This is the era of Rovian politics. The gloves are off, and mass media are the cornermen.

[Warren DeMontague]

213. Well, too late.

These people are here, (and more are coming, heh heh heh!) and they're not going away.

Oh well!

[Kelly Rupert]

156. What? I think you're missing the point.

The point is that we're broadcasting to the world that liberals think that masturbation will end war, which makes us look goofy and out-of-touch at best and depraved at worst. Either way, that would drive people away from associating with us.

[Warren DeMontague]

170. Hmmm. For the past several decades the Republican Party has said they think

the Constitution should be amended to make any use of oral contraceptives equivalent to murder, and people still associate with them.

[grizmaster]

177. now THAT'S crazy talk

[Warren DeMontague]

204. The HLA Plank of the GOP constitution calls for fertilized eggs to get rights under the

14th amendment. Pretty much every major "pro-life" organization in this country considers the Birth Control pill an abortifacent, and as such, morally equivalent to surgical abortion. Also, the SCOTUS decision the legal eagles of the "pro-life" movement are really gunning for isn't Roe so much as Griswold, which preceded it. Do the math, add it up, and it's pretty clear the agenda isn't just abortion, it's criminalizing contraception wholesale.

And you're right, it's fucking crazy.

[Kelly Rupert]

209. You see, that's the thing about spin.

Our spin on abortion is believed by half of America. Their spin is believed by half of America.

Now, when it comes to relative values of the party, there's about a third of America (way overgeneralizing here) that recognizes that we're a party of sane realists who want to work for the common benefit, and that the Republicans are corporate Bible-thumping whores. There's about a third of America that thinks we're loony hippies and the Republicans are smart Christian pragmatists. And there's a third that kinda wavers between thinking both, sometimes goin' one way, and sometimes the other (again, way overgeneralizing).

When the Republicans push against abortion, that doesn't really change much--everybody already agrees they're against abortion, whether you like them or not. When we support this stuff, though...we look like loony hippies. And really, nobody wants to be associated with loony hippies. Similarly, Republicans are stupid when they act like corrupt Bible-thumpers--if it weren't for Terri Schiavo, Mark Foley, and Tom DeLay, 2006 might have gone far worse. You never gain any points by embracing your worst stereotype.

[Warren DeMontague]

212. Um, well, first off, the majority of Americans are Pro-Choice. PERIOD.

So I disagree that "half of America" agrees with the GOP. I certainly don't think half of America wants to throw women in jail for taking the pill, even though that is the real-world implication of the GOP platform on Abortion if you take it to its logical conclusion.

Secondly, I have long hair. I like the Grateful Dead. Hell, I've even been known to sport a tye-dye in my day. I don't GIVE A SHIT if people think that makes me a "loony hippie", or if other people think that having people like me in the Democratic Party "makes us lose elections". And I resent the idea that "hippies" are somehow our "worst stereotype". Eh. Frankly, the worst stereotype I can think of on the "left" is that of a puritannical, humorless control freak whose attempts to micro-manage the personal decisions of other consenting adults gives the religious right a serious run for their money.



The lesson of Terri Schiavo is that all this bullshit about the American People looking like the couple in American Gothic, about the all-powerful "Values voter", is just that- BULLSHIT. And the idea that anyone is going to look at the brutal ludicrousness of the Iraq war and go "Well, I would oppose it, except for those loony hippies who are -gasp- Fucking to try to stop it" is just... beyond inane.

Frankly, this thread is a tired rehash of the same old "shut up!" shit that we've been hearing for years- "we" need to silence the gays, the atheists, the pro-choicers, etc. because they might "alienate the values voters". "We" need to wear business suits to peace protests, not tie-dye. (There's always a small cadre here on DU that can't wait to come out for a good hippie bash-in!) "We" need to inject more Jesus references into our speeches. Etc. Etc. Etc.

Sorry, not all of us live in terror of fitting into some "negative stereotype" put out by the idiotic, dysfunctional right wing noise machine, and we're not going away. Be who you are, but stop trying to force the rest of us into your mold. These protesters obviously aren't speaking for you. Let it end there.

[Kelly Rupert]

237. Okay.

1. That's great. It was obviously a simplified illustration. But don't let that stop your self-righteousness.

2. Good for you. I'm glad you're happy with yourself; more people should be. But that still doesn't mean that hippies masturbating is going to make the world's collective consciousness turn anti-war, because that's fucking nuts. And it doesn't change the fact that these types of protests are counterproductive.

3. The lesson of Terri Shiavo is that Americans don't like to have their beliefs challenged, whether it be by fundamentalist nutjobs who think an atrophied brainstem is conscious and sentient or by new-age nutjobs who think that if they all masturbate than their good feelings will cause a worldwide spike in happiness, ending war.

4. I...don't see anyone saying that we need to silence GLBTs (though I think the court-challenges were counterproductive to our movement), atheists, pro-choicers, or anything. There are a few people saying that masturbation doesn't actually end war, nor does it convince Americans that Democrats are serious leaders.

5. It's not a matter of what we do with our personal lives. I don't have any problem with people meeting stereotypes. The problem is people who, with good intentions, launch protests that turn people against the very idea they hope to raise awareness for.

[grizmaster]

176. It's guerilla theater

and I have confidence enough that anyone with a brain above the size of a pea will see it as that, and not that us evil liberals think that orgasms would solve all our problems.

And if the thought of people masturbating scares you off, you better start running cuz everybody does it. At least everybody who sees this story might, just might, think about peace for second the next time they reach for their nether regions.

The only ones who will buy into the crazy-dangerous-lib meme are the tools who hate us with an undying passion already.

[Kelly Rupert]

210. It's not a matter of buying into memes.

It's a matter of correlation and connotation. Used to be, when people thought "liberal" they thought of JFK, and when they thought "conservative" they thought of grumpy old tightwads. Now, thanks to an expert branding program, people think negative thoughts about the word "liberal," and are largely neutral to "conservative." If you want to brand something positive, you connect it with pleasant images. When you want to brand something negative, you connect it with unpleasant images. Unfortunately, while masturbation is pleasant, the word carries negative connotations, and as such this damages the peace movement.

Also, guerilla theatre doesn't do shit. The only people who find it stimulating or interesting are those who already were open to free thought--that is, people who are on our side already.

[Warren DeMontague]

215. The American Medical Assosciation says masturbation is "normal, natural and healthy"

If you can't get past your own negative connotations with the word, perhaps you ask yourself why.

[Kelly Rupert]

235. That's great. I'm not talking about *my* connotations.

And I'm not talking about the factual qualities of masturbation. I'm not saying these people are morally wrong. I'm saying these people are not going to help turn people against the war, because I'm talking about America-at-large's perceptions.

[Warren DeMontague]

165. NO ONE is going to base their feelings about this stupid, pointless war

on whether or not there's a "fuck for peace" protest.

The idea that there are all these easily alienated "fence sitters" for whom we have to constantly play to the balcony is another right-wing lie, and it keeps resurfacing in different forms:

We lost the 2004 election because of gay marriage. Or because we're too pro-choice. We have to hide the gays, the atheists, the pro-choicers in the back of the bus because we're alienating the all powerful (ha) "values voter". Stop "bashing christians" by, for example, debunking creationist bullshit or objecting to mandatory prayer in public schools. Wear suits to protests, not tie-dye. Blah. Blah Blah Blah. Blah Blah Blah Blah.

[Catherine Vincent]

129. They chose a good date to do this. Guess who's birthday is Dec. 22nd?

:evilgrin:

[Ian_rd]

130. Wow this thread got ugly. I apologize for starting it.

I've been accused of being a prude knee-jerk Republican who hates sex, has never had it (read: I'm an ugly loser), and who wants to stifle the speech of others and force them to toe a certain line. I haven't been flamed this badly since I trolled on the freeper forums. And the freepers, ladies and gentlemen, have got nothing on some of the people here. And I'm not the only one. Some of the people who agreed with my point even remotely were attacked in some pretty nasty ways.

In the original post my illustrations were over the top, I concede. The comparisons were ridiculous only because the right-wing rhetoric that will address this issue is sure to be equally ridiculous. It was never my intention to compare these people morally to the KKK, and I think an intelligent reading of the post makes this clear. My point is this, stated as clearly as I am able: If the goal of these people is to help end the war, I believe that their effort will backfire by providing right-wing opinion leaders with a means to show their well-controlled audience what they claim to be true everyday in their opinions of liberals and the anti-war crowd, not to mention serve to alienate many conservatively-minded and religious people who have every reason to despise the war, but no reason at all to feel associated with a giant coordinated orgasm.

Since this story hit the net, it has been posted on Drudge and other right-wing sites and my very Republican father has mass-emailed it to everyone he knows with glee, leading me to believe that my opinion has merit.

[Ian David]

140. No, no no... you miss the REAL problem

The REAL problem is that now conservative men will have to explain to their wives what an "orgasm" is, and why only Liberals seem to be able to have them.


This message post is presented for its scientific and social value.

[grizmaster]

136. sorry, but I'm gonna spank it till we have peace

or a piece of me falls off.


Lighten up. Nudity and sex are not evil and I refuse to buy into adjusting reality to appease the right-wing nutsacks.

[Red Right and BLUE]

171. LMAO!

:spray:

[grizmaster]

179. I mean it! I'll blind myself trying!

now where did I put that personal lubricant?

[Red Right and BLUE]

182. You won't go blind

most likely. Just watch where aim it...

[whoneedstickets]

141. Lord of War or Master of Your Domain!!!

What a quandary!

[Kelly Rupert]

157. That would be both.

"Master of your Domain" was code for not masturbating in Seinfeld.

[BlueEyedSon]

144. They got onto the AP with their message, innit???

[greyl]

151. Ending the war has been in the MSM for quite a while now, hello. nt

[BlueEyedSon]

188. The more, the merrier!

[Puglover]

148. Oh jesus christ

Just what this board needs. Another purse lipped school marm.



Bad hippies. Bad hippies.

:rofl: godless feel-good desires? :rofl:

[sui generis]

159. eggzackly

It's like the airplane went down just three minutes ago and some of us are already eating the survivors, in sight of an IHOP.

Well, the best thing is to just let them chase themselves out. We're sure not going anywhere.

:hi:

[Warren DeMontague]

174. "purse lipped school marm"

:yourock:

[Puglover]

149. dupe self delete

[frankly_fedup2]

153. Couldn't they just have said "Make love not war." The way it is being

presented is in an inflammatory way like they are two kooks. Just what the right needs to hear. Not that they would know what an orgasim is but they will use this as another tree-hugging whacko (no "PUNS" intended)degrading the morality of the American family and our troops.

Can't the media report on, say . . . where OBL might have been seen last? Are we even looking for him anymore? I mean they bitch about Clinton not getting him and yet after the worst terrorist attack in this country, the NeoCONs aren't even looking for the SOB.

What a country.

[WI_DEM]

158. Personally I don't care, but it's stunts like this that make people think

some anti-war demonstrators are flakes.

[GymGeekAus]

160. Public Anal Sex Day for Peace? From the o/p.

Gosh, people have been banned for much less.

Please, do not expect that all of America will share your values about sex, let alone war.

And let those who choose to speak and demonstrate do so as they will.

That is intrinsic to being an American, after all. That whole first amendment being what it was.

Stop cheapening their protest to make a statement about your sexual aversions.

[sui generis]

164. makes you wonder why he didn't choose

"baking pies for peace" or "prayers for peace" as his contra arguments. Well actually, I don't wonder at all.

It's just another prudish sex thread on DU. The funniest part is how rude the guy was to anyone who disagreed and then complains that people were rude to him.

Good thing those unwashed immoral sex-addict hippies weren't going to do "Wardrobe Malfunctions and Nipple Metallurgy For Peace". I can only imagine what would happen, especially if we found out that not everyone who has sex is unwashed, immoral, or a hippie.

[merh]

162. More power for the piece movement

after all, even the conservatives can get behind this! :rofl:


I'm willing to do my part and have one for the greater good! :smoke:

[Deja Q]

163. Fuck 'em

I am soooooooooo tired of people saying "do this" to people who don't have a clue and then not help them out as to how to go do it. That's meeeeeeeeeean. :(

:spray:

[Crim_n al]

195. I'd offer my body in the cause, dahling,

But I am sooo not your type.

O8)

[Greyhound]

166. So, are you a reich-wing troll or are you the victim of brainwashing?

"brainless hippies acting on their godless feel-good desires"

"Smoke Pot with Your Kids for Peace"

"'San Francisco Values' weakening our nation", a direct quote from O'Lieley

Care to re-think your position?

[meisje]

172. We're going to a 3-way forming a peace symbol

It's the least we could do

[Politicub]

187. Expect to see more news from San Francisco from now on

It's a wonderful and liberal city, and since Nancy Pelosi represents part of it, news from there is going to get more play than it normally would. That's not the fault of SF, it's more the agenda of the MSM.

But, I don't believe SF should become more conservative just because middle America is squeamish. I was kind of shocked myself to hear the word orgasm on the radio when this news story was reported, but it's not the fault of Pelosi or the Dems.

As for me, I love San Francisco values, and think the country would be a lot better off it it were more like the city by the bay. There's far more to SF than orgasms for peace.

[Porcupine]

196. It's also a FUN city!! San Francisco knows how to have FUN!!

better than any other city in the US with the possible exception of New Orleans. When people see news from SF they are going to see people haveing fun.

It's the origin of Renaiscance Fairs, the SCA, Burning Man, Gay Pride, and Bay to Breakers races. It had great farmers markets in the 60's. It has the best restaurants in the US. "Escape from Alcatraz" is a triathalon in San Francisco.

If people thought supporting peace was the path to getting laid peace demonstrations would be wall-to-wall crowded. Right now it's boring old guys on the corner. Peace marches in San Francisco are more party than penance.

Democrats need to be the party of well....party. We have the ingredients, good food, all the artists, all the musicians. The GOP is Ted Nugent and Thomas Kinkade for chrissakes.

[boolean]

189. OH MY GOD NOT SEX!!! SEX EEEEEVIIIIIILLLL!!!

:sarcasm:

[mdmc]

197. This is the best thing that the peace movement ever did

I challenge the OP to prove me wrong.

[aaronbees]

198. Jesus, you take this way too seriously....

I'll do my part!

:patriot:

[survivor999]

200. How about....

On Dec 22, everybody gives ME one buck? :)

[Minnesota_Lib]

201. An orgasm rally? I'm coming.

[Blackthorn]

205. Fucking seriously

That is incredible. Would you prefer "Beat Elderly Jews to Death for Peace"? This is their way of standing in solidarity with like-minded people. Where do you get off climbing onto your soapbox to attack these people because their choice of activism seems "stupid" and a "waste" to your high and mighty sense of righteousness.

Not to mention you've drawn the long bow of likening homosexuality to masturbation. And linking masturbating to white supremacy. Were you trying to belittle everyone to gives themself one now and again? Do you think its a good idea to say "We don't need" about people who are prepared to help your cause?

If people want to whack off for peace, then more power to them. I might dedicate the next one I rub out to peace. It's a fucking lot more enjoyable and far more constructive than posting garbage like this.

[majorjohn]

207. Silly ideas from silly people

Just as ridiculous as suggesting that everyone should paint their face green on Earth day, because somehow that will make the environment cleaner????

[Warren DeMontague]

216. No, a silly idea is invading Iraq on bald-faced lies

and expecting the American people to cheerfully sacrifice thousands of lives and hundreds of billions of dollars year after year after year.

[greyl]

221. There's a difference between silly and disgustingly ignorant & destructive.

Isn't the invasion of Iraq better described as "disgustingly ignorant & destructive" than silly?

One of the objections to globalorgasm.org is that its silliness disrespects the humans that are being destroyed in the war.

I mean, can anyone really have passionate sex while meditating about the realities of the war? I seriously doubt it.

If you say, well the idea is to meditate on peace and that will have a real effect on the war(as the site claims), you're not supported by the science.

[Warren DeMontague]

225. One of my objections to the Iraq War is that it disrespects the humans that it destroys.

I don't see how a protest against the war -no matter how silly- can come anywhere close to the level of disrespect contained in continual support for it.

But, as I said upthread, I agree that the supposed science is goofy. From a purely philosophical standpoint, however, increasing the amount of pleasure in the world as a statement in answer to the pain of war makes as much sense to me as anything else.

[greyl]

228. We are in agreement.

It's only the inclusion of the pseudoscience I have a problem with. I was familiar with the Princeton EGGs before this thread was posted, so that's what I keyed in on.

I understand your point about increasing the amount of pleasure in the world(I'm fond of saying "we add just as much suffering to the world when we take offense as when we give it"), however it's unfortunate that the pleasure at the center of this movement is relegated to private bedrooms rather than out in the world of neighbors and strangers. I think ending the war and affecting progressive change of vision in our country will take sincere, reverent sacrifice, not exactly an increase in pleasure between sex partners.

[MrSlayer]

214. I'm all for trying it.

Can't hurt.

[KyndCulture]

217. You motherfuckers are completely INSANE.

That's all I have to say.

[physioex]

220. Not sure what you are saying? Care to elaborate?? EOM

[Fly by night]

219. Joke 'em if they can't take a fuck.

[NoSheep]

227. lol!!!!

[Gemini Cat]

222. Huh.

Boinking for peace? Have fun with all that.
Personally I'd rather give blood to the local blood bank for peace or pick up rubbish from the park for peace or do something/anything constructive that would help people out...for peace.
Pulling my skivvies down for my own personal pleasure helps only me.

I doubt most people will take the idea of boinking for peace seriously.

[Xenotime]

224. How about a Gang Bang for Peace or Bukkake for Peace?

That would get more press.

[NoSheep]

226. We're killing out loud, why can't we love out loud???

I feel this kind of sentiment towards a movement like this is prudish. If you don't behave as if it is weird, then perhaps the repuke in the cubical next to you won't either.

Why is sex so scary to people? Most of us participate in it as a normal healthy part of being a human being. Why be in the closet about it?

[greyl]

230. You can, but if you think an angel gets its wings with every stroke

you're on very shaky ground.

[NoSheep]

234. That was funny!

:7

[aein]

239. funny, I read "guy's you're not helping" as dig against male virility

[baby_mouse]

240. What's the problem with it?

Seems harmless enough.

[Zhade]

241. What the hell is wrong with you?

Let's see...

'godless' - you show your bigotry against atheists; 'smoke pot' - you clearly think there's something wrong with marijuana; my doctors would disagree with you.

Sheesh. How does it feel with that stick in your ass?

(Oops, shouldn't have said that, your homophobia will probably show through even clearer now.)

Fuck OFF.