Here are the words you won't hear on Tee Vee. My honest assessment of the war on Iraq:

[Nimrod2005]

Everything else you hear from the so called pundits, analysts, experts, military generals, the Bidens of the world, the McCains, the talking heads, the Abi Zaids, the Tweeties, the book writers, the Rummies, the Rices, the Adalmans...etc. is a bullshit. They are treating themselves and you like dumbass uneducated morons, they think Americans and the world are a bunch ignorant dummies.

Here is my view

1) We lost the war on Iraq - YES. Be honest, militarily we lost, they defeated us!!! We did not have enough forces, Rummy blew it, they had no plan to win the so called peace...etc. whatever, our military is loosing and it will continue to lose everyday. Right now we are loosing the occupation of Iraq!

2) It is the full blown CIVIL WAR stupid...It is not low grade civil war, it is not ethnically motivated attacks, it is not dead-enders, it is not pseudo civil war, it is not almost a civil war...etc. They are all lying bastards!!! I see civil unrest, I see civilians who are now taking up arms to fight each other, neighborhood to neighborhood, tribe against tribe, religion against religion, militia against militia...etc. IT IS A CIVIL WAR YOU MORON...

3) The Pentagon choices as of today are: Get fucked long, get fucked wide, or just get the fuck out...Pretty soon, we will have no choice in the matter, so choose now.

My stupid ass pretend war President is the biggest disaster the world has ever seen.

[Subdivisions]

1. .

[Cary]

2. How do you know?

I understand and share your frustration. We have been victimized by the neocons, who believe they have a monopoly on the truth. So true are they to this belief that instead of owing up to their failures, they blame us for allegedly undermining them.

The damage done to our society is not so much the invasion of Iraq. There is some truth interspersed in neocon nonsense. One such truth is that we may have ended up invading anyway. Saddam didn't exactly play his cards so well, either, and we are better off without him.

The lesson I've learned is not "never invade". The lesson I've learned (even though I already knew that lesson) is never fall so in love with your own solutions.

Our diversity and our system are strengths. The supreme irony here is that the neocons, in the arrogance and zeal, totally discounted the true strengths of our system and falsely labeled our strengths as "weakness" and "treason".

We rushed into the invasion for no good reason, as it turns out. There are no good answers to the mess they've made; we just have bad answers and worse answers.

We shouldn't rush now either. We need to show the world what we can do when we do things right, even it's still a matter of choosing bad over worse.

[SutaUvaca]

3. Hmmm?!

"The damage done to our society is not so much the invasion of Iraq. There is some truth interspersed in neocon nonsense. One such truth is that we may have ended up invading anyway. Saddam didn't exactly play his cards so well, either, and we are better off without him."

So, eventually their oil might have been worth a few thousand American kid's lives not to mention a few hundred thousand Iraqi lives?
Uh huh.

No thanks. I don't need any neocon truth interspersed in neocon nonsense today.

[riderinthestorm]

4. Can you amplify your thoughts on this a bit?

"One such truth is that we may have ended up invading anyway. Saddam didn't exactly play his cards so well, either, and we are better off without him."

Why do you think we would have ended up invading "anyway"? If bu$sh and the neocons had simply waited and let the weapons inspectors finish their jobs, we would never have invaded since there weren't any wmds.

Why didn't Saddam play his cards well? He was a tyrannical dictator yes, but he was also a tyrannical dictator who held Iraq together better than we seem to be able to. If you are thinking about his actions just before we invaded, I'm also not understanding how you think he failed to play his cards well.

As for how "we" are better off without him, I'd really like an answer on this one. How are "we" better off without him? What threat do you/did you see him as being to us? Yes, he did have several decades to make googly faces at us and taunt us and shoot his rifle in the air like a brat but I fail to see how that harmed US one iota.

[Nimrod2005]

5. We were better off with Saddam in power..The world was much safer

and the ME was much more stable.