I am not a political scientist

[solara]

I am new to political activism.

But it seems to me that since this is still a 'lame duck' congress..we all need to take a step back and watch what is happening. The pendulum is swinging as we knew it would.. let it swing. Let the Rethugs handle the momentum. This is -their- war, this is -their- mess and accountability has come.

The Congress-elect has been given a big stick..let them use it to stir the pot. Rangel's statement about the draft has certainly brought up some stuff, hasn't it? A lot of what is going on right now, including his statement about the draft, has opened the doors to discussion and debate about war on other levels besides fear, and may well be a catalyst for questions which should have been asked about 9/11.

I think Rangel knows that a draft resolution will never pass in Congress, but, by bringing this up now, he is shining a light on the the imbalances in our military and on the unequal distribution of the responsibility of war. Because of Rangel's statement there is more dialogue about the lies that got us into Iraq and a growing awareness of the criminal ease with which the Bush administration sent our sons and daughters (not theirs) to Iraq to be maimed and to die.

I agree with Randi Rhodes... Rangel wants to stop the ease with which this government CHOOSES to go to war. Iraq is a war of CHOICE and it was Bush's choice .

People will pay more attention when their own asses might be on the line or when their own children might be put in harms way. I think Rangel is right. Had there been a draft five years ago we wouldn't be in Iraq now.

Watch the reactions.

Have faith.

[mike_c]

1. one might just as easily argue that had there been a draft...

...five years ago we would be in Iran as well as Iraq by now. The Bush/Cheney/Rumsfeld doctrine is one of unilateral "force projection" wherever the U.S. wants to project its interests. It is unlikely that anything would have stood in the way of that in 2002. Congress stumbled over itself to bend over for the administration, and they were mostly convinced that the war against Iraq would be quick and neat. If cannon fodder was cheap and easy to obtain, the administration would just as likely have advanced its hegemonistic agenda on multiple fronts, and today we'd find ourselves with many more dead.

[Mythsaje]

2. Yeah, that's my take on it too...

We should be damned glad there wasn't a draft.

And we sure as shit shouldn't be considering instituting one.

I don't think these people would hestitate to perform ANY atrocity to advance their agenda.

[MadMaddie]

3. Agreed we don't want to help them advance their bullshit

Neocon agenda...

What I fail to see in most the conversations on DU is the following...

...Is the proposal to continue to send our existing military men and women back for 4th, 5th, 6th etc tours of duty?

The ultimate answer is to get the hell out of Iraq

I see a few options, I know many of you have other ideas...

1. * finally sees the light and pulls our troops completely out. Probability...Not going to happen unless we can impeach him and his cabal

2. Continue redeploying our regular and reserve troops over and over until they get killed, have mental breakdowns or until they can't fight anymore...Probability...Very High

3 Draft...Not something I want to see ever ...but how do you stop resending our currrent troops over and over again....

Just askin...

Americans do not want a draft and they don't want this war...something has to give...

[Mythsaje]

4. First and foremost

we shouldn't be there in the first place.

Second. NO politician should be put in the position where he can break our military with impugnity.

Third. The National Guard is NOT for foreign adventuring.

Fourth. The back-door draft is bullshit.

Fifth. We need out NOW. No debates, no hedging, no "but it'll degenerate into chaos." It already IS.

The American people want us to leave. They want our soldiers home. Our politicians better well figure out a way to do it. If it takes impeaching Bush, so be it.

You know, I don't mind this debate. I think it's brought up some great issues. But I CANNOT and will not support the base proposition. I think it's just plain wrong.

[MadMaddie]

5. You are right we shouldn't be there and we shouldn't have to have

this conversation..

Our biggest concern should be getting our soldiers out while they still have sanity left and still have their bodies intact....

Other then getting them out there are no good solutions....

And we should be talking about impeachment for this illegal war....

[Mythsaje]

7. I was shocked to find myself agreeing with

Ed chultz a few weeks back. I rarely do.

He said impeachment should be "off the agenda" but "not off the table."

Meaning we can't march in and say "Hey, we're going to impeach this bozo" but, rather, "we're going to gather evidence and start pushing for things the American people want. If you don't let us give the people what they've asked for, THEN we're going to impeach your ass. And they're going to cheer us while we do it."

[MadMaddie]

8. That's the only way to do it...

Because I think all of the investigations will lead ultimately to Rove, Cheney, *, Condi and Rumsfeld, Bremmer and the rest of the cabal....and when the evidence is so overwhelming there will be no choice but to impeach.....The American people will demand it...

I also believe in order for the US to try to repair damaged relations around the world we will have to agree to let the Hague prosecute these criminals for "Crimes against Humanity"....

[Mythsaje]

9. I think so too...

I think we can lever complicit members of Congress into going along with progressive plans and basically rat out the rat-bastards for some sort of immunity.

I think we need to be pragmatic. If we do it right, we'll get most of them. I think doing it the wrong way will net us a convenient scapegoat. Probably Bush. As soon as he's out of office, he's useless to them.

If we want to take down the cabal, it's going to take smarts, not just ambition.

[MadMaddie]

10. Agreed.....

Well...getting ready to go watch.. Hero's Save the cheerleader, Save the World!!

Have a good evening!!:hi:

[Mythsaje]

11. Oh, yeah.

Watch that show religiously myself.

Half an hour and counting. Of course, I gotta wait until my wife gets home, works out, eats dinner, and THEN we can watch it.

[porphyrian]

6. People aren't used their representatives representing effectively...

...let these people work.