Do you believe a timetable in Iraq should be negotiated or imposed?

[Clarkie1]

I believe we need to talk directly with all parties who have an interest in what happens to Iraq both inside and outside Iraq...directly. As Clark put it in the USA today article today:

"confidence-building measures, hosted discussions between factions, and perhaps one or more larger meetings to conclude firm commitments, timetables or sequence of events."



Who are we to impose OUR timeline on the Iraqi people? Have we learned NOTHING from this administration's arrogance? The world will start respecting America when America stops imposing unilateral solutions on issues in which the nations, regions, and even the world has a stake. Can we at least show the decency of talking with people before issuing them an ultimatum? We did this to the Iraqis, shouldn't we at least negotiate any "timetable or sequence of events" with them and use the leverage we have for positive good?

[Redstone]

1. We should get the fuck out. NOW.

Redstone

[Clarkie1]

3. Selfish, putting aside whether it's in our best interest or not to do that.

edit: as well as arrogant and self-centered.

I guess we still think it's all about U.S.

Our war, our troops, our country, our politics, our decision, our world, etc,, etc., etc.

America, the great "DECIDERER" (Hell, our "president" even said so!)

[Redstone]

9. Tell that to the parents of the next soldier to die, would you? I dare you.

Redstone

[Clarkie1]

15. Iraqi or American? nt

[Redstone]

16. Either.

Redstone

[Clarkie1]

20. We all want the killing to stop.

Nobody wants to do anything that will create more bloodshed.

[babylonsister]

2. We need to impose a timeline for OUR troops. We've given

the Iraqis more than enough time to try to sort it out. How many have to die before they do, amidst a civil war? Will it ever happen? And who's to say they wouldn't be better off without our presence there?
This is from today and is not encouraging:

New Survey: Iraqis Want a Speedy U.S. Exit -- and Back Attacks on Our Forces

http://www.michaelmoore.com/words/latestnews/index.php?...

November 21st, 2006 7:40 pm

New Survey: Iraqis Want a Speedy U.S. Exit -- and Back Attacks on Our Forces
By E&P Staff / Editor & Publisher

NEW YORK Past surveys have hinted at this result, but a new poll in Iraq makes it more stark than ever: the Iraqi people want the U.S. to exit their country. And most Iraqis now approve of attacks on U.S. forces, even though 94% express disapproval of al-Qaeda.

At one time, this was primarily a call by the Sunni minority, but now the Shiites have also come around to this view. The survey by much-respected World Public Opinion (WPO), taken in September, found that 74% of Shiites and 91% of Sunnis in Iraq want us to leave within a year. The number of Shiites making this call in Baghdad, where the U.S. may send more troops to bring order, is even higher (80%). In contrast, earlier this year, 57% of this same group backed an "open-ended" U.S. stay.

By a wide margin, both groups believe U.S. forces are provoking more violence than they're preventing -- and that day-to-day security would improve if we left.

Support for attacks on U.S. forces now commands majority support among both Shiites and Sunnis. The report states: "Support for attacks on U.S.-led forces has grown to a majority position—now six in ten. Support appears to be related to widespread perception, held by all ethnic groups, that the U.S. government plans to have permanent military bases in Iraq and would not withdraw its forces from Iraq even if the Iraqi government asked it to. If the U.S. were to commit to withdraw, more than half of those who approve of attacks on US troops say that their support for attacks would diminish."

The backing for attacks on our forces has jumped to 61% from 47% in January.

a little more...

[Clarkie1]

4. We've given the Iraqis a war. nt

[babylonsister]

6. They do not want us there and are using our soldiers as

targets. What part of that don't you get? Pls. name one positive thing the soldiers are accomplishing there, because I don't know of any.

[Clarkie1]

8. A majority of the Iraqi people do not want the U.S. to leave in less than six months time

according to a poll released today...they want us to leave, yes, but they are afraid of the result chaos and bloodshed that will likely ensue if we leave too soon, or too quickly. A sizeable number do not want us to leave in less than one year's time, according this poll (I have no idea of the margin of error). We need to be talking to them, as well as powers such as Iran and Syria that want to control the future of the Iraqi people. We did this to the Iraqis, and obviously not talking is not working.

Time to start talking. Big time.

[babylonsister]

10. What poll was that? And could there be any more chaos or

bloodshed? Perhaps it will abate if we get the hell out. And talk? Do you honestly think anyone in this admin is going to talk, and if they should, who will they talk to? Yea, dimson is going to Jordan to meet with Maliki but what will he say or do? For that matter, what has anyone in this admin done to improve the situation? They are clueless and are just hoping someone can bail them out.
Your optimism is touching, but I think we're way beyond fixing this fuck-up we created. I'm sick of seeing the number of dead Americans and Iraqis rise daily, sick of hearing about the war crimes we've committed, the way we're treating prisoners who may or may not be guilty, sick of the whole inept bunch that started this.
It's time for our soldiers to come home.

[Clarkie1]

11. The poll posted on the front page today.

And to answer your question...yes. There could be a LOT more chaos and bloodshed.

[babylonsister]

12. We'll just agree to disagree. I do not want to be there for

10 more years and 45,000 dead Americans (a la VN) or any more dead Iraqis that our presence has caused.
I am done and will do anything in my power to get us out of there.

[ProSense]

5. It's not about imposing our timeline on the Iraqis!

It's about how long we leave our troops in harms way while the Iraqis engage in fighting each other and knowing that our presence is fueling violence. They also want us to leave!

[Clarkie1]

7. I'm not referring to any specific proposal of Kerry or anyone else.

I'm simply asking a question.

When you say, "They want us to leave," does that mean tomorrow? Have the leaders of the factions there asked us to do that? Did they ask us to leave at a set date?

We should certainly do what the Iraqis want, but we need to talk to them and work with them, as well as the regional powers that will likely decide Iraq's future.

There must be a negotiated settlement, it's the only chance of salvaging anything from this.

[elocs]

17. After 3 1/2 years, why aren't the Iraqi troop strengths higher?

They seem to either remain static or actually decline. They don't seem to have a lot of incentive to step up to the plate. With us in Iraq there is violence and chaos and if we leave there will be violence and chaos. It's just a matter of degree, better or worse. If at this time the Iraqis think things would be better if we left, then we should. If Iraq is a sovereign nation with a democratically elected government and they want us to leave, we need to leave. Even if our intentions were and are good, the road to hell is paved with good intentions. We should leave and take our contribution of hell with us.

[babylonsister]

18. Thank you. I agree totally. nt

[Clarkie1]

21. You should Bush that question. We can't take our "contribution of hell with us"

The hell that we've created in Iraq won't go away just by removing American troops.

[ProSense]

23. It'll get worse if we stay, and

even worse if they send more troops. Tens of thousands of innocent people are dying in that hell.

[elocs]

25. If the Iraqi people want us to go, we have to go.

Otherwise, regardless of our intentions, we are just your garden variety invaders and occupiers.
We do need to pay reparations for what we have done to that nation. The hell we've created won't go away by leaving American troops there as a lightning rod for violence and a recruitment for new terrorists.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

13. It took us a few days to drive into Iraq.

I don't see why it should take any longer getting out.

[LoZoccolo]

14. rhetoric 0, bumper stickers 4 n/t

[MadMaddie]

19. I would ask if our withdrawel from Vietnam was negotiated or

forced....

Because that is what is going to happen if we don't withdraw our troops in the next months...the green zone will get over run...and then what ....it's protected now...get them out now...

[bridgit]

22. negotiate, and in that bush has created the ultimate definition of what...

'disingenuous' now means...he should be made to pony out there with his dumb-ass himself and look into the eyes of the people he's been killing and HE should be made negotiate

[madokie]

24. Get the hell out is what I say

this is a job for the UN now. There is nothing the US can do except send money so they can hire the people necessary to rebuild their country, after all they 'did not' do anything to us