"In every case, when the principle occupying force pulled out its army, the fighting subsides,"

[chaska]

I don't consider the article a must read, but the snippet sure is. Let's spread the word about this. Keep kicked, if you'd be so kind.

McGovern Takes on Capitol Hill
Former Senator Brings His Iraq Timetable to Washington
by Z. Byron Wolf

http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/story?id=2658401&page=1&CMP=OTC-RSSFeeds0312

"Do we think everything is going to be hunky-dory after we leave? No," McGovern said. "We don't know what's going to happen. But we think we remove the principle irritant" when the U.S. troops withdraw.

McGovern argued that the United States could save money on reconstruction by contributing "3 percent of the hundreds of billions that the United States is going to pay to keep a large army there."

For their book, Polk said he studied 12 conflicts throughout history and found that there is a clear pattern.

"In every case, when the principle occupying force pulled out its army, the fighting subsides," he said.

[ChairmanAgnostic]

1. how true. we are the cause, not a solution.

But, unfortunately, Bush and his cronies don't bother reading anything that might disagree with their position.

[G_j]

2. George McGovern, Congressman Dennis Kucinich and AEI's Joshua Muravchik

http://www.democracynow.org/article.pl?sid=06/11/15/1459243

Wednesday, November 15th, 2006
Out of Iraq or More Troops? A Debate on Withdrawal with Fmr. Senator George McGovern, Congressman Dennis Kucinich and AEI's Joshua Muravchik

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
As leading Democrats call on President Bush to soon begin withdrawing U.S. troops from Iraq some Republicans are calling on more troops to be deployed. We host a debate on the issue with former Democratic presidential candidate and South Dakota senator, George McGovern, Ohio Congressmember Dennis Kucinich and the American Enterprise Institute's Joshua Muravchik.

[elehhhhna]

3. well duh.

[chaska]

4. You know if occures to me that if Baker is to come out with recommendations...

he would have to know the definitive reason why we're there. And if he knows why we're there, shouldn't he tell us, the people?

I mean we all know the many reasons we're there, but there is a particular reason that Bush is not willing to leave, and you can bet that at the root of it all it's primarily about money (oil), or Israel (which ultimately comes down to oil as well). In either case the people aren't going to be willing to put up with it.

Should we put Baker on the hot seat on this question?

[ChairmanAgnostic]

6. no. a waste of time.

that section will be "classified" or handled in a separate report never to be seen by non-neocon-eyes. I like the logic though. It does seem as though solving the problem requires the proper background, etc.

I suspect we will horribly depressed and disapointed by the Iraq Tsk report. It won't have a clear picture of what is happening, nor will it have clear guidelines about how to get out.
It will be a mixed stew of different opinions, all cloaked in subtlety, secrecy and paranoia. It will satisfy no one, because its purpose is not to solve the real problem, but to deflect even more criticism from Boy George.

Come on, Sandra Day O'Conner - an expert on wartime planning? give me an effing break. Hamilton? The most GOP supporting Dem since Zell and Joe? The rest of the commission is no better.

Now, the reasons for the delay are obvious. It was ready a month ago, but the elections interfered. Then they were ready to release it as a magic bullet to Boy George's troubles, but Iraq's problems grew worse. Had they abated, the report would have been out. Now that the collapse of Iraqnam is accellerating, and the situation is truly becoming untenable, they have to do a quick rewrite, so long as Boy George is protected. That is why they threw Rummie to the wolves, with Cheney to follow shortly.

But the actual report will be worthless.

[Warren Stupidity]

5. Only those on the margin dare speak the truth.

For everyone else, the lies will continue. Instead of Stay The Course we are now being told that we have to stay to Stop The Killing. As always now we are just on the brink of some other even more terrible development and as always the next six months will be critical. And then another six months will have gone by and another 500 or ours and 5,000 of theirs will be dead and we will still be there, the principle cause of the conflict, refusing to budge primarily because nobody wants to take the blame for the worst military blunder since Vietnam.

[chaska]

7. kick.