Help! I think my 13 year old is turning into a Republican. What do I do?

[DuaneBidoux]

His comments have just gotten a little scarier lately.


Last night I heard him talking about "Indians" and how they had weird houses.

When we were at the movies (Happy Feet) I said "aren't those penguins really cute?" His response was "Dad, you're turning into such a woooomen!"

He has this expression that he uses constantly now whenever he finds something or someone odd: "Oh, that's so gay," or "he's so gay."

He found an old sex textbook from my college sexuality class on my shelf in my office and he came to me and said "You're such a sex maniac" and I told him it was a book to inform people about sexuality and he told me "sex is dirty" and I could not convince him that sex was not dirty.

He also plays these video games that are violent and now seems to talk about the resolution of problems in terms of "blowing them away."

Am I doing something wrong? Sometimes it seems that when I try and talk to him it makes it worse (almost like he knows that it bothers me and is trying to provike me). Should I just let it all go at this tender age?

Any parent out there who has dealt with this please let me know. Yes I know that eventually he will grow up to be his own man but.....God I'm nervous.

[ChairmanAgnostic]

1. youth in asia. oops. Sorry: euthanasia

do it before it's too late.

[bigriver]

10. Killing is killing.

Enough with this euthanasia nonesense.

Well, either kill him or buy him a Hello Kittie backpack I guess.

[ChairmanAgnostic]

13. too true. My sarcasm was totally inappropriate, and I apologize.

raising kids is no easy task, and having bad humor instead of good answers tossed in helps not one bit.

[SaveOurDemocracy]

41. I thought it was humorous.

Made ME laugh. :hi: You NEED a sense of humor raising kids ... especially teens.

[bigriver]

46. I thought it was funny, too.

[northofdenali]

82. Beat me to it!

My first thought was "drown him". Having been through the 'teen years with 2 kids, boy and girl, I can promise that it'll get worse before it gets better. :P

Best of luck. Most of the time, the old adage is true - they grow out of it, particularly when set a good example by parents.

[msongs]

2. take some good advice from James Dobson about this nt

[Hav]

3. .

I don't really know. He's only 13 and at that age, he probably hasn't even found himself.
At 13 it might not be the norm but I don't even think it's unusual to think that sex is dirty when you are a kid.
Also concerning the gay thing, it doesn't have to mean that he turns into a homophobe. Maybe it's just what he hears in school. He still has so many years to develop.

Thinking about it, at that age it doesn't have to mean shit ;). On the other side, I also believe that you shouldn't totally ignore it. Maybe just ask why he says something like that?

[tridim]

14. "Sex is dirty"

Kids are told over and over again by adults that sex dirty and can kill you, so I'm not surprised.

It's a big problem IMO, because maturing kids are naturally driven by their sex drive and some unlucky kids are conditioned to believe these thoughts are equivalent to thoughts of murder. Mental problems will certainly follow.

[Bigmack]

43. I hate to get all "Summerhill" in this thread...

but my guess is the kid is masturbating, and that's giving him all kinds of feelings about ...."Am I gay? What the hell am I? I'm dirty. Sex is dirty. What if my parents or friends find out... or worse, talk to me about it."

Add all the shit that goes on in middle school... add societal pressures that are downright weird about sex (religion, movies, music, and vid games), and you have a recipie for a confused kid.

[Sapphocrat]

4. Bet you a dollar...

...he's hanging out with some real assholes for "friends".

Plus, he's 13. I'm not a parent, but isn't that about the age kids will start doing anything to make their parents crazy?

[etherealtruth]

23. Not just anything to make their parents crazy ...

...but anything to differentiate themselves from their parents (I think).

I've got a 13 year old and she really has a progressive view of life (and politics)...but she attends a "Unity" church which is quite different from her agnostic mother and Muslim father.

[IdaBriggs]

36. Actually, "Unity" is probably pretty close to your values.

Different religions as "spokes on a wheel" with God at the center; all religions have some part of the truth of God. Different speakers at a local Unity church have quoted the teachings of Hindu, Moslem, and Wiccan leaders, as well as using the Bible as a source. They believe in "certain universal laws" that kick in (like gravity!) whether you believe them or not, with God wanting for you what you want for you -- if you want to be miserable, God's okay with that, but if you want to live happy, then God's good with that, too. They believe that all things work together for good, even if we don't always understand it initially.

My favorite prayer comes from that church -- the Prayer of Protection:

"The Light of God surrounds you.
The Love of God enfolds you.
The Power of God protects you.
The Presence of God watches over you.
Wherever you are, God Is.
And all is well.
Thank you for this Truth, Lord.
Amen."

Its good to have a spiritual home; congratulations on raising such a wise daughter! :)

[etherealtruth]

65. It is very reflective of my values ...

Her father, however, became a very observant Muslim after we divorced ... He is not pleased that our children have clearly chosen not to actively embrace Islam.

A side note, while living in Virginia my (now 24) year old son was active in a Southern Baptist church.

i encourage my kids to explore any belief systems they can.

[A Simple Game]

74. I like the spokes on a wheel analogy.

Opinion on religion from an agnostic, take it for what it is worth.

[Sapphocrat]

42. So making their parents crazy...

...is just an extra added bonus? ;)

What's a "Unity" church? Is it like, what do they call them... "unifying"? Welcoming and affirming?

[ayeshahaqqiqa]

60. Yes

it's a mystical Christian church, and welcomes all. My husband and I lead the Dances of Universal Peace at one. The banners in the church recognize and celebrate all paths leading to the Source. Senior Sufi teachers have been welcome at Unity churches.

[Sapphocrat]

68. Whew! Good.

I was hoping as much. :)

[etherealtruth]

69. To a 13 year old making your parents crazy is ALWAYS a bonus

I think the others in this thread that have described what the Unity Church is have done a better job than I could have.

My daughter has attended several spiritual retreats with this church ... at these retreats they explored the commonalities of many world religions and some of the mysticism associated with them ... all in a very positive light.

To me this great ... to my daughters father this is a hideous rebellion. This is where the bonus comes in for her;)

[proud2BlibKansan]

5. Sit him down and talk about your values

Tell him you don't think it is okay to call things "gay" when you disagree with them, that calling someone "a woooomen" is inappropriate and sex is only dirty if you are afraid of it (that oughta get his attention - what 13 year old is NOT afraid of sex and how many would admit they ARE afraid?)

If you talk to him calmly, he should listen.

[FlaGranny]

6. He's 13

and that explains everything. Middle school is awful. The only thing you can do is lead by example and let him know how you feel about things, but do not lecture or try to change his mind. A 13-year-old is close to an immovable object. Many of them are so contrary that they want to appear to be your total opposite. If you've raised him right up to this point, he will settle down and become normal. He's probably using those phrases because that's how the other middle school kids talk. I feel sorry for people with kids that age.

Edit: In 2 years my grandson will be 13. I hope he takes after his father at that age. I was lucky with him.

[ginnyinWI]

7. I wouldn't worry about it too much

He's your firstborn, right?

Seems to me he is just trying to differentiate himself from his Dad by a bit of rebellious talk. He's trying out different personnas too, trying to figure out who he is. If you don't react strongly, he'll probably be onto other subjects soon. If you were a real RW dad, he'd probably be talking liberal stuff.
I'd just keep it lowkey and not try to convince him of your point of view. Just resond by correcting any facts he might have wrong, and then give him some space to figure it all out by himself.

He might be copying friends of his and how they talk. If there is a leader who is like that, he'll be trying to act that way, too. They usually come back to their parents' values in the end--if you continue to give love, support, respect, etc.

edit to add: my son also called everything "gay"--it doesn't mean anything more than "that's strange" or "that's weird". My son, now 27, straight and married, grew up to be a nice liberal and tolerant guy. Some of the friends he's had have taught him who he did not what to be.

[LeftishBrit]

8. I'm not a parent, but there are a number of teenagers in my family

And rebellion is the key word! They will do whatever they think their parents disapprove of - so if their parents are liberal, they will show off about how right-wing they can be. To use an irritating cliche, it's probably just a phase.

[pooja]

9. #1. take away those damn video games...

They will ruin your mind.

#2. Take him to a gay and lesbian alliance and let him meet real people that he is vulgarizing (and I don't care how uncomfortable it makes him... some gay/ lesbian people would rather hear a couple of insults from a child rather than feel a beeting later on by a young adult that never learned toleration.

#3. I really cant believe he thinks sex is dirty but having the AIDS agenda stuffed down our throats since we were born pretty much makes 2 types of people. People who abhor having sex thinking its the dirtiest most vile thing, and the People who say F..k it, I might as well die having some fun. Schools do not know how to teach sex-ed. If you are a parent that is open to anything then write a note and keep him out of Sex-Ed 101. Its horrible: sense of perspective from been there done that look back on it with horror now-- Imagine puberty. Uncomfortable, things changing, hormones raging... now put a bunch of people in a class together... boys and girls... who don't really know each other that well... now tell them to practice putting a condom on the fake erect penis (believe me they have it). Can you imagine? I wonder, is every girl thinking that's what to expect in size, shape, color... is every boy thinking, is that normal...do I compare.

I wouldn't worry about the penguin thing. I wouldn't worry about the Indians thing... a wigwam or a teepee is a strange different house. Remember he is still trying to be cool.

He's 13, give him a break... Do you really want him sexualy active or thinking about sex right now? Personaly I would be pushing the 18 and out of the house, no un-wanted extras thing.

[Feron]

73. oh boy..

Video games will not ruin a person's mind. I played violent video games as a teenager and yet I'm non-violent in real life. As long as he isn't spending all his time playing to the detriment of other things and has parents who teach him the difference between fantasy from reality then I wouldn't worry.

People who claim to be fucked up from a video game were fucked up to begin with.

Secondly, while not a nice way to say something sucks, gay is a popular term amongst the younger set. It is differentiated from people who are gay. It's also possible that he uses that term solely to get a rise out of his parent. Frankly I would just explain to him that the term is inappropriate and he is not to say it.

Thirdly when I was 13 I thought sex was icky too. In a few years that will change. Just make sure that he has had sex ed and knows that he has a parent to talk to.

It's no wonder my parents have gray hair from the antics my brother and I used to pull. We loved doing things that would horrify our parents. It makes me so glad that I don't have children. LOL

[pooja]

98. I disagree with the video game scenario.. I think its much better to

be active and do something.. but that's my opinion.

The gay thing is normal, but shouldn't be acceptable. Unless they are walking around happy all the time... its not appropriate..

And the sex thing is a big deal if you aren't so sure with yourself. I never thought much about it because I am such a strong person. We were a very liberal family.... my mother got the anatomy book out at an early age and explained difference between men and women and where babies come from (I swear I was 6, it was about the time my baby-sitter was due with her second daughter). Anyway.. we were naked people, one bathroom free-for all type of family.

On the other hand there are some kids out there that really aren't ready for it all and aren't comfortable sitting around with people they don't know discussing sex.

[Warren DeMontague]

99. Yeah. Take away his video games, drag him against his will to a GLBT alliance to "re-educate" him

but by all means, "give him a break". :eyes:

Like bashing someone in the face with a hammer is the best way to get them to wake up.

[lumberjack_jeff]

11. My two oldest are almost 17 and 14 1/2.

Age thirteen sucks.

Don't sweat it, just survive it. After 16 it gets mildly better.

FWIW, one of the best friends of the 17 year old is gay. He no longer uses "gay" as a perjorative, but he sure did when he was 13.

[boolean]

12. Sex is dirty? And he's 13?!?!

A 13 year old who thinks sex is dirty....I think you might have a late bloomer here. Give him a year or so.

[wellstone dem]

15. Well, it's probably that he is 13 but

my daughter used to come home and use language or take positions that drove me up the wall and over the cliff. Then I realized, she was repeating what she heard in school, and she came home and said it because she wanted to hear the arguments she wanted to say. I realized that the next day, the next time someone use "gay" as a negative term, she was repeating what I had said to her. She wanted to do the right thing, but couldn't figure out how to say it.

She's 18 now and going to school 1200 miles away, and the only other Thanksgiving I felt so sad, when was the year my Grandmother died on Thanksgiving. I wish I could have another gun owners rights argument with her. That one ended with her saying, "So just how did sub-machine guns get into this discussion."

[Flirtus]

64. hey, my 18 year old is just a few miles away and still didn't come home

from college for Thanksgiving. Just when she was getting past the intolerable years. Luckily I've got disabled relatives who always welcome a visit from me! Doesn't mean I'm not sad, but I'm keeping busy. What a terrible day to have 'off' from work, I'd be happy to be there, too.

I agree with most of the above posters, tell your children when they use objectionable language and why you object, and insist on good behavior, otherwise, you just have to let some of them find out for themselves who and what they are. CSN&Y "teach, your children well, their parent's hell..."

[BringEmOn]

16. Someday, he'll get a non-union job...

Hopefully, it'll run it's course after the scapegoat the (Mexicans, Blacks, illegal immigrants, etc.) stage.

[KharmaTrain]

17. Sounds Like Peer Pressure

Sounds like your son may be starting to get a worldview from others...and through trying to gain acceptance from friends, he's exert some "independence". While many of us at 13 said things or thought things that we later look at as being "dumb" and "stupid", it's also an age where minds can be opened and shut.

I started to become a lot more active in son's life when he reached that age...seeing how he was both starting to change, mature and looking at me in a different way than he did when he was younger. We started to do things that we didn't when he was younger...going to museums, plays, movies and other things that would stimulate his curiosity...open up his world to both the good and bad and be ready to discuss when something came to his mind. My big thing was to always listen...hear what he thought and challenge him to think on several levels...the first real steps of becoming a critical thinker. I never said my opinions were right, nor was anyone else...but that he should learn for himself, and if he needed someone to talk to, I'm always here.

My wife, whose studied Child Pyschology, would probably say his language is a sign of rebellion and attempting to assert his own identity...and a major part of this is to be accepted by his peers or by anyone who will listen. I'd keep an eye on his friends and see if you can see where the influences in his life is coming from. He might still think you are treating him like a little child and this may be the door to open his world, and yours, a little wider.

[Ian David]

18. Send him to CampQuest for de-programming

As seen on The Colbert Report
As seen on ABC's Good Morning America
As seen on ABC.com
As seen in the New York Times.
As seen in the Cincinnati Enquirer
As heard on Wisconsin Public Radio
As heard on the Michael Medved radio show

Camp Quest is the first residential summer camp in the history of the United States for the children of Atheists, Freethinkers, Humanists, Brights, or whatever other terms might be applied to those who hold to a naturalistic, not supernatural world view.

Camp Quest was started in 1996 by the Free Inquiry Group, Inc. (FIG) of Cincinnati and Northern Kentucky. It is now operated by Camp Quest, Inc. a non-profit Kentucky Corporation with a board of directors drawn internationally from leaders of various organizations which share the goals of Camp Quest. Camp Quest is its own organization, and while endorsed by several organizations and groups, it is neither owned nor controlled by any group other than Camp Quest, Inc.

The staff of Camp Quest is composed of volunteers. No staff is paid. They get to camp on their own, and are provided with room and board while at camp.

Camp Quest current rents facilities from the most cooperative and helpful YMCA Camp Campbell Gard in Overpeck, Ohio. A long term goal is to acquire land and establish a permanent home for Camp Quest. Contributions are sought and welcomed.

Camp Quest Mission Statement

Camp Quest is a not-for-profit educational organization created in 1996. Its purpose is to provide children of freethinking parents a residential summer camp dedicated to improving the human condition through rational inquiry, critical and creative thinking, scientific method, self-respect, ethics, competency, democracy, free speech, and the separation of religion and government guaranteed by the Constitution of the United States.

More:
http://www.camp-quest.org/?contentPage=info.xhtml

[TahitiNut]

67. Alternatively, I know this seminar personally. It's VERY effective.

http://www.wings-seminars.com/seminars/teen/true_colors.html

[annabanana]

19. He is yanking your chain....

Mine are 17 & 20 and they went through this..He is trying our his peer's phrases and attitudes on you to gauge your reaction. Don't overreact.. let him know with a laugh and a dig in the ribs what YOUR views are on various subjects (and why).

And DON'T take 13 year old boys to movies with cute tap-dancing penguins unless it's HIS idea!

(Also, he may not be evidencing any true homophobic tendencies by using the word "gay" as a general put down. It is probably the vernacular in his school environment. You should probably cue him in on how words hurt, even if he doesn't "mean it that way".)

[Leftisalwaysright]

20. I wouldn't worry about it...

He probably has a couple of friends that are feeding him bad information; I'm sure when he gets older he will begin to listen to and appreciate your views and trust the things you say. Thirteen is a very rebelious age.

[wryter2000]

29. Welcome to DU

:hi:

[angstlessk]

21. At that age you cannot TELL them anything, but showing them a thing

or two gets their own psyches going. Some stranger stopped my son and his friends one day and asked for directions and gave them tickets to a concert for the help. I never saw the tickets and knew my son WANTED to go, so I simply told him what the consequences COULD be..if I just told him he COULD NOT go and got angry he would have slipped out and gone. He never went...I scared the bejusus out of him! Again when he was 17 he told me about going to a party and they served 'everclear'..I simply told him he could drink enough of that stuff and DIE before he actually passed out. Years later he told me I RUINED his partying days...glad I could be of help ruining those parties!

Anyway...I never said you CANNOT DRINK..cause I could not be there, but I did tell him the consequences of anything he attempted. Hope this helps!

[valerief]

22. Remind him often that you'll take good care of him when he

returns from the Republican war with his arms and legs blown off.

[MrSlayer]

24. The only thing I find odd is that he thinks sex is dirty.

13 year old boy who is anti-sex seems very strange. The rest of it is normal. Living in a tepee is kind of weird if you are used to modern housing, "Cute" isn't cool when you're a teenager, saying things are "gay" is just another way to say they suck or are weak, it's a common expression and wanting to blow away your problems is also common in an immature, masculine mind. Video games aren't a problem, I'm sure he's able to distinguish between the real and the game. Rebelling against your parents is very common, expect a lot more of it. You might want to try a bit of reverse psychology on him, see how that goes.

[0rganism]

30. that's one of the things I'd say is normal, given the society we inhabit

My guess is the boy has discovered masturbation, and the consequent taboo-induced guilt and shame with which our culture collectively saddles early pubescents.

He calls his dad a "sex maniac" because he thinks of himself as a sex maniac.

It's projection, it's unhealthy, but it will pass.

[MrSlayer]

53. I don't know where these guys are from.

So I can't say if that's the case or not. But even when I was a kid masturbation was considered normal, I would think that today it's even more widely accepted, particularly among the younger crowd who are doing more sexually. I certainly never thought sex was dirty or wrong but I can see where an overly religious upbringing could inspire such thoughts. I wonder if that has anything to do with it.

[madmusic]

77. If the kid watches O'Liely and gets the mixed messages...

Between showing the images (for the ratings) and the simultaneous condemnation, that would do it. O'Liely is only the most obvious example though.

[MrSlayer]

83. I hope that's not the case.

Watching that crap is far more harmful to a young mind than playing Grand Theft Auto.

[roody]

111. O'Really shows masturbation and discusses it???!!!

Sorry, I don't have cable. I thought he stuck to hating democrats.

[benEzra]

85. That might just be the "cover story"...

the "sex is dirty" tack might be an act to cover up his feelings of awkwardness about the topic.

[NoBushSpokenHere]

25. LOL I have been threatening to duct tape my sons mouth

It is the age and the age of the other idiots he is going to school with. It is South Park and Family Guy and being an age where nothing seems to fit. The good kids, bad kids and mediocre kids are all attractive to them as friends. They honestly do not know who they are yet and are trying to find themselves. Ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh but if I hear "that is gay" one more time I am going to scream. Actually, I have already. I have lectured him AND HIS FRIENDS and talked until I am blue in the face (actually I already was blue). :)

It hasn't done any good. When he is on my ninth nerve with this I just remember, he is just a blink of an eye away from being older, wiser and more Democratic :)

In regard to the sex is dirty thing - my son didn't ever hit that stage - bypassed it, I guess, and almost everything you say or he hears he can put a sexual spin on. Scary, really, but, I believe it is normal for the age.

[Vinca]

26. At the risk of sounding like Tipper Gore, who I scorned

mercilessly about the rock lyric thing, I'm worried that kids who repeatedly play violent video games will become so accustomed to seeing heads blown up, etc., they won't react appropriately when bad things happen in real life. I'm probably just being an old fogey. I'm also bothered by the depiction of young women as "hos" in music videos and the repeated use of the "n" word in rap music.

[NoBushSpokenHere]

39. Reply to #26 Understand your concern and had a bit of the same myself

but my son was in a tragic situation a while back and his reactions were the same as anyone could expect from any child. The rap music he used to listen to and the video games he has played didn't change the fact that it was a scary situation and he was able to separate fiction from reality. Some of the lyrics I hear coming from his speakers - "I killed a baby today, I raped your mother today" etc. I have been concerned but strongly believe he has learned right from wrong long ago and when the chips are down, will do the right thing. I am sure there will be a day to come where he sees the light of his current horrid habits.

[wryter2000]

27. I don't have kids

So, of course, that makes me an expert. :evilgrin:

I think what I'd do first is ask him where he got the idea that gayness is bad or sex is dirty. That might help you know how to proceed.

[acmavm]

28. No, it has nothing to do with politics and everything to do with

how old he is.

Mine is 14. Hates bush** and everything he stands for. But lately he's still unbearable. Smart mouth, self-pitying, and knows EVERYTHING. He's the final judge of right and wrong, cool (or sick as he calls it) and uncool (I don't know the term for that, maybe healthy or something like that).

I had four girls, and I knew they were moody little wretches. So was I. But this boy, I'm seriously thinking about reserving a room at Boys Town if he doesn't get off my ass.

Has your's started the skipping school thing yet? Or the being mouthy to his teachers? If now, either count yourself lucky or brace yourself. Mine just did both recently.

Good luck.

[NJ Democrats]

31. Not a big deal

I've said many of these things too (I'm 15). And I'm still a Liberal Dem. Don't worry about it, its just typical male teen stuff.

[timtom]

32. He's not turning into a republican

My kids used that phrase ("....so gay...") at about that age and now they are firmly in the Democratic camp.

Fear not, my child.

[Opusnone]

33. Having once been a 13-year-old boy I speak from experience

He's not turning republic, he's turning into a man.

His hormones are starting to rage, his pubes are growing, everything is "gay" or "sucks", he's simply going through puberty and becoming a man.

My advice is to teach him right from wrong, live by the Golden Rule, and show how it's always better to give than receive; let him mature naturally.

He won't develop a party affiliation until college, and then he'll probably change his mind when he sees the world for what it really is.

[QMPMom]

86. Oh yes. Everything "sucked" to our DS for a while. It got so bad that

his sister started calling him "Sucks" as his *name*. The first time she did that DH and I had to leave the room so they wouldn't see us laughing ourselves sick.

Sorry to say, but your DS is only 13. It *will* get worse. He'll start to turn human again around 17 or so but the transformation is slow.

Best of luck.

[0rganism]

34. The difference: true Republicans don't grow out of it

That kind of self-hating xenophobic nuttiness is standard in pubescents -- unhealthy, but normal, given the social pressures we live with. Just make sure he has enough hobbies and physical activity to keep him distracted through the "snotty years", and he'll come out of the phase okay. (note -- video games do not count as either hobbies or physical activity, unless he's programming them himself)

If your son still thinks that way in 10 years, you'll have my sympathies. I think it's a big part of the Republican psyche, they never "graduate" from puberty, never come to terms with their own desires, and never develop the sense of personal responsibility that comes with doing so.

[krispos42]

35. Try taking him shooting to deal with the violence problem

You probably know somebody that can load you a bolt-action deer rifle for an afternoon. Try to get a .30-'06 if you can; it's the same cartridge fired by the Garand. I mention this because the Garand rifle figures prominately in all of the popular World War Two shooters like Medal of Honor and Call to Duty. Take him out to the range and let him fire off a box or two of some cheapie ammo. The real kick of a rifle in the shoulder should make him realize just how serious this stuff is.

The first time I fired a high-powered rifle I was about 25, and the kick really brought into perspective what real-life gun shooting is. It's not Rambo. It's deadly serious stuff that take discipline and skill to use, and the recoil of a rifle hammers that home (literally and figuratively) every shot.

<on edit> After 20 or 40 rounds of ammo, he'll have a nice sore shoulder the next day or two, as well. Constant reminder!

[Union Thug]

49. What an interesting point. I'll have to think about this one..

I'm a gun owner, and don't have any hang-ups with teaching my kids to shoot. But I've never thought about it in terms of demonstrating the difference between a game and the real deal. Funny thing, though I'm a gun owner, I do not let my kids have toy guns, nor do we purchase any shooters for vid gaming.

[krispos42]

57. Thank you. A few more thoughts

I would only let my kids play the "good" first-person-shooters. I base this on my own modest game-playing experience. I asked for and got Grand Theft Auto: San Andreas for Christmas a couple of years ago and wound up giving it to my younger brother. Not because it wasn't a really cool game (it was), but because I was simply uncomfortable playing the role of a criminal!

So now I stick to the World War Two shooters. I play only occassionally, but I'm looking forward to Call to Duty 3 this Christmas. I just feel better 'fighting' WW2, which really was the last armed struggle for our existence, the last "good war". It is to my mind justified war, and as such is something that does not bother me. But GTA:SA did, simply because the relentless organized crime, thirst for power, relentless drive for 'respect', and random violence turned me off.

So this follows from that.

Like you, I doubt I will by my son any toy gun except a brightly-colored squirt gun or maybe laser tag when he's a kid. I don't have any problem at all with teaching shooting, but I don't want any real-looking cap guns around. I'll just take him shooting when he gets older.

[ComerPerro]

37. well, he's not going through an easy time, you were 13 once. Try to remember

how important gender roles were, and what an important role they play in the self-image of kids entering puberty.

Basically what I am saying is: He's not a Repuke, hes just maturing.

I have always thought that the immature views of Republican men were pretty similar to those of most 12 and 13 year old boys. So the Repigs just never matured or grew up or learned anything...

[Cleita]

38. Send him to right wing rehab. Just kidding! Or, investigate whom he is getting

these ideas from. His peer group? Or his school? You can try to baffle him with facts and logic everytime he says something like that so that can debate this with whomever is giving him ideas.

[SaveOurDemocracy]

40. At 13 he's supposed to be a doofus ...

... it's in the job description.

As the mom of 2 teen boys (15 and 17) my advice is ... don't panic, and don't overreact. Have confidence that the values you've instilled all these years will hold fast; and he will pass through this phase, just like all the others. My sons are well aware that I don't approve of terms that disparage whole groups of people ... so they know it won't pass without a response from me, even if just a 'look'.


I think the best way to discourage it, is to 'explore' what they mean when they say these things:

"What was that you said?"

"Why do you say that?"

"What does that mean?"

"Do you think that's true?"

"Do they ALL do that?"

"How can 'this' mean 'that'?"

"Do you really think that's fair?"

etc ... keep it up until the eye-rolling and frustration level approach critical mass. Then shrug and say, "Well, it makes no sense to me."


Might make them think ... but, at worst, they'll stop using controversial language around you for fear of being boreassed. :rofl: :rofl:

[elehhhhna]

44. He's 13. Take the violent video games away NOW. Get him a pet and make him

take care of it if he doesn't have one already. Leave that sex book in his room--he'll read it when you're not looking...

And no, he's not turning into a reep -- he's just trying out the 13 y/o boy act. The trick is to get him PAST it -- the men who never get past it DO become Reeps.

Get him out alone w/ you more, too. Helps immensely.

Good luck, D'wayne

[Union Thug]

51. getting pets was one of the best things we did for our boys..

They are the only thing that brings out the tenderness in a kid who is invested in being cool and tough.

[elehhhhna]

113. Who else can a big tough tweener hold onto when he needs a good cry?

Dogs never tell.

[Hippo_Tron]

52. He's going to be exposed to the violent video games no matter what

13 is old enough to have a long discussion about the difference between fantasy and reality

[elehhhhna]

112. He's going to also be exposed to drugs, weapons, and porn,

eventually, no matter what.

That doesn't mean Dad should let son just have at it at the tender age of thirteen.

Thirteen is VERY tender, btw. I know it..I have one and know many. They're gorgeous, hormone-addled, gawky, half-crazed babies.

[Union Thug]

45. Sounds like typical 13 year old boy speak to me.

Having been through the process of raising children and working with kids in a previous life, this stuff sounds like typical schoolyard chatter to me.

[porphyrian]

47. You have a 13 year old child. - n/t

[LWolf]

48. Why does he have violent video games,

and where are the "republican" influences?

I would recommend:

Less time in front of screens. Filtered, supervised internet access. More time with good books, liberal/progressive community gatherings/projects, and other things that broaden perspective.

[BlueCaliDem]

50. I'm a mother of two sons, and a 15-going-on-25 daughter...

...and I don't think you have anything to worry about.

My eldest is mentally challenged, so he's been pretty much rebellious all throughout his life.

My second child, a son, has been through this 13 year old rage too, so I know where you're coming from.

My 15-going-on-25 daughter uses the same reply at something odd: "Oh that's gay!"

How did, and do I deal with this clear rebellion of my parental authority?

Answer: FIRMLY and RESOLUTE.

Fact of the matter is, this is a difficult age for your son, as you should remember. The main thing to remember is to be consistent and firm when correcting him. This is also the age when children in urban and suburban areas think about "cliques" and "gangs" to join where authoritarian behavior is prevalent.

What they seek is a strong leader, and it's YOUR job to be that leader.

This is a time when parents shouldn't be "wusses". Believe me, your strength as a leader will be tested for years to come now, but you have to stand strong, and be the leader your son wants you to be, because now, he's testing you where you've "drawn the line" and although your first reaction is to be your son's "best friend", it's your leadership he's seeking now, and when he finds it in you, you will have the best friend you want.

My daughter is a smart cookie, and if you think boys are hard to deal with in puberty, you ain't seen the horrors of a strong-minded girl at that same age!

Yet, although we debate to the point of argument (she thinks being nominated TWICE as Renaissance Student--achieved through a constant 3.5 or above GPA) she sometimes believes herself to be smarter than her mother. NOT. As a liberal, but also an authoritarian, I allow her to spew her angry points while I firmly hold to my view of gays, lesbians, pre-marital sex, the contraceptive pill, partying, cursing, etc.

Last year, when she was 14 1/2, she debated a 16 year old boy on the Death Penalty. As a liberal, she was against it; as a Republic, he was for it. In class, she came with her bullet points, and carefully researched information garnered from State and Federal government websites, also from anti-death penalty websites, and crushed the unprepared student as she carefully refuted his arguments point-by-point.

She won by ONE vote in a predominantly pro-death penalty, Republic class.

She used my tactic of correcting her opponent with facts, and stood firm on her stance backed by these facts (death penalty is more expensive than life in prison; death penalty re-instated by California to deter crime--which failed according to stats; death penalty morally wrong because it glorifies revenge, rather than punishment; death penalty does not bring closure to survivors etc.). When he used the ol' "if any of your family members were murdered, you'd think different" argument, she calmly told him "no, because she'd rather have the ass rot in prison for the rest of his miserable days while constantly being on the look-out for not being the next one shanked".

The point I'm trying to make is, you need to take a leadership role with your rebellious son. Like I explained to your earlier in this long post, he's seeking leadership in you, NOT a "best friend". If you understand this, and allow him to spew his anger while correcting him with facts (how can you disparage gays when your uncle's one and you love him!--which I used to open my children's minds to see the wrong stance they held since they love their Uncle Fred) you'll open up dialogue, allow his POV, and show him respect while maintaining the leadership role.

Although it may not seem like he hears you, he really does, and by taking a leadership role in your son's life, all the life's lessons you teach him in theory, he'll see as worthy since, well, you ARE, after all, his leader.

Just the other day, I was surprised to hear my daughter tell me, that she admires me! She told me, that she admires and respects me because I'm not bigoted; not racist; not judgmental; not weak. That's the word there: weak

Leaders aren't weak even when they admit they're wrong. That's the key.

Ask yourself why Schwarzenegger is so popular among young boys as they know him through his films. That alone should help a great deal as you deal with your son's clear testing of your capabilities as being his nomination to be his leader and mentor.

You are being interviewed by your son as to why he would listen to what you have to say. It's your job to show him why.

Good luck!

[originalpckelly]

54. Ask him who told him that crap, the next time he talks about it that way.

It may be a teacher stepping out of line, or another student at his school.

[NNN0LHI]

55. Quick put the little darling in a barrel with a small hole for feeding

When he hits 18 years old plug the hole up.

Don

[ThomWV]

56. Tell Him To Get A Job Like A Good Republican And Pay His Own Way

Rent, food, clothing, utilities, taxes, transportation, ....

After he gets used to the economic impact of his republican ways you can get started on the social issues.

[angry_chuck]

61. repugs like chimpy

have lower income wage slaves subsidize their lavish expenses through corporate compensation. Stop subsidizing wealthy individuals! Protect yourself from wealthy, donor class tax predation! Carpe Diem!

[angry_chuck]

58. just remember the words of the chimp

"In my line of work you have to repeat yourself a lot, kind of catapult the propaganda." Remember what your 13 yo is up against, the confusion of the MSM, Faux News and RoveBush. If you constantly denounce biggotry and violence as irresponsible and ignorant (repeat it a lot) like Bush pounded the cut n run crap, he (your son) will use those reasons to refute the little freepers at school (teachers too). The tenets of fundamentalism are so unAmerican that no reasonable person would believe that crap unless they were brainwashed. Skepticism provides a mechanism to resistance. Question everything. "The unexamined Life is not worth living."

[Neecy]

59. part of it's a phase...

The "that's so gay" thing seems to be a popular expression these days amongst his age group. It's a shame that the right-wing Christians have opened the door to this kind of slur being used regularly by children.

As for your worry that he'll grow up Republican...I met someone at a MoveOn event not long ago and her son just registered to vote for the first time and he registered as a Republican. I asked if this horrified her and she laughed and said, "No, it just shows that I raised him to think for himself." See, there's a silver lining everywhere.

[dorkulon]

62. When I was 13, I called things "gay,"

--and I played video games, and was scared about sex. Your kid is normal--it takes a while to develop a sophistacated worldview. But that doesn't mean you shouldn't tell him when he's wrong, and why. That's an essential part of any kid's education.

[flying_monkeys]

63. Sounds like normal 13 year old boy to me....

I have one, too. Scary critters, aren't they? I hate that "its so gay" line and point it out every time my kid says it. I also pounce on all the "thats retarded" and "you retard" speak, too...


Its the age. Don't panic yet - - I hear 14 is a *real* scary time LOLOLOL

[iconoclastic cat]

66. DB, you're a great guy, but I call bullshit on your post. ;) nt

[noamnety]

70. Two recommendations

1. Spend Christmas break doing volunteer work along the gulf coast with him. Let him get to a place where social justice is a priority for him. Lecturing won't do it.

2. Ask your library to get a copy of this movie through their loan system (for you, not him): http://www.mediaed.org/videos/MediaGenderAndDiversity/GameOver

[Generic Other]

71. Sounds like typical teenager

Rebellion. What bugs mom and dad the most. Since you are liberals, I suspect also tolerant, your son has to choose rightwingish type rebellion to get a response out of you.

I sympathize. Make him volunteer to work in a soup kitchen.

[Raster]

72. Drive a stake through his black little heart before he infects the rest of the family.

[Nay]

75. To comfort you--my son, who is now 24, uses that expression "gay"

to mean "lame"; he plays violent video games; he thought sex was disgusting when he was 13; and he is a basically a democratic socialist who can't stand Bush or anyone like him. So, I'm not so sure you should be so worried.

He is trying to get your goat, that's for sure, and he may have overheard some ditto pinheads at school and is trying their crap out on you. I wouldn't overreact, but, for example, when he made the comment about the penguins, I would have said something like this: "Yes! That's exactly right! All men and all women have both male and female traits, I think those penguins are cute, and your mom likes to do carpentry, and that helps make everyone a well-rounded individual." And leave it at that.

[aikoaiko]

76. Ya gotta be green

Seriously, its probably a phase. Don't overreact and let him figure things out.

[neebob]

78. I think they pick it up from other boys

and it must be a natural part of the transition to manhood. I'm constantly modulating racist, homophobic, and other wingnutty-sounding stuff that comes out of my 17-year-old son's mouth. It often feels like teasing, like he doesn't really believe it but says it to get a rise out of me and is just asserting himself. In that case I tease him back, tell him he sounds like a Bubba and I'm embarrassed and he must not be related to me.

We have a little different dynamic than you may have with your son, because I'm the mom and he's an only child and his dad lives in another state. It's always been just the two of us, and I've treated him like more of an equal than a lot of parents do. I needed him to be self-managing, and my life just didn't work if we were always struggling. So he's pretty autonomous and now, more like the man of the house. I assume his dad would and does get a double dose.

Which is not to say the disturbing attitudes aren't rampant in the schools and there isn't some very real peer pressure behind it. I'm confident, though, that what I've taught him will prevail.

[Mayberry Machiavelli]

79. This just sounds like normal male adolescent crap to me.

[fujiyama]

80. LOL

I'm a bit surprised about his comments about sex though.

I thought 13 year olds are supposed to hide Playboys from their parents?

Anyways, I wouldn't worry too much. In time he'll learn and grow mature...as for his politics, he'll find his own way.

[BlooInBloo]

90. lol! Um, the kid saying that is PART of the hiding.

EDIT: Or else he's gay - and going thru some kind of hide-what-other-kids-don't-like-by-being-anti-the-whole-shebang thing.

[retread]

81. Get ready for a rough ride. Living with a teenager is not easy. A good sense

of humor and a loving partner helps.

[Vidar]

84. Respond with humor when possible.

[Bucky]

87. My daughter, who is gay, uses that phrase "that is so gay" too. Here's how you outsmart the kid...

1. Hit 'im with honesty. Kids hate that shit and it totally works. Tell your kid, "Look, we don't talk like that in this house. You learn to show respect for others." He'll play it off; he'll make like it's no big deal to say "that's so gay", either dismissively ("Dad, it's just an expression, it doesn't mean anything, gahh!") or sarcastically ("But Dad, 'gay' just means happy; there's nothing wrong with being happy, gahh!"). But the truth is that your values do get passed down onto your kids, even when they're playing it off or exercising their rebel against the 'rents mentality.

2. Undercut the issue. Say "Son, you sure are talking about "gay" a lot lately. Are you starting to have some insecurities I need to know about? Because you know I'll love you know matter what." As a veteran teacher I can tell you young teenage boys totally hate that shit, too. It also plants the seed in his mind that people who run down gays a lot tend to be the most insecure about themselves. He may mimic is homophobic friends around you; but 90% of teenagers also end up mimicking their parent's values when they're around their friends. What the "are you insecure about that?" trick does is give him a tool to one-up his friends when he's around them.

3. The sneakiest trick of all is to treat him with respect. This totally undermines a kid's rebelliousness. He obviously feels safe enough around you to sound out how you deal with being confronted with many of the negative messages society puts out about foreign cultures, men being sensitive, and the acceptability of being gay. But you can outsmart him by consistantly confronting intolerance with tolerance and prejudice with love. That's how you can, well, totally blow them away."

[bridgit]

88. here, show him this...

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=385x6373 maybe it will solidify his lack of conscience :shrug: maybe better to get straight to it

[BlooInBloo]

89. 13 yo boys are mean & stupid - hard to tell the difference between that &....

... being a republican...

Changing his environment - i.e. the jackasses he hangs out with & is trying his damnedest to emulate - seems like a good bet to me.

[SaveOurDemocracy]

93. What do you suggest ... lock him in his room?

Have you raised a teenager? Do you remember being a teen?


It's all about self-discovery and seperation. The days of protecting them, and picking their friends, have passed. This is just the noisy flutter of his wings being stretched and tested.

[BlooInBloo]

94. (shrug) Ok - good to have the laissez faire solution on board I guess.

[SaveOurDemocracy]

95. Answer the question then ...

You made a suggestion. How would you go about implementing it?

[BlooInBloo]

96. I don't know - it depends heavily on the details of the OPs circumstances....

... which I'm not privy to.

Just curious though: what do you imagine the fact that I only have the skeleton of a suggestion to offer proves, exactly? Is no suggestion worthwhile unless it's accompanied by a step-by-step foolproof manual? lol - what an absurdly high bar that would be.

[shanti]

91. is this your first son/child?

i have four sons, 3 are grown, and my youngest is 16. sounds pretty normal to me. most teens will go for the "shock value", to get your reaction. don't freak out - just keep your ears open. remember, this too shall pass...

good luck!

[brettdale]

92. Hes only 13

Wait two years, (Im sure he wont think sex is dirty by then) Tell him Democrats have more sex than republicans, then I bet he wontr become a freeper.

[Zorra]

97. Get a DVD of "Schindler's List" and watch it with him.

Then see if you can get him to discuss the film with you.

[Warren DeMontague]

100. I wouldn't worry to much. I used to like army toys and I was a pretty typical homophobe in my early

teens.

And shit, I *still* play video games.

But I grew up into a pacifist hippie liberal Democrat who is passionately committed to the concept of equal rights for my fellow GLBT citizens. I wouldn't sweat it. Railing against it at this point gives it the lure of the "forbidden".

[Warren DeMontague]

101. I don't think that "sex is dirty" thing will last, either.

And once he figures out that the right wingers are raving anti-sex zealots, he'll probably get off the boat. That's where they lose a lot of people.

[Swamp Rat]

102. Have him watch this:

:D Humor sometimes can be the best medicine. ;)

"Become a Republican:"

http://www.thefrown.com/player.php?/frowners/becomerepublican

[upi402]

103. He sounds normal

And you sound like a very good dad. We're getting old I think, dad.
The vid games are violent but they are less so if the creatures are not humanoid. Halo. There is puzzle solving and hand-eye coordination involved. Not to mention the interface aspect. Some are violent garbage, true.

I bet your college sexuality books have a whole chapter on how young men get nervous about male femininity. Some men never grow past that stage. I bet his awareness will go way beyond that by the time his teen years are over.

He's testing his wings as per typical, enjoy his first awkward flights:D

[uppityperson]

104. Teenage yrs, when you act oddly and are treated oddly. Good luck

I would never ever be a teenager again. Usually they turn out ok. Oh yes, kids spend the first 10 yrs finding your buttons, the next pushing them.

Everything has the same emotional weight-major. No one understands. Trying to discover their sexual identity is difficult because sex is emotional and weird and changing from a child to a sexual being is just difficult.

My main goal was keeping communication channels open so at some point UPJr could come talk if wanted too, and letting jr know that certain words and phrases, while initially may sound funny, can hurt. Good luck.

[AZBlue]

105. He's 13 not 33. Take charge! Get off DU and do some parenting.

Talk to him about inappropriate language (calling someone gay or a woman, as if that's a bad thing). Take away the violent video games. Talk to him about sexuality. And remember that he's 13.

[flying_monkeys]

106. I don't think it is fair to suggest OP is on DU so much

that they aren't effectively parenting....


13 year old kids don't need the Constant Supervision a 5 year old needs - - so there is some 'down time' to the parenting gig when the kid is with friends or asleep, kwim? I mean, 13 year olds need guidance but not an ever-hovering nanny....


To suggest that the OP is on DU rather than effectively parenting their child is a bit of a rush to judgment, IMO...


FTR, my 13 year old is asleep so I am not needed to effectively PARENT right now and I can post at will LOL

[opihimoimoi]

107. Too little too late....his mind is gone...his out look negative...the polarity will never change

[Redneck Socialist]

108. At 13 I wouldn't sweat it.

I was pretty much a puke with libertarian leanings all the way through high school. I didn't wake up until college.

He'll get over it.

[roody]

109. I don't have kids, but I remember being 13.

One day I woke up and could no longer stand my dear, loving parents. At 13, I think a kid's job is to be as unlike his or her parents as possible.

[Eric J in MN]

110. Everything you described is normal

...for a boy that age. Don't worry about it.

If he says he's voting Republican when he's 18, then you can worry.