I really believe the conservative movement is crumbling.

[cali]

I think it's in worse shape than the liberal movement ever was. I think if the dems do a even a fair job in the 110th, we'll increase our majorities in 2008, and we'll win the Presidency- not to mention that our bench of potential nominees is far deeper than theirs.

Conservatism is about holding back the future, and turning back progress. It just doesn't work in the long term.

To paraphrase Cheney; It's in its death throes. Or at least it is until it finds its way back to small government and reasonable social issues stances.

[bluestateguy]

1. I think we need to wait and see on that

I definitely think that neo-conservatism suffered a big blow this month, but traditional conservatism may still have some potency. To be able to say that the 2006 election is more than a one year aberration, I think that there will have to be some sort of confirmation from the 2008 elections.

One thing that I actually kind of admire about the Right is that when they lose they go right back to fighting for what they believe in. They don't whine about moving to Canada, they just get up, dust off their uniforms, figure out what they did wrong, and go back to fighting again.

[Warpy]

2. Part of the reason it's crumbling is that "small government" thing

People saw in the Katrina aftermath exactly why BIG government might be a good thing. Starved social service agencies weren't up to the job and a militarized version of FEMA only got in the way as it maximized waste and misery.

People who thought only those OTHER folks needed meddlesome behavior laws are now finding themselves oppressed by the big nanny in the sky and they're starting to resent it. People who put their faith in the basic honesty of corporations in delivering a safe product and the power of the marketplace to punish them if they didn't are now reconsidering in the wake of drug scandals that have left people dead. It's hard to punish a corporation, it has no ass to kick or to jail.

It seems big government is most useful when it stands with the people against the powerful, as in the case of regulatory agencies. It is most useless when it stands with the powerful against the people, as in nanny state laws.

THAT is why conservatism is crumbling. It promised greater freedom and delivered only greater restriction, misery and death.

[Iris]

5. I agree. But I think cali is also right - conservatism is about holding back progress

and that can only hold for so long, especially in today's global environment.

[jwirr]

15. Great analysis.

[NewJeffCT]

3. They do have the media on their side, however

That's something we've never had.

Conservatism was nearly finished by the Great Depression and their subsequent sucking up to Hitler & Mussolini in the 30s & early 40s. When Eisenhower ran for president in the 50s, he made it a point to espouse liberal values, affirm his support for social security, warned against the military-industrial complex, etc.

However, conservatives have really effectively used the "Stabbed in the Back" methodology that Hitler used so effectively in the 30s. They last 35 or so years, they have really consolidated their power - creating a powerful right-wing news media and effectively dragging the MSM to the right, through infiltration, corporate consolidation and canny marketing (Trickle Down economics becomes "Supply Side" economics becomes Compassionate Conservatism)

What the RW also has is radicals/reactionaries with a voice like Rush Limbaugh, Ann Coulter, Michelle Malkin, Glen Beck, etc. They effectively function to make a conservative Republican politician seem more mainstream - "oh, that John Cornyn is conservative, but at least he's not as bad as that Coulter woman." In the 60s and earlier, a lot of those radical groups were on the left - the SDS, Black Panthers, etc. Back then, those groups had a voice, and a Democratic that was a bit to the right of them was the one appearing more mainstream...

Maybe the "blogosphere" will be the new version of a leftist movement that will make Dem pols seem more mainstream, but it remains to be seen.

[warrens]

4. Don't count on it

They're masters at appealing to people's lesser natures. They'll find something that works, and be back spewing hate and division before you know it.

[Kerrytravelers]

6. We can't get some people to vote against schwarzenidiot in California...

... I just see California turning red... or just redder. And that is 54 electoral votes, my friends.

[cali]

8. But as I understand it, except for

Ahhnold, CA became even bluer. It's like my state of Vermont. We overwhelmingly voted for Bernie but re-elected or pub guv. Maybe I'm wrong but I haven't seen any serious analysis of CA politics that posits that its turning redder.

[Kerrytravelers]

9. I find myself on the ground in CA often during elections.

Although many seats went to Democrats, this was also part of a nation-wide sweep. However, the enthusiasm for arnold and the general acceptance of anti-immigrant and anti-choice opinions we hear in addition to the passage of our Prop 83 and the closeness of the parental-notification and the large amount of red areas is making many of us a bit nervous.

Honestly, if the CA Dem Party would step it up and show a little strength, we could take back the governorship and be a moving force rather than a sleeping giant.

[Sapere aude]

7. If you look at the last 6 years, conservatism never existed.

The government was increased and became more intrusive during the last six years. Taxes as a part of income grew for the middle class. Spending and deficits grew to historic proportions. Where was the conservatism? I didn't see any of it.

[peacetalksforall]

10. We can't make the mistake that this is just a PNAC fall/failure.

The people that we are talking about have been working hard for 100 years in waves and groups. The barons found that war and earth resources were good and people were only to be used. Then we got taken by run away secrecy in government. The current operatives have been with us since the JFK assassination. They have figured out that organizing and grooming and taking over our infrastructure was a sound way to go. They figured out who their voting bases needed to be and went after them. This is a well oiled, greased, and slippery orchestrated move against common citizens in our country that affects and murders many people all over the world. An OK was given to PNAC to try their plan. Only the PNAC people are falling. And only the leaders.

Did anyone think Poindexter, Eliot, Goss, Cuban CIA terrorists would retire after successful and unsuccessful former plans against the people?

The big money is with these people.

The big money barons are not going to jail or in to retirement. We don't even know what most of them look like.

Also, will stockholders of the partner corporations revolt against PNAC/baron policies and demand less killing, less theft?

Who/Which will win - their original agenda to own and control us or will we get a true democracy that allows other countires to own their own country? True free trade or ongoing imperialism? And which Dems can we rely on throughout the repair work that needs to be done?

There is a rock there - a very solid rock that we can't see it in its entirety, but it's alway in the way of idealistic democracy.

[tabasco]

11. The conservative movement agrees.

Demographics spell the doom of the stupid-angry-gullible-racist-white-man-party.

That is why they are a particularly dangerous animal right now.

Yes, I am a white man, so trolls, spare me the reverse racism crap.

[Jack Rabbit]

12. The problem, old friend, is that the "conservative" movement isn't

It's in its death throes. Or at least it is until it finds its way back to small government and reasonable social issues stances.

Bush is definitely not about small government, personal liberties or fiscal responsibility. Since Reagan, the first anti-conservative conservative, the Democrats have become the party of fiscal responsibility -- almost by default. The only thing left of the old conservative platform is low taxes.

The Republicans, once upon a time when they really were a conservative party, were not only for low taxes but all the corollaries that went with it: reduced spending and (guess what?) smaller government. And, of course, the conservatives argued that smaller government does not have the ability to violate personal liberties by rummaging through a citizen's phone records or finding out what he is reading at the public library.

Today's conservative still keeps taxes low so there's no money for big government, but that didn't keep Bush from constructing a gargantuan police state that checks phone and library records and claims the right to declare anybody it deems dangerous an enemy combatant and imprison and even torture such a person indefinitely without charges.

That's not conservatism. That's fascism.

[cali]

13. You're absolutely right

What I should have said was that the fascist appropriation of Conservatism is crumbling.

[Strelnikov_]

14. "The People Who Cast The Votes Decide Nothing. . . .

The people who count the votes decide everything."

- (Uncle Joe) Stalin

Ignoring the implications of the above statement, I agree. Things have not even started to unravel. The only question is if the Reich can keep their fingers in the dike until after '08.