A question for some Democrats.

[Dhalgren]

Many DUers have put the challenge to Freepers and Bushniks (and rightfully so), that if they support Mr. Bush's war in Iraq why don't they "put their asses where their mouth is?" If they support the war why don't they join the Army or support a draft?

I would like to ask all those Democrats who support one or another possible Democratic Presidential candidate who advocates for a sustained presence in Iraq (for the development of one or another plan for ending the war), and do not think that the troops should be withdrawn immediately, I would ask a similar question.

If the candidate you support has a plan that involves the sustaining, for any length of time, the US troop levels in Iraq, and your candidate is elected, would you be willing to join the Army and go to Iraq to support the new President's plan? Would you support a draft to make the new President's plan effective? And if you say "no" to these questions, how is that different from the "chickenhawks"? How is that not asking the poor and underprivileged to do the fighting for their "betters"?

[LSK]

1. I didnt know many DUers support those types of candidates

Has DU changed that much in the past few months???

Is this the same place that was in sheer joy when Lamont won the primary??

:shrug:

[Dhalgren]

3. Almost all of the Democratic "contenders" ( whatever that means this early) in the

have some variation of "we can't just pull out" "plan" for Iraq. On another thread there was a great deal of debate about "pulling out" not being the thing the US should do. It just struck me that if anyone for any reason thinks that US troops should stay for any amount of time, then the OP question is valid. If you think it is a good idea, would you support it with your body?

[Erika]

4. Then why did you mention economics?

Just trying to understand.

[LSK]

6. you mean the comment in the OP about the poor fighting the war?

Because a lot of the National Guard soldiers sign up to help pay for college. Cindy Sheehans son included.

Also remember in F9/11 the scenes about recruiters targeting poor areas.

[Dhalgren]

8. Because the current military is made up in its majority by the poor

and underprivileged. By men and women who have few opportunities and so the military is a type of "last hope". That is what economics has to do with it.

[Erika]

13. Can you provide stats?

Thanks.

[Dhalgren]

15. The stats are widely available both here on DU and elsewhere on line.

[Erika]

18. So post them n/t

[Erika]

2. If a war was unnecessary and unjust

why should anyone continue it, regardless of economic income?

Maybe I don't understand your question.

[Dhalgren]

5. If you listen to any of the major Democratic "contenders" for

President almost all that I have heard discuss this says that an immediate withdrawal would be "bad" in some way or another. Clinton, Biden, Clark, Obama have all said something similar to this. So if you are in agreement with a plan put forward by a candidate and that candidate wins, would you put your body behind your support for this New President's plan?

[Erika]

10. No. But my Marine nephew would.

They've become a brotherhood over there.

[Jed Dilligan]

7. I hear you.

If the Democrat in 2008 wants to keep us in Iraq for any length of time after 1/20/09, I will not vote.

However, I don't buy the "economic draft." Having been poor, I am offended by liberal arguments that the poor have no choices or no minds to make their own choices. Of course, many of these same people who say "economic draft" are condemnatory of gang members and drug dealers, equally subjects of an economic draft. Being poor is a bunch of shitty options, the military being just one of them. Claiming these poor, poor soldiers had no choice whatsoever, though well-meaning, is rather disrespectful if you look at it from their standpoint.

[LSK]

9. 1 weekend a month, 2 weeks a year

We will help you with college.

How is this so hard to understand?

:shrug:

[Jed Dilligan]

11. I could have used that help myself,

but didn't take it, for many reasons. The main reason was that I understood as a member of the US military I would likely be called upon to fight in unjust wars.

So don't kid me. It is nothing like being sent a draft notice and having the choice between service or prison.

You also must realize that most of the poorest youth in this country don't even aspire to go to college.

[Dhalgren]

12. I grew up poor and I do not consider myself "middle-class" even now.

When you go out to recruit the poor and underprivileged and make offers of signing bonuses and college plans as a way of targeting them - it does make a difference. And it is not belittling the poor, to point out that the wealthy (or even the "middle-class) do not make up a significant portion of the military - there must also be a reason for that...

[Jed Dilligan]

14. Sure, I dig that.

The comparison to a draft, though, seems outlandish to me.

[MannyGoldstein]

16. Has Mrs. Clinton Stopped Supporting The War Yet?

Not as far as I can tell.

[Erika]

19. Has Cheney?

What is the relevance of your question?

[MannyGoldstein]

21. It Goes Directly ToThe OPs Question

The OP was about supporters of Democrats who, in turn, support the war. I'm curious if Mrs. Clinton continues to be one.

[spag68]

17. First of all

IMHO, if we are still there in fall 2007 the positions of all the candidates will be based on that reality. If we are still there it would indicate that the last election was meaningless and we wasted our time. The best thing to do ,again IMHO, is get out as fast as possible and try to get O Bin Laudin, then start from there.

[Erika]

20. I believe eerily that was said two years ago,

No, let's let the GOP hang themselves again.