If lost in the woods..is it better to stay put or look for help?

[trumad]

I guess it depends how desperate you are with the situation.

[demnan]

1. It's best to stick to a road at any event

if you aren't disoriented, which the poor guy probably was.

[Laura PourMeADrink]

47. I heard they think he was chased by bears...nt

[Shakespeare]

55. No, they don't think that at all.

I'd love to see a link to that.

[Laura PourMeADrink]

59. I heard it on the news report. They were wondering why he

ran off the road. They speculated he might be
running from a bear - because searchers found bear tracks.

yikes, lighten up.

[The Stranger]

64. Humans cannot outrun bears.

If they were "chasing" him, they would have left evidence of their presence on his body.

[Shakespeare]

67. No one in any official capacity said that. Why they think he was where he was:

He was following a stream, which by (sadly) outdated lore they used to think would eventually bring you to civilization if you just followed it. What he didn't know is that the route he took along the creek took him into incredibly treacherous terrain as the creek neared the area where it emptied into a big, raging river.

[Name removed]

69. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Shakespeare]

74. Insult aside, that in no way says they think he was chased by a bear.

It says that he may have seen bear tracks--that's something else altogether. Now who's the dipshit?

[Laura PourMeADrink]

76. yikes.

"think" "may have" what's the difference. no one knows, they can only conjecture. the report on the news that day said the same thing. But, your pouncing on an innocent statement - one that I said I heard on the news - by no means definitive - one that I didn't make up out of thin air - is the dippy part. Up on the wrong side of the bed, I can only assume. several days in a row.

peace out.

[Shakespeare]

77. Hey, I'm not the one worked up and calling names.

There was nothing angry or accusatory in any of my posts to you. I simply stated that nobody said he'd been chased by a bear. You told me to "lighten up," for some unknown reason, and posted a link that still didn't support your statement. I said so. Now you're overreacting again. I'm not the one with a problem here.

:shrug:

[Laura PourMeADrink]

78. Ha - Take a break

and stop sometime and read what you write and see if you think your tone might be considered rude and self-righteous.

from USA Today:
http://www.usatoday.com/printedition/news/20061208/a_missing08.art.htm

Randy Jones, a local developer and the chief helicopter pilot for the nearby Jackson County search-and-rescue unit, said Kim might have been chased by a bear. He says he saw the tracks of a large black bear crossing the road Kim took.

[Shakespeare]

80. Check out post #64.

Nobody in an official capacity believes for a second he was chased by a bear, volunteer pilot Randy Jones notwithstanding.

And no, my tone was not rude or self-righteous. You seem to take major issue with somebody questioning the veracity of your posts, so perhaps you should examine your tone instead. I'm not the one who had a post deleted for making an unwarranted personal attack, btw.

[NMDemDist2]

2. after 7 days, it's a self rescue situation in my mind unless you have

supplies to wait it out

[SoCalDem]

8. Every day that passes actually makes you LESS likely to survive

on foot, hiking around in an unfamiliar area. people ration food, and cannot sleep, they are cold and scared.. not a good plan to be out wandering around.

[htuttle]

3. If it's cold, and winter, fire-building should probably be high on the list

10,000,000 cavemen over the ages can't be wrong!

[Lisa]

51. even if it's not winter, fire is very useful for signalling

... because of the light, and the smoke (and now with the new sensor technology, infra-red emissions can show up a long way away). In most places in North America, for most of the year, even someone who's warmly dressed will start to feel cold after a while (and especially at night, or if it starts raining). They might not freeze to death, but it's uncomfortable, and without a fire, their bodies will have to burn calories to stay warm ... and over days, this can lead to serious weakening.

[chknltl]

71. They did that...burned their tires to signal and or keep warm. n/t

[Vincardog]

4. It is best to stay with your vehicle.

[leftyclimber]

6. Another vote for stay with your vehicle

It is big. SAR can see it much easier than they can see you.

[elocs]

57. It is the best idea to stay with the vehicle. Hiking out usually ends badly.

I cannot understand why anyone would travel in a region of the country known for having heavy and early snows to not travel with and emergency kit, especially no winter boots and clothes. Food, matches, blankets, sleeping bags, a big candle in a coffee can. For somebody who is not familiar with the wilderness to hike 8 miles in a circle is a classic. This was a tragedy waiting to happen.

[LSparkle]

5. STAY PUT ... as we all just learned.

[SoCalDem]

7. STAY WITH THE VEHICLE

(unless you are very close to a major road, and could easily hike back and forth to try & flag down cars that might pass)

[itsmesgd]

9. stay put

be prepared before you leave, carry supplies, and know the area where you are going.
You can learn more by reading Tom Brown Jr's survival books.

[ChairmanAgnostic]

10. always head down hill.

once you decide to leave. If there is no one looking for you, and your vehicle offers no shelter or is not visible, then grab what will be useful (you may be surprised).

by heading down hill, you drastically increase the possibility that
a) you find water
b) you find other inhabitants (human)
c) you find a road.
d) you fnd shelter

[itsmesgd]

12. or you might end up in the bottom of a valley

that might not be reachable for rescue workers. Also, nasty weather could move in and trap you there. I have always been torn about moving or staying put. I was taught to stay put, but something makes that hard after a few days.
Regarding James Kim: why did they wait until today or yesterday to start dropping rescue packages? When the boundaries of a search area are defined, I believe that they should start dropping these a lot sooner?

[OzarkDem]

65. Fog and bad weather

They couldn't fly in the area much the day after they found his family.

[RiverStone]

43. Not necessarily...

NW resident here.

Actually, there were "inversion" conditions present for much of the time he was lost. That means that the higher you climb, the warmer and sunnier it gets. Cold air remains trapped in valleys causing freezing fog and poor visibility; additionally, the valleys are also often fully shaded from the sun this time of year. He was actually within a mile of a winter lodge; if he had climbed up to a viewpoint and waited till nightfall, he may have seen the lodge lights and headed in that direction. It would have also been warmer.

BTW, staying with the car would have been better then the above scenario.

My heart goes out to his wife and children.

[fleabert]

62. actually, going higher gives you the ability to better know where you are and

gets you out of the tree line- so search teams in the air can find you better. Get high, get open, and light a fire.

That said- I really think it's best to stay put, unless you have a map, compass, provisions, and know how to use all of them properly.

Very young children who get lost in the woods are found more easily because their tendency is to stay put- adults feel like they have to DO something. It's easier to find a person in one spot than one that is moving around.

[Arkansas Granny]

11. Stay put is the advice I always heard. Moving about might

bring you to an area that has already been searched or it may take you further and further from the search area and the searchers.

[lapfog_1]

13. Unless you are well prepared... it's better to stay with your vehicle

Your vehicle is likely near a road. It's a large metal object, usually painted a single color. It is much more visible than a person. The vehicle will provide you a ready shelter. If your vehicle ends up down a ravine or deep in the brush, hike up to the road and make whatever maker (branches, rocks piled up, road flares) you can, return to the car for shelter.

But in any case, no matter where you live, keep an "emergency kit" in your vehicle. A gallon jug of water, a blanket (or a few space blankets), keep a cell phone charger and power up your cell periodically (on a regular schedule, like on the hour for 10 minutes). Road flares, repair tools, matches, and a saw. Keep some extra clothes in the trunk.

[madokie]

14. Stay put.

[malaise]

15. Easy to say now

Stay put.

[etherealtruth]

68. You are right

As easy as it is for us to say "stay put" ... this guy was desperate not to let his family die.

What a sad horrible lesson we have all learned:(

[renate]

16. without cell phone service, and if waiting it out doesn't seem to be working...

... it seems to me that you start considering Plan B.

The other day my husband lost track of our daughter in the store; because the two of them shop together so rarely, he didn't know that I'd told her to stay put if we ever got separated so I could just backtrack to where she was. So she waited and waited for him--following the rules while he searched around the store, thinking she could have wandered anywhere--and then, since waiting wasn't working, she went to a cashier for help. I was so proud of her.

In other words, there probably does come a time when you have to figure that nobody is going to find you where you are, and you go look for help. They waited for a week, didn't they? A case could be made that waiting longer would have been unwise.

Mainly, I just hope the mom doesn't blame herself for any decision the two of them made for him to finally go look for help. Those "what ifs" can drive a person around the bend.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

17. I think it depends on the situation.

But if you're going to walk back to the highway, for fuck's sake, stay on the road.

That's one of those things about this case that I can't make any sense over.

[MazeRat7]

18. There is no single answer...

In this case since there was a vehicle, that being a given other posters pretty much nailed it. Stay put and use the vehicle to help your survival. Even if you don't have a "kit" in the car, there are plenty of options to keep you alive for several weeks - given there was snow for water, wood for fuel, vehicle for signal/shelter, etc.

On the other hand, if you get lost on a day hike or have an accident while engaged in some remote "activity", staying put could kill you. For every situation, there are always options but there are few "constants" when it comes to survival.

As you correctly pointed out... "It depends on the situation".

MZr7

[sandnsea]

27. Either of your scenarios

indicate staying put. Even on a day hike, hell especially on a day hike, 'hug a tree'.

Still, I can't say Kim made the wrong choice. Nobody was going to drive by on that road, plus I think they got off on a side road from the forest service road making it more unlikely they'd be found. It'd been days, the thought of starvation had to be an issue and they weren't familiar with what was safe to eat. People have been known to hike out of these lost scenarios and are heroes when they do, so it's tough to say he was wrong after so many days of no sign of help.

[MazeRat7]

29. Well consider this...

Your on a day hike, not well prepared, become lost, and only told people the "general" area you would be in.... (granted your a dumbass... but thats not the point here)... you can't find the trail but know you are some 20 -30 miles south of a major highway.

What do you do ? Sit and wait, or find a help in 5-10 hrs, depending on terrain, by heading toward what you do know ?

Again, its all dependent on the situation. There is no one right answer.

MZr7

Side note: As for the Kim situitation... I can't say if he should have stayed or hiked, I wasn't there and I don't know what "resources" he had available. If it were me, my family, my mindset, my vehicle...same place, same storm, same set of events... I would have been hiking on the 2nd or 3rd day at the latest. From all I've read about this sad state of affairs, this was the wrong move for Mr. Kim but would have been the right move for me. (and BTW... I'll be 50 a year and 2 days)

Thats what makes things like this so difficult...

[sandnsea]

35. Hug-A-Tree

There's a reason there's an entire outdoor safety program called 'Hug A Tree', it's because S&R know it is in your best interest to stay put. The only case I would say to move is if you KNOW BEYOND ALL DOUBT, that there is shelter very very close by - let's say you passed a cave twenty minutes earlier. Then again, if you were lost and passed a cave 20 minutes earlier, and didn't plunk yourself down in it - well geez I won't say it. Anyway, it isn't difficult at all. Stay put.

[Solon]

19. Generally, its always a good idea, when going anywhere, to have a compass and map...

Even without the map, you can usually find your bearings. If caught in a vehicle, I would stay around it for a while, especially if the weather is bad(too cold, too wet, etc.). If on foot, while hiking, I would have a trail map at least, and use that in addition to my compass to find my way to the nearest park ranger station or town, whichever is nearest.

Actually, in both these situations, I'm not really "lost" I guess. :shrug:

[sandnsea]

25. If they hadn't had a map

They would have turned around and gone on the highway. At the very least, if they had just asked somebody, literally anybody, they would have been told to NOT take that road. I don't recommend it in summer, let alone winter. The paved state highways to the coast are bad enough, the forest service roads are just awful. I would say the forest service is even at fault for not clearly marking it, except I also read that they moved rocks out of the road and sometimes forest service roads are blocked with rocks. So they may have moved the warning themselves. And for heaven's sake - check the damned weather!!!

[slackmaster]

20. Totally depends on the situation

What is the weather like? What supplies do you have? Do you have access to water? Fuel? Food?

Do you have any information at all about where you are, e.g. general direction of nearest known road?

I've spent a lot of time backpacking and have only become slightly lost a couple of times. I was with other people. Both times we hunkered down, spent the night where we were, and in the morning were easily able to figure out where we were using maps and compasses. Both times, we were within 1/4 mile of where we had planned to camp for the night. Both times, bad weather had hampered our navigation.

It's always a bad idea to go into the woods alone. Since the recent victim in Oregon had children in his party, he really didn't have the option of taking anyone with him. I think he should have stayed at the car.

[izzie]

21. I have often thought of this when you read a sad story.

I guess I would stay with the car. When my husband traveled in Alaska he had to take a set plan of things. His company made him do this. There is an interesting story about a young man in Alaska that found a bus and stayed in it but he still died. What do the woods men of the West say on this?

[Ezlivin]

53. "Into the Wild" by Jon Krakauer tells the story to which you refer

A very gripping read, too.

http://www.amazon.com/Into-Wild-Jon-Krakauer/dp/0385486804/sr=1-1/qid=1165535330/ref=pd_bbs_1/102-5917812-6056119?ie=UTF8&s=books

After graduating from Emory University in Atlanta in 1992, top student and athlete Christopher McCandless abandoned his possessions, gave his entire $24,000 savings account to charity and hitchhiked to Alaska, where he went to live in the wilderness. Four months later, he turned up dead. His diary, letters and two notes found at a remote campsite tell of his desperate effort to survive, apparently stranded by an injury and slowly starving. They also reflect the posturing of a confused young man, raised in affluent Annandale, Va., who self-consciously adopted a Tolstoyan renunciation of wealth and return to nature. Krakauer, a contributing editor to Outside and Men's Journal, retraces McCandless's ill-fated antagonism toward his father, Walt, an eminent aerospace engineer. Krakauer also draws parallels to his own reckless youthful exploit in 1977 when he climbed Devils Thumb, a mountain on the Alaska-British Columbia border, partly as a symbolic act of rebellion against his autocratic father. In a moving narrative, Krakauer probes the mystery of McCandless's death, which he attributes to logistical blunders and to accidental poisoning from eating toxic seed pods. Publishers Weekly

[izzie]

58. That is the one.

I found it very sad. There is also a child's book of a small boy lost in the White Mountains of NH that makes one feel very happy. I think you can still find it. Takes place I would say in the 1930's. I used to give it to my grandchildren and they all liked it.

[fleabert]

63. a fantastic book. nt

[Richard D]

22. Cars are probably easier to spot from the air

And it's a great idea to alway have some food, water, extra clothing, a mirror, flares, space blanket, matches, compass, headlamp and batteries, and a map in a day pack just in case. I'd think in a worst case scenario, you could always set your car on fire, which would certainly get noticed. The only way I would try to walk out is if no one knew where I was or where I was going, or when I'm supposed to return.

[bleedingheart]

23. Stay put.

[WannaJumpMyScooter]

24. ALWAYS stay with a vehicle or boat

or airplane, or anything else which is easier to find than an inexperienced person on foot.

[WatchWhatISay]

26. Who was found first?

Those in the car were found in time.
The one on foot was not.
Tells me all I need to know.

[murray hill farm]

28. For survival, the most important and the first step is always...

to find shelter before the night sets in. In the case of the Kims, staying with the car...a shelter...would have been the thing to do...but..hey...after so many days, I can see why he felt that he had to strike out for help. Very sad.

[RamboLiberal]

30. Stay with your vehicle is the best option

And make sure before you make the trip someone knows where you are going and when you should arrive at a destination.

But I can't blame James Kim for trying to find help after a week out there and no help.

What disturbs me about this case is it seems the authorities did a bad job of searching initially. It was a private helicopter hired by the family who found the car. W/O the money to hire the helicopter the mom and kids would still be out there IMHO.

Internet is a great place for getting some ideas of what to keep in your car as a survival kit. Not a bad idea to keep a kit in your car even if you're not in a wilderness area. You never know when a natural disaster will strike and you'll be out of your house for a few days.

[EvolveOrConvolve]

31. I took a lot of wilderness survival classes

In snowy or extremely cold weather, ALWAYS stay with the vehicle unless it's in such an out-of-the-way place as to be impossible for rescuers to find. Even a disabled vehicle conserves body heat, and moisture can be gathered from melting snow. Humans can go a long time without food, but not long without water. Exposure makes the situation worse to the person who tries to hike out.

Anyone traveling in an area where conditions could get bad should have a survival kit. Blankets, first aid kit, a gallon of distilled water, energy bars, vitamins, flashlights, maps, GPS, extra batteries, compass (if you know approximately where you are and how to use a compass). Also, I also carry one of those propane powered tent heaters. Not only do they provide light, which can attract rescuers, they can keep the temperature of a car in the 50's or 60's, no matter how cold it is outside. The heaters emit very little carbon monoxide, so they're relatively safe.

This is one of those sad cases where On-Star would have saved a life.

[Lars39]

32. There was a survivor-type program on a while back

my husband was telling me about. The guy in the program took one the tires off the vehicle,put siphoned gas in it and lit it.

[RamboLiberal]

34. That was probably Survivorman

Interesting program. Les Stroud. He also did a "I shouldn't be Alive" on Discovery recreating the ordeal of a family who got lost in their car in a blizzard and stranded in the wilderness. They and their baby did survive.

SCIENCE OF SURVIVAL: LOST IN THE SNOW
Jennifer and Jim Stolpa ended up lost in the snow miles from help. They survived for days alone and without help. Could YOU?

In the coldest Colorado winter for a decade, survival expert Les Stroud shows what you can do to survive if you are trapped in a blizzard without any special gear. He strips his truck and turns a car seat into a makeshift pair of snow boots to battle his way through the Rocky Mountains. He shows you how to make a signal fire from an old tire and a car battery, then treks off through 80 mph winds and knee-deep powdery snow in temperatures of minus 86 degrees F wearing nothing more than an old overcoat and pants — just like the Stolpas had during their ordeal.

http://dsc.discovery.com/fansites/alive/episode/scienceofsurvival.html?clik=fanmain_leftnav

[EvolveOrConvolve]

38. That actually sounds dangerous!

What did he use to siphon the gas? Without a garden hose or a tube, you'd have to butcher the engine to find something to use as a siphon.

But, with matches and a little bit of gasoline, you could have a pretty good fire, even with extremely wet and cold wood.

[SoCalDem]

44. fabric ..like a wick?

I bet if you used a gasoline soaked rag, you could get a tire fire started..

[never cry wolf]

75. All sorts of hoses under a car's hood

Windshield washer reservoir would be one not needed.

[RamboLiberal]

33. Being such a techie - I would've thought James Kim would have

On-Star. ? - does On-Star work everywhere or is it dependent on something like towers like cellphones do?

[SoCalDem]

36. it needs a signal. there are 'dead spots' all over.

I am always thankful for them when I'm headed for vegas with my friend.. (she's a phone-aholic".)

[EvolveOrConvolve]

39. I thought On-Star used satellites for there communication?

Are there really that many dead spots with the sats?

[Gormy Cuss]

42. Apparently, there are still dead spots for Onstar

Similar to cell phone service, there are some areas where it may not work. Thus, Onstar may not have worked for the Kims.

http://abclocal.go.com/kfsn/story?section=consumer&id=4172090

[EvolveOrConvolve]

46. Their marketing seems to suggest that no matter where you are,

On-Star can help you out. How disappointing to find out that's not true.

[TangoCharlie]

70. OnStar dead spots

Apparently, it's just cellular, nothing to do with satellites. So there are dead spots.

None of the communication companies talk about dead spots in their marketing.

Can you hear me now? Hello? Hello? Rats.

Regards.

[chknltl]

73. Local news service requested info on "On-Star/Kim" tragedy...

On-Star signal does NOT work everywhere and does not work in area of Kim tragedy. (Nor do most cell phones).

[sofa king]

81. And another thing....

Why does a cell phone tower have to be stationary? Why can't you put all the electronics for a signal tower in a helicopter and use it to activate the emergency GPS chip in the stranded person's phone? Come to think of it, isn't that why your phone can track you in the first place?

I was under the impression that the reason why a GPS chip is in every modern phone is for just that sort of emergency. But sometimes, I find myself thinking that the chip is there to track whomever The Man wants to track, and they care fuck-all about actual emergencies.

[Cleita]

41. Oh yeah!

Techie can't survive in the woods if that is what they are relying on. I feel so bad for these people because they were trying to get through on a road and to a destination that usually only takes a few hours to pass through. The thing is that when passing through our wilderness areas in our west, you can be really stuck alone and no techie stuff works anymore.

Believe me I know. My late husband and I broke down in many places that weren't easily hikable to the next truck stop or ranger station. We learned to respect Mother Nature in ways that no cell phone, batteries or other electronic goodies could overcome.

I hope this man rests in peace and that his family won't suffer too much from their loss. They didn't ask for this. They were the victims.

[fujiyama]

37. Anyone have a flare gun as part of an emergency kit?

That may be useful in such a situation.

Also, is anyone familiar with satellite phones? After all, they don't rely on cell phone towers. I'd definitely buy one just for emergency use.

[cynatnite]

40. leaving your vehicle makes it more difficult for you to be found...

My hubby grew up in areas where it was so easy to get lost. They hunted and camped up in mountains during the winter. They were raised to know how to survive in case they were lost.

When we lived there we carried what we needed to survive in case we were ever stranded. He always instructed me on a few things should I ever get stranded. The first was to always stay with the car. He stuck a flair gun in the trunk, too. The second was moderate how often the car was ran in order to stretch out the gas in case I'm stuck for an extended period of time. He kept the trunk packed pretty well with the essentials and I have no doubt I could have survived for quite a while if need be.

[tyedyeto]

45. As a parent of a search and rescue son.....

I've always thought that you stay with your vehicle. People have been found alive up to 2 weeks after being 'lost'. If you are not at your vehicle, then you find the closest road or access point.

[seabeyond]

48. if... he was half a mile away from a house. 8 days later the family dies

waiting for help.... people would have ripped his ass for not being a hero and going that mere half a mile. oh i can here the people.... why the hell didnt he just walk that little distance to save his family. save the kids

he did stay in place for a long time.

[hedgehog]

49. On the issue of city folks in the wild -

it's a problem even in New York State. Letchworth State Park, the Adirondacks, Mt. Marcy; they all can be dangerous places if you don't understand the dangers. Right on the campus of Oswego State University there is a problem with students going out on the break walls to watch the lake when the waves are high. They just can't believe that a wave can knock them off and sweep them into the water.

[Lisa]

50. yes -- I'm from highly-urbanized Southern Ontario

(hi, neighbor!)
As you say, sometimes people assume that just because places like New York or New Jersey have big cities and busy highways, they will never have to worry about this kind of thing. I've noticed this attitude in Ontario, too -- though in between major cities like Toronto, Hamilton, and London, there are also some very rough areas of topography, like the Niagara Escarpment. A person can literally be a couple of miles from "civilization", but a bad fall can leave you helpless and stranded -- especially if nobody knows where/when you were expected to be. My folks enrolled me in a lot of nature study courses and we hiked a lot as a family (and volunteered for maintenance duties on the Bruce Trail) -- but even now that there are such things as cell phones, I would not want to go out there unprepared on a day trip! My folks both grew up in rural areas, and they felt that understanding and respecting the wild was not just common sense, but part of our heritage as Canadians/Americans.

My mom teaches outdoor ed classes in the local school system -- every county used to have its own outdoor ed centre, with instructors who would go over basic outdoors survival training with elementary and high-school classes. But budget cutbacks resulted in the two neighboring counties losing their centres, and ours is next on the chopping block. Mom almost cried when she described one class last year, with something like 90% of the kids not having footwear that would help them avoid a sprained ankle, and people (not the girls, either!) complaining that they were afraid of getting muddy. (In the case of kids from very poor families who only had the one set of school clothing, that's understandable, but most of those who were complaining were from affluent backgrounds.) Very few of the kids knew how to avoid poisonous snakes, poison ivy, or hypothermia -- and most of them simply didn't care. They told her that they would just call for help on their cell phones. Mom tried to explain that if your car breaks down and your cell phone doesn't work, a backup plan could save your life. Perhaps what happened to poor Mr. Kim will remind them of that.

[Guaranteed]

52. It entirely depends on the situation- you have to use your best judgment.

I'd say that the default rule is to stay put and take cover in whatever you have with you. However, if no one knows that you were going to be in that area, and you're not in a well-traveled area- you might be on your own to get yourself out of the situation. Also, as the days go by, if there aren't any signs of rescue, it might be time to head out.

But, again, usually you should stay with your vehicle/boat/plane. Make smart use of the resources you do have.

[warrior1]

54. three things to remember

1. You can survive for three hours without shelter
2. You can survive for three days without water
3. You can survive for three weeks without food

[bklyncowgirl]

56. Stay put, especially if you have shelter, water and the means of making a fire.

Number one, you need to keep warm and dry. Hypothermia is a very real danger. It can kill you if you get chilled even in relatively warm weather, let's say 50/60 degrees.

Unless you have a compass and map, know where you are going, and have the proper clothes and equipment to protect yourself from the elements then you are putting yourself at risk.

[RamboLiberal]

60. Looks like one big mistake James Kim made was getting

wet. Just read a story on SF Chronicle that says he apparently had to swim in the creek he tried to follow. That will definitely bring on hypothermia. We'll never know but I wonder if he would've survived till rescuers found him if he had avoided getting his clothing wet.

<snip>

The first 5 miles or so of his trek took him back up the logging road, but then Kim clambered down an embankment and into Big Windy Creek canyon. He left an extra pair of pants at the spot in what searchers believe was an attempt to let them know where he was going.

After 2 miles of swimming, crawling and climbing over rocks and fallen trees, he dropped another pile of clothes and pieces of his map, Hastings said. Although they don't know when he died, authorities believe Kim spent at least one freezing night shivering in wet clothes.

Another 2 1/2 miles down the canyon, in 2 feet of water, Kim's body was found Wednesday. He had all his clothes on and was still wearing his backpack. The medical examiner found bruises and scrapes consistent with someone who had walked through the woods but no injuries that would have incapacitated him.

http://sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?file=/c/a/2006/12/08/MNG75MS0P61.DTL

[piedmont]

79. Damn.

I wonder if he got to a point where he felt he couldn't climb back up the bank, so he walked/swam IN the creek, or if he accidently fell in and just kept going? Either way, I'd say getting wet was what proved fatal.

[dogday]

61. This excerpt from a news article says alot

"I admire his effort. He had fortitude," Jackson County Sheriff Mike Winters said Wednesday. "He had a strong will to survive and I can tell by his effort that he put a lot of thought into what he was doing."

Winters said that despite having little wilderness experience, Kim made smart decisions about trying to find help. "He thought on his feet and he was meticulous," said Winters, who also said that at one point in their search rescuers came within about a quarter of a mile of where Kim's body was eventually found.

Kim had covered an estimated eight miles. "It seems superhuman to me that he was able to cover that amount of distance given what he had and also that he had nine days in the car," undersheriff Brian Anderson said, according to CNN.com.

http://people.aol.com/people/article/0,26334,1566956,00.html

[OzarkDem]

66. He did a very good job

considering the situation he was in. He conserved what he had to keep everyone going and made the best choices he could.

[chknltl]

72. Discovery channel Survivorman says STAY PUT!

Car=shelter, car=bigger target for searchers to spot. He has had a show on lately about what to do when in this EXACT predicament. First and foremost is letting a RESPONSIBLE someone know: where you are going; e.t.a.; your route and any changes in plans before making those changes.