What happens if we pull-out of Iraq?

[Kiouni]

I have been torn on this decision for a while. I don't support a surge of troops because it obviously hasn't worked in the past. I understand when the Army leaders say that if we have an immediate pull-out, Iran and Turkey cannot curb the anarchy that will ensue. I understand that currently we are doing little to no good there, but I don't know if an immediate pull-out would be the best thing for the Iraqi civilians.

The best idea I have heard so far to fix this mess has come from the war commission which recommended upping the funding for the iraqi security forces. Combine this with increased funding for infrastructure and I can see the U.S. withdrawing all of our troops within 6 months.

I think the U.S. is bringing in too many outside contractors to re-build Iraq. They obviously have the capability to build things, because we blew up a shit-ton of it. So why not pay them to fix it instead of bringing in foreign companies at 100 times the price to build a children's hospital that will never be finished. I can't imagine that the insurgents want to completely destroy their own land, they just don't want to see America's war profiteers getting fat off it.

I'm hoping someone can explain to me a plan for withdrawl that doesn't include the total destruction of the Iraqi people.... or are we too late?

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

1. What happened when we pulled out of Vietnam?

[Kiouni]

2. Well,.... it didn't go so well.

"Chaos, unrest, and panic ensued as hysterical South Vietnamese officials and civilians scrambled to leave Saigon before it was too late. "

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vietnam_war#Total_U.S._withdrawal

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

4. Right.

Things were peachy before we left, weren't they?

[USA_1]

6. Yes it did ...

... today Vietnam is a capitalist country.

[Neshanic]

9. So by that logic, after the deaths of millions after the collapse of Iraq...

you will be able to say "I told you so" when Walmarts ,Nike factories, and Apple Computer stores carpet the cities of the region of 2050 that will exist, amid radiactive waste, radioactive oil, and sitting in your comfy chair in a country that China owns, and pays your meager salary.

[fairfaxvadem]

3. I doubt there is an "if" anymore. Just "when."

Or, we resign ourselves to stay for 10 years and put ALOT more US troops (troops we presently don't have) on the ground. It would take that kind of commitment to make sure Iraq is as stable as it needs to be for us to say "good job."

Short of that, I think we're just postponing a result we won't like. If it doesn't devolve into total chaos, it certainly won't be the shining beacon of democracy Bush intended.

I wonder if he has any idea yet that he just played right into Iran's hands with this invasion. Iraq's Sunni neighbors have got to be having heart attacks every single day.

[magellan]

5. We're too late

The time for all of these great ideas was four years ago. Too many of the bad guys have armed themselves in Iraq now, they all want their piece of the pie, and there isn't anything to stop them fighting over it. Our presence there is like putting a bunch of cops in the middle of a gang war in L.A. -- we're just providing extra targets.

Bush** has betrayed the Iraqi people, those like you and me who just want normal peaceful lives. I honestly can't think of a way to ensure they get that now.

[seabeyond]

7. murtha over the horizon. pull the troops to protect the border

out of baghdad and let the iraqi's go at it. keep troops to control borders and the areas that are in good shape and keep iran and syria out. then go from there on pulling the troops out. i finally heard what the murtha plan repositioning was.

[Kiouni]

8. that's sadly a realistic approach

a very sad solution if you think about it because honestly that may be all we can do: try to contain the chaos.

I wish i was a religions person so i could get some solace out of the chimp burning in hell.

[seabeyond]

13. i am a spiritualist so i have solace... but it is not that bush is going to hell

cause i am not religious and that is part of religion.

ya... i think it is doable and will allow the withdrawal in a more orderly fashion

[dysfunctional press]

10. pigs fly over a frozen-over hell...

at least while the current idiot is still sitting in the "big chair".

[doublethink]

11. Richard A. Clark former Counter-terrorism Chief ........

author of "Against All Enemies" .... gave a speech a few days ago, Q&A session on just what your asking. He covers it in this 50 minute video. Here's a link to that video, was really informative. Hope this helps. Peace.

link: http://www.americanprogress.org/events/2007/01/after_iraq.html

note: the actual video link is on the page under 'Resources' ....

[Kiouni]

14. thanks

i couldn't get the video to come up but I'll try back later.

[porphyrian]

12. There are plenty of Muslim nations who can provide security...

...instead of our troops. It's still our mess, and we're still responsible for cleaning it up, but we need to do it without an American presence in Iraq, which is do-able. Our presence is doing nothing but making things worse.

[Neshanic]

15. That's a fantasy.

[porphyrian]

18. Not at all. You're in denial or misinformed. - n/t

[bigwillq]

16. U.S. troops lives will be spared.

The U.S. will save billions of dollars.

Maybe people will start to like us again after we start leaving countries alone and let them decided what is best for their country.

[karlrschneider]

17. Maybe it really does in the final analysis come down to money

These are just some offhanded ideas I've pondered regarding the Iraq
debacle. Maybe none of them are feasible, or some of them could be,
I don't pretend to have the answers but what has been done so far sure as hell isn't working.

A (UN?) resolution/decision? placing all of Iraq's oil reserves and infrastructure into an international 'trust' administered and managed by NATO with a guarantee that the net proceeds of sales are returned equitably to
ALL Iraqis. Doesn't Alaska have some kind of similar arrangment? Let their oil be produced and sold on the open market. There's enough to make everyone in their country comfortable. Sure, the 'peak oil' scenario isn't going away but
why not make use of it until alternatives are developed? Financial security is a pretty damn strong incentive to make nice and could mitigate some of the sectarian mess.

Provide UN/NATO forces to protect the facilities while they are repaired and reconstituted. Find the funds to hire IRAQIS to fix all the stuff we broke...instead of bringing in foreigners to do it. This might require redeployment of significant numbers of U.S. and "coalition of the willing" (are there any left?) troops from Baghdad/Anbar and let the 'civil war' go on as it's doing anyway. How much worse could it really be?

Meanwhile we offer very attractive prices for weapons to the "insurgents"...I don't know how much but for what it's costing us every day we could purchase a hell of a lot of Kalashkanovs, AK47s, RPGs and whatever other stuff they're using to kill our soldiers and each other. I think similar programs have even been used here in the USA with some success.
In any case, whatever we can get and destroy diminishes the risk to our troops.

[PsN2Wind]

20. There you go again Karl

Offering a realistic solution to a difficult problem.

[karlrschneider]

21. Just trying to make the pie higher...

;-)

[Blue_Roses]

22. Excellent!

:thumbsup:

[mmonk]

19. Well, we won't have to kill or be killed anymore.