Showdown in Odessa...Texas, that is.

[madfloridian]

And Chuck Norris is on board for the fight at the Odessa corral. Well, not in the court case, but supporting the National Council on Bible Curriculum in Public Schools.



Council board member and actor Chuck Norris has described this curriculum as the "first step to get God back into your public school."

From the Washington Post:

Showdown in Odessa: Teaching the Bible in Texas public schools

WHEN THE newly elected school board in Odessa, Tex., announced that it would require public schools to offer a Bible course elective, many townspeople cried hallelujah. But last week some other residents, aided by the American Civil Liberties Union and the People for the American Way Foundation, sued the school district for violating the First Amendment.

Currently 8 percent of public schools nationwide offer courses on the Bible. The Supreme Court has deemed these classes constitutional so long as they "present knowledge, but neither promote nor disparage belief." Odessa residents are thus challenging the course's execution and not its existence. The district chose the more controversial of two leading Bible class curricula: a course designed by the National Council on Bible Curriculum in Public Schools, a group run by a veritable Who's Who of conservative Christian leaders. Council board member and actor Chuck Norris has described this curriculum as the "first step to get God back into your public school."

...."The fact that Odessa schools may be carelessly implementing their new Bible course doesn't bode well for their willingness to teach the Bible in an objective, scholarly, nonsectarian fashion. Given that the Texas legislature is considering a bill to bring Bible courses such as Odessa's to schools statewide, we hope that this lawsuit will force schools to think more critically about teaching this important but sensitive subject.

This is an update on the story I wrote about the other night.

Texas school board member tells parents to "kiss my butt" over religious class.

L.V. “Butch” Foreman, a member of the Ector County school board in Odessa, Texas, has three words for parents who say the district’s Bible course crosses the line: “kiss my butt.” Said Foreman

“If they don’t have children in the class, they can kiss my butt,” Foreman said. “They’re just looking to impose their beliefs and their views on everybody, and we don’t put up with that crap out here.”

If the plaintiffs did have children enrolled in the classes, then Foreman said he would tell the students to drop the class and take another course since it’s an elective.

..."Chuck Norris, star of TV’s “Walker, Texas Ranger” as well as films including “Missing in Action” and “Delta Force 2,” and his wife Gena have joined the board of directors of the National Council on Bible Curriculum in Public Schools (NCBCPS)

It is an important case because many schools are or will be using the curriculum from this group. It has the support of Pat Robertson, whose group has a text being used, Dr. James Kennedy of Florida, Concerned Women of America, founded by Beverly LaHaye; Focus on the Family, associated with James Dobson;National Legal Foundation, founded by Pat Robertson; Eagle Forum, led by Phyllis Schlafly; Tony Perkins, and many others.

This is going on in Florida and in several other states.

More information on the Texas schools is available here.

Texas Freedom Network

[Bitwit1234]

1. Have you ever noticed--

how those has been republican actors start controversies trying to get themselves back in the limelight....ha ha ha ha ha....I think trying to force their god on everybody is the cause of conflict today.

A person wants to choose the time, the place and how they worship God in their own way. No what other people want.

[Iris]

3. have you ever noticed that most republican actors aren't even really actors?

They just sort of play themselves and call it acting.

[demoleft]

21. That beautiful scene in the roman Colosseo!!!

Indeed when I read the Madfloridian post, all that fell in my mind was the scene at the roman Colosseo where Norris gets beaten up by Bruce Lee in The Way Of Dragon.

Lee was far better than him as a martial art master, as an actor (though not a big one), as a man of culture - with his blend of buddhism, taoism and western ideas of individual liberation.

Mostly, as far as I can see from his works, Lee was a laicist.
That makes me think one more time (with pleasure) at the above mentioned scene!

ciao

[Iris]

22. Delicous example!

:9

[madfloridian]

23. Chuck got beaten up by Bruce Lee? So sorry I missed that movie.

I am glad to hear that.

I bet there in Italy you never get to see Walker, Texas Ranger.

http://www.sonypictures.com/tv/shows/walkertexasranger/

Chuck always wins on that show.

:hi:

:D

[demoleft]

24. Texas Ranger every year...

...everyday, at 7.30 pm, in Italy. And year after year the same old ones, that is the whole series!

The show is on one of the three Berlusconi's televisions, so it makes sense!!

ciao!

[madfloridian]

25. Berlusconi owns 3 networks still? And Walker is on one of them. Ha Ha.

That is the first time I have really smiled today.

[SemiCharmedQuark]

2. But I thought Republicans hated actors sharing their views?

:shrug:

[madfloridian]

4. It's only the hollywood liberal types they don't like expressing views.

It's ok for TX conservative actors to do it.

:hi:

[madfloridian]

5. Some of the questionable parts....

http://www.tfn.org:80/religiousfreedom/biblecurriculum/execsummary/

Shoddy Research
The curriculum contains many passages in which the developers have distorted history and science, including:

The curriculum cites a “respected scholar” who claims that archaeological evidence “always confirms the facts of the Biblical record” page 170. Yet that “respected scholar” claimed elsewhere to have seen Jesus’ school records in India, records from the lost continent of Atlantis and evidence that Egypt’s Great Pyramid of Giza was used to transmit radio messages to the Grand Canyon thousands of years ago.

The curriculum uses a discredited urban legend that NASA has evidence that two days are missing in time, thus “confirming” a biblical passage about the sun standing still pages 116-17

The curriculum identifies a creation scientist as an expert and recommends materials from his Creation Evidence Museum to explain the origins of life.
Factual Errors

The curriculum is full of errors (such as the dates of historical events, the identities of key individuals, and the details of biblical stories), faulty logic, unsubstantiated claims and unclear wording, including:

The curriculum misstates the length of the ancient Jewish calendar page 14 and the years of the rule of Herod as king of the Jews pages 193 and 196.

The answer key to a quiz page 87 identifies a pharaoh as “Hyksos.” Hyksos was the name of an Asiatic-Semitic people who once ruled Egypt.

The website also cites instances of possible plagiarism. A pdf version of the full report is available at the site.

[Javaman]

8. "Jesus’ school records in India"

Jesus' report card found!!!

Hindi A

Science b-

social studies A+

math c

Phys Ed Failure.

Teachers comments.

Jesus shows and aptitude for relating to people and the world around him but frankly, he's a spaz. He can do some pretty amazing things when he puts his mind to it.

Of concern lately, he's been talking about hearing voices and has shown signs of an overly developed ego.

Aside from that, he's a pretty good kid. He hobby of magic has impressed us all. We are all still trying to figure out how he was able to walk across the gym's pool.

[FatDave]

6. Here's the thing.

I try very hard to stay tolerant. I try to tell myself that people are free to believe whatever they want, even if I find it silly. But freedom of religion is never enough, is it? They've got to force it on people who don't want it. What the fuck is with that? I know there's liberal Christians out there. Can't you do anything to shut these fuckers up?

[Freddie Stubbs]

7. Isn't that where the Putty Division is?

On Federalsburg Street?

/probably too obscure of a reference

[madfloridian]

9. God’s Lawgivers? Carrying the Water for the Religious Right in Texas Government

Ah, this looks like an interesting report for folks in TX to keep up with who is doing this stuff.

From the Texas Freedom Network.

God's Lawgivers

This new Texas Freedom Network Education Fund report takes a close look at state officials who carry the water for the religious right in Texas. The report describes how Terri Leo, R-Spring, and other far-right bomb throwers on the State Board of Education are dragging our public schools into the culture wars. It also profiles key legislators - including newly elected state Sen. Dan Patrick, R-Houston, and state Rep. Phil King, R-Weatherford - who are leading the assault on religious freedom and individual liberties at the Capitol.

God’s Lawgivers? Carrying the Water for the Religious Right in Texas Government is the TFN Education Fund’s second annual report on the religious right’s powerful influence in Texas. Inside the report you will find:

• A comprehensive history of proposed state legislation relating to key parts of the religious right's agenda, including promoting private school vouchers, opposing responsible sex education, attacking stem cell research and censoring public school textbooks.

• A listing of Texas groups associated with the religious right, including data on each group’s finances, leadership and activities

• An analysis of the 2006 Texas Republican Party platform

• A compilation of some choice quotes attributed to far-right leaders and elected officials in 2006

The report itself is in pdf format.

[blogslut]

10. Interesting. This is an WP editorial

Note the phrase: "present knowledge, but neither promote nor disparage belief" . Well, put that phrase inside quotes on a Google search and you get 2 results. One link goes to the Bible Literacy site where, what do you know? There's that same phrase:

The textbook keeps the teacher from veering away from court-defined standards, which stipulate that teachers can “present knowledge, but neither promote nor disparage belief".

They even copy/pasted the scare quotes. http://www.bibleliteracy.org/Site/News/bibl_newsOpEd060414.htm

The other link goes to a wire service re-print of the same WP editorial, at a website named Vindy.com in Ohio.

My question is why can't I find this phrase linked to the Supreme Court or any other website for that matter? Another question I have is who wrote this anonymous, yet official Washington Post Op-Ed? Did they just assume that the Supreme Court actually ruled in this way, in reference to these particular classes? If so, how come neither this BS WP Op-Ed nor the Bible Literacy cite the Supreme Court case where this ruling was made?

I think Chuck friggin Norris or some other Dobson goon wrote this blather and the WP passed it off as editorial opinion.

[madfloridian]

11. I got a different impression from the WP editorial. Bible as literature is ok.

"Biblical understanding is not only constitutional; it's also essential to the study of literature, art, history and politics. But keeping school systems from indoctrinating, rather than educating, students on Scripture can be difficult. The fact that Odessa schools may be carelessly implementing their new Bible course doesn't bode well for their willingness to teach the Bible in an objective, scholarly, nonsectarian fashion. Given that the Texas legislature is considering a bill to bring Bible courses such as Odessa's to schools statewide, we hope that this lawsuit will force schools to think more critically about teaching this important but sensitive subject."

I think many of us would agree with the Bible being taught as literature or for background...is just fine.

Read this from CBS...

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2006/04/16/sunday/main1501195.shtml

"So perhaps it's not surprising that a new CBS News Poll out this morning suggests that while 46 percent of Americans say that teaching the Bible in public schools would violate the separation of church and state, 64 percent say it should be allowed if it's taught solely as literature.

Some schools are already trying it.

It's an elective course at one high school in St. Francisville, La., mostly for juniors and seniors and it's almost always packed.

Connie Bunch, who usually teaches English, knows full well there's a fine line between teaching and preaching."

[FatDave]

15. the Bible being taught as literature or for background

I'm not so sure. Now, if you want to have a class covering all religions of the world, I'm all for that and even think it should be mandatory. But when you narrow the focus to the Christian Bible being taught in Odessa Texas, well you'll have to forgive me if I don't trust them to handle the subject objectively.

[madfloridian]

16. I think you are misunderstanding what I am saying.

I believe in comparative religious courses. I simply used that as one example.

If we taught all religions, people would be able to see that the saviors and the need for shed blood, among other tenets...are seen in nearly all religions in the world.

[blogslut]

17. I admit

I got hung up on that Supreme Court thing. Sloppy reportage, if you ask me. Maybe Chuck Norris didn't write it after all. :)

But whoever wrote it should have fact-checked that Supreme Court bit.

I'm still not in favor of teaching about just one religion in schools. It should be all of them or none of them.

[madfloridian]

18. Comparative religion is what I prefer.

Examine the world's religions equally.

[madfloridian]

12. Good overview of this from Dispatches from the Culture Wars.

http://scienceblogs.com/dispatches/2007/05/ncbcps_curriculum_challenged_i_1.php

"I've been waiting for this one for quite some time. The ACLU has filed suit on behalf of several parents in Odessa, Texas over their use of the NCBCPS curriculum for an elective Bible course. The case is called Moreno v. Ector County Independent School District and you can see the full text of the complaint here. Several thoughts come to mind.

First of all, I hope the local police will provide protection for the plaintiffs in this case; if history is any guide, they will need it. Once word gets out, expect vandalism, obscene phone calls and death threats. If happens every time. Second, the legal case here is a slam dunk. This course is riddled with false claims and sectarian religious dogma. There simply is no question that the curriculum does not merely teach about the Bible but rather endorses explicitly sectarian beliefs about the Bible and presents it as the true and accurate word of God.

..."The sectarian nature of the program is made obvious by many statements throughout the curriculum. The material reflects not merely the Christian understanding of the Bible, but a specifically Protestant one (and a particular type of Protestantism at that). For instance, one section of the curriculum describes the Roman Catholic belief in literal transubstantiation as "warped" and brought on by "mysticism." The curriculum even recommends that students read Foxe's Book of Martyrs, an anti-Catholic diatribe written by an early proponent of the Church of England. It doesn't get much more sectarian than that.

The complaint also notes that the Bible courses in Odessa both show one of David Barton's videos to the class, and notes that at least one of Barton's videos has been banned from classrooms by a Federal judge. It further notes that both that video and the curriculum itself contain numerous fake quotes from the founding fathers about religion, as has been documented here and in many other places. It's going to be fun to watch this case, which I intend to do as closely as I did the Dover trial."

One of the comments says a school system near them just adopted the NCBCPS curriculum. I think it is pretty widespread, though the group won't give out the figures.

And their website is offline.
http://www.bibleinschools.net/

[Tekla West]

13. chuck norris

as the spokesperson for the Prince of Peace? Jesus wept.

[madfloridian]

14. Well said.

And I agree. He must be weeping a lot about what we have done.

[Cha]

19. Jesus was a Peacemaker..

so don't try any of that bullshit crap that Jesus had anything to do with waging War On Iraq and bombing innocent children and babies to worship your fucking buddy, gwbush.

The World ain't buying it, ya murdering hypocrites.

[madfloridian]

20. Yes, and he would be appalled at what our country has done.

You are right. The internet society has made it easier for us to see these things our country is doing.

My husband and I just can't bear it sometimes.

[19jet54]

26. Elective course is fine....

... it adds the same value to education as an Art Class, Woodworking, Anthropology, Poetry & Short Story, or any other elective that a student is personally interested in. However, if it is an attempt to force all students to involuntarily study Christianity & the Bible; that is illegal per the 1st Amendment of the Constitution. Those who support & believe the Bible and Jesus are fine, but if you force you beliefs on me - then we have a problem.